Halo 3 Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: The Only BR Thread
  • Subject: The Only BR Thread
Subject: The Only BR Thread

Multiplayer Gameplay
Halo:CE------------------Reach--------Halo2-----------------H alo3
Campaign Experience
Reach----Halo:CE-----------------ODST-----Halo2---------Halo3

Glad that Halo 3 garbage is dead, thanks to Reach.
Unfreakenbelievable!!

I admire that you actually put some thought into this, even though much of it is inaccurate and irrelevant. The main issue is not how many weapons each game allows to use to kill a Vehicle. The issue is are you able to fight them when you spawn. The combination of the spawn system and the effectiveness of spawn weapons against Vehicles is the issue. Not there are "X" number of ways to kill a Vehicle. Actually, if you count up all the weapons provided by the game, Halo 1 has the best with about 50% that can kill Vehicles/Scorpion.

Just by not including the M6D and the Sniper as ways to kill a Scorpion you support the fact that you lack enough experience and knowledge of Halo:CE. I'm pretty sure Halo PC was the same game, but you still seem to not understand the use of the prefered spawn weapon, the M6D. Did you know that I and others were sometimes scared to get into a Scorpion in Halo 1. It was almost a death trap sometimes. I didn't mind others getting into it one little bit. It pretty much gave me a free kill if I had a Sniper or even a M6D.

The only way a Scorpion gets balanced in Halo 3 is with a Lasor at each base, so I somewhat agree that it's balanced, BUT ONLY for the Heavy variant (although I usually wait at the base for a Vehicle since being on foot is pointless, [opinion]thus my point why Halo 1 was better[/opinion]). If you play a normal game on Valhalla with 2 Scorpions, maybe 4 Warthogs, and with Default weapon layout (Lasor in the middle), then it is guaranteed to be unbalanced. If you do the same in Halo 1, by having 4 Warthogs and 2 Scorpions, then it is guaranteed to still be balanced, because the Tank doesn't have a cover and you spawn with a capable weapon, the M6D.

I'm just stating facts. I feel no need to argue about what is better or more fun, because that then would just be opinion.

  • 01.18.2009 8:26 PM PDT
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My connection is terrible. I am always yellowbar or redbar, and When i play CoD4 i get the "connection interrupted" screen more than once per game, every game. My connection used to be better, but it has gone to crap. People say "a General lagging, no surprise there" when in all actuality my connection makes it harder for me to play, not easier. i never get host.

  • 01.19.2009 2:47 AM PDT

From strategywiki.org

"Using Scorpions

This is the easy part. The tank is very powerful (The cannon will destroy most enemy vehicles with even a glancing blow), and the machine gun works like an Assault Rifle on steroids. It is rather slow however, so don't plan on splattering anyone with it unless you've cornered them. Good news is that the tank will kill with even a glancing blow from a single tread. Here's how best to use it against the different opponents in multiplayer (these also work against AI's in Campaign)

Enemy's on foot: Shot them with the machine gun or blast them with the cannon. Just be careful if they have a rocket launcher or a FRG, if you are playing on PC, and if they throw plasma grenades.
Ghosts: Use that gigantic cannon to blast them to bits. You don't even have to hit them squarely, the blast will kill them if you miss. If you do miss, use the machine gun till the main cannon reloads. The MG wont destroy the vehicle, but it might kill the driver. At least it will make them move around to dodge your shots, which will reduce their accuracy.
Warthog (Normal): Same tactic as above.
Warthog (Rocket): Don't even bother with the Machine Gun if you miss. Just move around and dodge the rockets till your main gun reloads
Wraith (In Campaign): Blast them with the cannon and dodge their shots if you miss.
Banshee (In Campaign/PC): Use the machine gun to try and shot them down. Your cannon reloads to slow to make any difference. If they come at your head on however, you can try and use it. One hit and they're history.
Other Scorpions: Just dodge and fire back with both weapons.

Battling Scorpions

There are a couple of good ways to combat an enemy in a Scorpion tank:

The, hopefully, obvious way is to use a rocket launcher (or a FRG, if you are playing on PC) against an enemy Scorpion. Keep in mind however, that although tanks may drive slowly, you will still need to lead your shot to some extent, especially when firing from a long distance. One direct hit should kill under normal slayer rules.
If you can't get your hands on a rocket launcher, then probably an equally, if not better way, is to use a sniper rifle. There are gaps in the rollcage for the Scorpion, and so you should be able to hit the driver, if not score a headshot. Remember that experienced players will know better than to drive straight at you though, and will try to keep only their turret faced towards you, with the actual chassis of the tank facing the opposite direction.
If you wind up close to an enemy tank, try to use plasma grenades to destroy it, if you have them. You should only require two if you make direct latches, and if you don't have plasma grenades, throwing frag grenades under the tank will also do a fair amount of damage, but not as much as stickies would.
Another good way to take out an enemy tank is to use a Ghost vehicle. Because of the vehicle's stunning effect, the driver won't be able to turn as fast as he'd like, and so is rendered helpless as long as you don't overstrafe back into his turret's way. Also, even if that happens, it is considerably harder to kill a Ghost than another vehicle because of the fact that it hovers above the ground."

I would say this is fairly balanced, I remember playing against my friend on Blood Gulch and he would get hold of one of the tanks and I would be able to snipe him. It's not a piece of cake to snipe the driver but its not impossible, it really is perfectly balanced just like almost everything else in halo 1. Obviously some people prefer excessive randomness, every weapon to have a specific niche, vehicles to be ridiculously overpowered and easy to use, the BR to have a severely limited range, most weapons to be very easy to aim and as said by various others a general rock, paper, scissors flow to gameplay. I personally don't like this. There would be much more depth and longevity to the game if the weapons took more skill and had more versatility.

  • 01.19.2009 3:25 AM PDT

It is not never falling that makes us strong,
It is rising every time we fall.

- Ghandi

IF YOU SEND ME A GROUP INVITE I WILL BLOCK YOU

I admire that you actually put some thought into this, even though much of it is inaccurate and irrelevant. The main issue is not how many weapons each game allows to use to kill a Vehicle. The issue is are you able to fight them when you spawn. The combination of the spawn system and the effectiveness of spawn weapons against Vehicles is the issue. Not there are "X" number of ways to kill a Vehicle.

You have a point, fair enough. But in Halo 1, did you spawn with a Sniper? Then I guess the issue is really with comparing Halo 1's Pistol vs a Halo 1 Scorpion to Halo 2/3's BR vs a Halo 2/3 Scorpion. Added to that there is always the option to jack the vehicle on Halo 2 & 3.

Actually, if you count up all the weapons provided by the game, Halo 1 has the best with about 50% that can kill Vehicles/Scorpion.

Well just by looking at my list. I think I've disproved that.

Just by not including the M6D and the Sniper as ways to kill a Scorpion you support the fact that you lack enough experience and knowledge of Halo:CE. I'm pretty sure Halo PC was the same game, but you still seem to not understand the use of the prefered spawn weapon, the M6D. Did you know that I and others were sometimes scared to get into a Scorpion in Halo 1. It was almost a death trap sometimes. I didn't mind others getting into it one little bit. It pretty much gave me a free kill if I had a Sniper or even a M6D.

Yes, I've already stated I didn't have much experience in Halo 1. I've only had equal to around half a year of experience whilst in contrast I've had around three years on Halo 2 and one on Halo 3.

In any case the reason I didn't include either is due to the fact that your average Scorpion tank will have the hatch broken open with enough damage, making all weapons useful, and in the case of that happening or on Halo 1 where it was already open, as soon as you were seen the Scorpion's best strategy was to swivel around the turret to face you backwards, shielding the open driver's seat and rendering all weapons other than the ones specified useless.

The only way a Scorpion gets balanced in Halo 3 is with a Lasor at each base, so I somewhat agree that it's balanced, BUT ONLY for the Heavy variant (although I usually wait at the base for a Vehicle since being on foot is pointless, [opinion]thus my point why Halo 1 was better[/opinion]). If you play a normal game on Valhalla with 2 Scorpions, maybe 4 Warthogs, and with Default weapon layout (Lasor in the middle), then it is guaranteed to be unbalanced. If you do the same in Halo 1, by having 4 Warthogs and 2 Scorpions, then it is guaranteed to still be balanced, because the Tank doesn't have a cover and you spawn with a capable weapon, the M6D.

I don't see why having only one Laser is unbalanced. If your team isn't able to secure the center at the start then it is obviously either down to connections or the more likely skill aspect. Halo has always been about map control, it's been stated by MLG Pros and Bungie alike, if you can't control the map you lose. The Laser is an aspect of the map, it spawns in the middle giving both teams ample time to rush it and grab it. If you are able to fend off the other team and grab the Laser it is down to skill and/or better tactics.

Remember that experienced players will know better than to drive straight at you though, and will try to keep only their turret faced towards you, with the actual chassis of the tank facing the opposite direction.

Just thought I'd pick this out of Prodigy's post. :)

Although I have to say that I didn't know about the Ghost's effectiveness on Scorpions. I guess you learn something knew every day eh?

[Edited on 01.19.2009 3:43 AM PST]

  • 01.19.2009 3:37 AM PDT
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Sparrow is correct ( For Once :P)
Having 1 laser on a map is the best option.
Have u played Heavy Standoff?
If so you will have realised having a not 1 but 2 lasers in each base makes it so stupid i quit everytime we get it,.
Its all down to pure communication,tactics and skill to be able to retrieve a power weapon such as the laser.

  • 01.19.2009 4:01 AM PDT

It is not never falling that makes us strong,
It is rising every time we fall.

- Ghandi

IF YOU SEND ME A GROUP INVITE I WILL BLOCK YOU

Posted by: o Fozzy o
Sparrow is correct ( For Once :P)


And what's that supposed to mean? >.<

  • 01.19.2009 4:55 AM PDT

Sparrow, you need to stop using any Halo 1 examples in any of your arguments. All the information you presented is blatantly inaccurate and completely nullifies any argument you're trying to make. You've admitted what most of us already knew; you have little experience with Halo 1. That’s fine, there's nothing wrong with that. Just stop trying to make arguments based on something that you so obviously lack knowledge of.

  • 01.19.2009 9:03 AM PDT

Posted by: Air Sparrow
Registration issues can occur during LAN play as well.

There has to be a point where it isn't "bad connection" and is actually "bad programming."


I've never had it happen to me before.

Now as most forum-goers say...

Evidence or it didn't happen. :)

Sniper registration issues on LAN

  • 01.19.2009 10:24 AM PDT

Multiplayer Gameplay
Halo:CE------------------Reach--------Halo2-----------------H alo3
Campaign Experience
Reach----Halo:CE-----------------ODST-----Halo2---------Halo3

Glad that Halo 3 garbage is dead, thanks to Reach.
Unfreakenbelievable!!

Well just by looking at my list. I think I've disproved that.Good grief. Do I have to spell it out for you?
M6D, Sniper, Rocket, Ghost, Banshee, Grenades, and other Tank could all be used effectively against the Halo 1 Scorpion. Weapons not used: Needler, PP, PR, AR, Shotgun, Warthog. I won't count Gauss Hog. So, that's what? 7 out of 13, so 54%.

I'm not gonna bother doing the other Halos as it's pretty evident that Halo 1 has a better % of weapons that can do damage against the Scorpion. I think Halo 3 was something like 9 out of 21 or so, can't remember. Hey, at least it somewhat comes close.

I don't see why having only one Laser is unbalanced. If your team isn't able to secure the center at the start then it is obviously either down to connections or the more likely skill aspect. Halo has always been about map control, it's been stated by MLG Pros and Bungie alike, if you can't control the map you lose. The Laser is an aspect of the map, it spawns in the middle giving both teams ample time to rush it and grab it. If you are able to fend off the other team and grab the Laser it is down to skill and/or better tactics.Did you ever play Coagulation with 1 Rocket Launcher? It's pretty much the same. One team controls the weapons and map the entire game. There really is no way around it. Bungie at least sees it that way which is why there aren't any Tanks on the Default layout. Hmmm, did I just agree with Bungie about something? That's unusual.

Halo has always been about map control, yes. It has NEVER been about having that control the entire game when two equal teams compete. Well, at least until Halo 2 came out and brain washed some of you guys into thinking that's how the game should be played. And, did you just support something using MLG as an example? If you want to look at balance look at their gametypes and settings. They try there hardest to bring back the balance we once had with the great game of Halo 1. Too bad some things are just out of their control.

[Edited on 01.19.2009 11:05 AM PST]

  • 01.19.2009 11:04 AM PDT

It is not never falling that makes us strong,
It is rising every time we fall.

- Ghandi

IF YOU SEND ME A GROUP INVITE I WILL BLOCK YOU

Sparrow, you need to stop using any Halo 1 examples in any of your arguments. All the information you presented is blatantly inaccurate and completely nullifies any argument you're trying to make. You've admitted what most of us already knew; you have little experience with Halo 1. That’s fine, there's nothing wrong with that. Just stop trying to make arguments based on something that you so obviously lack knowledge of.

So you would rather I compare to Halo 2 instead? And what would that accomplish?

If you didn't already figure it out, Halo 1, 2 and 3 are different games. It doesn't matter what I compare Halo 3 to out of the two because they are still different games in their own respect. In fact you might as well quit comparing the H2 BR and H3 BR too. In any case from now on I'll refrain from talking about the previous games provided everyone else does so too.


Sniper registration issues on LAN

I've never had that happen to me before. Personally I think it's been played over Live and now the guy wants to whine over a 'Broken Sniper'. Of course, that's just my opinion. :)

Good grief. Do I have to spell it out for you?
M6D, Sniper, Rocket, Ghost, Banshee, Grenades, and other Tank could all be used effectively against the Halo 1 Scorpion. Weapons not used: Needler, PP, PR, AR, Shotgun, Warthog. I won't count Gauss Hog. So, that's what? 7 out of 13, so 54%.

I'm not gonna bother doing the other Halos as it's pretty evident that Halo 1 has a better % of weapons that can do damage against the Scorpion. I think Halo 3 was something like 9 out of 21 or so, can't remember. Hey, at least it somewhat comes close.


I'll repeat what I said before.

After a certain degree of damage the Scorpion's latch breaks open and the driver is open to fire anyways, so that would put all non-power weapons at the same advantage.

Now this means that if the latch is broken open it acts just like a Halo 1 Scorpion.

Ok, you following me so far? Ok, good. :)

Alright then, now that the latch is broken open, all weapons will do the standard amount of damage to the driver, headshot bonuses included. This means that it is now the equivalent to the H1 Scorpion. In addition to that, on any of the games should the standard/damaged Scorpion's driver wish to not get headshotted by you, he could just face his back to you and swivel around the turret free to take shots, as I extracted from Prodigy's wiki post. This renders all weapons other than the ones I specified earlier in my list, absolutely useless.

In conclusion. Please don't treat me like I'm stupid. I'm already two steps ahead of you. :)

Did you ever play Coagulation with 1 Rocket Launcher? It's pretty much the same. One team controls the weapons and map the entire game. There really is no way around it. Bungie at least sees it that way which is why there aren't any Tanks on the Default layout. Hmmm, did I just agree with Bungie about something? That's unusual.

Ah Coagulation... so many CTF Matches... So much BTB Slayer...

Back to the point. I agree to some extent but if you remember correctly the Sniper Rifle still beats the Rocket's due to the missile travel time. If you can fly a Banshee well enough you can also out-manuever the Rockets and Scorpion simultaneously. In short, I think Halo 2 was balanced up to the point with Banshees. It was the only element that unbalanced the game at all, and your average Banshee pilot wasn't that good anyway so unless you had a particularly skilled pilot you had nothing to worry about. Of course in Halo 3 we have Missile Pods and Power Drains now which can render a Vehicle's manueverability pretty useless anyway.

Halo has always been about map control, yes. It has NEVER been about having that control the entire game when two equal teams compete. Well, at least until Halo 2 came out and brain washed some of you guys into thinking that's how the game should be played. And, did you just support something using MLG as an example? If you want to look at balance look at their gametypes and settings. They try there hardest to bring back the balance we once had with the great game of Halo 1. Too bad some things are just out of their control.

Halo has always been about two things:

1. Map Control
2. Being able to break that Control

Simply, if you have the skill to break the other team's control of the map then you will win. Otherwise you lack skill and lose. Simple as. :)

And on the MLG note. Halo 1, Halo 2 and Halo 3 are different games. If you like Halo 1, go play that, if you like Halo 2 go play that and if you like Halo 3 then quit complaining about the BR and go play that.

On a new topic, what is the point to complaining about the BR? Seems pretty useless after all, Bungie aren't going to change it and you aren't going to prove anything. What is the point to it all?

  • 01.19.2009 2:40 PM PDT

Posted by: Air Sparrow
I've never had that happen to me before. Personally I think it's been played over Live and now the guy wants to whine over a 'Broken Sniper'. Of course, that's just my opinion. :)
It's an illogical opinion. Stop blindly ignoring the games flaws. The guy who posted that video had no reason to lie about the game being played over LAN. Do you think people would really be that desperate to show that this game has bullet registration issues? What incentive is there for people to do that?

It's also easy to tell that the game is on LAN based on the first kill he gets, and how quickly his shots register. That's either LAN, or the best internet connection ever. Even if that video wasn't over LAN, it still doesn't excuse occurrences like this being present in the game.

  • 01.19.2009 4:56 PM PDT

I beat down a Scarab.

Old BR please.

  • 01.19.2009 4:58 PM PDT

Multiplayer Gameplay
Halo:CE------------------Reach--------Halo2-----------------H alo3
Campaign Experience
Reach----Halo:CE-----------------ODST-----Halo2---------Halo3

Glad that Halo 3 garbage is dead, thanks to Reach.
Unfreakenbelievable!!

It's like trying to compare who is better between Kobe and Lebron. It's fact that Kobe is better, and historically, but some will think that it's opinion and and try to argue.

Halo has always been about two things:

1. Map Control
2. Being able to break that Control

Simply, if you have the skill to break the other team's control of the map then you will win. Otherwise you lack skill and lose. Simple as. :)
I'm pretty sure that's what I said. You also stated as if those are the ONLY two, which is false. Also, by saying this, you just supported why Scorpions are not on Default Valhalla. You also supported why Halo 2 Vehicles were horribly unbalanced for Coagulation and would be even worse for Halo 3 (Hmmm, hence why people complain about Warthogs on Standoff). The reason why Blood Gulch was so loved was because of the balance between being in a Vehicle and being on foot after the spawn. But, you don't understand that fact, and I doubt you will ever understand.

Ah Coagulation... so many CTF Matches... So much BTB Slayer...Oh, you're one of those people, biased towards Vehicles. Someone who likes the only map that didn't work for Halo 2, because of how badly you can control every aspect of a game on that map no matter who you play. But, by your opinion that means the loser sucks, right? LOL.

Either way, your experience with Halo:CE is lacking, and you continue to support your ideas with complete nonsense. At least you're keeping this discussion entertaining. Too bad it has to come to an end.

[Edited on 01.19.2009 6:21 PM PST]

  • 01.19.2009 6:20 PM PDT

Why not stop by my File Share while you're here?

~Long Live Halo 2
Only regret is I didn't play more of it.

If you haven't noticed by now, I'm sort of a jerk.

Posted by: mooshmoossh
I like the BR just the way it is.

I really don't see what's wrong with it.

i like to hide with it
=)

[Edited on 01.19.2009 6:32 PM PST]

  • 01.19.2009 6:31 PM PDT

Why not stop by my File Share while you're here?

~Long Live Halo 2
Only regret is I didn't play more of it.

If you haven't noticed by now, I'm sort of a jerk.

hiding is fun :) =) :-) ^_^ even more with my BR

  • 01.19.2009 7:09 PM PDT

Posted by: Air Sparrow
Alright then, now that the latch is broken open, all weapons will do the standard amount of damage to the driver, headshot bonuses included. This means that it is now the equivalent to the H1 Scorpion. In addition to that, on any of the games should the standard/damaged Scorpion's driver wish to not get headshotted by you, he could just face his back to you and swivel around the turret free to take shots, as I extracted from Prodigy's wiki post. This renders all weapons other than the ones I specified earlier in my list, absolutely useless.

In conclusion. Please don't treat me like I'm stupid. I'm already two steps ahead of you. :)
lol, I haven't used a scorpion on H1 for awhile but I would assume it's harder to drive when reversing with the turret facing backwards. Even if it's not there is still a wide angle open to anyone who can flank the scorpion which if it acts aggressively won't be difficult to do at all on a map like blood gulch. If the scorpion sits back it is far less effective and therein lies the balance. On the assumtion that it is harder to drive facing backwards it will also be vulnerable to grenades which in halo 1 are quite powerful. So in halo 1 your success depended upon strategy, decisions and ability more than "I'm in a scorpion I AM INVINCIBLE! Uh oh Laser, maybe not." Likewise with warthogs in halo 3, you have to stick the thing twice usually to take it out and often when you flip it it rights itself anyway, the only truly reliable means is the laser or missile pod (rockets in confined areas), again 'rock, paper, scissors'.

Your the one who acts condescendingly even though you are dealing with people who have more halo experience than you, are probably better than you at halo 3 and don't act in a condescending manner toward you unless provoked.

  • 01.20.2009 1:46 AM PDT

It is not never falling that makes us strong,
It is rising every time we fall.

- Ghandi

IF YOU SEND ME A GROUP INVITE I WILL BLOCK YOU

It's an illogical opinion. Stop blindly ignoring the games flaws. The guy who posted that video had no reason to lie about the game being played over LAN. Do you think people would really be that desperate to show that this game has bullet registration issues? What incentive is there for people to do that?

What incentive is there for him to complain about a single kill in a game played over LAN with a few friends? I personally think he's desperate to show that this game has bullet registration issues, in which case it could just be a game played over Live.

It's also easy to tell that the game is on LAN based on the first kill he gets, and how quickly his shots register. That's either LAN, or the best internet connection ever. Even if that video wasn't over LAN, it still doesn't excuse occurrences like this being present in the game.

True, true. But did you ever wonder what happened to the second player after he was shot? My guess is about two or three seconds later he took damage from the shot, not headshotted, he was hit in the shoulder first so it wouldn't of counted as a headshot. This means the other guy wasn't notified of any kill but it's likely that he got an assist out of it. It's likely that the first guy lived in the same country/county/state as the player and therefore connected fine so all bullets registered, the second player was likely from overseas and as a result he sponged the shot.

It's like trying to compare who is better between Kobe and Lebron. It's fact that Kobe is better, and historically, but some will think that it's opinion and and try to argue.

Who are Kobe and Lebron?

I'm pretty sure that's what I said. You also stated as if those are the ONLY two, which is false. Also, by saying this, you just supported why Scorpions are not on Default Valhalla.

Yes, Valhalla has very little cover and so for a Scorpion it would be very easy to simply sit at one side, safe behind the middle line and hold that side, he could even go as far as to put a lock on the Pelican and Radio Tower and with two scorpions, no one would be able to cross the middle line. On Coagulation, there was no high mound that was big enough to completely shield one side and so the Scorpion was always prone to Rockets, Grenades and other vehicles. Plus due to the small hills and paths on the map it is quite easy for a player to hide but a Scorpion is simply too big and will always be spotted.

You also supported why Halo 2 Vehicles were horribly unbalanced for Coagulation and would be even worse for Halo 3 (Hmmm, hence why people complain about Warthogs on Standoff). The reason why Blood Gulch was so loved was because of the balance between being in a Vehicle and being on foot after the spawn. But, you don't understand that fact, and I doubt you will ever understand.

Sometimes it is harder to break control on one map than another. Different maps have different levels of control that can be taken and broken. If you are complaining about the Warthog on Standoff and Coagulation then why did you let them take so much control of the map in the game you were playing?

Typically, at the start of the game, you have one player go for Camo and Rockets and then Laser, the other three hold down the middle of the map. If your Camo guy is good enough, he should be able to switch his BR out for the Laser and retreat to the top of the Base, then the opponents have their Warthog lasered and you are two points up. If you were unable to do this, then why? It's likely that your support team mates didn't have the BR skills neccessary to hold down the middle of the map, the opponents charged and took the Laser and now have the control with their Hog.

Now if this happens you likely be pinned down in the base but you will always have three options:

1. Wait for the Camo and Rockets to Respawn to eliminate the Warthog
2. Use the Power Drain and Stickies in the base to eliminate the Warthog
3. Use the Plasma Pistol and Stickies in the base to eliminate the Warthog

After this it is a matter of disarming the Laser guy so you can get your Warthog up. But you likely don't understand that flow of gameplay either right?

Two steps ahead...

Oh, you're one of those people, biased towards Vehicles. Someone who likes the only map that didn't work for Halo 2, because of how badly you can control every aspect of a game on that map no matter who you play. But, by your opinion that means the loser sucks, right? LOL.

If you are able to control every aspect of a game no matter who you play. You are obviously the best team in the Halo world. A skilled team will always present a challenge, likely they'll be using the same tactics and will be able to perform them even better. It doesn't mean the loser sucks, it just means that they were weaker in that game. :)

Either way, your experience with Halo:CE is lacking, and you continue to support your ideas with complete nonsense. At least you're keeping this discussion entertaining. Too bad it has to come to an end.

I support my ideas with nonsense? Well the fact that I've supported every one of my ideas with common sense makes it seem otherwise. And are you sure you are finding it entertaining? You seem to be getting stressed out. Calm down just a bit, it's not me you are fighting, it's my ideas and ability to fend off four people simultaneously.

Personally I think the 4 vs 1 thing is a little unfair though. :)

lol, I haven't used a scorpion on H1 for awhile but I would assume it's harder to drive when reversing with the turret facing backwards. Even if it's not there is still a wide angle open to anyone who can flank the scorpion which if it acts aggressively won't be difficult to do at all on a map like blood gulch. If the scorpion sits back it is far less effective and therein lies the balance. On the assumtion that it is harder to drive facing backwards it will also be vulnerable to grenades which in halo 1 are quite powerful. So in halo 1 your success depended upon strategy, decisions and ability more than "I'm in a scorpion I AM INVINCIBLE! Uh oh Laser, maybe not." Likewise with warthogs in halo 3, you have to stick the thing twice usually to take it out and often when you flip it it rights itself anyway, the only truly reliable means is the laser or missile pod (rockets in confined areas), again 'rock, paper, scissors'.

Personally I found driving the Scorpion Tank backwards fairly easy, it's like driving any Vehicle backwards, you just have to get a feel for it. In any case you make out like the laser is the only thing that can kill you and you blindly state that Halo 1 depends on strategy, decisions and ability while in Halo 3 where is is far easier to kill a Scorpion with a wider range of weapons, vehicles and now equipment than in Halo 1. If you really think that having four options to defeating a skilled driver whilst in Halo 3 we now have nine options, including one option with homing and not including equipment. You are sadly mistaken.

Your the one who acts condescendingly even though you are dealing with people who have more halo experience than you, are probably better than you at halo 3 and don't act in a condescending manner toward you unless provoked.

Actually I believed it has always been you guys that have started the condescending conversations rather than me. If I remember correctly it begun with...

Posted by: Prodigy117
I find it amusing that you attempt to patronize me even though I am the one with a 50.


In which case I didn't provoke you and you still acted condescendingly. On top of that, it doesn't matter about skill or experience, it's about common sense. Please don't accuse me of acting condescendingly when you are the one who started it and are trying to keep it going.

[Edited on 01.20.2009 7:49 AM PST]

  • 01.20.2009 7:12 AM PDT

Posted by: Air Sparrow
What incentive is there for him to complain about a single kill in a game played over LAN with a few friends? I personally think he's desperate to show that this game has bullet registration issues, in which case it could just be a game played over Live.
The player he was shooting should have died. The game didn't work as it should have. He has the right to complain.

True, true. But did you ever wonder what happened to the second player after he was shot? My guess is about two or three seconds later he took damage from the shot, not headshotted, he was hit in the shoulder first so it wouldn't of counted as a headshot. This means the other guy wasn't notified of any kill but it's likely that he got an assist out of it. It's likely that the first guy lived in the same country/county/state as the player and therefore connected fine so all bullets registered, the second player was likely from overseas and as a result he sponged the shot. I can't argue with you if you're going to make such ridiculous assumptions. Look at the first shot he makes on the second player. It registers instantly. Now look at the second shot on that player. It doesn't register at all. Everything else in the game is working properly (including the movement of this laggy player, which we would be stuttering if he truly was overseas), except for one bullet not having the effect it should have. Why such a sudden change?

In addition, all of your explanations for the bullet not registering are irrelevant because they require the unnecessary and false assumption that the game was played over Live.

  • 01.20.2009 12:14 PM PDT

It is not never falling that makes us strong,
It is rising every time we fall.

- Ghandi

IF YOU SEND ME A GROUP INVITE I WILL BLOCK YOU

The player he was shooting should have died. The game didn't work as it should have. He has the right to complain.

And yet, despite the fact that he obviously wouldn't waste his time if it was online he would waste his time if it was offline? Sounds fishy to me.

I can't argue with you if you're going to make such ridiculous assumptions. Look at the first shot he makes on the second player. It registers instantly. Now look at the second shot on that player. It doesn't register at all. Everything else in the game is working properly (including the movement of this laggy player, which we would be stuttering if he truly was overseas), except for one bullet not having the effect it should have. Why such a sudden change?

I have games commonly online where everything runs smoothly but the latency is rediculous. In a Snipers game I played the other day the movement of all of the players wasn't laggy in the least, however. One proceeded to sponge every shot I made on him reguardless of the fact that his team mates (besides one other) were dying just fine. Latency and Lag often go hand in hand but not always, often a game will have no lag affecting it but will still have a huge degree of latency to one person and nil to another. It's the internet, it's always going to be laggy, but of course that's a rediculous assumption as well isn't it?

  • 01.20.2009 4:18 PM PDT

Multiplayer Gameplay
Halo:CE------------------Reach--------Halo2-----------------H alo3
Campaign Experience
Reach----Halo:CE-----------------ODST-----Halo2---------Halo3

Glad that Halo 3 garbage is dead, thanks to Reach.
Unfreakenbelievable!!

Who are Kobe and Lebron?Google or Youtube them.

Personally I think the 4 vs 1 thing is a little unfair though. :)Hey, you brought it onto yourself. I was holding back from posting anything, because I knew you were out- numbered. And, when I finally did post someting, I made sure to state that you should not feel the need to respond. I honestly didn't want to get into any disscussion with you. Actually, the only reason why I posted was to inform you that using Power Weapons to support your idea of balance does not help your argument. And then, you began to support it with Vehicles which have been overpowered since Halo 2. I was only initially suggesting that you support your ideas with weapons that are underpowered and lack effectiveness.

And, common sense? You are the only one in this discussion that feels the way you do, and with lesser experience. I wouldn't call it "common sense," though. It's more like "common knowledge," which comes from experience, and the wiser is usually the one who has spent the most time with something.

We all know, deep down, that nobody on these forums will ever be persuaded, especially those who have played Halo since day one of the Xbox and the game (and still play which is a rarety). That's why I'm not going to reply to your idea of Halo 2 and Coagulation. That is completely opinion (not "common sense"), and it would be a waste of time to try and explain to you which is more fun or competitive (though, if it truly did mean the best team wins with control on that map then MLG would've used it, which they didn't. Not saying everything MLG does is right, but they do seem to understand what is fair and competitive.).

[/discussion] (about balance of large maps, for me anyway)

  • 01.20.2009 4:49 PM PDT

Posted by: Air Sparrow
And yet, despite the fact that he obviously wouldn't waste his time if it was online he would waste his time if it was offline? Sounds fishy to me.
I don't know where you are getting this "wasting time" stuff from, but whatever, it's still irrelevant. It isn't complicated, the game has registration issues on LAN and serious registration issues on Live, and they should be fixed.

I have games commonly online where everything runs smoothly but the latency is rediculous. In a Snipers game I played the other day the movement of all of the players wasn't laggy in the least, however. One proceeded to sponge every shot I made on him reguardless of the fact that his team mates (besides one other) were dying just fine. Latency and Lag often go hand in hand but not always, often a game will have no lag affecting it but will still have a huge degree of latency to one person and nil to another. It's the internet, it's always going to be laggy, but of course that's a rediculous assumption as well isn't it? That's great and everything, but the clip I linked you was on LAN. Stop denying it. If registration issues occur on LAN, it's no wonder the game is awful on Live.

  • 01.20.2009 4:57 PM PDT

Posted by: Prodigy117
Posted by: Air Sparrow

[quote]If you decide to use the BR though then remember, don't mash the trigger. It's a common mistake people make that they ram the trigger as hard and as fast as possible. Slow down the pace a little and time your shots, give a split second gap between each shot otherwise the kickback builds up and loses a lot of accuracy over a distance.
I find it amusing that you attempt to patronize me even though I am the one with a 50.


This is what I replied to and it is condescending in my opinion.

As to the tank it has already been pointed out that a greater percentage of halo 1 weapons could take out the tank as well as the spawn weapon. In halo 1 it is much more likely that you will have the means to take out a tank providing you have the skill. In halo 3 its a simple matter of having the right weapons in most instances and if you do its a foregone conclusion. I suggest you try find a few friends to LAN H1 with and see how much better than 2 & 3 it is and perhaps you will change your opinion about it.

  • 01.21.2009 1:52 AM PDT

It is not never falling that makes us strong,
It is rising every time we fall.

- Ghandi

IF YOU SEND ME A GROUP INVITE I WILL BLOCK YOU

I don't know where you are getting this "wasting time" stuff from, but whatever, it's still irrelevant. It isn't complicated, the game has registration issues on LAN and serious registration issues on Live, and they should be fixed.

I don't know, you tell me.

Do you think people would really be that desperate to show that this game has bullet registration issues? What incentive is there for people to do that?

Thanks, now it all makes sense. :)

That's great and everything, but the clip I linked you was on LAN. Stop denying it. If registration issues occur on LAN, it's no wonder the game is awful on Live.

"But... But IT WAS ON LAN U NOOB! STOP DENYING IT!!!"

That's all I'm reading from this, you need to have evidence or common sense to support everything. This can't be supported through common sense so you would need evidence. There is none, you can't support it. The clip is void. :)

Hey, you brought it onto yourself. I was holding back from posting anything, because I knew you were out- numbered. And, when I finally did post someting, I made sure to state that you should not feel the need to respond.

Oh I meant that 4 vs 1 was unfair. I never said that I was in the unfair position. :)

And, common sense? You are the only one in this discussion that feels the way you do, and with lesser experience. I wouldn't call it "common sense," though. It's more like "common knowledge," which comes from experience, and the wiser is usually the one who has spent the most time with something.

But I'm also part of the majority of the Halo 3 community that thinks the BR works fine and that it's just MLG trying to overpower their favorite weapon. One discussion is meaningless, try the whole B.net Board. You'll likely find that 99% of players like the BR just how it is.

And you are talking about wisdom now? Seriously, chill out.

That's why I'm not going to reply to your idea of Halo 2 and Coagulation. That is completely opinion (not "common sense"), and it would be a waste of time to try and explain to you which is more fun or competitive (though, if it truly did mean the best team wins with control on that map then MLG would've used it, which they didn't. Not saying everything MLG does is right, but they do seem to understand what is fair and competitive.).

You are right, it is just an opinion. But it makes perfect sense doesn't it?

Think about it this way, each team is like the face of a coin. There is always the chance it will land on one side or the very small chance that there will be a draw. Think about all of the weapons on the map, each weapon, vehicle, equipment and power weapon unbalanced the game right? Well if it is an even distance from both sides, it unbalances the game in who's favor? The answer is it doesn't, providing all power weapons are an even distance apart from each team then each team has an even difficulty in getting them and at that point it comes purely down to skill, strategy, tactics and teamwork.

This is what I replied to and it is condescending in my opinion.

You'd be surprised about how many 50's didn't know that. On my thread "BR Statistics from the files" I had three or four Generals running around denying kickback even existing. I simply assumed you hadn't heard the news that kicback was actually real, it's not you being stupid and it's not me being condescending, it's simply a misunderstanding.

As to the tank it has already been pointed out that a greater percentage of halo 1 weapons could take out the tank as well as the spawn weapon. In halo 1 it is much more likely that you will have the means to take out a tank providing you have the skill. In halo 3 its a simple matter of having the right weapons in most instances and if you do its a foregone conclusion. I suggest you try find a few friends to LAN H1 with and see how much better than 2 & 3 it is and perhaps you will change your opinion about it.

I used to do split-screen on Halo 1 quite often before Halo 2, when they released Halo 2 I was like "What the heck is this? It's not even Halo!" but as time passed and as I got an Xbox Live connection I just realised that Halo 2 was the better game. Halo 3 didn't even have anything like that for me, I accepted it as a Halo game straight off the bat. I guess it's just that similar to Halo 2.

As to the Scorpion, this is the third and final time I'm going to say this, afterwards I'll quote it.

I think my list has proved that there are more ways to kill a Scorpion on Halo 3 than on Halo 1. Have a look at my list and don't you dare say that I missed the Sniper and Pistol. They, like every other weapon on Halo 1, 2 and 3 are useless if the Scorpion's Driver simply faces his back to you, as he would if he was experienced.

But I agree to your statement able having the right weapons at the right time. Either that or you could just have your team mates to have varied weapons to deal with any situation.
I like teamwork. :)

  • 01.21.2009 5:19 AM PDT
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  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Posted by: Air Sparrow
"But... But IT WAS ON LAN U NOOB! STOP DENYING IT!!!"

That's all I'm reading from this, you need to have evidence or common sense to support everything. This can't be supported through common sense so you would need evidence. There is none, you can't support it. The clip is void. :)

I see a lot of crap on these forums, but nothing quite as ironic and hypocritical as this. You are lying to yourself if you really think that clip wasn't on LAN just because you can't stand the idea that Bungie actually made a mistake. All I'm reading from this is "BUT WAIT... BUNGIE CAN'T MAKE MISTAKES!!!" What possible motivation would the poster have had for lying?

But I'm also part of the majority of the Halo 3 community that thinks the BR works fine and that it's just MLG trying to overpower their favorite weapon.
Making the BR consistent wouldn't make it overpowered. The Sniper Rifle is consistent but not overpowered.

One discussion is meaningless, try the whole B.net Board. You'll likely find that 99% of players like the BR just how it is.
Why don't you go over to the Halo 2 Board, or Halo CE? The people there will tell you that the H2 BR, or the CE Pistol, were fine, for the most part (some will disagree, just as some in this forum disagree with the H3 BR).

I used to do split-screen on Halo 1 quite often before Halo 2, when they released Halo 2 I was like "What the heck is this? It's not even Halo!" but as time passed and as I got an Xbox Live connection I just realised that Halo 2 was the better game. Halo 3 didn't even have anything like that for me, I accepted it as a Halo game straight off the bat. I guess it's just that similar to Halo 2.
I find it odd that you claim you've played Halo 1 or 2: you continue to insist that the Halo 3 Scorpion is easier to take down and the fact that your linked gamertag, which has over 10,000 Halo 3 games, has not played Halo 2 online.

I think my list has proved that there are more ways to kill a Scorpion on Halo 3 than on Halo 1. Have a look at my list and don't you dare say that I missed the Sniper and Pistol. They, like every other weapon on Halo 1, 2 and 3 are useless if the Scorpion's Driver simply faces his back to you, as he would if he was experienced.
It doesn't matter if there are "more" ways, it matters what percentage of weapons/tactics players can use that are effective against the Scorpion, and as Jiggly (I think) pointed out earlier Halo 1 has the higher percentage. Additionally, the Halo 1 Scorpion had lower rate of fire, significantly weaker secondary turret, and less armor. The only person you're fooling is yourself.

  • 01.21.2009 7:23 AM PDT