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This topic has moved here: Poll [27 votes]: Have you played Halo2 with all skulls active?
  • Poll [27 votes]: Have you played Halo2 with all skulls active?
Subject: Halo 2 Black eye skull
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Poll: Have you played Halo2 with all skulls active?  [closed]
yes:  22%
(6 Votes)
no:  26%
(7 Votes)
almost:  11%
(3 Votes)
don't care:  15%
(4 Votes)
you are a dork for putting this poll up:  26%
(7 Votes)
Total Votes: 27

I was wrong.

Save effect and check point negation occur without the black eye skull active. However, the black eye skull exploits both of these bugs (?).

Here is how it works. As far as the save effect: on “Armory”, one can save at any point before the first checkpoint. Checkpoint negation: checkpoints no longer function when one has no shields.

Test checkpoint negation by starting Outskirts. When you are able to move, find a wall and throw a grenade at your feet. This will reduce your shields to zero. The first checkpoint is synched with the video. It occurs as the game switches from widescreen to full screen. Thus, it occurs at the same time every time you play through the level. The exception to this rule: if a player’s shield == 0, then negate checkpoint. The black eye skull exploits this by keeping your shield equal to zero once damaged. Maybe this is not that useful, but it does seem like a fun way to make the game excessively difficult! Think about it, no checkpoints and no shields through an entire level. Ouch.

The black eye skull exploits the save effect by letting you negate the first, and only, checkpoint and saving at any point during the level once. When you set a save point on Armory, you cannot set another unless the level is restarted. The obvious exploit is to set your checkpoint after the tram ride starts and before you reach the unnamed skull. The readers may be wondering why this dead horse needs to be beat. Visit group

Trephine
to see the original post on secondary skull effects. If interested, there is a link to the original thread included.

I claimed that the checkpoint negation effect was a secondary effect of the black eye skull. Although this skull exploits the checkpoint negation effect, it is not otherwise related (i.e. the bug (?) can be demonstrated without the black eye skull being active). Hey Bungie, these effects, are they bugs or intended?

The community’s input and wild speculation is welcome.

  • 04.04.2008 2:05 PM PDT
Subject: Halo 2 Blind skull: Another effect
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This is really obscure but...

Blind Skull
Reveals hidden text

Here is the proof: start Gravemind, notice that no "checkpoint...done" prints to the screen before "Uncomfortable Silence" prints to the screen. Save and quit. Activate the Blind skull. Start Gravemind and notice that "checkpoint...done" prints to the screen before "Uncomfortable Silence" prints to the screen. This can be observed on at least five different levels.

See group Trephine for more details. All are welcome to join the group Trephine (a trephine is an instrument for putting holes in skulls).

  • 04.06.2008 6:02 PM PDT
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ARBITER, I CAN'T BELIEVE IT'S NOT BUTTER!!! WORT WORT WORT.

It's so hard to go through on Legendary with all of them on...

  • 04.07.2008 9:45 AM PDT

Whisper Game Studios - shhhh, it's a public secret.
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[*Please note that anything in my posts is likely to be filled with sarcasm, and should be taken with a pinch of salt. I tend to help people, usually*]

I have, and I've completed almost all the levels.

Cairo Station, also known as "Contains Over 9000 Super-Mega-WTF-Elites", is the only level I haven't completed in Halo 2 L.A.S.O. mode. I've gotten as far as the Bomb room. And so did my ammo. I attempted assassinations for the remainder of the level, but I gave up eventually.

Tartarus...holy mother of Bungie....he took me a good 4 hours to kill.

  • 04.07.2008 3:03 PM PDT
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Please feel free to share strategies learned from facing those challenges. Many do not care to take up the challenge of the skulls. However, it is a great way to learn new tactics and warm up for Live. Here is a question: how do you like starting Gravemind with no shields?
Cairo Station with all skulls active on legendary...it is a completely new game.

  • 04.07.2008 6:12 PM PDT

Campiagn Kill Count :31,745. And growing.

The Revisionaries- One of the greatest screenshot groups on B.net. With 250 members and growing.

I tried some levels with every skull that makes it hard active. (except blind..)

THAT IS HARD!

  • 04.07.2008 8:23 PM PDT
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ARBITER, I CAN'T BELIEVE IT'S NOT BUTTER!!! WORT WORT WORT.

Yeah, I'm stuck starting on Cairo Sonic haha.

  • 04.08.2008 3:07 PM PDT
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Well, the yes and no votes still lead the 'you are a dork....' vote by one. Good stuff!

  • 04.10.2008 9:49 PM PDT
Subject: Some checkpoints always happen.
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Blind skull research showed that some checkpoints always fire.

How can we be sure that some checkpoints always fire? Use a combination of the Blind skull and the Black Eye skull (i.e. with zero shields) to prove it. If a checkpoint that only prints with blind skull active fails to activate do to negation, then the theory cannot be true. Next we may ask, well if the first checkpoint fires about one second after the level starts (in some cases) then how can we have zero shields? How do you start a level with no shields?

There could be multiple answers to this, but the easiest route implements a very obscure finding. At the beginning of Gravemind, you start with zero shields. If the Black Eye skull is active, you will be in the unique position to negate that checkpoint. Unfortunately, testing indicated that some checkpoints cannot be negated.

  • 04.10.2008 10:03 PM PDT
Subject: Weird checkpoint behavior
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The n00b erred again. Here is what is new: while playing Cairo Station with all skulls active on legendary, a case of checkpoint negation occurred even though shields were not zero.

There may be at least two other ways to negate checkpoints. One way, on Gravemind, may be walking forward on that first checkpoint. Walking forward puts the character in the line of fire of the two brutes. On legendary, with the black eye skull active, this would be suicide. The checkpoint (that fires even with zero shields) negates by proximity to dangerous enemies (?).
The second alternative method for negating a checkpoint remains mysterious (i.e. reason for the post). Here was the situation: I had made it past the second room and up the ramp, opening the door that leads to the third fight. A checkpoint fires at this point under normal circumstances. With zero shields, the checkpoint negates. However, Master Chief had shields, because of an assassinated grunt, and no checkpoint fired. This case of negation goes beyond the bounds of any previous research done. The checkpoint negated and neither known method for negating a checkpoint applied. Could time also negate checkpoints? Does anyone have any ideas on how to test this?

Maybe Bungie would be nice and give us the pseudocode on the logic controlling checkpoints? Pseudocode would clear up any questions about weird checkpoint behavior. It would also be interesting for game programmers...Yeah, I know…NDA’s probably prohibit that, but I had to ask.

  • 04.14.2008 11:25 AM PDT

First of all (to be on topic), I played for about eight months with all skulls activated. Drove me nuts. The only two levels I could get by were Outskirts and Quarantine Zone and that was because I could run by everything and OS had invincible Marines and an indestructible Hog. In my mind it was impossible until SonicJohn said he's done all but two. I'm still reeling over that one.

That said, you've made some really good points on Blind and BE. Because I record a lot I always use Blind and sometimes I use Blind and BE together. I've seen so many variations that that I've surmised a few things:

Rare to get a CP with enemies fighting close.

Some CP's depend upon who wins AI battles, so if you go to a spot and wait for a CP, you may not get it if the common battle between AI goes opposite of the usual. Case in point, just before you get to the IWHBYD skull room the Marines engage the covenant (sniper alley and such). I've noticed I don't get the CP or the skull if the covenant win, if I see red dots below, there's no skull. When I land on the porch to the skull, if I see yellow dots or no dots at all, the CP and the skull appears. Yes, the Marines either win appx 1 out of 7 times or the game is slated to make the skull appear so all AI vanish (I don't know about this one).

If you charge through an area fast enough the CP's will build up. That's one reason why you get a few CP's sometimes.

If you continuously swing your weapon when running by a CP spot, you will delay that CP for as long as you continue the action. For a Sputnik save I just swing the sword all the way to the skull and stop. As soon as I stop, a CP appears. Very handy, at times.

So I believe the variables that Bungie put in the game for checkpoints are complex but are not negated by any one skull. Add Legendary to that and sometimes you don't get squat for CP's.

One last thing, if you want to make the snow go away on Sacred Icon and Quarantine Zone, just activate Blackeye, go in either level and quit and save at the first CP. Eject disc and reinsert and then go back into the saved profile (but you don't need BE anymore). In QZ, it will be beautiful with no snow.


[Edited on 04.15.2008 1:48 AM PDT]

  • 04.15.2008 1:25 AM PDT
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Your excellent observations shed light on checkpoints, but the proposed conditions do not seem to affect the current question about why this particular checkpoint negated while entering the doorway at the top of the ramp just past the second turret on Cairo Station: no enemies were around, the marines won thanks to an invincible Johnson, and no swinging weapon. However, until this negated checkpoint can be reproduced reliably, we may assume that maybe a grunt yet lived hiding behind a crate, or maybe a random swing of the weapon (celebrating the nearby checkpoint prematurely) delayed the checkpoint long enough to get into the third room, tripping off the bad guys, and negating the checkpoint.

  • 04.15.2008 8:21 PM PDT