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  • Subject: Two part suggestion
Subject: Two part suggestion
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Surfing around the forum, I notice some posts (and users) that make me want to invent a device to stab people in the face over the interweb. So to allow us (mostly) sane posters to strike back at the fine scum of idiots we have floating at the top of the Bungie.net barrel, I suggest two independent solutions:

1- Impliment reputation. Allow us to make a lasting impression on people for their stupidity, even more so for their contiuned stupidity.

2- Where is my report post button?

Comment/discuss?

[Edited on 04.29.2007 6:18 PM PDT]

  • 04.29.2007 6:18 PM PDT
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Wtf is up with bungie having all these network problems?It's making me really mad!!!!!

  • 04.29.2007 7:25 PM PDT
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Spam somebody else's thread, plz.

  • 04.29.2007 7:27 PM PDT
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Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

I hate the stupidity on this site as much as the next guy. That said, I think implementing a 'report' button will become largely another avenue by which the stupid people can abuse the system.
It will cause more problems that it could ever solve.

  • 04.29.2007 8:30 PM PDT

cars, girls & cake all day everyday

Posted by: Fluke Hawkins
Surfing around the forum, I notice some posts (and users) that make me want to invent a device to stab people in the face over the interweb. So to allow us (mostly) sane posters to strike back at the fine scum of idiots we have floating at the top of the Bungie.net barrel, I suggest two independent solutions:

1- Impliment reputation. Allow us to make a lasting impression on people for their stupidity, even more so for their contiuned stupidity.


That's flaming, which is not allowed.

2- Where is my report post button?

Too many stupid posts on the site. We have almost 1000 to 2000 active accounts in the public forum, and only about 30 moderators. You don't think there working hard enough already?

-CB-



[Edited on 04.29.2007 8:37 PM PDT]

  • 04.29.2007 8:37 PM PDT
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Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

Hey Blinky...how does implementing a reputation feature constitute flaming?

  • 04.29.2007 8:45 PM PDT

Sandswept Studios Design Director

Visit us and check out our games at Sandswept.net!

~~Pardon Our Dust.~~

This is the part where Achronos, and sometimes Recon, steps in and gives us his theory, which usually is a really great analysis of online behavior, on how attaching 'worth' to our Live IDs will bring good behavior. Not punishments, but rewards. ;)

You should specify what kind of reputation system. User-feedback? Bad idea. Easily broken. Perhaps you should elaborate on your ideas, eh?

As for a 'report post' button, I have no trouble contacting moderators at all times of day. They're a bunch of lifeless nerds. They're always around.

[Edited on 04.29.2007 8:49 PM PDT]

  • 04.29.2007 8:48 PM PDT
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Posted by: shiv master
Hey Blinky...how does implementing a reputation feature constitute flaming?

Because having a low reputation makes people feel bad...not that I have anything to worry about. Losers.

  • 04.29.2007 8:49 PM PDT
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Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

Posted by: Halifax
Posted by: shiv master
Hey Blinky...how does implementing a reputation feature constitute flaming?

Because having a low reputation makes people feel bad...not that I have anything to worry about. Losers.


Quite.

It's always those who should feel bad about themselves who don't.

  • 04.29.2007 8:57 PM PDT
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Posted by: shiv master
Posted by: Halifax
Posted by: shiv master
Hey Blinky...how does implementing a reputation feature constitute flaming?

Because having a low reputation makes people feel bad...not that I have anything to worry about. Losers.


Quite.

It's always those who should feel bad about themselves who don't.

Seriously. And they are always so oblivious to the fact that everyone is annoyed with them. Geez, people with egos need to get a life. A life like mine.

  • 04.29.2007 8:59 PM PDT

"Science without religion is lame. Religion without science is blind." - Albert Einstien

Posted by: Count Blinkula
Posted by: Fluke Hawkins
Surfing around the forum, I notice some posts (and users) that make me want to invent a device to stab people in the face over the interweb. So to allow us (mostly) sane posters to strike back at the fine scum of idiots we have floating at the top of the Bungie.net barrel, I suggest two independent solutions:

1- Impliment reputation. Allow us to make a lasting impression on people for their stupidity, even more so for their contiuned stupidity.


That's flaming, which is not allowed.

2- Where is my report post button?

Too many stupid posts on the site. We have almost 1000 to 2000 active accounts in the public forum, and only about 30 moderators. You don't think there working hard enough already?

-CB-



Reporting posts is less likely to be abused effectively, since all it does is notify and doesn't effect anyone else. Reputation isnt flaming either, because not only do you have negative rep, but positive rep, although a rep system is far easier to abuse.

The simple solution to the need for moderators is this.... get more.

  • 04.29.2007 9:17 PM PDT
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Posted by: UL7IM4 G33K
The simple solution to the need for moderators is this.... get more.
Agreed.
More moderators.

  • 04.29.2007 10:07 PM PDT
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People should be judged based on the merits of what they have to post, not some stupid reputation system that is open to abuse. Also, the PM system is just as effective as any "Report Post" button could ever be.

  • 04.29.2007 11:00 PM PDT
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Alright, the report post thing was more or less of a dim idea anyway (I'm a mod on a forum with, like, 100 members and I get plenty of crap anyway. Size is a good point.)

Rep, however, I want to defend. @ SS_Zag: What do you mean by user feedback? What I'm thinking is V_Bulliten style rep: You like the post, you +rep, you don't, you -rep. Personally, I think that a big red bar underneath somebody's name would tell people "Don't be like this guy, he's a idiot" and a big green bar underneath somebody's name would say "This guy is awesome. Listen and aspire to be like him."

  • 04.30.2007 3:15 PM PDT
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Destinypedia - The Wiki for Bungie's Destiny
Posted by: DEATHPIMP72
Anyone but Foman. He smells like cheese.

Posted by: Fluke Hawkins
Rep, however, I want to defend. @ SS_Zag: What do you mean by user feedback? What I'm thinking is V_Bulliten style rep: You like the post, you +rep, you don't, you -rep. Personally, I think that a big red bar underneath somebody's name would tell people "Don't be like this guy, he's a idiot" and a big green bar underneath somebody's name would say "This guy is awesome. Listen and aspire to be like him."

No, sorry Fluke. I like the general thought behind your idea and I think that the purposes behind it are noble ones. But this is not a simple matter of sticking a reputation button under every post.

As you've proposed it, with no checks or balances, your reputation system open to the general public here would be a disaster. Here's why:

Vendettas
Sometimes arguments here can get heated. No matter what the particular forum -- Halo 2, Halo 3, the Flood, the Septagon, or anywhere else, people can get into pretty intense debates. Moreover, some people dislike others based purely on that person's opinions.

For example: try going to the Halo 3 forum and making a post about Halo 1 being better than Halo 2, or vice versa. You will get flamed and insulted into oblivion. Were there to be a reputation system, every person who disliked your opinion would vote "-Rep." A couple dozen of these could completely ruin a reputation that you worked hard to build up.

Do you really want to have to self-censor and avoid talking about certain topics just to preserve some phony reputation? I sure don't.

Multiple Accounts
This site has a rather unique problem with some individuals creating dozens of multiple accounts that they use for either neutral or nefarious purposes (depending on the person). A reputation system would -- and there is no dispute about this -- encourage even more of this kind of behavior, as users created multiple accounts just to give themselves a better reputation.

These users might even try to justify it -- "I'm just trying to get my reputation back up after those spammers with the vendetta destroyed it in my H1 > H2 post."

Creating a system that encourages people to break the rules is never a good idea, and if this reputation system were to be implemented in the way you propose, I think that you'd see an explosion of alternate accounts, which in turn could lead to spamming, excessive flaming, and other violations of the rules.

Arrogance
I never use the word "elitism," but I am referring to the same idea that other posters have ascribed to this term. In other words, with a reputation system, you would see an explosion of posts that state something along the lines of:Posted by: CompleteJerk789
Uh you're a complete blam so get off this site and never come back... I see that Fluke has a reputation of 4 green bars while you only have a 1 red-bar reputation so STFU GTFO blam blam blam etc.
These forums should never breed arrogance or "elitism," and a user should never be evaluated on what amounts to a popularity contest.

In Conclusion
Even worse, the end result of all of these problems negates the entire purpose of a reputation system in the first place. I see no need for a "rep" system if that system's integrity is undermined by spammers, alt accounts, troublemakers, and what amounts to "cheaters."

The idea of giving rewards for "good posts" and "trustworthy users" is one that has been stated time and time again here to be a well-intentioned one. Indeed, Achronos has stated that an internal, invisible algorithm is currently rating users to determine their trustworthiness, and that this system may or may not eventually evolve into some kinds of ratings-and-rewards system that is actually visible to us users. But any idea along these lines must be subjected to the unique issues and problems to be seen on these forums, and needs careful thought to be sure that it's a worthwhile and useful tool rather than superficial flamebait.

[Edited on 04.30.2007 3:43 PM PDT]

  • 04.30.2007 3:33 PM PDT
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Tact is for those who aren't witty enough to be sarcastic.

No use cryin' over Spillt Milk

Posted by: x Foman123 x
Posted by: Fluke Hawkins
Rep, however, I want to defend. @ SS_Zag: What do you mean by user feedback? What I'm thinking is V_Bulliten style rep: You like the post, you +rep, you don't, you -rep. Personally, I think that a big red bar underneath somebody's name would tell people "Don't be like this guy, he's a idiot" and a big green bar underneath somebody's name would say "This guy is awesome. Listen and aspire to be like him."

No, sorry Fluke. I like the general thought behind your idea and I think that the purposes behind it are noble ones. But this is not a simple matter of sticking a reputation button under every post.

As you've proposed it, with no checks or balances, your reputation system open to the general public here would be a disaster. Here's why:

Vendettas
Sometimes arguments here can get heated. No matter what the particular forum -- Halo 2, Halo 3, the Flood, the Septagon, or anywhere else, people can get into pretty intense debates. Moreover, some people dislike others based purely on that person's opinions.

For example: try going to the Halo 3 forum and making a post about Halo 1 being better than Halo 2, or vice versa. You will get flamed and insulted into oblivion. Were there to be a reputation system, every person who disliked your opinion would vote "-Rep." A couple dozen of these could completely ruin a reputation that you worked hard to build up.

Do you really want to have to self-censor and avoid talking about certain topics just to preserve some phony reputation? I sure don't.

Multiple Accounts
This site has a rather unique problem with some individuals creating dozens of multiple accounts that they use for either neutral or nefarious purposes (depending on the person). A reputation system would -- and there is no dispute about this -- encourage even more of this kind of behavior, as users created multiple accounts just to give themselves a better reputation.

These users might even try to justify it -- "I'm just trying to get my reputation back up after those spammers with the vendetta destroyed it in my H1 > H2 post."

Creating a system that encourages people to break the rules is never a good idea, and if this reputation system were to be implemented in the way you propose, I think that you'd see an explosion of alternate accounts, which in turn could lead to spamming, excessive flaming, and other violations of the rules.

Arrogance
I never use the word "elitism," but I am referring to the same idea that other posters have ascribed to this term. In other words, with a reputation system, you would see an explosion of posts that state something along the lines of:Posted by: CompleteJerk789
Uh you're a complete blam so get off this site and never come back... I see that Fluke has a reputation of 4 green bars while you only have a 1 red-bar reputation so STFU GTFO blam blam blam etc.
These forums should never breed arrogance or "elitism," and a user should never be evaluated on what amounts to a popularity contest.

In Conclusion
Even worse, the end result of all of these problems negates the entire purpose of a reputation system in the first place. I see no need for a "rep" system if that system's integrity is undermined by spammers, alt accounts, troublemakers, and what amounts to "cheaters."

The idea of giving rewards for "good posts" and "trustworthy users" is one that has been stated time and time again here to be a well-intentioned one. Indeed, Achronos has stated that an internal, invisible algorithm is currently rating users to determine their trustworthiness, and that this system may or may not eventually evolve into some kinds of ratings-and-rewards system that is actually visible to us users. But any idea along these lines must be subjected to the unique issues and problems to be seen on these forums, and needs careful thought to be sure that it's a worthwhile and useful tool rather than superficial flamebait.


Jeez...

Take a breath.

  • 04.30.2007 5:16 PM PDT
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Hm. Well, I see the point about the rep spamming. I'm speaking from my experience with VBulliten, which does have a check on the rep function- You can only rep a certain person's posts X number of times. Say this number is three. You can rep 3 of a person's posts before you have to wait to rep more of their posts. Or we could do it RvB style- they've got Karma points, I.E. this as its really kind of hard to explain.

All I think is we need a better way to reach out and touch people whose spamtardedness make me want to hurt myself.

EDIT: Also, I didn't realize the problem you guys have with MuPs, what with my VBulliten experience and whatnot.

[Edited on 04.30.2007 6:52 PM PDT]

  • 04.30.2007 6:50 PM PDT
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Stupidity is not a bannable offense. If someone breaks the rules, you can report them via PM, [email]bnetmods@gmail.com[/email] or over MSN to one of the mods.

Until then, learn to use the amazing power of will and ignore the stupid people.
-TGP-

  • 04.30.2007 7:16 PM PDT
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*ignores TGP*
I will now summarize Foman's post.
User input = bad.
Thank you, thank you. For my next trick, I will vanish from this thread.
*loud bang, cloud of smoke, hacking coughs*

  • 04.30.2007 8:59 PM PDT