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  • Subject: The host advantage disussion.
Subject: The host advantage disussion.
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host is just random or whoever gets into the MM first (hence host box). and when you talk about the crappy game with all these things not registering it just means someone has bad connection and game is laggy. and im sure you know what lagy game is like people walkiing to walls and shots not killing them. And about that lunging through each other i have noticed too and my guess would be again bad connection aka bad host, really bad.

BTW: Host doesn't determine everything in a game its not all big and godsend power you think it is. host just allows you whether to cheat like modd and you can maybe shoot a little farther with a weapon more accurate and you can grenade jump which is about it.

  • 07.28.2007 6:17 AM PDT
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Posted by: Heroyi
host is just random or whoever gets into the MM first (hence host box). and when you talk about the crappy game with all these things not registering it just means someone has bad connection and game is laggy. and im sure you know what lagy game is like people walkiing to walls and shots not killing them. And about that lunging through each other i have noticed too and my guess would be again bad connection aka bad host, really bad.

BTW: Host doesn't determine everything in a game its not all big and godsend power you think it is. host just allows you whether to cheat like modd and you can maybe shoot a little farther with a weapon more accurate and you can grenade jump which is about it.
lunging through on the beatdown was part of a patch by bungie recently to make beatdowns more powerful. its very similar to the way bd's worked in the beta

  • 07.28.2007 6:34 AM PDT
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oh well that was jst a guess on my part lol

  • 07.28.2007 6:59 AM PDT

Host isn't just decided by the bandwidth of your connection. It takes location into account and how much you quit also, I heard. You have a hosting record stored on your console and I'm not sure exactly what criteria are recorded in it, but it's used in deciding host. When the last patch (1.5) was applied to the game I think it may have reset the records and hosts have been more random since, though in theory it should be getting better.

Taking location into account isn't all that effective because matchmaking matches players up from all over the place. Put it this way, if there are 6 US players in the game and 2 UK players, one of the ones in the US will get it as they have better connectivity to the most players in the game. So it is the best host for that game, but the game might not be that great for all the players they matched into it.

  • 07.28.2007 7:01 AM PDT
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Here are my two cents.. I play a lot.. more than a lot of you.

I played a stream of games of probably 10-15 the other day, in which the party leader couldn't get a host box to save his life.. I continually told him to give it to me, because I knew I had a good connection.. We kept going in and getting handled game after game.. Yeah, we won a few because it was either a really bad team, or a level where host isn't as big of a deal.. but when we'd get into Desolation, Warlock, and Ascension, where the maps are open and BR's go all the way cross map, etc.. it's insanity.

I have had instances where on Warlock I will see the guy top mid and shoot him 2 or 3x in the face, and he'd turn around to be shot 4/5 more times in the back while he runs away and off the edge..wtf?? How many times do I have to shoot you? Then when the same thing goes the opposite way, even if I shoot him FIRST, and we shoot head to head, he will 4 shot me and it will take me 5/6?? MMk.

It kinda be really, really, laaaame. I've had host taken from my host box plenty of times, too. I really don't get it.


  • 07.28.2007 12:21 PM PDT

Halo 1 > Halo 2 > Halo 3

Word of advice. Don't trust getting the host boxes all the time. You might get the host box and the game will still give it to someone else or someone will try to take it from you. The latter usually gets booted now if they try but sometimes they can still pull it off. Also, a person can quit continuously and still get host because I know of a lot of unranked games that I've played that the host is usually the first to quit thus putting everyone in the blue screen. If they do it once in an unranked game then they probably do it again and again and they still keep getting host.

Luckilly, in Halo 3 host advantage isn't as big of a problem. The host may still be able to kill faster than everyone else but I rarely saw any sort of advantage that a single player had over another simply due to connections. Halo 2 had a crappy host system now Halo 3 has fixed it.

  • 07.28.2007 2:17 PM PDT
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sighs......host doesnt not what so ever give you super power to kill someone faster. The only thing host may do is allow you to do is shoot farther is i know for a fact. I have talk to guys who have played halo alot and are some pros and have said that load is BS. its just when your host your suppose tp have beter connection so all your bullets will or should register in making the illusion "faster bullets" happen on xbox live.

  • 07.28.2007 2:23 PM PDT

Halo 1 > Halo 2 > Halo 3

Posted by: Heroyi
sighs......host doesnt not what so ever give you super power to kill someone faster. The only thing host may do is allow you to do is shoot farther is i know for a fact. I have talk to guys who have played halo alot and are some pros and have said that load is BS. its just when your host your suppose tp have beter connection so all your bullets will or should register in making the illusion "faster bullets" happen on xbox live.


Apparently, you have never played a game of SWAT Carbines before. Try fighting the host with that weapon and see who constantly wins. I've had several games where I've shot people in the head multiple times with a Carbine only to have them turn around and kill me with one. Your buddies must get host a lot. That's the only explanation as to why they don't notice any difference in gameplay.

  • 07.28.2007 2:27 PM PDT
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Posted by: XeroHunter
Posted by: Heroyi
sighs......host doesnt not what so ever give you super power to kill someone faster. The only thing host may do is allow you to do is shoot farther is i know for a fact. I have talk to guys who have played halo alot and are some pros and have said that load is BS. its just when your host your suppose tp have beter connection so all your bullets will or should register in making the illusion "faster bullets" happen on xbox live.


Apparently, you have never played a game of SWAT Carbines before. Try fighting the host with that weapon and see who constantly wins. I've had several games where I've shot people in the head multiple times with a Carbine only to have them turn around and kill me with one. Your buddies must get host a lot. That's the only explanation as to why they don't notice any difference in gameplay.


actually no. Well i would argue back but there is insufficient info for me to based on your sWAT game. but ill assume that you were medium range and aiming at head. First off were you aimin at head if so then ok one down. Secondly i dont know if you r anybody noticed that if you shoot constitanly (sry cant spell today) you shots are erratic and doesnt fly straight and true, instead you wanna shoot it like a semi automatic but little slower like wait till recoil from gun goes away (i dont know if you got that) then it flies good. Assuming how many shoot carbines you probably pulled trigger as fast as you can which is okay but yea that might be why you dont kill em.Oh btw you know its pretty hard to kill someone from the back wih a carbine aiming for headsot cause you have to aim just a little above that block or whatever you call head from the middle and auto aim does the rest

  • 07.28.2007 2:45 PM PDT

Halo 1 > Halo 2 > Halo 3

Posted by: Heroyi
actually no. Well i would argue back but there is insufficient info for me to based on your sWAT game. but ill assume that you were medium range and aiming at head. First off were you aimin at head if so then ok one down. Secondly i dont know if you r anybody noticed that if you shoot constitanly (sry cant spell today) you shots are erratic and doesnt fly straight and true, instead you wanna shoot it like a semi automatic but little slower like wait till recoil from gun goes away (i dont know if you got that) then it flies good. Assuming how many shoot carbines you probably pulled trigger as fast as you can which is okay but yea that might be why you dont kill em.Oh btw you know its pretty hard to kill someone from the back wih a carbine aiming for headsot cause you have to aim just a little above that block or whatever you call head from the middle and auto aim does the rest


I guess I should have also added that in these particular games, if I get host (which is rare) I own a lot more people than usual. I don't play any differently than I did in the games where I wasn't host and now I'm killing more whether it's the front of their head or the back. I notice this a lot if I have host. Not many people can beat me when I have a BR and host. I went a whole game in Sanctuary CTF with 31 kills, 0 deaths. I was able to kill everyone with only four shots from the BR no matter where they were. However, if I wasn't host that same exact game would have gone differently because I would have to use more shots to kill someone and I probably would have died a few times.

[Edited on 07.28.2007 2:52 PM PDT]

  • 07.28.2007 2:50 PM PDT
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So, you're telling us all host doesn't mean a thing, huh?

Why don't we go play a 4v4 game of shotguns on Beaver Creek 1 flag, and at the end you tell me if host matters or not.

What a tool.

  • 07.28.2007 3:27 PM PDT

SB-117

Moving to the Halo 2 forum. This is more about H2s network code than Matchmaking itself.

  • 07.28.2007 3:36 PM PDT
Subject: The host advantage disussion.
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So here I go, I have not said anything for a very long time because I know that this is bungies first online game, and I think they did very well for the most part. For the rest I am sure it will be much better in Halo 3.

However, Has the host advantage got worse over the last few months, or are the hosts just getting worse? I am not bragging about my internet by any means, but one thing I notice is that when I get host it seems to be a decently fair game. Shotgun is consistant even off host, BR is decently consistant, snipe works, everyone can four shot. This is not me saying these things, but other people saying I have a good host.

Then I get in some games that the host is just ridiculous. Nothing works at all. Br doesn't register from 10 feet away, shotty doesn't work at all. Beatdowns are useless. Grenades don't take people shields down, nothing. How do these people get host? What is the deciding factor in getting host? Do you just go with the fastest DL speed or is it completely random? Do you check up and down? Do you check centralized location between poeple? I just don't get it.

Can someone please fill me in on why some people have such a ridiculous host advantage?

I think my biggeest question though, is when did this lunging through each other during a melee thing start happening? I don't remember that from back in the day.

  • 07.28.2007 12:49 AM PDT

The strength of host varies between each host. A good player with a great host will own a game. Host almost always has a definite advantage. Host has a huge effect on the outcome of a game and means the difference between four-shotting and having to seven-shot somebody. Big difference.

  • 07.28.2007 4:06 PM PDT
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With host you can expect every bullet to hit, since everything is real time.
When you're off host, many people don't realize this, but they have to adjust their playing style when you're off host. You can't directly shoot at the guy, you have to lead the person you are shooting a bit (depending on the distance and the latency on the host).
When you're host all your bullets hit if you're accurate, but when you're offhost they might not, which is why you have to aim a little offkey when you're offhost to compensate for that. For example if someones running to the right on midship and you're across the map, you should aim at a distance about a few spaces to the right of his head, you can't aim directly at his head. This is why so many people complain "I put X amount of shots into this guy and he doesn't die!". Well that is because theoretically the shots aren't hitting him on his screen. So to play better off host you have to play as if you're a split second behind, because you are in fact more or less a split second behind.

  • 07.28.2007 5:06 PM PDT
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Posted by: DYMATIZE
The strength of host varies between each host. A good player with a great host will own a game. Host almost always has a definite advantage. Host has a huge effect on the outcome of a game and means the difference between four-shotting and having to seven-shot somebody. Big difference.


I agree with that somewhat, except for the good player with a great host. When someone has a great host the host advantage becomes less and less obvious. Like I was saying about my host, everyone can four shot with decent consistancy most of the time. Then on some hosts the host has 15 head shots a 50%+ hit percentage and 10 more kills than anyone else. While the players off host in those games have 1 or 2 headshots, 4 or 5 kills. A 30% hit, and no chance of winning.

Wy does this happen? Is it a user based problem? Meaning they actually have a good host, but they are trying to watch -blam!- and play at the same time?

  • 07.28.2007 5:11 PM PDT
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Posted by: Done DL
With host you can expect every bullet to hit, since everything is real time.
When you're off host, many people don't realize this, but they have to adjust their playing style when you're off host. You can't directly shoot at the guy, you have to lead the person you are shooting a bit (depending on the distance and the latency on the host).
When you're host all your bullets hit if you're accurate, but when you're offhost they might not, which is why you have to aim a little offkey when you're offhost to compensate for that. For example if someones running to the right on midship and you're across the map, you should aim at a distance about a few spaces to the right of his head, you can't aim directly at his head. This is why so many people complain "I put X amount of shots into this guy and he doesn't die!". Well that is because theoretically the shots aren't hitting him on his screen. So to play better off host you have to play as if you're a split second behind, because you are in fact more or less a split second behind.


A very good point. that might be the reason, i've stuck a person before and the plasma grenade was floating like 3 feet away from him.

  • 07.28.2007 5:18 PM PDT

Greatest of all time

Brute Shot + Host = Ownage

  • 07.28.2007 7:20 PM PDT
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Posted by: nickyfour92
Brute Shot + Host = Ownage

Only if you have the Alex Combo.

  • 07.28.2007 7:28 PM PDT
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Posted by: I SacramenT I
Posted by: nickyfour92
Brute Shot + Host = Ownage

Only if you have the Alex Combo.
CUE EFF TEE

  • 07.28.2007 7:36 PM PDT
Subject: The host advantage discussion.

Don't assume anything, because it makes an "ASS-" out of "-U-" and "-ME"

How do you know if your in the host box? Which is the host box? Could Bungie make it show which is the Host Box and who is the Host? Wouldn't it be on a dedicated server?

  • 07.28.2007 7:59 PM PDT

I guess all the thread posters are from the USA? Working with a majority assumption there, I believe none of you have the necessary experience with international latency & lag. If you're only talking about USA hosts/players then the below is true to a much lesser extent, hence the common believe by some people that host does not have a huge advantage.

Being Host or even being located in the same country/continent is in fact a huge advantage! I have thousands upon thousands of first hand experienced games from Australia, let me tell you all there is an advantage in every respect. Reactions, accuracy, walking speeds, network predictions, splash damage, non-assassinations, overall damage dished out and even your level of damage to others.

To be more specific, how about picking up a weapon and 15 steps later your gun finally cycles to the new weapon OR shooting yourself in the back with a rocket fired 20 steps ago OR latency updates and you find yourself falling off of lockout again OR sniping gold visors three times in a row then watching the same guy simply walk off (and I'm talking about a guy standing perfectly still)? Anyhow, this could go on for ages.

Simply if you have never played an internationally hosted game, then you simply don't realise the difference of advantage.

Granted if all players were in say Texas and within 40 miles of each other, then yes host advantage is drastically reduced. Oppositely if players in the same game were spread from east to west across America then lag/latency would occur more.

As far as halo 3 goes, I believe now many weapons are validated against what you see onyour screen VS. what the host decides. Hence why we have so many reports from the halo 3 beta about the shotgun always working, Client vs Host validation.

[Edited on 07.28.2007 8:20 PM PDT]

  • 07.28.2007 8:18 PM PDT

Another point worth mentioning about host advantage, I'll go on record about my personal games being a reflection of host advantage -

I know I have a lot of games to look through. But if you cared to look, you'd find a pattern to host vs winning team vs individual player performance -

1. When a USA player gets host, my (Aussie) performance is much lower overall (less medals, less objective accomplishments, less kills & more deaths). Here it is not uncommon to go 5/10 kills to 15/20 deaths and lose 3 scores vs 1 or 2 vs 0 etc.

2. In Aussie hosted customs or when Aussie parties are lucky enough to get host, the games simply speak for themselves. It's really not uncommon to go 18/25 kills to 5/10 deaths and win 3 scores 0, other team quits quickly etc.

3. When you see poor performance it isn't always down to poor skills, not everyone has ideal physical locations or reliable speedy connections.

Please forget flaming, telling me I suck etc. No point to it, I'll still play the game and so will you. Also I go into matchmaking as a single/random Aussie on a USA host most times. Frankly I care nothing for rank or K/D ratio or what trash you may post in this manner. I enjoy playing with a wide variety of people when I play, not the same friends over and over. The tactics, strategies and gametypes etc just get too boring for me.

I am a skirmish player, not slayer so don't trash talk my KDR thanks, again no point to it. Further I choose not to button glitch or cheat in anyway. Yes I can BXR & RRX but again i choose not to cheat.

Alas until Halo 3 and no cheating, at least for a short period until new cheats hit. Good luck with that battle Bungie.

  • 07.28.2007 8:37 PM PDT