Halo 1 & 2 for PC
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Subject: Do other users really cheat or GASP even worse do servers cheat?
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I can go to websites that say they have aim bots you can use with Halo, and those same sites talk about MODing where you can do things like make your assault rifle shoot sniper rounds, not to mention all the various things you can do with your shields and health. And then there is the guys who one minute are right in front of you, the next minute they have moved like 100 feet to the left. These same guys I have seen pass thru the body of my warthog. And I have seen guys that I just attached plasma grenades to, walk into the wall and the grenades just fall to the ground and kill me. (Not to mention giving the wall walker credit for a kill of me from my grenade)

And then the thing about the little yellow box that appears in the lower right hand corner of my screen. Most folks call this lag. I often notice this right when some-one who is “Blessed with God-Like Skills” enters or leaves the server.

I hope you see what I am asking but to be more specific………

Is there any way for me to tell if I am playing on an “unfair” server?

If I am running the server, can I block the users from using cheats?

So you guys tell me, is this stuff happening or has my village put something in my drinking water?


[Edited on 6/25/2004 3:54:28 AM]

  • 06.25.2004 3:47 AM PDT

Modding only works if you're the host. And aimbots are useless (thanks to the lead time). The things that you have noticed are attributable to lag (warping is a BIG problem for Halo PC).
There are SOME hacks that work (invisible walls is all I can think of), but really hacking isn't something that you have to worry about.

  • 06.25.2004 5:05 AM PDT
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Most of the "cheats" that you mention are not actual cheats, just mods that alter the multiplayer gameplay so you can experiment... for instance, there is the overpowered mod, which makes bullets, rockets, and plasma knock vehicles and you high into the air... and ones that makes it impossible to run out of ammo...

So if you join a game where a mod makes it seem unbalanced, just don't play.

  • 06.25.2004 8:45 AM PDT
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It's customary to ask the host what's modded. If he decides to be unfair and doesn't tell you, just experiment with all the weapons you can get your hands on.

  • 06.25.2004 10:55 AM PDT
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Posted by: Yoe Dude
And then there is the guys who one minute are right in front of you, the next minute they have moved like 100 feet to the left. These same guys I have seen pass thru the body of my warthog. And I have seen guys that I just attached plasma grenades to, walk into the wall and the grenades just fall to the ground and kill me. (Not to mention giving the wall walker credit for a kill of me from my grenade)

And then the thing about the little yellow box that appears in the lower right hand corner of my screen. Most folks call this lag. I often notice this right when some-one who is “Blessed with God-Like Skills” enters or leaves the server.


Ok first off, your basicly totally wrong

Yes there are aimbots and mods etc, but they dont work, the mods only work offline or on servers that have been modded

The section you describe as people who can move 100s of feet in a second, thats called warping, these people have very bad connections to the server and are lagging, that is why they warp

the little box is NOT when people are cheating enter or join the server, it is YOUR inet connection, and you are recieving packet loss from the server

a suggestion, please consider talking to others in games about this before posting stuff like this on forums that n00bs read and start making conspiracy theories similar to yours

  • 06.25.2004 2:51 PM PDT
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Thank you guys for posting to my inquiry. Your insights have been helpful, but I still find my questions un-answered. No insult to you Goweb, you sound like you know what you’re talking about.

The aimbot question could better be summed up with this example. On Blood Gulch, if there are guys driving hogs around my base, I can empty my assault rifle and not take the down (Yes, I use my pistol with no problems killing them) but I get the flag and drive to my base and some guy is shooting me with his assault rifle, and I zig-zag, bounce and do whatever, yet they hit me from on top of their base and I die from ½ way across the field. (If you say this is normal, send me your home address I’d love to come over and watch you play, if you’re that good)

One other example I tested out last night on a (nameless) server. I had a member of the other team wait for me under the bridge in Ice Fields. When he got there I jumped off the bridge to land next to him. He got the credit for a kill without him firing a shot. (Yes he was amazed that what I told him was true.)

If I see something really wrong (like my pistol shooting sniper rounds) I DO leave that server. (Plus I have a list so I don’t go there again) But really guys, if some-one has Modded their server so their team has, say more health points than my team, do you really think they will admit this? (People who would cheat like this don’t strike me as being the most honest folks)

And lastly Cube. (No, I’m not going to flame you, I read the rules to this forum, unlike you. I can tell from your use of the “N” word.)

I am an OEM PC manufacturer. My first console was Pong and my first PC was a Commodore 64. (And I do have grey hair) My PC is slick, and I have it turned way down to play multi-player on-line. (Yeah, spent shells flying from the hog gun are cool, but if it costs me any chance of lag why use it?) I have a dedicated T3 in my home office that I use to play Halo. I get ping times from Europe of about 110 and I never play any games that I get a ping of greater than say 66. I lose approximately .001% due to packet loss. During times of “Lag” my ping times DOES NOT CHANGE. I do notice other users going from say 100 ping to 400 ping, so the “packet loss" must be from the server side of the connection. And lastly, I have no intention of creating any rumors about cheats. I am here to get real answers if they are to be found. My original post is a shortened version of an e-mail I wrote to Bungie.net asking for advice from the horse’s mouth so to speak, but they choose not to reply to me, hence I made this post. I didn’t notice the word moderator next to your name, so you are like me, a user without any inside knowledge.

You all said that aimbots and trainers don’t work but no-one said I have tried them and they didn’t work for me. I am tempted to try one myself, but I know better than to install “unknown vendor” software on my pc, since I use it for work and my data is too valuable to risk


[Edited on 6/25/2004 5:27:29 PM]

  • 06.25.2004 5:19 PM PDT

Bungie won't respond. They don't provide support for their own games. Try Microsoft support for help.
There are some interesting glitches in Halo PC. The game awards the other player the kill because, I guess, it decides that the other player caused you to fall to your death. And I doubt it's just the AR guy shooting at you.
And for Halo, a ping of 66 is still significant, because of the prediction code.

  • 06.25.2004 6:09 PM PDT
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Hey there,

I'm not a moderator here, but I am a moderator on Gearbox's website (the company who did the PC port). Here is the official word from a Gearbox developer:

The trainer programs are very, very funny

They work for single player, thats fine, it does not hurt anyone else if folks want to goof off and have fun. But in multiplayer on a dedicated server its quite a bit different.

People that use these are seeing on their end unlimited ammo, super overshield, super health, etc.... Its all client side. So the folks using these are just fooling themselves.

The Halo server is what matters, it does not see any of the results of the trainer. Same thing goes for folks using hacked .map files. They may see grenades or warthogs shooting out of their pistols, but the server sees the game correctly.

You see, the server has the authority, what the server says goes, all game decisions are final

David Mertz
Gearbox Software


Because the server decides what is happening in the game, mods or hacks that someone makes on their machine (the client) have no effect on the real game, even if it looks like it's working on their screen. Now, if someone is hosting the game, anything is possible, since their computer is acting as the server. But if you stick to dedicated servers, you have nothing to worry about.

That little RJ-45 icon on the bottom right corner of the screen is for packet loss, not a hacker coming into the server. Your connection may be fine, but if the server is having trouble you'll still have problems. The warping players are people with crap connections, not cheaters. You'll notice that usually those people have >300 ping.

There are a lot of weird things that happen in HaloPC that baffle people. Many people immediately scream "cheater!", but most of the things can easily be explained by lag. Sometimes I fall over dead without hearing a shot. Sometimes someone will shoot me with a rocket and I collapse without seeing or hearing an explosion. Sometimes I run over someone 3 times in a warthog and they seem to bounce off my bumper. Sometimes I hit Banshees with tank shells and they don't die. Sometimes I melee someone in the back 4-5 times without them dying. Sometimes plasma grenades disappear. It's all lag. Because the game is server-authoritative, the "real game" is taking place on the server, and sometimes may not be the same thing you're seeing on your screen. Your tank shell may look like it hit the banshee (and your screen drew the explosion and everything), but if the shot missed on the server, nothing will happen.

Hopefully that will help explain some of the weird things you've seen. I've played this game most every day since it came out last Fall, and I've never once seen anything I would suspect of cheating. If you play on dedicated servers (instead of some random guy's host), you should have nothing to worry about.

(Another problem with playing on someone's host is that, because his computer is having to run his game of Halo as well as keeping track of all the other players, his computer's resources are spread too thin. This will result in bad performance for all the other players. HaloPC is already a resource hog, but if you make it also double as a server it doesn't work so well for the other players.)

  • 06.26.2004 12:21 AM PDT
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Posted by: Yoe Dude
The aimbot question could better be summed up with this example. On Blood Gulch, if there are guys driving hogs around my base, I can empty my assault rifle and not take the down (Yes, I use my pistol with no problems killing them) but I get the flag and drive to my base and some guy is shooting me with his assault rifle, and I zig-zag, bounce and do whatever, yet they hit me from on top of their base and I die from ½ way across the field. (If you say this is normal, send me your home address I’d love to come over and watch you play, if you’re that good)

One other example I tested out last night on a (nameless) server. I had a member of the other team wait for me under the bridge in Ice Fields. When he got there I jumped off the bridge to land next to him. He got the credit for a kill without him firing a shot. (Yes he was amazed that what I told him was true.)

If I see something really wrong (like my pistol shooting sniper rounds) I DO leave that server. (Plus I have a list so I don’t go there again) But really guys, if some-one has Modded their server so their team has, say more health points than my team, do you really think they will admit this? (People who would cheat like this don’t strike me as being the most honest folks)

You all said that aimbots and trainers don’t work but no-one said I have tried them and they didn’t work for me. I am tempted to try one myself, but I know better than to install “unknown vendor” software on my pc, since I use it for work and my data is too valuable to risk


Ok, your first paragraph ive quoted, that can be easily explained......more then one person is shooting you and they get headshots on you, it happens to alot of people all the time and is why games are not won in a couple of minutes........i suggest swerving more in a more unpradictable pattern

second paragraph, if the server is moddied its moddied for all, not certain players, and you can easily tell if it is or not, even if you got the best pc out there, internet connection and its your next door neighbours server, you'll still lag on there becuase the files are diffferent

third paragraph, he gets credit for killing you if he only fires a single assualt rifle round at you, which hits, as hes the last person to hit you before you die

forth paragraph, because you said this, i went and had a look, i have absolutely no intention of even testing one out, but from what i saw, if you dont know much about computers, and a few keyboard commands, your a bit screwd, which in my opinion is a very good thing, as those who go looking for them can end up with computer problems, and from what i can tell without testing one out, is that most seem to be bogus, the websites dont really have them, or they are not what they are labled up as

"unknown vendor software", well what can i say you are obviously very careful with what goes on your pc, i wouldnt put it past you having a bit of spyware on it (auto downloaded off bogus websites), but not much, as the "ultra careful" approach is quite effective but is its own weakness, you miss out on free little programs which work fine and help your pc, but each to there own, if your comfortable doing that, thats your choice

"since I use it for work and my data is too valuable to risk", i suggest you get a program called norton ghost then, get in a stack on blank recordable disks and make a copy of your hard drive onto these disks, this would allow you to reset your computer to the settings and files it had on at the point in which you backed it up (remember to delete all temporary files, before backing up, as you dont want to back those up with wasted space)

  • 06.26.2004 1:42 AM PDT
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I believe that there are possible exploits "hacks" out there too. Alot of the same people who have told you "there are no hacks in Halo PC" did the same to me. Though none of them is anywhere remotely a Developer. None of them actually know because they are just like you and me; privy only to the small snippets of info given to the public by the devs. Also they are not the "hackers", and if they were they would want to definately keep that under wraps. This game like many other does have vulnerabilities to cheating. Though it is "server authoritative" a program may be written for the client that aims at the most vulnerable parts of the opposite team at all times, and if you are using this cheat no matter when you pull the trigger you will be telling the server that you are shooting at those vulnerable spots. Still more people will argue this in saying that you have to "lead" your targets; still "lead" is a simple mathmatical equation that can be integrated into a much more complicated aimbot program to overcome such factors of "lead". There are cheats in Halo PC, though many times there are just skilled people (with no life other than playing Halo PC 15 hours a day). A friend of mine is a local computer store owner where I live; he got access to a website touting "hacks" for Halo PC, and he downloaded and installed them. He called me after he had got it working, and I went to see what he was talking about. There in front of me (while he was on a official Bungie server) was Halo PC hacked to the gills. This particular cheat was a "wall-hack". It allows you to see the enemy at all times through any surface in the game. Also this particular cheat had a little thing called "esp" that puts a little blue or red circle around the heads of the opposing team members. Just the existence of this cheat ( and the fact it was free to download off the internet) leads me to believe the obvious. That there are in fact more complicated and nefarious cheats for Halo PC.

Believe me that there will be a horde of posts before and after my reply telling you that I dont know what I am talking about, but just remember they are not the developers of this game in any way, nor are they the originators of the cheats; so in all actuality they only have as much information as you and me. Unfortunately cheating happens eventually in all good online multiplayer games; even in games with strict rules and policies, and stringent anti cheat software implemented in them (planetside) . Computer code is an open ended entity, and if you are strong enough with writing it, and smart enough, anything can be hacked. From the most protected database... To a great game called Halo PC.

  • 06.26.2004 2:55 AM PDT

You are right about their being a lot of replies after your post. However, I would like to point out that you are not a developer or a hacker either, so you're in the same position as us. You just have to trust what the developers actually say, as they're the real experts.

  • 06.26.2004 3:25 AM PDT
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There in front of me (while he was on a official Bungie server) was Halo PC hacked to the gills. This particular cheat was a "wall-hack". It allows you to see the enemy at all times through any surface in the game. Also this particular cheat had a little thing called "esp" that puts a little blue or red circle around the heads of the opposing team members. Just the existence of this cheat ( and the fact it was free to download off the internet) leads me to believe the obvious. That there are in fact more complicated and nefarious cheats for Halo PC.

The invisible wall thing does not imply the existence of other cheats like aimbots, infinite health, super-powerful weapons, etc. It works totally differently. The reason the invisible wall thing works is because the map textures are on the client's computer, so if the client replaces the wall textures with a transparent texture, he can see through the walls. Ditto for altering the character models, etc. But once again, these have absolutely nothing to do with other cheats like aimbots, infinite health, etc. It in no way implies that other more "nefarious" cheats exist.

The difference between a server-side netcode and a client side netcode has been explained before. I'm too lazy to retype it all, and it would probably fall on deaf ears anyway. Comparisons to Counterstrike, Unreal, BF 1942 are irrelevant ("those game have hacks, why can't Halo?"). And the point of "hackers and 'phreaks' can do anything, even (and especially) when it's impossible" isn't really an argument.

And besides, Halo isn't popular enough for "1337 hax0rz" to bother with anyway. It's the same reason Mac OS X doesn't have the same virus problems as Windows (aside from all the security holes in Windows).

If someone can provide links to some working aimbots or super-health cheaters or something like that (either via private message or on the forum, if that's allowed), I'll believe it when I see it. Until then, I'll stick with what the Gearbox developers have said (see earlier quote) and my own experience playing this game almost everyday since release.

  • 06.26.2004 4:01 AM PDT
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Posted by: goweb
You are right about their being a lot of replies after your post. However, I would like to point out that you are not a developer or a hacker either, so you're in the same position as us. You just have to trust what the developers actually say, as they're the real experts.


See what I mean about alot of replys trying to de-bunk what i posted?

  • 06.26.2004 3:52 PM PDT
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The invisible wall thing does not imply the existence of other cheats like aimbots, infinite health, super-powerful weapons, etc. It works totally differently. The reason the invisible wall thing works is because the map textures are on the client's computer, so if the client replaces the wall textures with a transparent texture, he can see through the walls. Ditto for altering the character models, etc. But once again, these have absolutely nothing to do with other cheats like aimbots, infinite health, etc. It in no way implies that other more "nefarious" cheats exist.

The difference between a server-side netcode and a client side netcode has been explained before. I'm too lazy to retype it all, and it would probably fall on deaf ears anyway. Comparisons to Counterstrike, Unreal, BF 1942 are irrelevant ("those game have hacks, why can't Halo?"). And the point of "hackers and 'phreaks' can do anything, even (and especially) when it's impossible" isn't really an argument.

And besides, Halo isn't popular enough for "1337 hax0rz" to bother with anyway. It's the same reason Mac OS X doesn't have the same virus problems as Windows (aside from all the security holes in Windows).

If someone can provide links to some working aimbots or super-health cheaters or something like that (either via private message or on the forum, if that's allowed), I'll believe it when I see it. Until then, I'll stick with what the Gearbox developers have said (see earlier quote) and my own experience playing this game almost everyday since release.


This guy too.. he is a moderator on the gearbox forum (not a developer) which in his mind makes him an "expert" ,or at least he likes to play the pompous "I know more than you" part. Definately a legend in his own mind...

But what none of these "de-bunkers" can tell you Yoe Dude, is that there is no possible way that someone can write a cheat to work with the "server authoritative" system. Beacause in all reality there can be cheats written for this system. In fact there can be cheats written for games that scan your hard drive everytime you log onto the game (planetside). So if people are getting passed that. How is it that they cant get passed the "almighty" Halo PC "server authoritative" system. Also 1337 hackers would find the challenge of the constant "Halo Pc cannot be hacked" banter going on all around the community a challenge, and therefore would love to hack the living ca-ca out of it. Now I am not talking about "infinite shields" or "infinite ammo" , just a simple aim-bot. Something that would cause just as much havok to non-cheating players as any "infinite" cheat would. In the end these guys will quote the words of the developers with a muffled tone (cause they got thier collective noses shoved way up the Dev's rear ends) , and tell you that I dont know what I am talking about (though I have a Masters Degree in computer programming) , but in the end it is really all up to you to decide who you want to believe.

  • 06.26.2004 4:08 PM PDT
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Yes I sure have opened a can of worms with this post =) One of my friends called me after reading this and he told me his horror story. I won't go into any details now because I told him to post what he found out not just tell me. (I think I should have picked a different handle on this site since one of my friends knew it was me from my name.) Just one more thing I guess I need to say, One of you told me I knew nothing and should use a "Norton product" on my PC. Well if you knew anthing you would know how much of a processer hog Norton is, you would be a fool to use anything made by them when there are so many better things out there. ( I use CA for my virus software ) What I ment by "untrustworthy software" is thease damm aim-bots that I found don't even come signed from thier publisher, and if your having problems finding these just message me with your e-mail and I will send the two I found for you to test.

Oh yeah, I guess one other reason I am asking these questions is I wish to open up my new Halo server, but I am still nervous about this due to the fact it would be a PC sitting outside my firewall, and I really don't wish to run anything else on this sytem but the Halo server ( ie no virus software ) and man that is a scary thought.

[Edited on 6/27/2004 2:02:20 AM]

  • 06.27.2004 1:49 AM PDT

No-one's found a security hole in the Halo server yet, so I wouldn't worry.

  • 06.27.2004 2:55 AM PDT
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Yes, I moderate their webforums. No, I'm not a Halo developer (although I do write software for a living). But I can point you to developer quotes saying why meaningful cheating on dedicated servers can't happen. Do you really expect a developer to come to every forum and post in every thread where people ask about cheating? Give me a break. They're busy people and have better things to do. So posting a link to a developer answering the same question is about as good as it's going to get. Sorry if that's not good enough (although I get the feeling that even if Jason Jones himself came here and explained why cheating can't happen, that wouldn't be enough for you and you'd still argue that nothing is impossible.)

Like I said, if someone can show me an actual Halo cheat, I'm all ears. Until then, I remain skeptical. The onus is on you to show the existence of cheats and hacks. It's not up to me to demonstrate the non-existence of something (which is impossible).

  • 06.27.2004 3:32 PM PDT
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i looked around on the internet for a while for an "aimbot" , and this was all i could find. Click here for Aimbot
Edit: I know it sure helped my game... :)

[Edited on 6/28/2004 12:14:05 AM]

  • 06.27.2004 3:55 PM PDT
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Crap! Darn it... I knew there must have been an aimbot. Oh well, I'll just have to eat my words then. I guess it's finally time to start screaming "OMG WTF h4xx!!!" every time I get killed.

[Edited on 6/27/2004 10:52:37 PM]

  • 06.27.2004 10:50 PM PDT
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wow guys nice flaming technique!

still cant overcome the "know it all" attitude, and actually talk about how someone could use thier programming smarts to overcome the Halo PC system. I understand that making witty quips and insulting is alot more fun for you. Thats just fine with me as I still am looking for an "adult " attitude like yoe dude is exhibiting. Now you may be over 18 years of age but still your flaming me like a child. Yes I admit to the same behavior (occasionally), but really guys cant we just get along and use this forum as an "adult" area to debate with some sense of civility. Elmo you talk about being a software author; could you (not would you) be able to write a program to always aim at the enemy teams most vulnerable points whether they are in a vehicle or not? Its a simple question, and I think we both know the answer.

Yoe dude, dont worry about leaving that server open to the public, if the only thing you have running on it is Halo PC, I doubt anyone will mess with it. Also if and when you get it running post the IP here and I will join up and frag you :)

  • 06.28.2004 1:31 AM PDT

still cant overcome the "know it all" attitude, and actually talk about how someone could use thier programming smarts to overcome the Halo PC system.
That's because no-one CAN overcome the Halo PC system. OK, someone could waste their time writing a really smart aimbot, but the serious hacks that you see troubling games like Counter-Strike are completely impossible. This is straight from the developers, as TalkingElmo has already stated.
Now could we end this debate once and for all? If you find a working and downloadable hack then this would be worthy of comment. Otherwise just drop it, because neither of us will be able to change each others' minds.

  • 06.28.2004 1:44 AM PDT
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I am not trying to change minds. Just trying to have an intelligent debate with a fellow programmer about the posssiblity of someone actually writing that "smart" aimbot. Which in fact (if it were distributed) wreak havok on Halo PC, just as others have in CS.

  • 06.28.2004 1:52 PM PDT
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Hey guys. I am the friend that Yoe spoke about in his earlier post. Here is a copy of an E-mail I received after I spoke with some players on-line and wanted more information about their clan. I removed any details that would get this post removed from this forum:

if u wanna join the clan go to www.- {SOMECLAN} and make sure to put the – in it and register then go to the bottom of the home page and go to clan tryouts then go to the lotr clan topic and post there so we know that u r a member and if u wanna i can make u a screen name email back if u wanna join the clan and if u made a screen name on halo-mods. After you join I will show you how to get auto ammo and auto shield.

{CLANMEMBERNAME} NOT {CLANMEMBERNAME} that is my recruit name

Ok, that is it. I guess this clan and their server has been MODed in some way for its members to have extra shields and extra ammo, which answers Yoe’s original question. Do GASP servers cheat? My response to that would be…. YES!

Oh and that is the original text, save for where I remove their website address and the writers clan names.

  • 06.29.2004 11:40 AM PDT
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Yes I say thank you to all who added thier 2 cents worth. I have learned, listened, and tried to follow the advice offered. And this is what I have concluded.......

1. My play does not change that much no matter where I play. I play defence on some maps and get the flag on others, and I usally get about 15% more kills than deaths. (Unless I am only trying for the flag, then I die alot more.)

2. Someone pointed out to me that playing on Bungie servers, I would NEVER run into an "unfairly" MODed server. And I have been playing on those to some extent and I noticed that no-one ever gets a score of 45 kills vs. 6 deaths. (However I will not be driving a tank on Blood Gulth on a bungie server.)

3. There is a lag issue on some servers. And amazingly there are folks that think they can play Halo thru a dial-up internet connection. In these cases my responce is LATERS!

4. And yes Virginia, there are servers out there that have cheats in thier MODs. I'm makin a list, checkin it twice, and hopefully I can avoid servers that aren't nice.

Two other sad things....

The above un-named clan server, which has all the nice little "extras", is run by people in thier 30's. (The server MODer is 16 though.) I had expected to find that those who would cheat in a GAME would be more mature. (Not that I am trying to put down any-one younger, I am sure most of you have morals, however I expect more from adults than I do from pre-teens.)

And this server is offering these MODs to their members for subscribing to the server. What folks will do for a buck. I was thinking of offering them 30 pieces of silver, since they are KILLING the fun of the game.

Once again, THANKS to all who wrote to this forum. And I think I will go out on a limb......
I can talk the talk, but can I walk the walk you might ask?

I look forward to see you all on-line some day =)

«GÒM» Cabbie

  • 07.09.2004 10:27 AM PDT
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And I have seen guys that I just attached plasma grenades to, walk into the wall and the grenades just fall to the ground and kill me.

Heh, that's actually legitimate. You should try it sometime. If someone sticks a plasma nade to you, melee the nearest wall and sometimes it will fall off; a very handy thing to know. ;) It doesn't work 100% of the time, but those few times that it does work... man, it just feels great. :)

  • 07.09.2004 9:12 PM PDT

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