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Subject: Are the moderators more tolerant of the misbehavior of highly ranke...

Rock Chalk Real Talk
Minnesotan, currently going to school at KU.


@Geegs30

I don't know about the Mythic members, but the normals like me, yeah we get banned/warned pretty often :(

I like to try to be good, sometimes it just doesn't work out. And I hate myself for it

[Edited on 04.02.2009 4:54 PM PDT]

  • 04.02.2009 4:53 PM PDT

"I dont follow footsteps. I make them"

If you were a Mythic member and you got banned for a week or two would you lose your rank and restart as a normal member again?

  • 04.02.2009 5:06 PM PDT

‮‮Awesax

Can you guys try and make your points a bit more concise? This is getting to be a bit too much of a read. Also, being concise makes you look pretty wise.

Sometimes I suspect Foman likes to hide behind those long posts...show yourself, you are a mere mortal, aren't you!?

Anyhoo. I wouldn't mind if the titles became associated with in-game play like Achronos is suggesting. Though, either way, I'm quite happy. I think the forum ban methods at the moment incorporate a nice blend of trust according to member title as well as moderator knowledge of the forums. I say this, because if the mods relied entirely on member titles in the dealing of their bans, I'd be pretty f*****. I liked Pezz's definition of banning according to whether or not the loss of this person would help/harm the community. To go a bit off-topic, the mandatory 2 week bans in The Flood swing away from that to some degree, I feel.

EDIT: Disregard above. I just became heroic. BAN ALL MEMBERS.






[Edited on 04.02.2009 5:16 PM PDT]

  • 04.02.2009 5:07 PM PDT
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EXTREME PREJUDICE

Posted by: MikeNeel
To me, the current system may not necessarily be flawed, but it does seem to bring up more problems then it does solve
Indeed. Invisible status would work nicely I think.

Posted by: Canada Dry L
If you were a Mythic member and you got banned for a week or two would you lose your rank and restart as a normal member again?
You can count on that. I know from experience, although your ban can be as short as 3 days.

[Edited on 04.02.2009 5:16 PM PDT]

  • 04.02.2009 5:13 PM PDT
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Join KOTOR!

I intend to live forever, or die trying.

Well I can say that I like the way the trust system works I was once Heroic then became Legendary then I was Honorable Legendary member and just yesterday I somehow became a Mythic member but all in all I'm still the same person I always was and that won't change!

  • 04.02.2009 5:33 PM PDT

Back.. and to the left.
Back.. and to the left.
Back.. and to the left.
Back.. and to the left.
Back.. and to the left.
Back.. and to the left.
Back.. and to the left.

I think that the higher ranked members would be tolerated a little more than a normal member because they have obviously been doing something right in their bungie career on the forums to get a high rank. I expect they would probably get more warnings before a ban than a normal member would.

  • 04.02.2009 7:04 PM PDT
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Posted by: Jay120171
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Posted by: radical00edward
I think that the higher ranked members would be tolerated a little more than a normal member because they have obviously been doing something right in their bungie career on the forums to get a high rank. I expect they would probably get more warnings before a ban than a normal member would.


To play devils advocate, shouldn't it be the other way around?

They have been here longer, therefore they should know the rules better.

A newer member has an excuse for slipping up, they just don't know better yet.

So if anybody flirts with the line of repercussion shouldn't those with titles be held to a higher standard?

Again, playing devils advocate.

  • 04.02.2009 7:09 PM PDT
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Posted by: The Slayer
I only ban blue bars.

I'm coming for you next, Skib.
Oh you wouldn't...

I like the member titles. They allowed me to assemble a fun group of members and provide some nice variety on the forums.

  • 04.02.2009 7:16 PM PDT

so it begins...

  • 04.02.2009 7:20 PM PDT
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Something I wish could be implemented would be earning trust based on activity without actually posting. I'm on here a lot reading the forums, but I don't actually post that much. I can see that this would be abused though, so maybe it's not such a good idea.

  • 04.02.2009 7:27 PM PDT

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"Ignorance is a plague."

Close, but the plague killed those infected with it, and the ignorant are still alive.
I wish ignorance was a plague.

How often do you people get banned? Really, I think that as long as you don't do anything stupid, you should be fine.

  • 04.02.2009 7:28 PM PDT

Hi. My name is Sean. I've been a Bungie fan since Halo launched. Some of my interests include games, exercising, laser tag, martial arts, movies, music, sports, and technology. Feel free to contact me at any time.

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Posted by: x Foman123 x
However, I thought that the trust rating was implemented for the purposes of eventually implementing something like the member titles on the public forums? Wouldn't this completely negate the purpose of having trust ratings at all? I like the idea of being able to have a (very) rough idea at a glance of how much Bungie.net "trusts" a user, and I like the concept that trust ratings have noticeably encouraged some users to behave better on these forums. As my PM box can attest, users do care about member titles, and they know that warnings and bans can hurt them.
I believe Achronos was trying to say that he didn't want users to think of their title and title bar color as a rank, but rather just a label. The problem is that because administrators have a yellow bar and moderators have an orange bar, members think of title bar colors as a hierarchy. If he could tweak the system and then give us more insight about what prefixes relate to after the update, we could use them as a rough idea to see how much Bungie.net "trusts" a user. I assume join date is one of the major factors of the trust system so making the title bar color based solely off of that would probably not affect the one we have right now. Replacing the "base" part of the title with labels you could unlock would be very beneficial for the reasons already stated.

[Edited on 04.02.2009 8:14 PM PDT]

  • 04.02.2009 8:03 PM PDT

My spoon isn't the only thing that's too big

Posted by: destroys u
How often do you people get banned? Really, I think that as long as you don't do anything stupid, you should be fine.
^What he said.

Don't be stupid, stupid.

  • 04.02.2009 8:19 PM PDT

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Posted by: Deus_Ex_Machina
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Posted by: Cryptic
Posted by: x Foman123 x
However, I thought that the trust rating was implemented for the purposes of eventually implementing something like the member titles on the public forums? Wouldn't this completely negate the purpose of having trust ratings at all? I like the idea of being able to have a (very) rough idea at a glance of how much Bungie.net "trusts" a user, and I like the concept that trust ratings have noticeably encouraged some users to behave better on these forums. As my PM box can attest, users do care about member titles, and they know that warnings and bans can hurt them.
I believe Achronos was trying to say that he didn't want users to think of their title and title bar color as a rank, but rather just a label. The problem is that because administrators have a yellow bar and moderators have an orange bar, members think of title bar colors as a hierarchy. If he could tweak the system and then give us more insight about what prefixes relate to after the update, we could use them as a rough idea to see how much Bungie.net "trusts" a user. I assume join date is one of the major factors of the trust system so making the title bar color based solely off of that would probably not affect the one we have right now. Replacing the "base" part of the title with labels you could unlock would be very beneficial for the reasons already stated.
I totally agree, but I think that because people see our "labels" as ranks it gives them more of an incentive to behave. I'm going to sound evil, but.... Let them stay ignorant so they behave. :P

  • 04.02.2009 8:22 PM PDT

I cried like a little -blam!- when Foman banned me for calling someone fail, or whatever the hell it was.
But not because it changed my member title, but because of how stupid of a thing it was to be banned over. I'm not insulting Foman here, there are rules, I broke them, I deserved what I got. A warning as opposed to a ban would have been nice, but whatever.
What I mean by what a stupid thing it was to be banned for is, how stupid it was on my part. I could have contributed to the thread in an articulate manner, I knew that I should have, and I knew that simply saying you're full of fail was wrong, but I did it anyway. That's what's stupid.
I've been trolling here for years, never bothered to register, then I finally do and barely make it more than a year before I get a ban. Had I been a mythic member I probably would have thought twice. So even if some leeway is given, I think it's perfectly acceptable. Supposedly with age comes wisdom right?

I'm so rambling here, I'll go now before this gets any more incoherant and I get another ban for spam.

  • 04.02.2009 8:41 PM PDT
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  • Fabled Mythic Member
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Wow... .this thread kind of blew out of proportion...

If anyone wants my opinion(which i doubt), I think that there should be no member titles, color, etc. Of course I like the old purpley-bluey forum system better in every conceivable way... Those were the days!

  • 04.02.2009 9:26 PM PDT

Frank O'Connor is a 12-year veteran of the videogame magazine industry and has therefore never worked an honest day in his life.

It's interesting to note that the system in place has done a different job than it was originally intended to do. BUT you do have to agree that while this forum is generally well behaved, The reason behind it is many of the older members find this a good haven to discuss things related to Bungie.net and other Bungie items. It's no surprise that most of the webteams post are contained in this forum (not that it's a bad thing) and that most mods seem to "open" up more about how they deal with things on the forums here too. I think in general this is just a place where some of the older members come to post, because they know it's the most serious forum, we have our fun, we have our spam but in general we are a good forum.

That's not to discredit any younger members who post here, Cause they seem to understand what this forum is for, but go to the flood or Halo 3 forum and you will see repeated topics, off topic posts, spam and just generally amusing posts. Most because they are fairly new to the site and just want answers to questions about Halo 3 or like any kind of off topic forum they are always looking for that bar.

Of course I think a system in which you can earn different ranks by doing different things either in game or on the site itself is a good concept. It not only promotes you to play the games that the developer makes, but rewards you on their sites for doing so (imagine being able to show off some kind of neat title bar on the COD forums because you got the mile high club achievement. That would be cool. But also keeping the website based ratings would be nice, Yes maybe they aren't perfect, but they do seem to encourage good post a lot more than other forums, and I've seen a lot better posting around here since they were put in, With that said I'm wonder if anything like the Xbox forums icon system was ever thought of for here. Icons for good posting, good F.A.Q's and other things, Not so much the number based system itself though as that caused issues to me.

  • 04.02.2009 10:13 PM PDT

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Possibly,

  • 04.02.2009 10:15 PM PDT

(random yet funny signature goes here)

I just don't see why a members trust rating should have any relevance to any of us regular members who weren't tasked with moderating the forums. I understand the initial deterrent they bring on in the "If I behave and don't get banned, I'll be promoted to something fancier". That said, an invisible trust rating only mods could see would be best off for everyone. Title bars are perceived as ranks no matter the original design, and as long as they stay the way they are they will always be perceived as such. The current system isn't flawed, but it brings in more problems then it solves (even if it wasn't originally meant to "solve" any problem, but instead be a fun gimmick).

I'm not picking them apart or saying they are initially bad, just that for the one deterrent they provide the efficiency is off.

  • 04.02.2009 11:15 PM PDT
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It can be obvious at times that the Mods are more lenient towards higher ranked members and that's fine,they've been around awhile and probably deserve a little slack.

As long as they don't break any major rules(pronz for example) it seems alright to me,although I've on an occasion or two, seen a thread get nuked and the only couple people left were members with higher titles...that's where I think the favoritism crosses the line.

If you are gonna blacklist everybody in a thread you better damn well be banning your buddies too.

  • 04.03.2009 12:27 AM PDT

KOTOR
Also: Swine Flu
Posted by: Achronos
We don't need a rule for every single freaking thing someone thinks is spam.

Uhh. . . How much lee-way do I get?

  • 04.03.2009 1:01 AM PDT
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Posted by: N1CK5TER
I've noticed it in groups, in fact in the group I run I've done it myself. It just makes sense. If you've been around a while you won't get in trouble since the mods sort of know you. If you're friends with a cop who pulls you over, you won't get a ticket most times. Same basic principle.


I'd agree with Nick. That seems to be how it works, regardless of member title or bar colors. I haven't been banned much, not ever more than a week. A mod once shortened a well deserved ban because I had a technical question to post in the Flood. (You know who you are, and I still love you!)

I've gotten a little leeway, not too much but a little. They know who I am, they know that I'm mature, and they know that I'm gonna be here for a while.

  • 04.03.2009 1:46 AM PDT

For Carnage Apply Within - Fatum Iustum Stultorum

"Do not mistake your rank and number for superiority. The oldest child may learn from the youngest."

Posted by: x Foman123 x
For me personally, Legendary and Mythic members get more leeway generally -- not necessarily because I know them, but because their member titles are a recognition of a long history of being around, being active, and not getting into trouble with the rules. If I send a message to a Mythic Member asking him to please not make a certain type of post, or please be sure to post in a certain forum from now on, I know I will get a response back that is coherent and reasonable. If I post in a Mythic Member's off-topic thread with the reason why the thread is being locked, I know that the Mythic Member will read it and try to avoid doing that kind of thing anymore.


So, you trust people based simply off of colored pixels? If that's the case, what of some one who was Mythic, but due to a decline in participation, has become a 'lesser' member? Do you trust them less simply because their bar isn't a certain color. I'd go as far as to call such behavior possibly absurd, and certainly favoritism.

Personally I think that if you sent "a message to [any] Member asking him to please not make a certain type of post, or please be sure to post in a certain forum from now on", most would understand what you are saying and agree to do as you say. Give people more credit than it seems like you do, and I'd wager you may just be surpised with how many members act like Mythics given the chance. For that matter, what of members who have been around for some time but don't have a Mythic status due to their unwillingness to post for the sake of posting? I'd postulate that a good number of members have lurked for quite a while and rarely post, especially when compared to the relative total number of actual Mythic members who actively do so (post, that is).

People make mistakes and I find it unfair to treat one class of members differently from another. Yes, I know that this is "Bungie's site, we have no rights, play nice", so don't give me that line. That doesn't excuse letting some people get away with things you'd ban or blacklist others for. If a new member mistakenly posts something in the wrong forum simply because he didn't know to first look to the side of a forum for a tiny header (or multiple headers as is often the case) and read the detailed rules for each and every forum on B.net, that does not mean they either won't get around to doing so or would have ignored them if they did. Sometimes mistakes are honestly made, so why punish someone for such?

If a sense of 'community' is as important to everyone here as this thread is making it out to be, why ban and possibly 'turn off' a new user to the site when that same user could have potentially become a Mythic member or even the next Stosh somewhere down the line? I believe a sense of community is founded on respect and that respect should extend to everyone, and this is the important part, equally. When one set of people recieve more respect than others you don't have a community, you have cliques.

Then again, who am I to say anything? I'm just a member who doesn't have a blue bar nor has the time to post every day.

[Edited on 04.03.2009 2:18 AM PDT]

  • 04.03.2009 2:11 AM PDT