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  • Subject: Pros
Subject: Pros

My last thread: Why Reach Sucks

<3 Foman

Posted by: Sketto
Posted by: Zach The One
So Yes a morbidly Obese man can still be an athlete, a professional one at that. Because he's trained his mind, not his body. And as far as I know the mind is classified as a muscle.

<3 Zach


Your mind is an organ I don't think it's classified as a muscle. But I don't think that's integral to your argument.


I don't see how just because you get better at something the more you play/do it makes you an athlete.

Just making sure: you would consider chess players athletes, correct?


As long as golfers are. And i golf =D

  • 06.26.2007 4:37 PM PDT
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I hate this argument, because it never ends and it will always be brought up again. Bottom line is the argument is a lot stronger to consider Gaming a sport and Pro Gamers athletes.

  • 06.26.2007 4:39 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sketto
Posted by: Deceiver196_
So a fat person cannot be an athlete?


Depends on your definition of "fat" and "morbidly obese"



So an extremely obese person cannot be an athlete?

[Edited on 06.26.2007 4:40 PM PDT]

  • 06.26.2007 4:40 PM PDT
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Posted by: Ix ReX xI
Posted by: metalmoses
i didnt say it takes no skill, there is professional checkers isn't there, but who really cares

If the improvements made in the beta carry through we might actually have a legit pro community with people that are actually good at video games.

Im just saying that a lot of mature, more skilled players are turned off by the horrid multiplayer experience of hl2 and go to other games that have much more established dominant pro circuits, like cal for example.




If they have no skill, and they're not good enough then why do they have mansions from winnings they got from beating hundreds of other people...if it takes no skill I'd think there would be a huge variety in the top teams.


Yeah, seriously.

It just annoys me how CS kids dog Halo2 so much. Why? because it isn't EXACTLY like CS. Yes, aiming in Halo2 isn't as hard, but that's because its a different type of game. CS is so much about aiming skill, and getting headshots. Halo2 isn't about that. Halo2 takes a lot more melee skill, grenading skill, weapon control(does CS even involve weapon control).

Not to mention, a game like Halo2 needs auto-aim, it would be horrible without it.

  • 06.26.2007 4:41 PM PDT
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Posted by: metalmoses
i didnt say it takes no skill, there is professional checkers isn't there, but who really cares

If the improvements made in the beta carry through we might actually have a legit pro community with people that are actually good at video games.

Im just saying that a lot of mature, more skilled players are turned off by the horrid multiplayer experience of hl2 and go to other games that have much more established dominant pro circuits, like cal for example.




Moses, I can see where you're getting at, but you're still not recognizing the fact that there better players out there who can beat most others. That's why they're pro.

I don't see why you're saying Halo 2's community isn't a "legit" pro community. Sure, this game isn't the hardest to master, but there are still many teams and people out there who are really beast at this game, and are better than others.

edit

And I've faced a lot of good people who absolutely wreck me LOL so yeah I can tell you firsthand there's some real talent out there in this game.

[Edited on 06.26.2007 4:43 PM PDT]

  • 06.26.2007 4:42 PM PDT
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I like to Rollick

Posted by: Deceiver196_
Posted by: Sketto
Posted by: Deceiver196_
So a fat person cannot be an athlete?


Depends on your definition of "fat" and "morbidly obese"



So an extremely obese person cannot be an athlete?


hehe um what if I say yes?

Perhaps I was too hasty in saying "morbidly obese" you see because sumo wrestlers of course are athletes. I was looking for a term to describe a person who only could play halo 2 and nothing else.

  • 06.26.2007 4:46 PM PDT

My last thread: Why Reach Sucks

<3 Foman

Posted by: ICEMAN ASSASS1N
Posted by: metalmoses
i didnt say it takes no skill, there is professional checkers isn't there, but who really cares

If the improvements made in the beta carry through we might actually have a legit pro community with people that are actually good at video games.

Im just saying that a lot of mature, more skilled players are turned off by the horrid multiplayer experience of hl2 and go to other games that have much more established dominant pro circuits, like cal for example.




Moses, I can see where you're getting at, but you're still not recognizing the fact that there better players out there who can beat most others. That's why they're pro.

I don't see why you're saying Halo 2's community isn't a "legit" pro community. Sure, this game isn't the hardest to master, but there are still many teams and people out there who are really beast at this game, and are better than others.

edit

And I've faced a lot of good people who absolutely wreck me LOL so yeah I can tell you firsthand there's some real talent out there in this game.



I've been through this argument of halo2 vs CS, they're different games, with different equipment. Yes lets compare golf vs. football. I love smart people. They make me happy.

  • 06.26.2007 4:46 PM PDT
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Posted by: Ix ReX xI
I hate this argument, because it never ends and it will always be brought up again. Bottom line is the argument is a lot stronger to consider Gaming a sport and Pro Gamers athletes.


Problem is that no matter how we may back up our claims with evidence and rational thought, the opposing side will attempt to do the same.

Both sides think they're right. I don't think anyone in this thread has had their opinion on MLG/Pro gamers changed (whether you support it or oppose it.)

I mean, we can keep arguing, it's at least entertaining to see a (mostly) intelligent discussion on these forums. Everyone has mostly kept their cool, and displayed maturity. So.......I guess that's a good thing.

Even though neither side is going to agree with each other LOL

Carry on :-D

[Edited on 06.26.2007 4:48 PM PDT]

  • 06.26.2007 4:46 PM PDT
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Most people that claim this game takes no skill are not known or even amateur. If you beat a pro, or a pro says this game takes no skill...all bets are off and I agree with you...but until that happens this game takes an insane amount of skill to master. Go to MLG and you'll see that.


Dinner BRB :D

[Edited on 06.26.2007 4:52 PM PDT]

  • 06.26.2007 4:51 PM PDT
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Posted by: FKxPandemic
and you definitely need stamina to play at a consistent level all day long.


(And Iceman too)

But then you are implying a split, (I think)

Professional Gamers are athletes but regular gamers are not. That is the split I think you're getting at. (please correct me if I am wrong)

The only problem is that when you look around what other sports are like that? Is a professional golfer an athlete but and amateur one is not? Is a Professional Basketball player an athlete but a streeball player isn't?

[Edited on 06.26.2007 4:55 PM PDT]

  • 06.26.2007 4:54 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sketto
Posted by: FKxPandemic
and you definitely need stamina to play at a consistent level all day long.


(And Iceman too)

But then you are implying a split, (I think)

Professional Gamers are athletes but regular gamers are not. That is the split I think you're getting at. (please correct me if I am wrong)

The only problem is that when you look around what other sports are like that? Is a professional golfer an athlete but and amateur one is not? Is a Professional Basketball player an athlete but a streeball player isn't?


I'd say yes. Its just a hobby at the non competitive level. Like I said earlier, i think its two different kinds of sports. there's the atheltic sports, which are always sprts, and the recreational sports, which are hobbies that are made into sporst at the competitive level.

  • 06.26.2007 4:56 PM PDT
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Posted by: Ix ReX xI
Most people that claim this game takes no skill are not known or even amateur. If you beat a pro, or a pro says this game takes no skill...all bets are off and I agree with you...but until that happens this game takes an insane amount of skill to master. Go to MLG and you'll see that.


Exactly what I've been saying for the longest while. People who say Halo 2 takes no skill are way off base.

Sure, a guest who just picked up the game can probably kill an experienced level 40 if he has shot him 3 times in the back and the experienced player can't react in time to save himself, but that doesn't mean this game is unskilled. It means that there's more to it than pure ability.

There are times when I'll say to myself "I wish he couldn't kill me so easily" but hey, I have the same tools at my disposal he does. The aim assist is high, but it's no excuse for when you get outplayed. I wish more people realized that.

Heck, I'm still trying to figure out this game. There's more to it than having a decent BR. Much much more.




[Edited on 06.26.2007 4:59 PM PDT]

  • 06.26.2007 4:59 PM PDT
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Posted by: FKxPandemic
I'd say yes. Its just a hobby at the non competitive level. Like I said earlier, i think its two different kinds of sports. there's the atheltic sports, which are always sprts, and the recreational sports, which are hobbies that are made into sporst at the competitive level.


Ok, but what about the people who go to an MLG for and FFA and get knocked out in the first round. They are in the competitive level, but they didn't show any stamina according to yourself. So I think a better word should be "professional level"

And I err consider Gaming a sport, but I don't consider them athletes at any level.



[Edited on 06.26.2007 5:02 PM PDT]

  • 06.26.2007 5:00 PM PDT
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Posted by: FKxPandemic
Posted by: Sketto
Posted by: FKxPandemic
and you definitely need stamina to play at a consistent level all day long.


(And Iceman too)

But then you are implying a split, (I think)

Professional Gamers are athletes but regular gamers are not. That is the split I think you're getting at. (please correct me if I am wrong)

The only problem is that when you look around what other sports are like that? Is a professional golfer an athlete but and amateur one is not? Is a Professional Basketball player an athlete but a streeball player isn't?


I'd say yes. Its just a hobby at the non competitive level. Like I said earlier, i think its two different kinds of sports. there's the atheltic sports, which are always sprts, and the recreational sports, which are hobbies that are made into sporst at the competitive level.


Agreed.

My gosh........do you think we've found the compromise for this arguement?

If so, halle-freakin-luah

[Edited on 06.26.2007 5:01 PM PDT]

  • 06.26.2007 5:01 PM PDT
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Let me sum this all up!

Professional Football Players (Don't be a smartass and say "WHAT ABOUT COLLEGE AND STUFF", you know what I mean)
are athletes but kids playing at school are not, it is basically a hobby. Same goes for gaming. Pros, and people at the competitive level are athletes, and people who play at home, not competitively are not athletes. An athlete (imo) is a master of whatever they are an athlete at, making there tons of different kinds of athletes.

This game takes a tremendous amount of skill, and you can quote ICEMAN's and my earlier posts to know why.

And the game is a sport because it takes a superiour amount of composure, skill, consentration, power of will, luck, agility, and stamina. Every sport requires a little bit of all of those.

  • 06.26.2007 5:16 PM PDT

Posted by: Zach The One
I must say you throughly convinced me to slam on my brakes and make a complete 180 from pro to anti-gaming. I mean you definately took into account my first hand experience that your ignorant ass has never been through, and then applied it to your point of view. I definately think of gaming as never ever for any reason being anything more than just for fun. I mean playing competetively for money? when has money ever put something to a level past recreation?

You want to reply like a little kid? then I'll talk to you like a little kid. Let me first show you what I wrote:
Playing Halo 2, whether for competition, for fun, or for money, is RECREATION no matter how you guys try to spin it. Just because a select few get a bonus for playing 8 hours a day, everyday, does not mean it constitutes as being a job.

That being said, you can do anything in the world for money.. does that make it a job? NO. I won $100 at the roulette table, does that mean its my job now? way to miss the point completely.

I dunno man, i mean obviously all landscaping is recreation because some people enjoy gardening and shaping their yards. Obviously being a chef is completely recreational because I enjoy cooking, even since I was 8! I mean if an 8 year old can cook, it must be a joke of a job for a 40 year old MAN to do it. AH HAHAHA, it's just laughable how now, because of your argument, I know see almost all middle class jobs as completely recreational. I don't know how I didn't see it before!!! Navillus, I present to you the Nobel Peace prize for single handedly, and permanently, ending this debate.

I forgot where I said anything enjoyable = recreation. Can you PLEASE quote it for me? Pretty please? Oh wait... that's right... you're a moron.

And for your information Navillus, who is obviously santa clause in disguise because he knows what everyone does all the time. I started working at 16 at a Junk Yard doing inventory and dealing with customers, then at an Auto Body doing prep and recon, I've done days with a septic friend of my family who pays out big for dealing with "poop", and I've done a whole "poop" load of carpentry. So overall Mr. Clause AKA (ha HAaAA! I knew santa was real!!!!) Navillus, I have worked many real jobs.

Thats also true.. right on the money. I know what everyone does! Holy crap what a discovery! And after working all those jobs, do you sit back and consider playing games a job? And tell the truth little boy.. because I obviously know who's naughty and who's nice.


You should probably take a step back from yourself and realize that I'm trying to inform you of the other side of the argument no one else here has been able to show. Your disregard for what I've posted acts as a crystal clear window, showing your stuborn ignorance and bias against gaming as a job. It is just as much work as most other jobs. You do not understand and choose not to accept it. Even when I've shown exactly what it takes to be pro, so you YOURSELF can make your own juxtaposition. You should probably just bow out of this discussion now before your pride drops below the suicide line.


So now I'm stubborn and ignorant because I don't consider playing a video game, whether in leagues or tournaments, a job? You might as well call society ignorant and stubborn then. Wake up and smell the coffee kid.

Oh I forgot... its just as much work as other jobs huh? you might as well start telling yourself the world is flat and believing it as well.


No scope headshoting Noobullus all day,
Zach


His true maturity level comes out! Thanks for wasting my time Zachery.

  • 06.26.2007 5:29 PM PDT

Posted by: Zach The One
There's much more work and hours needed to be a pro gamer. A lot of the people pushing themselves right now have dropped out of school for more time to practise. You again, are in no place to shoot down my experiences because you compare it to a sport where natural athletic prowess is the main factor. In halo it's your mind. You must train your mind, and the mustles in your fingures to be the best. 99.9% of people couldn't possibly be pro because there's a mental limit to what you can reach, or the progress is so slow its almost intangible. The same goes for the ability to play soccer. But you played semi-pro in the chicago area. For us to make money we have to be the best IN THE WORLD. Swollow that one for a second, let me know if you choke.


Um, every professional sport requires strong mental capabilities. How can you say there is much more work and hours? Have you ever reached any type of pro level? You have to physically train daily, keep a scheduled diet, run, lift, practice outside of practice...etc etc. how much work do these professional gamers have to do besides play halo 2? honestly... what do they have to do besides play halo 2. Dont say "come up with strategies" BECAUSE THEY DO SO WHILE PLAYING HALO 2. So since you seem to be a self-appointed expert, please let us all know.

  • 06.26.2007 5:36 PM PDT

Posted by: Zach The One
you forgot control over mind(nerves), and intelligence for two huge ones mr. no such thing as a mental athlete. Obviously you've never seen a math team meet.

and why did everyone ignore my replies... or atleast laugh at how bad that navillus guy is at making an argument.


Why dont you walk up and down the street making these claims, see how many people laugh in your face. I'm here to be the voice of society and reality. Making a fool of yourself and of MLG with your posts is not helping to change my, or anyone else's minds like me. I think the other guys on this forum who have provided good arguments should restrain you from making any more posts of this garbage you keep typing.

  • 06.26.2007 5:40 PM PDT

Posted by: ICEMAN ASSASS1N
Posted by: Zach The One
you forgot control over mind(nerves), and intelligence for two huge ones mr. no such thing as a mental athlete. Obviously you've never seen a math team meet.

and why did everyone ignore my replies... .


Your replies weren't ignored, they were really good. Pretty sensible arguments in there.


Or because I was driving home from work. I prefer arguing with ICEMAN because hes not a jagoff.

Be back later or tomorrow.. so dont worry about me while im gone! Kisses!

  • 06.26.2007 5:44 PM PDT
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Yo I outsnipe Naded on his host across the map Im better than him :D

http://www.bungie.net/Stats/GameStatsHalo2.aspx?gameid=721585 630&player=Chimp%20iz%20BaK

  • 06.26.2007 6:32 PM PDT
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You lost and it's team snipers...:/

  • 06.26.2007 7:03 PM PDT
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Job - A regular activity performed in exchange for payment, especially as one's trade, occupation, or profession.

Given that definition, would it be wrong for me to assume that Pro, contracted gamers and those who are sponsored can call gaming their job(Basicly the people who get paid)? The rest of the players not getting paid could just be considered players seeking employment in gaming through MLG.

Just something I wanna throw on the table.

  • 06.26.2007 7:56 PM PDT
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the game started and i saw walshy on the other team so i just quit becuase i was scared that he would hurt me. i went to my mommy and she gave my a big lollipop and the bad walshy was all gone.

  • 06.26.2007 8:00 PM PDT
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I played Walshey, good teamplayer, not much else, he plays the same master chief as everyone else.

  • 06.26.2007 8:12 PM PDT

Halo 1>Halo 2>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>Halo 3

Want to hear a funny joke? Marijuana prohibition.

I did a match with ghandi once (whose gamertag is scottaaay)

  • 06.26.2007 9:01 PM PDT