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  • Subject: In depth explanation of the Halo 3 skill ranking system.
Subject: In depth explanation of the Halo 3 skill ranking system.
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I agree with all this. The skill system is broken. I went twenty and four in a game yesterday and didn't go up for it, and that happened like four times. I also love how I can win ten games and not go up, then lose one and go down for it.

And that whole partner leveling up thing happens to me too. I hate that, especially when I do better than them every game. The part of it including the amount of games played makes it unfair, people get better as they play more, it should level you up based on the performance of only like the 5 games you play in a row. Not your past games. It needs to be fixed, soon.

  • 01.06.2008 11:26 AM PDT
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Posted by: I3aLiStiK WolF
OK explain this...

Today I've played 25 games straight of Lone Wolves. I've came in **1st place 22 times**, came 3rd twice and came **6th once due to being lagged out!**

When I started I was level 1, so how after that am I only a level 11!? Check my games played for proof.


You are not supposed to go up every game. In fact,as you play more it will start to be every 4-8 games. The system is still unsure of your rank so it is ranking you conservatively. One of my other gamertags is almost identical to what is happening to you. Then I lost a game and actually went up.

  • 01.06.2008 12:15 PM PDT
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From 2faced"Looking at your games shows little different reality. What I saw was you winning 10 games in a row and moving from a 21-24. You did lose the 24 after the next loss but you gained it back after just 1 win (you were probably on the border). After that you won some and lost some and ultimatly won about 62% of the next 45 games. You reached a 28 but due to losing 7 of your last 9 games you dropped to a 26. All told in your last 55 games you've moved up up 4 levels and won about 70% of those games. That might seem slow, but you also have to consider almost all those games were played in a mixed party where you were the high rank. This is definitly going to slow you down. I'm not sure who "MR AZURE" is but I didn't see you playing with such a person. You were definitly the high rank in just about all those games. Your past history might also shed some light on the speed in which you can rank. If it took you a while to get to 22 things will naturally be slower. I didn't look at your past history though so I don't know if that has much to do with it, but that's also something to consider."

Thank you for the insight and taking time out of your way to look. It must just feel slow. My g/f Anjelicious who also plays with us was just ranking much faster and after I re-read everythign posted it does make sense. So thanks again!

ps- MR AZURE has played at least 80% of the games with me, maybe you just missed it. But thanks again! Now im stuck at a 33... is it worth me cancelling my account and starting over?


[Edited on 01.06.2008 3:23 PM PST]

  • 01.06.2008 3:22 PM PDT

Posted by: Sp1nCycl3ofD00M
I agree with all this. The skill system is broken. I went twenty and four in a game yesterday and didn't go up for it, and that happened like four times. I also love how I can win ten games and not go up, then lose one and go down for it.

And that whole partner leveling up thing happens to me too. I hate that, especially when I do better than them every game. The part of it including the amount of games played makes it unfair, people get better as they play more, it should level you up based on the performance of only like the 5 games you play in a row. Not your past games. It needs to be fixed, soon.
"All of this" or every post in this thread, or even most posts in this thread, don't say it's broken. Just because it doesn't work how you want it to work doesn't mean it's broken. It works how it was designed and a lot of people don't like it but there are some that do. Individual stats in a game don't account for anything as far as the skill system is concerned. With the amount of games you've played you are not going to go up a level after each win. You will only go up or down a level after each game early on or until you start performing how the system predicts you to perform. I looked through the last 10 pages of your history and the longest streak I saw was 7 wins in TD and you went up 1 level.

The system doesn't keep track of your past games and doesn't take streaks in to account. The reason the more you play makes it harder to level up OR down is because of your sigma (uncertainty) being lowered after every game. The amount of Mu and sigma change is calculated after each completed game. The new Mu, sigma and "default conservativeness" are then calculated to give you your new skill.

If you would like it fixed, what should it do? What is the issue you see with it?

  • 01.06.2008 3:53 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sp1nCycl3ofD00M
I agree with all this. The skill system is broken. I went twenty and four in a game yesterday and didn't go up for it, and that happened like four times. I also love how I can win ten games and not go up, then lose one and go down for it.

And that whole partner leveling up thing happens to me too. I hate that, especially when I do better than them every game. The part of it including the amount of games played makes it unfair, people get better as they play more, it should level you up based on the performance of only like the 5 games you play in a row. Not your past games. It needs to be fixed, soon.

That would be unfair. Then, you can play with level 50's, rank up real fast, become a 50 yourself and just play with your friends again.

  • 01.07.2008 10:25 AM PDT
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Very interesting read man. Thanks for the post.

  • 01.07.2008 12:45 PM PDT
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I think that the only problem with the trueskill system is losing a game and losing 1 or 2 levels when you are at your true skill lvl. If your at your true skill, it should at least be a little harder to lose levels at your true skill.

And for all of those having problems leveling up, I was stuck at 35 and couldn't get up, so I stopped playing ranked, played like 300 social games, for 4 weeks and the next time I played I leveled up to 45 within about 20-25 matches. Of course I lost 2 levels as soon as I got the 45 after losing the next game, but I don't play ranked a lot anyway. In fact, inspite of being one of Halo's all time fan's I find myself playing anything but Halo due to the lag and the few cheaters who play and think they are good.

  • 01.07.2008 2:19 PM PDT
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Posted by: Bluestreak2k5
I think that the only problem with the trueskill system is losing a game and losing 1 or 2 levels when you are at your true skill lvl. If your at your true skill, it should at least be a little harder to lose levels at your true skill.

And for all of those having problems leveling up, I was stuck at 35 and couldn't get up, so I stopped playing ranked, played like 300 social games, for 4 weeks and the next time I played I leveled up to 45 within about 20-25 matches. Of course I lost 2 levels as soon as I got the 45 after losing the next game, but I don't play ranked a lot anyway. In fact, inspite of being one of Halo's all time fan's I find myself playing anything but Halo due to the lag and the few cheaters who play and think they are good.


You bring up a good point. Once people initially top out they should stop playing ranked and go improve in social. At least that way they dont bury their sigma down close to 0 and get stuck in a situation where they need to winn 100 games to move up 12-15 levels.

As to your first point...remember true skill shown to you is not the same as the actual true skill they have computed behind the screens.

[Edited on 01.07.2008 5:43 PM PST]

  • 01.07.2008 5:42 PM PDT
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can you explain RC Brittle's highest skill after playing w/ his pro team and owning every game. played 100 exactly, 89 steaktaculars and his highest skill is a 13...

  • 01.07.2008 11:18 PM PDT

Posted by: hockeymonkey1220
can you explain RC Brittle's highest skill after playing w/ his pro team and owning every game. played 100 exactly, 89 steaktaculars and his highest skill is a 13...
He has ran in to the two biggest limitations with TrueSkill. The first is he has played most of his games with the same teammates. People that only play together get stuck around 14/15. The other thing he has had recently is those teammates he plays with are now 10/11 levels above him. That is putting them in "low quality" match-ups because of the skill gap which will also slow his progression way down. If he plays with different teammates or randoms who are closer to his skill level, he should go up.

  • 01.08.2008 5:45 AM PDT

My other gamertags are: M foR MaYHeM and LoL im MayHeM

If you let a friend who is better than you play on your account for a while (ranked), would you go up faster?

  • 01.08.2008 7:57 AM PDT
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Posted by: DeSerT I EaGle
If you let a friend who is better than you play on your account for a while (ranked), would you go up faster?


Yes, bit it doesn't mean the process in general will be fast.

  • 01.08.2008 11:54 AM PDT
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I stopped playing Halo 3 two months ago due to the flaws in the skill system, Its simply no fun to be stuck in the low 20´s and winning every game 50-5 or 25-1, depending on playlists, which is what happened. Then a couple of days ago I figured that Id try it again. I think Ive won 30 slayer games, against way higher levels than myself since i was playing in a mixed party, 15 games of double team and a few objective games and no losses. The total skill lvl increase for that was1 lvl, i repeat ONE LEVEL. This level was given to me in double team whereas the other playlists wasnt affected at all.

This ii the system that Bungie claims to be flawless. I dont think the people we played today enjoyed it much either, although they were high lvl´s in other playlists we managed to totally crush them. How does 25-1 in double team against two lvl 40´s sound or numerous games of slayer where the other team didnt even reach 10 sound? That me and my friends are stuck isnt gaining anyone yet BUngie isnt even prepaired to admit that the system might, just might, have caused and causes problems for a few.

Notice that im not complaining about not leveling as a high level, this is in the low to mid 20´s.


[Edited on 01.08.2008 1:27 PM PST]

  • 01.08.2008 1:25 PM PDT
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Posted by: Batzter
I stopped playing Halo 3 two months ago due to the flaws in the skill system, Its simply no fun to be stuck in the low 20´s and winning every game 50-5 or 25-1, depending on playlists, which is what happened. Then a couple of days ago I figured that Id try it again. I think Ive won 30 slayer games, against way higher levels than myself since i was playing in a mixed party, 15 games of double team and a few objective games and no losses. The total skill lvl increase for that was1 lvl, i repeat ONE LEVEL. This level was given to me in double team whereas the other playlists wasnt affected at all.

This ii the system that Bungie claims to be flawless. I dont think the people we played today enjoyed it much either, although they were high lvl´s in other playlists we managed to totally crush them. How does 25-1 in double team against two lvl 40´s sound or numerous games of slayer where the other team didnt even reach 10 sound? That me and my friends are stuck isnt gaining anyone yet BUngie isnt even prepaired to admit that the system might, just might, have caused and causes problems for a few.

Notice that im not complaining about not leveling as a high level, this is in the low to mid 20´s.


Whats your gamertag so I can look and figure out whats going on? Maybe it's just not showing up as linked right now due to the xbox live problems.

  • 01.08.2008 4:54 PM PDT
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I know you may have just explained this, but i won like 5 times in a row in lone wolf, with my score of about 20+ in each of them fights, and my rank did not go up? how does this work out?

  • 01.08.2008 5:58 PM PDT
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Here's my question: I've gone up in rank a lot. I'm up to 11 right now and have played on and off for 3 days. I have no problems iwht my rank, but my experience hasn't moved at all. I'm still a recruit and I have no experience points. help please.

  • 01.08.2008 6:49 PM PDT
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this still doesent mae any sense

  • 01.08.2008 9:58 PM PDT
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For some reason my rank will not move up, as you can see I have won about 90-95% of my ranked matches, but I have only moved up 5 notches (25 straight wins atleast). http://www.bungie.net/stats/PlayerStatsHalo3.aspx?player=imgu nnamercyou

  • 01.09.2008 12:14 AM PDT
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I can not get pass skill level 37 with 493 EXP points. Most of my Team Slayer games goes like this. Win, Loss, Loss, Win and the whole thing goes over again. I am getting sick of it. I am now a Commander Grade 2. Right now I am 31 in Team Doubles and then the whole process starts over again. I am thinking about giving my account to a friend and let them help me out. Can anyone give me tips?

  • 01.09.2008 12:46 AM PDT

It's like a retard riding a bicycle while eating hot wings.
Sometimes you have to take the bike seat off to really enjoy it.

I think the OP can has recon and orange text.
=]

  • 01.09.2008 1:00 AM PDT

I would say play some warm up games in unranked matches before playing any ranked matches. Do not party up with friends that are not the same skill level as yourself. Party up with people that are closes in skill and exp as yourself. Do not quit any games because that puts a hurting to your exp points. I was stuck at a level 35 in team slayer forever and today I changed my methods and ended up moving up to a 38, so something worked for me. It takes a long time to level up, but this seemed to help move it along a little quicker. Besides I think that with this leveling method that bungie has come up with we are all going to become very skilled players, because you have to if you want to get up there with the big dogs.

  • 01.09.2008 2:02 AM PDT

BEAN-a-LEAN

yea this happend to me the other day in doubles. my buddy started out at 12 i was 26 we won like 10 or 12 straight i went to a 28 in those 12 games he shot all the way up to a 32 going up practically 2 levels with every win. now we play a day after we did this and he kept going up 1 or 2 points everytime while i stayed the same rank and if we lost i would drop and he would stay the same. why is this and it makes me so angry that i am almost willing to get ride of halo and never play again. becuase of this i have since stopped playin ranked matches. could your rep have something to do with this cause i got a bad rep from ppl using my profile and talking smack. i hope not otherwise im gonna beat my friends with a stick

  • 01.09.2008 3:39 AM PDT
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Posted by: XANAcomputer
I can not get pass skill level 37 with 493 EXP points. Most of my Team Slayer games goes like this. Win, Loss, Loss, Win and the whole thing goes over again. I am getting sick of it. I am now a Commander Grade 2. Right now I am 31 in Team Doubles and then the whole process starts over again. I am thinking about giving my account to a friend and let them help me out. Can anyone give me tips?


If you are winning 50% True Skill is working.

  • 01.09.2008 12:52 PM PDT
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cool just what I've been looking for thanks. but now if its not to much trouble could u tell me if you finish the fight on legendary does this give your armour and weapons more power, if this is a stupid question i will sit in the corner and never be heard again but i keep hearing this when I'm playing on line just wondering if their is any truth behind it cheers.

  • 01.09.2008 2:18 PM PDT
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Ok, so i played some more slayer today and yet again nothing happened. This made me do some time-consuming crap, i counted win % for a couple of players and compared those to my own.

I have 61 matches played and a 86 win %, im a lvl 23. All my losses are from the first games, I hadnt been playing halo for a year.

Friend A has 66 matches played and a 91 win %, he´s a lvl 41.
Friend B has 108 matches played and a 86 win %, hes a lvl 42.
Random lvl 50 i found in the forum had 178 matches played and a 75 win %, very mixed results.

Now if im just comparing myself to friend B, which has more or less the same amount of slayer games played as myself, isnt the 18 lvl difference a little too much? And I really dont see how this lvl 50 i found could have leveled that fast with such a poor record.

  • 01.09.2008 3:58 PM PDT