- BerserkerBarage
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- Exalted Mythic Member
MY LOVE FOR YOU IS LIKE A TRUCK...
Posted by: Langley
--on another note, I think MLG Chewhatever is an idiot.
Posted by: Achronos
There is a reason I am user ID 1 and my account creation date is before this site came online.
Posted by: MadroKurgan
The same argument about effective bullet range can be said about any type of 3 burst military rifle. The BR's accuracy and spread is effective at the most 30 yrds. Any military 3 burst rifle has an effective accuracy at around 120 yrds. So EVERY weapon is scaled back in the game. Not just the AR and shotgun.
Yup, exactly. Which is why the BR in Halo 3 has been scaled back in it's effectiveness. Just like other weapons that in real life have much larger effective ranges are scaled back in H3 to create balance. You don't have a problem with Bungie scaling back the AR or Shotgun but you have a problem when they scale back the BR? Your logic is amazing.
And there is no need to give me a lesson in clay pigeon shooting. I'm an avid big and small game hunter. And have shot clay pigeons many a time. I own a .270, 30-06 and .300 wetherby high powered rifle for large game deer, antelope, black bear and elk hunting. A 12 gauge, 16 gauge, and 4-10 gauge shotguns for bird, rabbit and other small game hunting.
That's great. I own a chrome Mag Research .45 Desert Eagle, a Glock 23C, an USMC M40A3 rifle, and a 30-06. Well, actually the Glock is more my fiancee's than mine, but you get the picture. I also worked as a ballistics tech for several years before taking my current position in a NPO. My point was that there are weapons that are considered "skillful and precise" that others typically don't see as such. Stereotypically shotguns have been very limited in scope in video games. That's for weapon balance sake rather than it being a reflection of the weapon's actual ability. That was the point; not a lesson on shooting.
The point about Halo 3's AR, Shotty, etc. is that they take very little skill to use, and are not accurate at all. So who cares about their spread, considering their effective range is only around 3-5 yrds.
You find them to take very little skill to use. I find carrying one is often times very limiting because of how narrow the effective range of the weapon is. The "skill" aspect of the shotgun has less to do with the firing of the weapon and more to do with getting yourself into scenarios where it is within it's effective range. The same could be said of the BR although I'll grant that it's slightly harder to aim the BR because of the size of the reticule. I'd imagine that is counterbalanced by the fact that the BR's effective range is FAR greater than the shotgun's. And I care about the spread of the shotgun because when going against another shotgun user it can make a wide difference. Try shooting (split-screen) someone who is just barely outside "red reticule" with the shotgun. Then compare it to when it is just barely "red reticule". I've had times where being outside of "red reticule" actually removed more shield than having the reticle being red. The spread on the Shotgun can mean the difference between having to shoot 2 times at a distance or having to shoot 3 times at a distance. Hmm...that sounds familiar...
The BR is the only accurate mid range weapon in Halo 3 (with the exception being the Carbine, of which cannot be selected as a starting weapon). Both skill and accuracy go hand in hand. When skill and accuracy are taken out of a weapon, i myself, along with many others, find no satisfaction in using them.
You are focusing primarily on one definition of "skill". Which is both naive and biased. All weapons require accuracy. I can't shoot 8 ft. to your left with any weapon and be expected to hit you. Do some weapons require more precision in aiming? Yes. Do those weapons typically have far larger effective ranges? Yes. Does that help create weapon balance? Yes. Now for the completely biased and subjective opinion part. I don't like BR-start games? Why? Because they are monotonous and boring. I can pretty much use the BR the entire match. I don't care if I live or die because if I die, on-spawn I have a fresh BR with plenty of ammo. I don't mind using the BR obviously since I have over 16,000 kills with it. I just don't like starting with one because in my opinion it ruins weapon variety and turns the game into very predictable and monotone.
And thereby the reason MLG uses primarily the BR. They want the most competitive, skill based play possible in Halo 3. If they were to have the AR and shotguns as their primary weapons, the game would be nothing more then a "spray and pray" frag fest. Boring and anything but competitive.
Again, purely subjective opinion. That's cool that MLG has a ragin' clue for the BR. Personally the most competitive and skill based game would be M6G starts with no other weaponry. If you can consistently kill people with that weapon IMO you're pretty damn skilled. Again, MLG and apparently you focus on one specific definition of "skill". There are many. You're/They're focusing on the "aiming precision" skill aspect but that takes away a lot of the "have the right weapon for the right situation" kind of skill. You find it boring and non-competitive. I find MLG boring and non-competitive. Weee...opinions are fun.
And how the hell do you have a dueling match with the AR or shotgun? Weapons that are not in the least bit accurate, and have no range, and do not register headshots. Strafing has little to no effect, and all you do is try to spray the most bullets into the other (headshots do not count), then follow up with a melee... wow how fun and skillful is that?
Actually, if you are not a half-retarded circus monkey using the AR, chances are you don't do the whole "spray and pray" crap that you're sooo biased about. Typically I'll stay outside of range because I know most other people only hold RT so I'll wait till their clip runs empty while firing bursts into them. Anyone who is moderately skillful (and I know you hate hearing that) with the Assault Rifle rarely if ever uses it in combination with a melee. It's far too risky because of the possibility of a "double-melee" occurring. If you really think that all people use the AR in the whole "hold RT while running at opponent then melee" mindset you're so ignorant, biased, and naive that I'm surprised you haven't swallowed your tongue and choked to death.
Funny how you can dis the Halo 1 pistol, but every Pro (Final Boss, Str8 Rippen) who has played all three Halo's competitively, has stated how Halo 1 MP and the pistol provided the most skill based play of all 3 halo's. I think I, along with many other competitive players, will take their word over yours. Not to mention our own experience with the superior, skilled based Halo 1 MP and pistol.
Congrats on buying into "pros" opinions. Very fanboish of you. I can understand that people feel that the M6D was the "most skillful" weapon in the series. I can also fully understand why the M6D was the most "broken" weapon in regards to weapons balance. They aren't dichotomous. I also found the M6D to be rather cheap because you could easily just hit a person with a couple shots (with that HUGE reticule) and then melee to kill them. I also love how you're insinuating that I didn't play HCE or HCE competitively. I only went to 1 HCE LAN competition while having LANs at my house every week for a year and a half. I also regularly played HCE on XBC. I also participated in several HCE PC LAN competitions during my years in undergrad. I've played the game enough...
Oh, and the mauler is present in MLG. Funny that you didn't know that.
Funny how I did know that. I've mentioned that exact fact several times during this thread. Apparently MLG doesn't have a problem with bullet spread because they allow a weapon (Mauler) which has it in their competitions with no qualms about it. Sounds to me that they are just trying to be selective about which weapons they complain about because they don't like it when Bungie balances "their" weapon.
~B.B.
[Edited on 07.09.2008 8:43 AM PDT]