Bungie.net Community
This topic has moved here: Subject: As community guy, and now incharge of MM should sketch post more of...
  • Subject: As community guy, and now incharge of MM should sketch post more of...
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Might aswell throw my opinion amidst the many...

It's actually quite simple... for a change.

Sketch, Frankie and any other Bungie employee should be working on video games... but Halo 3 in particular

That's it... those are my 'expectations' . I know, quite boring really.

Now, it'd be nice to see them post here and there more freqently but the bottom line is their job is to make kick-ass games or support the development of such games. Yes... kick ass

Can't think of anything else worth saying really :P

Edited for terrible spelling and a general distaste for the original order of words.

[Edited on 05.01.2007 12:55 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 12:51 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

A Guide to Networking, Matchmaking, and Host in Halo (HBO mirror)

Bungie Friends and Family invitee, and sender of "random emails" about networking.

The reason why Bungie employees tend to post more elsewhere, as Recon so correctly points out, is the attitude of the b.net community as a whole.

When Halo 2 came out, and people were disappointed with it, I clearly recall this happening:

*X is disappointed and makes a well thought out post explaining why, in a polite manner.*

HBO: Either A) I'm sorry but I disagree, but here's why... OR B) I agree, this is what I think

Instead of Bungie.net, where this tended to happen, no matter how intelligent the original comment. I also hasten to add that naturally, this does not represent the entire userbase, but is designed to illustrate some of the large differences between the two as a whole:

B.net A) "I HATE YOU. BUNGIE. RULES. HALO 2 IS THE BEST GAME EVER. I HOPE YOU DIE YOU BLAM." OR B) yes i agree h2 sucks i hate this game [no reason given]

And no, I am not trying to make a statement by choosing that particular incident.


So why does the difference occur? Simple.

1) Because it has got to the stage where the moment employees show their face, they are torn apart at B.net, whereas at HBO they are very well received and treated with a lot of respect and politeness. Something which does not occur anyway near as common as it should do here.

2) The very nature of the HBO community discourages stupid and immature posts, and encourages intelligent mature ones (and the general quality/maturity of content/users over there is much higher). Here, people can post all kinds of crap, stuff that anyone with half a brain would realise would be bad for the game. I know if I worked at Bungie, I'd rather read through HBO/NeoGAF/etc than most of the crap you see here. High quality threads and discussions are drowned out by a wave of rubbish, and even when you do get good threads, some idiots will come along and ruin it.

3) There is a much much lower acceptance of the kinds of behaviour that are allowed here. At NeoGAF, people who troll and make baseless comments like "Halo 3 looks -blam!-", are quickly banned. Does that happen here? Hopefully I don't need to supply the answer to that question...


What is a shame in some ways is that I seem to have built up a reputation as someone who makes well thought out and good replies/threads. Yes, you might be thinking "What?" at this stage, but indulge me for a minute.

If I might be permitted to quote things like "another quality post from One One Seven". The sheer fact that this seems worth commenting on is a real shame, because it suggests - accurately - that such people a few and far between. People shouldn't have to say "Yet another really intelligent post from X", but "That was a well thought out post, good job OP, here are my thoughts on the topic". In other words, the quality should not so low, that someone can stand out all the time by merely posting.

Of course, *exactly* how these things would be fixed is kind of outside the scope of this message, but hopefully I've made some sense instead of incoherently rambling ;-)

[Edited on 05.01.2007 1:21 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 1:20 PM PDT
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Posted by: Recon Number 54
Posted by: Death v2
Dont get us started on moderators Two posts in the last year... and one was a one liner in the flood, arent those not allowed? Two posts in this entire year 25 posts this entire year, with a few breaks of multiple months 25 posts this entire year aswell 8 posts this year I mean really none of this makes any sense, I know its off topic to an extent, but I think that generally, people who have positions of power should post commonly. DMB stepped down because he couldnt post enough, so why shouldnt others?

Moderating doesn't have a post quota or an attendance requirement.
I never said it did


While it is hoped that if someone realizes that they are unable or unlikely to perform their duties, that they will come forward with that information, it is up to the Overlord and the moderator in question as to when they (and their number) will be retired. For example, I have no personal information on the moderators that you specified. I'm not their boss. I am their colleague. To me, if they are here today and working/posting, then I am glad to see them. Until or unless it is made my business, I know that this is the domain of Achronos.
It is indeed hoped that it would happen, but unfortunatly that doesnt seem to be the case at all.


Posting is also not a requirement of a moderator. I will admit, I am one of the chattier ninjas, and there are members who wish that I would stop. I know that other ninjas (including some on your list) might not have public posts, but posts on the public forums are not a required part of being a moderator. It is possible to moderate these forums pretty effectively and not post once. Warnings, PM's and blacklists are all tools that leave little evidence for the public to see.
But common sense would say that if it took the same amount of time to PM a user, why not post the comment to a user in order to allow the public forums to see your presence, to see the way things are supposed to be done, and to be reminded of the rules?


Hell, sometimes I am here and am more stealthy than usual. That is typically when I am using my mobile device and feel that I am more effective by using lock, ban, warn rather than get bogged down thumb-typing.
But this is the exception rather than the rule, as opposed to the cases of those listed above.


I understand that you are expressing a common and widely held view. That you would like to see the staff post more. I agree, I would love to see them more than we do at this time.
I think that they should either post more often or have their powers removed(in the case of ninjas). All that their powers do now is make their posting more commonly read and more notable to regular users, when that shouldnt be the case. Moderating should be about helping the community, not making your posts more apparent in a thread.


Where we disagree is that I don't think that it is their job to post on these forums. Sketch has other and more pressing duties that are related to Bungie's contact with external entities. Frankie has multiple articles each week, contact with the press, head waxing and gamer-gurl stalking. Achronos has web-dev duties, Webmaster containment and hawtness upgrades. and so on.
I would buy this BUT they(frankie and sketch) post in other forums all the time, as opposed to here. So it isnt like they are completly strapped for time, or simply cannot do it, they simply chose not to =/


Posting on the forums is not "press release" caliber stuff (to me). It is more "hey guys, what's up?" sort of thing. And (again, to me) there are plenty of places on the Interwebz that are more welcoming to them (than Bungie.Net) when they have a personal moment to make a "hey guys" forum post.
But there are things that the community should be alerted to, the upcoming updates reasons for example. Would it really be that hard for him to go and write about 2K characters on why the update is coming, drop some stats, etc. to calm down optimatch and focus discussions there into a smaller area, as opposed to the chaos which was there a while back? 30 mins of his time, to save the rest of the moderators the trouble of dealing with that circus? Comon now...


My suggestion? If we want more interaction, we need to encourage it, not demand it. When it does happen, we need to nurture it, not attack it. We the members are who populate these forums. If we can't be welcoming to the people who we supposedly admire/like, then why would they want to spend their personal time here?

They have the ability to ban people... if they post and someone says "Hey ____ you blow" then ban them. Really man, if people are so hostile, why not enforce the play nice rule? It makes sense that people who are hostile to them would be trouble makers throughout the forums and should be banned anyways, but thats just my opinion.

[Edited on 05.01.2007 1:26 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 1:24 PM PDT
  • gamertag: trayne
  • user homepage:

Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

It's unreal how many of you have no qualms about coming here and telling these guys how to do their jobs.

No matter how many times it's said, you don't seem to hear.
This is not a support site. You have no reasonable expectation of dealing with Bungie employees directly.

  • 05.01.2007 1:26 PM PDT
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Posted by: shiv master
It's unreal how many of you have no qualms about coming here and telling these guys how to do their jobs.

No matter how many times it's said, you don't seem to hear.
This is not a support site. You have no reasonable expectation of dealing with Bungie employees directly.


And no matter how many times you are told that a reasonable expectation has been made due to prior actions, the cash paid for both H2, your xbox/360, and XBL, all microsoft products, etc. you continue to post this same thing over again. This issue has been adressed about 2 pages ago, now please drop it and allow this discussion to continue as opposed to bringing things back from pages ago in order to try to make your failure of a point again. We are all having an intelligent discussion here, so please stop trying to interfere with that by posting something that if true, wouldve been posted by someone else with more of a position of authority by now... as in someone better suited to speak on what you should get for the cash you spent, as in a bungie employee(past or present). I'm not trying to flame, i just needed to get the point across.

  • 05.01.2007 1:33 PM PDT

Strange evolution how people have come to believe
That we are it's greatest achievement
We're barely, we're just a collection of cells
Overrating themselves

Posted by: Death v2
Posted by: shiv master
It's unreal how many of you have no qualms about coming here and telling these guys how to do their jobs.

No matter how many times it's said, you don't seem to hear.
This is not a support site. You have no reasonable expectation of dealing with Bungie employees directly.


And no matter how many times you are told that a reasonable expectation has been made due to prior actions, the cash paid for both H2, your xbox/360, and XBL, all microsoft products, etc. you continue to post this same thing over again. This issue has been adressed about 2 pages ago, now please drop it and allow this discussion to continue as opposed to bringing things back from pages ago in order to try to make your failure of a point again. We are all having an intelligent discussion here, so please stop trying to interfere with that by posting something that if true, wouldve been posted by someone else with more of a position of authority by now... as in someone better suited to speak on what you should get for the cash you spent, as in a bungie employee(past or present). I'm not trying to flame, i just needed to get the point across.

You've 'discussed' your opinion with everyone in this thread. You seem to lack the ability to understand what has been told to you over the span of 4 pages.

Simply put, your expectations arent being met because your expectations are unreasonable. If you cling to your belief that they are not unreasonable, thats fine, I just hope you cope better with the dissapointment your expectations bring than you did with the truths that were offered to you in this thread.

In the real world, saying "As long as I believe it, its true" has no meaning.

Edit: Dealing with people who refuse to acknowledge what is being told to them is what I believe to be a major factor as to why they dont post here more often.

[Edited on 05.01.2007 1:40 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 1:39 PM PDT
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Here, people can post all kinds of crap, stuff that anyone with half a brain would realise would be bad for the game.
There is a much much lower acceptance of the kinds of behaviour that are allowed here.

So people with the ability to fix these things are leaving because of them? Seems like a downward spiral doesnt it... if only the people walking away could prehaps press one little button(unleash ninjas) and be part of the solution, not part of the downward spiral. Oh, what a perfect world it would be. Another idea would be to remove the mods that never do anything(no offense) and put in some that do things. When cam, trigger, ash, GP, and that other guy :p got put into power, things improved, so prehaps a few more mods might be in order, or prehaps taking responsibility by inactive mods. Either would help.

I agree with your post 117, I am simply saying that there are better ways of dealing with things than simply walking away.

[Edited on 05.01.2007 1:44 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 1:39 PM PDT
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Posted by: twinkiemaker
your expectations arent being met because your expectations are unreasonable.


Do you know what my expectations are? No... so then you are making an assumption? Yes... Now, would you consider it unreasonable for the community guy to make 2 posts a week in optimatch to answer questions concerning the upcoming update, or to even make 1 stickied post explaining the reasons behind it? I wouldnt think that it is unreasonable. One post on something as big as a MM update? Comon now....

[Edited on 05.01.2007 1:47 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 1:43 PM PDT

Strange evolution how people have come to believe
That we are it's greatest achievement
We're barely, we're just a collection of cells
Overrating themselves

Posted by: Death v2
Posted by: twinkiemaker
your expectations arent being met because your expectations are unreasonable.

Do you know what my expectations are? No... so then you are making an assumption? Yes... Now, would you consider it unreasonable for the community guy to make 2 posts a week in optimatch to answer questions concerning the upcoming update, or to even make 1 stickied post explaining the reasons behind it?

Yes I was assuming, but this entire thread people have been operating under the assumption that they have a right to know the reasons behind decision x or playlist y as well as the right to expect the Bungie staff to post here.

Recon did a great job earlier in the thread explaining why many of our expectations are unreasonable, and how our interpretation of what Bungie.net exists for is skewed. The only thing I could manage is as follows.

"You have no rights, play nice," does a great job of explaining what we have a right to expect.

  • 05.01.2007 1:51 PM PDT
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Posted by: twinkiemaker
Posted by: Death v2
Posted by: twinkiemaker
your expectations arent being met because your expectations are unreasonable.

Do you know what my expectations are? No... so then you are making an assumption? Yes... Now, would you consider it unreasonable for the community guy to make 2 posts a week in optimatch to answer questions concerning the upcoming update, or to even make 1 stickied post explaining the reasons behind it?

Yes I was assuming, but this entire thread people have been operating under the assumption that they have a right to know the reasons behind decision x or playlist y as well as the right to expect the Bungie staff to post here.


So we have a forum dedicated to playlist discussion, but we shouldnt know why playlist decisions were made? That makes absolutly no sense to me...

  • 05.01.2007 1:57 PM PDT
  • gamertag: trayne
  • user homepage:

Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

Hey Death...Recon posted several pages ago that this is not a support site.

I assume that's enough authority for you?

Don't let that information stop you from acting an ass.
I suppose in your world simply trashing someone is enough to make them scurry out of a conversation.
If you like banging your head on a brick wall that's ok with me. I look forward to seeing your brain spatter on the grout.

  • 05.01.2007 1:57 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Destinypedia - The Wiki for Bungie's Destiny
Posted by: DEATHPIMP72
Anyone but Foman. He smells like cheese.

Death,

(it feels weird to address somebody as "Death")

As we all know, words on an internet forum mean little. If you really feel that the lack of posts by Bungie staff is such a problem, then my honest, non-sarcastic suggestion to you is to allow your wallet to speak for you. If you want more posts about matchmaking and you're not getting it, then you should refuse to play Halo 2 or Halo 3 over XBL until the "problem" is resolved. Don't buy any more XBL subscriptions. Don't buy Halo 3 until you start seeing more posts.

If you are unwilling to do this, then it's obviously not such a big deal to you or anyone else that it is liable to cause Bungie to lose money if they do not do it. Therefore, the Bungie employees should not feel any pressure to post here on the b.net forums.

It's been said before but I'll say it again. When the Bungie staff interacts with us, it's because they want to. When you demand it, it makes them want to even less and thus reduces the chances that they will in the future.

After all, you don't give a dog a bone so that it won't sleep on the couch.

[Edited on 05.01.2007 2:00 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 1:58 PM PDT
  • gamertag: trayne
  • user homepage:

Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

Posted by: MLG_Achronos
Posted by: shiv master
Hey Death...Recon posted several pages ago that this is not a support site.

I assume that's enough authority for you?

Don't let that information stop you from acting an ass.
I suppose in your world simply trashing someone is enough to make them scurry out of a conversation.
If you like banging your head on a brick wall that's ok with me. I look forward to seeing your brain spatter on the grout.

Recon Number 54 is not an official Bungie employee.


Aww...that's cute.
Do you feel important now that you've stated something that everyone already knew?

I said he was in a position of authority, which is what Death asked for.

  • 05.01.2007 2:01 PM PDT
  • gamertag: trayne
  • user homepage:

Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

Posted by: MLG_Achronos
Posted by: shiv master
Posted by: MLG_Achronos
Posted by: shiv master
Hey Death...Recon posted several pages ago that this is not a support site.

I assume that's enough authority for you?

Don't let that information stop you from acting an ass.
I suppose in your world simply trashing someone is enough to make them scurry out of a conversation.
If you like banging your head on a brick wall that's ok with me. I look forward to seeing your brain spatter on the grout.

Recon Number 54 is not an official Bungie employee.


Aww...that's cute.
Do you feel important now that you've stated something that everyone already knew?

I said he was in a position of authority, which is what Death asked for.

He is not in authority to explain why the people being discussed do what they do which is what he explained earlier.


Before you go on, you might want to look back at exactly what I was responding to.
He asked for word from someone in a higher position of authority than myself.

Please, try again.
The third time, as they say, is the charm.

[Edited on 05.01.2007 2:11 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 2:10 PM PDT

Strange evolution how people have come to believe
That we are it's greatest achievement
We're barely, we're just a collection of cells
Overrating themselves

Posted by: Death v2
That makes absolutly no sense to me...

Therein lies the problem.

  • 05.01.2007 2:10 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

I actually agree with Recon. Bungie employees should not post in the forums in an official capacity, excepting rare Q&A events, and imo, those should be kept to news articles. The community just isn't right for that level of interaction.

However, that still does not explain the HaloGen episode. Why was an official statement by the responsible employee made on an unofficial site's unnofficial forum, while their own official site was ignored? Had it been a news press release and not graced b.net, that'd have been fine; it was intended for the press, not the general public. However, sketch took the time to author a forum post on HBO, hell, even a copy and paste of that onto B.Net's front page would have satisfied most people, but it wasn't even acknowledged for days to come after that. Even then, we still had more input about it from the Web team than the "Community" team.

  • 05.01.2007 2:20 PM PDT
  • gamertag: trayne
  • user homepage:

Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

While I agree that any official word should be made here first, members liked Death and MLG Achronos have proven via this thread that this community isn't capable of more than making demands and stamping their feet if those demands aren't met.
Sadly, this is even true when they're faced with logical and informed reasons why they're being unreasonable.
Ironically, they represent the very reasons why their demands can't be made policy.

[Edited on 05.01.2007 2:33 PM PDT]

  • 05.01.2007 2:31 PM PDT
  • gamertag: trayne
  • user homepage:

Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

Posted by: MLG_Achronos
Posted by: shiv master
While I agree that any official word should be made here first, members liked Death and MLG Achronos have proven via this thread that this community isn't capable of more than making demands and stamping their feet if those demands aren't met.
Sadly, this is even true when they're faced with logical and informed reasons why they're being unreasonable.
Ironically, they represent the very reasons why their demands can't be made policy.

It's unreasonable for officials to post at least twice a week? They posts like 20 times a week on HBO.


The difference between obligation and recreation has already been explained more than once.
Either you weren't paying attention, or you have trouble with reading comprehension.

  • 05.01.2007 2:38 PM PDT

Strange evolution how people have come to believe
That we are it's greatest achievement
We're barely, we're just a collection of cells
Overrating themselves

Posted by: shiv master
Posted by: MLG_Achronos
Posted by: shiv master
While I agree that any official word should be made here first, members liked Death and MLG Achronos have proven via this thread that this community isn't capable of more than making demands and stamping their feet if those demands aren't met.
Sadly, this is even true when they're faced with logical and informed reasons why they're being unreasonable.
Ironically, they represent the very reasons why their demands can't be made policy.

It's unreasonable for officials to post at least twice a week? They posts like 20 times a week on HBO.


The difference between obligation and recreation has already been explained more than once.
Either you weren't paying attention, or you have trouble with reading comprehension.

I think what Shiv is trying to say is that inability to grasp a concept does not make the concept invalid.

  • 05.01.2007 2:41 PM PDT