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  • Subject: Matchmaking Playlist Update
Subject: Matchmaking Playlist Update

I'm sorry, it should have said Halo 2 and Halo 3.

"The English idiom "to cry wolf", derived from the fable, refers to the act of (persistently) raising the alarm about a non-existent threat, with the implication that the person who cried wolf would not be taken seriously should a real emergency take place. It can also be used to describe an alarm system that regularly goes off falsely, causing it not to be believed when a real emergency occurs."

Now, in this story it applies to alarm/threats -- but one can also apply to hype/promises. Bungie/Frankie repeatedly make promises in weekly updates, whether that be about progress, what's coming next week, and they have to inevitably cover try and cover their tracks every single time. I'm not saying I hate Bungie, I'm far from it. In fact, I'll stick up for them on 95% of their decisions, but from a marketing/PR side of things they leave a lot to be desired.


Posted by: Achronos
I don't think you understand that particular story, nor do I think you are even talking about the right game. We're talking about Halo 2 here.

Posted by: cl0ckw0rks0ul
Ever heard the story about the little boy who cried wolf?

Quintessentially, that's what Bungie has been doing recently with Halo 3. If you think for one second that this isn't hurting them somewhat as a company, well it is. It's not hurting them drastically right now, nor will it in the future, but keep it up and see what happens to them and their reputation as a game company.

Capiche "Kid?"

  • 04.26.2007 12:24 PM PDT
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Posted by: J TO THE P
Posted by: SHADY K1LLAZ
absolute garbage. way to stick it to your paying customers. Again - quit being lazy, put down the controller for the Halo 3 beta, pick up your skirt and get it done. Why are you guys even waiting to begin with???? The people without maps can still play unranked games. What is the point of withholding necessary updates then?? The logic behind this is absolutely ridiculous.

Question: Why do you have playlists that don't include the new maps?
ANSWER: SO THAT PEOPLE WHO DON'T HAVE THE NEW MAPS CAN STILL PLAY - DUH!!!

I think the real problem is a lack of planning and the new playlist / rank reset programming hasn't even been done so there is nothing to implement and bungie is just making excuses about not releasing the updates because an extremely small percentage of the community can't download the maps. Again, I say, ABSOLUTE GARBAGE.


Your a douche! It's better that they wait so ALL customers can get the maps downloaded! That's the only way for the rank reset to be fair! Hypothetically if I can't download the maps, but Joe smith can, he has a better chance of getting his rank up before I even get the chance. Pull YOUR skirt down and shut your mouth, your putting out WAY to much!

And you have no idea what the real problem is so shut the hell up


1st - It's not a small number that don't have the maps yet otherwise they probably would go ahead with the reset.

2nd - I don't think anybody yet has a handle on what the 'real problem' is which is why it's taking so long.

I currently have 14 xbox live call id's and I'm no further forward than I was on the 17th!!??

  • 04.26.2007 12:25 PM PDT

Posted by: exed23
Achronos, Bungie, XBL,

Guys, do you hear that sound? That's the 747 carrying the POINT of the matter flying over your heads. I can understand your point regarding the dates and the troubleshooting issues you guys are facing. Everyone can I believe, the point you guys are missing was eloquently stated in your quote, "The playlist update and rank reset were announced a date, but here is what we said: "This is currently slated to happen around 4/24 to 4/27ish but we’re going to wait and see how things are going online before locking that down. We’ll keep you posted."
Allow me to direct your attention to the very last line, "We'll keep you posted."
Exactly what about that line is not clear to ANYONE at Bungie? We have been searching for troubleshooting tips until we are blue in the face, forums, gamer sites, XBL, and yes, here at Bungie.net. FOR OVER A WEEK!!!! Allow me to point out the overwhelming silence on your part, not ONE single acknowledgement of the problems everyone was having. Not ONE. No postings, no story, no blurbs saying "We know, and we're on it." This is as frustrating as the problems with the downloads and I think this is evidence of a conspiracy. Someone, a pooh bah no doubt, has decreed that there will be no stories or anything regarding the trouble. Nothing from Frankie, and in 12 pages of comments on the last "weekly update" nothing from the renowned Achronos. None of you took the 5 minutes to put something up on the website. This has to be a conscious decision and it's very, very insulting to your customers. It is also unprofessional and an example of corporate incompetence. That, no doubt, is where comments like "put down the Halo 3 controllers and get to work!" come from. I am a small business owner and I do "computer stuff". I also help people with their home networks including Xboxes and the like. Having to shrug my shoulders at more than one customer over the past 10 days has been very frustrating and difficult. Also, as a business owner, I think your professionalism is properly questioned in regards to the way you and your company have handled this problem. Looking at your website, you would never know there is a problem. And THAT, sir, is wholly and totally unprofessional. Of all the things you could respond to, that point is the most valid in my opinion. I am a long time Halo addict and will continue to be, that is money in the bank for you and I would appreciate it if you would show some respect for that. I understand some of the posts here show a little anger and idiocy from time to time, but that is not a reason to leave the situation twisting in the wind, so to speak.
To sum it up, you have my full support on the dates, etc. issue, and I think you guys do fantastic work, but you guys are totally in the wrong in how you have handled this situation. Do you think RIM could get away with something like this? If 5 blackberries get BSODed then there are headlines all over the world and RIM puts out hourly updates on the progess. You guys, on the other hand, stuck your heads in the sand for over 10 days and nothing was reported. NOTHING. That is wrong, no business should treat their customers in this manner.

Good vent.

  • 04.26.2007 12:26 PM PDT
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nice exhaust

  • 04.26.2007 12:28 PM PDT

Posted by: mthddirector
nice exhaust


Yeah a really nice vent.

his post could of used some spacing, but I believe he was caught up in the heat of the moment while typing that out. and its true that bungie could have posted info on the matchmaking list not being updated sooner because of problems, and not waiting pretty much to the last minute on the 24 when people were expecting the maps to be added to the matchmaking play list. But WE got was a post on the front page stating "Bungie is holding this update while we investigate and fix some of the Xbox Live download problems that people have been reporting" and that the playlist update and rank reset will probably occur next week instead of this week.

Still you could have thrown up a temporary unranked play list for everyone to play while the bugs were being worked out on the final one play lists? But then again I don't really know how difficult it is to add play list to the matchmaking.

  • 04.26.2007 12:59 PM PDT

You will be missed.
My YouTube Channel
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"See what I did there?"
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Dont get too wrapped up in the Internet. It's already forgotten about you.

Well, don't make me say I told you so.

I could have guessed originally that Bungie was pooping their pants with the map download problem.

Then both Bungie and CA really pooped their pants when they found out how glitchy the new maps were.

It used to just be "Player failed to load the map."
Now it's, "I'm not able to download those maps."

LOL.
(Not trying to be a jerk, but you've got to admit, it is funny)

  • 04.26.2007 1:07 PM PDT
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Well I think sometimes the complications are a bit difficult to predict - especially how long it takes to fix issues (like downloading) when they arise. So while the community team (Frankie, etc.) are definitely aware of the concerns here, there are tech monkeys at Xbox Live and Bungie (2 different locations) trying to solve the problem. Simple things like ETAs become difficult to deliver to the public. Not to mention contingency plans like a temporary playlist - which entails coding and things like that. I also think Bungie is doing the best they can under the circumstances.

  • 04.26.2007 1:16 PM PDT

Kill the Noobs!

This Is so F*#@ing messed up I can only stomp my friends into the ground so much before I need a real challenge.Everyone I talked to had no problem downloading the maps.I guess it is just another way for Bungie to have us by the balls.


P.S. Coagulation needs to be added to more matchmaking lists.It shows up twice that I know of in unranked game types . . . . I MEAN COME ON!!!!!!!!

  • 04.26.2007 1:26 PM PDT
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i dont see why everyone is so upset over the rank reset and new maps. for one thing you have been playing for a long time without the new maps so another week isnt gonna kill you.

and second, why would you want bungie to rush this update when rumble pit and BTB slayer and skirmish will be destroyed

not to mention the new maps are full of glitches....i mean seriously... invisible walls that people can hide behind and you can't shoot thru, right in the middle of a hallway ramp. i mean did you think no one would be trying to kill eachother there or somthing? lol just funny

[Edited on 04.26.2007 1:28 PM PDT]

  • 04.26.2007 1:27 PM PDT

It's crazy I still can't dl the maps so I for 1 am glad there holding off instead of leaving others in the dust for something beyond the users control.

  • 04.26.2007 1:46 PM PDT
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JUST PUT THE DOWNLOAD ON THE 360 Market Place with a code. Or have them online your website wo we can burn them to a disk and place them in the HDD like the xbox update.

Or make it free... lmao

  • 04.26.2007 1:51 PM PDT
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well atleast they posted that they are trying to do something about this =D

  • 04.26.2007 1:58 PM PDT

It's just a game folks.

Explain the logic behind this statement: "...so I for 1 am glad there holding off instead of leaving others in the dust for something beyond the users control." If 50,000 people bought a can of soda and 25,000 people wanted that soda but couldn't get it, how is it that those 50,000 people should wait to drink that soda until those other 25,000 people get it?

Even better, lets say 10 people buy a brand new car. However, 5 more people want to buy the same car but are unable to. Now, according to your logic, those 10 people should not be allowed to drive those cars until the 5 other people are able to buy it. If I paid some amount of money for a car, I want to use it as it is intended. I do not want the use of my car to be limited by the manufacturer simply because not everyone can have it. I bought it. I paid money for it. In reality, I SHOULD be able to drive it without any stipulations. If not, then I am not being allowed to use it as it is intended and in many way, i've spent some amount of money for a really nice lawn ornament that only my friends can see. See the connection?

That rationale doesn't quite pull its weight.

  • 04.26.2007 2:01 PM PDT

4

Bungie is just trying to create media buzz amongst the gaming community. For one thing, not all playlists require the new maps. The autoupdate could be implemented, and everyone could play. Second of all, if my memory is correct, when other maps were released you could attempt to play any playlist you wanted. If you went into MM and found a match that was going to play a map you didn't have, you'd get kicked to the pregame lobby with a map error message, and someone who did have the maps would fill your place. So, in reality, everyone can play every playlist.

There is no reason to hold on the update.

  • 04.26.2007 2:16 PM PDT
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This is so stupid how there resetting are levels. My gosh.

  • 04.26.2007 2:20 PM PDT
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I am rather curious as why they did not just have two bundles with these maps, one for the xbox 1 crowd and one for the 360'S. both packs would have contained the identical maps just a different wrapper for the 360. seems so simple that it could have worked. oh well, this is ms, logic and testing escapes them sometimes.

[Edited on 04.26.2007 2:30 PM PDT]

  • 04.26.2007 2:28 PM PDT
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Posted by: icecold51
on top of all that, i go both ways i guess.
Heh, he goes both ways.

  • 04.26.2007 2:36 PM PDT

Tom Achronos
Bungie.net Overlord
twitter: http://twitter.com/Achronos

"I have no words that would do justice to the atrocities you commit to the English language, as well as your continued assaults on the concepts of basic literacy and logical reasoning."

Posted by: exed23
Exactly what about that line is not clear to ANYONE at Bungie? We have been searching for troubleshooting tips until we are blue in the face, forums, gamer sites, XBL, and yes, here at Bungie.net. FOR OVER A WEEK!!!! Allow me to point out the overwhelming silence on your part, not ONE single acknowledgement of the problems everyone was having. Not ONE.

Really? Nothing? A search of recent forum posts by myself seems to indicate otherwise. That doesn't seem like overwhelming silence. I also seem to remember it being mentioned in last week's weekly update. That also indicates a lack of silence on the issue. And that's only the stuff you could easily find. I won't get into the emails and phone calls we've had working with Xbox Live to track down the source of the problems, as well as with the Support guys to make sure they were relaying the correct information.

No postings, no story, no blurbs saying "We know, and we're on it." This is as frustrating as the problems with the downloads and I think this is evidence of a conspiracy. Someone, a pooh bah no doubt, has decreed that there will be no stories or anything regarding the trouble. Nothing from Frankie, and in 12 pages of comments on the last "weekly update" nothing from the renowned Achronos.
Just to clarify, you weren't really looking that hard. I agree, it would be insulting to hear nothing. That's why I posted a bunch, and why Frankie mentioned the issue in the weekly update for those who don't keep track of the forums.

I recognize your frustration - but please at least do us the courtesy of looking for said posts and information before you claim there is none.

[Edited on 04.26.2007 2:49 PM PDT]

  • 04.26.2007 2:46 PM PDT

Tom Achronos
Bungie.net Overlord
twitter: http://twitter.com/Achronos

"I have no words that would do justice to the atrocities you commit to the English language, as well as your continued assaults on the concepts of basic literacy and logical reasoning."

Your knowledge of how content downloads work for Xbox 1 games and how the 360 plays Xbox 1 games at all is somewhat lacking. Suggesting incompetence when you don't know how things work is the height of arrogance.

Posted by: dirtyone
I am rather curious as why they did not just have two bundles with these maps, one for the xbox 1 crowd and one for the 360'S. both packs would have contained the identical maps just a different wrapper for the 360. seems so simple that it could have worked. oh well, this is ms, logic and testing escapes them sometimes.

  • 04.26.2007 2:54 PM PDT

"Fatty is your daddy."

http://www.bungie.net/Search/default.aspx?q=fattness&g=5
^
l
l
l
told ya!

[Edited on 04.26.2007 3:33 PM PDT]

  • 04.26.2007 3:26 PM PDT

iluvatar2448

i just spent 45 minutes with people from xbox support to get the new maps...we tried everything to get the new maps but i still dont have them!!!!

  • 04.26.2007 3:33 PM PDT

It's just a game folks.

Are you trying with the 360 or the original xbox? I attained mine while on a 360. All I did was make sure that my credit card information was up-to-date in the Account section of the 360 dashboard. Once I did that, I simply went in to the Halo 2 in-game downloader and let it do its thing. I'm sorry to hear that you can't get these maps, however; other than having the ability to play custom games, you really are not missing anything just yet! Cheers.

[Edited on 04.26.2007 3:38 PM PDT]

  • 04.26.2007 3:38 PM PDT

4

Achronos, why won't you rashly and impolitely rebuttal my point?

  • 04.26.2007 3:40 PM PDT

Posted by: Achronos
Sigh. I bet you're one of the same guys that was demanding to know the date of the beta and is still demanding to know the date Halo 3 will be released. I wonder if you understand the irony there? I think a little reality check is in order.

The playlist update and rank reset were announced a date, but here is what we said: "This is currently slated to happen around 4/24 to 4/27ish but we’re going to wait and see how things are going online before locking that down. We’ll keep you posted."

Notice the part I underlined. Explain to me exactly what part of that isn't professional or honest. Would have prefered we not tell you about a rank reset? I mean, we could reset things right now, but given the problems some people are having, that wouldn't be prudent. Gee, that's EXACTLY why we said we hadn't locked things down. Imagine that - a date changed because we had to adjust to the situation! It seems to me an the lack of "professionalism" is in your analysis of the situation, not our decision making process.

And what dates are have we missed? I seem to recall Halo 1 being released when it was supposed to. Halo 2 also was released on the day we said it would be. I'm somewhat curious as to what dates were missed? I don't mind people complaining about the download issues, or even that they have to wait longer for the matchmaking update or rank reset - those are perfectly legitimate issues. But calling us unprofessional because we miss a date that we even told you was subject to change? Please. Come back when you have a valid complaint.



In reply to your first question, the part of that statement that is unprofessional is the "ish but we’re going to wait and see how things are going online before locking that down. We’ll keep you posted." part. I think the other part that is really erking us all is Frankie's "This playlist update and rank reset will probably occur next week, pending the outcome of our ongoing work with the Xbox Live team." A truly accountable company would balk at making such public statements to it's eagerly awaiting customers. One could even consider what was done as a bait and switch, although I'm sure some slimy lawyer somewhere made sure that you included the last parts about seeing how things are going and keeping us posted. Let's compare your statement to a real world situation. Your mom just asked you when you are going to clean your room, you coyly respond "Mom, currently I'm planning on cleaning my room in a couple hoursish, but I'm just going to wait and see how things are going, I'll let you know for sure when I make a decision. I'll keep you posted" and than a couple hours later when she asks again when you are going to clean your room you again coyly say "Mom, I've had some issues, so I'll probably be doing it later, pending the outcome of how I feel in the meantime." I don't know about you, but if i said that to my mom, she would look me in the eyes and say "You're full of *blam*. Quit making excuses and get it done". Which is the same I say to you.

I mean, we could reset things right now, but given the problems some people are having, that wouldn't be prudent.
How do you consider shunning your PAYING customers to be fair? If you ask me, you are being too prudent - again as I said previously, pick up your skirt and do it, what are you guys so scared of? - I'm guessing the real reason you haven't done the update is because of people who have paid for the map and can't download it yet. Fair enough. But you know as well as I do that a good business always has a contingency plan. It seems, in this case at least, that the contingency plan was to make vague statements so that you could withdraw any previous statements and run to the hills with your metaphorical tail between your legs when things went wrong. What about a statement regarding a "Team Preview" playlist? As others have stated, every other map pack release was immediately followed by an addition to matchmaking so that users could begin playing the new maps immediately while any download issues were resolved. Why not this time? A: Because it was too much work and it was much easier to just do one playlist update instead of two.

As to missing dates, wasn't halo3 originally supposed to be released hand in hand with the 360 as an initial 360 offering? Then I do also remember rumors about a push to release halo 3 this past Christmas? Granted, a lot is rumors and yes you have been very secretive and probably haven't ever said anything about these dates, so fine, according to what YOU guys say and release, you're on time, but it's easy to look like your on time when you create the schedule and news releases now isn't it?

On a side note, why does it seem like we never see any posts from you (Achronos) until somebody just says something God awful and stupid and you feel the need to lash out? Why not a kind and *professional* response with any kind of useful info like "Hey everyone, we're really really really sorry, in the meantime, we are working as hard as we can to both solve the download issues and we are currently debating about whether or not a team preview playlist would be possible." Instead, your response is simply a cold, dry, sarcastic shadow of a statement, just like Frankie's statement that started this whole debate.

[Edited on 04.26.2007 4:06 PM PDT]

  • 04.26.2007 3:44 PM PDT

It's just a game folks.

I would guess the reason that he has not acknowledged your post is because a similar post was submitted earlier in the thread. He already debated that point of view and as such, it was dismissed. See page 5. Cheers.

  • 04.26.2007 3:44 PM PDT