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  • Subject: The Only BR Thread
Subject: The Only BR Thread
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The BR can be a drag. Considering the fact that you can withstand 3-4 shots in the body without shields, knowing that it takes only 1 bullet in the head to kill you.

I find that the biggest problem with the BR is getting the last head shot. Especially when you're in a battle and you manage to get his shields down, but not the final head shot, resulting in a loss.

  • 10.13.2008 5:01 PM PDT
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Black Water Ops

- "Look im MLG"

the BR is fine

  • 10.13.2008 5:51 PM PDT

Posted by: fifthderelicte
I don't want the BR upgraded for the whole reason of skill. If they tighten the spread, it's just another easy gun to use. Seriously, how is the BR difficult? I've already stated this several times before, but the BR really doesn't take much skill. People want more range on a weapon that is so simple to kill with and get headshots with. If they made it much more like the carbine and made the burst a non-factor (or implement Breezy's idea), that's fine. But so many people want a more powerful BR while still keeping it a skilless weapon.

Futhermore, of course people complain about more range on it. In H2, snipers were barely effective many times. BRs could easily keep you out of zoom, and there was no way you could noscope from across the map consistently. But even unscoped BRs are very accurate and easy to use, so they were more powerful than snipers. It didn't matter if you got knocked out of zoom with a BR. Not to mention, BRs shooting across the map can kill almost as fast as a sniper can kill with two body shots. That's quite powerful. You should at least have to team fire to get that quick of a kill.

IMO, BRs aren't all that skillful. Yes, more so than other weapons, but still, not much. If you want to start with the most skillful weapon in the game, tell Bungie to make a carbine gametype where they place carbines all over the map and starts on maps that support it. Or, start with snipers and have 2x OS, making 2 HS necessary or extra body shots, if you're so concerned about skill.


I said nothing about tightening spread I said it should be single shot. Make it like the H1 pistol in terms of function but 4 or 5 shot instead with a slower rate of fire than the pistol. Three shotting in halo 1 is difficult, 4 is difficult. It would then take skill.

To be honest I don't think the BR is easy to use especially online it is much harder playing off-host which I do in the UK usually against americans. I have played some games on LAN and I would say it isn't actually that difficult to aim and there is lots of auto aim, getting headshots is easy, everything in general is actually so much easier on LAN or on host. I would still label it one of the most skillful weapons in the game though.

Perhaps you have this opinion about snipers being underpowered in halo 2 because people double shotted you or used double shot controllers. Please watch a halo 2 MLG game between Final Boss and Carbon or Str8 Rippin or another team like that and you will see they go out of their way to either get the sniper rifle/s or prevent the other team getting them, they often sacrifice themselves so their team has control of the sniper rifle. Clearly they considered it a power weapon. The halo 2 sniper was not underpowered at all and was highly valued by skilled players.

Now the proposition for an accurate BR in halo 3 will not make it anything like the halo 2 BR: It will not be hitscan, it will not double shot, it will have less auto-aim. If it is single shot without bullet magnetism, so the bullets go exactly where you aim them rather than auto aim the other players head when you shoot him in the arm, then it will take lots of skill.

The carbine is also very random and has a lot of spread, I don't find it that much harder to use to be honest and you don't have to lead with it either or very little. Snipers would be boring and the game would no longer be halo.

On top of making the game more skillful an accurate single shot BR would also make the game more consistent online. Less information needs to be sent about the shots fired and it is much easier to adjust your aim if your shots aren't registering.

  • 10.14.2008 7:15 AM PDT

Posted by: fifthderelicte
I was going under the assumption that the only thing they would change is the spread. If that were the case, it would make an already easy weapon even easier. As it is, the BR is simple to use. My biggest problem with it is its ease of headshots. Yes, 1v1 BR battles take skill, but when it comes to downing an opponent once their shields are down, it's lame. And even in 1v1s, if you're team firing, you have a greater chance to hit because you fire three rounds. I agree that if they changed other things along with spread, they could increase the skill. However, a lot of people usually focus on spread. And even with autoaim toned down, the burst would still keep headshots relatively easy, and even easier at longer ranges with decreased spread.


I agree headshots should be more difficult.

Sure. Snipers should feel uncomfortable at medium ranges. But if you think back to H2's BR, it was wicked from Burial Mounds (behind rockets to base), Hang em High tower to tower, etc. Those were all pretty good distances, and snipers were practically useless from that range. Just imagine not being able to snipe from base on Valhalla to hill. That's about the longest range of sight you'll get on that map, and the sniper will be near worthless. I think you should be able to ping snipers out at that distance, and if you team fire or they're slow, kill them in 5-8 shots, but to 4 shot them is ridiculous (again, based off H2's standards). And most maps don't have that large of a line of sight. The only maps that have a vast line of sight over the whole field is Avalanche and Sandtrap (and Standoff, but only if you're playing snipers). Everything else has one or two large lines of sight, if any at all. Now the BR mops up the whole map. Like I said, I agree that it should be accurate enough to ping the snipers at that distance, and maybe even 5-6 shot them. Team firing would still kill very quickly (encouraging teamwork). But there's no need to make it the uber weapon like in H2 (I know that may not be what you're arguing, but people tend to go to extremes, and I'm stating why I want to be careful about how changes are made). And like I said, unscoped BRs are pretty easy to use. So to be able to ping a sniper at those long ranges is huge, as snipes can't work well at distances out of scope, while BRs can.

Never gonna happen, your view itself with the BR is restricted at range especially when your not scoped. Even if the Halo 2 BR was used the sniper just has to change position quickly and peak out and he will get a shot off. The sniper will still be extremely useful unless you made the BR a 2 headshot kill with a 5x zoom or something ridiculous.

The only power weapon BRs take skill going against, provided you're at mid to long range, is the laser (but only if the other guy is quick) and the sniper (which you can easily ping out of scope). So I really don't agree that Brs take skill going against other power weapons. Maybe rockets or shotty up close, but that's your fault for using a BR there (even though I use the BR always). Unless you're talking about across Sandtrap, and the other person has a laser or sniper, the only thing the BR has to fear at mid range and beyond is another BR or carbine.

To be honest it's not that difficult to strafe accross somebody when you have a sniper and drop their shields. Then if you're clever you will whip out a headshot weapon and finish them or they will probably back off at the least. Also the scenario you outline is essentially mid range and where the BR should dominate, in close it will still be inferior, as it is at longer ranges to the sniper.

Also you approach the game as if every confrontation takes place in an open arena with little cover and no team support, the strength of the sniper is it's range and kill speed so a good sniper changes positions and finds unexpected angles to kill or weaken the enemy. It is not really meant to be used with ease 1v1 against a BR.

  • 10.14.2008 7:38 AM PDT
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I agree with your single shot BR. I'd have no problem with it being more accurate then. That's why I like the carbine so much. It still has randomness, but it's much more difficult to use, and it takes a bit more skill, IMO.

I'm glad you agree with me that BR headshots are way too easy.

I agree that snipers would still be good. I was exaggerating a little, but not all that much. Honestly, H3 maps are littered with cover, and there really aren't many maps where the sniper would be the best choice for a weapon. Though with good team support and callouts, it could be effective. I just don't usually think of power weapons as being dependent upon everyone else.

Yes, even a H2exque BR would take more skill with hitscan and other factors in H3, but still, the burst just gets me. I know you're arguing for single shot, which is good, but a lot of people just argue for tighter spread.

I still think an extremely accurate BR is easy to use unscoped compared to an unscoped sniper.

Like I said, I agree with most of what you say, I just want to make people think before changes are made. H2s BR was horribly easy to use and made the game trudge along. I don't mind a great weapon, but at least have skill to it. More shots with faster ROF or same with slower ROF and more accuracy would be great. Less autoaim, keep hitscan the way it is, etc. I think that's a fair tradeoff.

  • 10.14.2008 8:35 AM PDT

In my free time i'm a Turkish ambassador

I like the BR just the way it is too. Oh, and theres also NOTHING better in halo 3 than getting a 4 shot with the BR. =D

  • 10.14.2008 1:25 PM PDT
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Posted by: X0XH3ADSH0TX0X
I like the BR just the way it is too. Oh, and theres also NOTHING better in halo 3 than getting a 4 shot with the BR. =D


Getting a 5 shot with a pistol, getting an 8 shot with a carbine, getting a headshot with a sniper, getting a noscope with a sniper, our-ARing a BR who thinks BRs are godlike at all ranges and they can still doubleshot and bxr, etc.

  • 10.14.2008 2:48 PM PDT
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Posted by: fifthderelicte
Posted by: X0XH3ADSH0TX0X
I like the BR just the way it is too. Oh, and theres also NOTHING better in halo 3 than getting a 4 shot with the BR. =D


Getting a 5 shot with a pistol, getting an 8 shot with a carbine, getting a headshot with a sniper, getting a noscope with a sniper, our-ARing a BR who thinks BRs are godlike at all ranges and they can still doubleshot and bxr, etc.

Opinion... Though I do agree with the Pistol kill...

  • 10.14.2008 3:28 PM PDT
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wats wrong wit it is say ur trying to snipe a dude and he pulls out a f@...... br r u going to die or live think about it

  • 10.14.2008 3:47 PM PDT
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thats wat im trying to say like if u have a sniper r u going to die or live and if the -blam!- wit the BR shots at u wat now that my point r u going to die or live

  • 10.14.2008 3:50 PM PDT
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Posted by: Breezy131
Posted by: fifthderelicte
Posted by: X0XH3ADSH0TX0X
I like the BR just the way it is too. Oh, and theres also NOTHING better in halo 3 than getting a 4 shot with the BR. =D


Getting a 5 shot with a pistol, getting an 8 shot with a carbine, getting a headshot with a sniper, getting a noscope with a sniper, our-ARing a BR who thinks BRs are godlike at all ranges and they can still doubleshot and bxr, etc.

Opinion... Though I do agree with the Pistol kill...


Of course it's opinion. But I was replying to an opinion. And yes, out of all those, pistols are one of the nicest. Though a good noscope is pretty fun too, IMO, haha.

Seriously, Breezy, I like you. You have good ideas and you always see the holes in mine. I love coming at debates from extremes, and honestly, I think the majority of people (at least at the levels I play) love the BR and for a more accurate one. I feel some kind of weird responsibility to play the Devil's Advocate and argue against them, though I do not want a H2 repeat.

You've definitely addressed the only concerns I could come up with for a better BR. You've addressed making headshots harder, upping the accuracy (which ups the effectiveness), but adding more elements that require skill (such as single shot and no burst, keeping hitscan as it is, decreasing autoaim, etc), which is what most people fail to do. Most argue for tighter spread, but want to keep the ease of use as is. That, I am not willing to accept. If they made the BR not just more accurate, but less random, as well as upped the range a little and the skill needed to wield the BR effectively, I think it would do nothing but help gameplay and sort out the good from the best. That is, of course, all in my own opinion.

  • 10.14.2008 4:51 PM PDT

DEATH FROM ABOVE!


FrE3LanCe f0r HiRE

how does changing ur sensitvity higher help u with the br?

  • 10.14.2008 7:32 PM PDT
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Posted by: lt hindu
how does changing ur sensitvity higher help u with the br?


Reaction time, for a better chance in winning a fight where the other guy saw you first.

Look speed to help out your teammates quicker

Since BR bursts make the sweeping tactic an easy headshot, this may allow you to have quicker reaction times and still be fine, since accuracy for finishing kills isn't imperative

I love 10 because it helps me with grenades. Get caught off guard, quick turn sideways or look down and throw a grenade, walk forward a little, then turn around. Your enemy has just walked into your grenade and you only need a headshot.

If you get caught with your pants down at close range, it can help out a lot. CQ fights are insane, and if you don't have a good alternative weapon or time to change, this helps a lot

  • 10.14.2008 8:27 PM PDT

Reach!

Tighter spread.. nerfing everything isn't better... rockets are deadly wtf? wheres the pistol playlist then.. I fn hate rockets,

damn snipers better than H2s just that I suck with it!!

Love the BR, and really miss the pistol from CE.

  • 10.15.2008 3:33 AM PDT

more balanced now, and no more noob combos either.

  • 10.15.2008 2:20 PM PDT

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Posted by: MaTT MiLLeR 93
i think it's really the all purpose gun as its got good accuracy and an ok rate of fire, although in campaign i tend to use ar more.

just the opposite. I use it a lot more in Campaign.
But i think all the guns are fine the way they are.
if you have a problem, ask for a new gun

  • 10.15.2008 2:49 PM PDT

The next person to assume I am talking about ranked, do us all a favor and look at what I play!

The BR fills its role correctly. It is long range as shown on this chart.

Shotgun: CQB.
SMG: SRB
AR: MRB
BR: LRB.
SR: ERB.

  • 10.15.2008 4:01 PM PDT

Posted by: Great_Pretender
Case and point: don't worry about it. Girls start getting boobies pretty soon, and then you'll have plenty of other things to think about. Being an Inheritor is not a life goal.
-TGP-

The BR kills in one headshot It just gives some warning shots first...

  • 10.15.2008 5:02 PM PDT
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Posted by: mortabunt
The BR fills its role correctly. It is long range as shown on this chart.

Shotgun: CQB.
SMG: SRB
AR: MRB
BR: LRB.
SR: ERB.

Yeah, you missed the entire point of the random vs. non random argument.

[Edited on 10.15.2008 5:09 PM PDT]

  • 10.15.2008 5:08 PM PDT

The BR is great the way it is right now

  • 10.15.2008 7:01 PM PDT

DEATH FROM ABOVE!


FrE3LanCe f0r HiRE

well sheet putty my sensitvity all the way to 10 would be great but im one who like using sniper when i doubles and i dont think having a high sentsvity would help wiht snipping .... sacrifces must be made

  • 10.15.2008 9:40 PM PDT

Ohai, I'm Loscocco (pronounced Loss-cocoa). I'm a college student (computer science major), 3D animator, and long-time Halo player.

guys guys you have it all wrong.
BR is an abbriviation for Bath-Room Dont you get it? =)

but in all seriousnes
leading shots is actually a good thing- it adds a realistic touch to the game.
dont tell me "it has aliens and is about super spartans" that doesnt mean that laws of physics can be broken (outside the mancannon)

and high and low sensitivity both work wonders.
high- you can lead your shots because you can move much faster
low- you have a more steady shot against your opponant
both work very well for different reasons- if you are bad at aiming because you are out of control with the right control stick- use low sensitivity. if you are a good aimer and think you can go faster, try a higher speed

[Edited on 10.16.2008 2:31 PM PDT]

  • 10.16.2008 1:39 PM PDT
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The problem with high sensitivity is a slight nudge of the right thumbstick, and you'll send yourself doing 360's. Of course, I'm exagerrating, but some good advice is not to put your sensitive extremely high, a bit higher than default is perfectly fine.

  • 10.16.2008 11:20 PM PDT
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Right ill just get my flame suit on...
I HATE BRs i just dont find them a very good gun, im more of an in your face eat a sticky/ my gun person, YES i use the AR but i use it skillfully not just SPRAAAAAAAAAAY i will launch a grenade or two then shoot them when theyre shields are down sorta like the BR and plasma pistol combo AKA the noob combo, each gun takes skill to use just a different style so all who say BR starts are great really are sad OR mlg, tbh starting with an AR is better because THEN you have to find a BR and your not being pummeled by every member of their team which has more BRs than the map should have! so i rest my case AR starts are better than BR starts for the pure fact that if you can get a BR in the match fine but if you start with it, whats the point? its like giving everyone a ridiculously powerful weapon! infact i just think a BR is too powerful a gun that you can come across to easily.
well everyone im waiting for your replies tbh im expecting ALOT of flame HENCE my flame suit
right now i guess i better get prepared for nuclear flamage! this is going to be fun!

  • 10.17.2008 1:55 PM PDT
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I think the BR looks awesome.

  • 10.17.2008 4:19 PM PDT