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Subject: Bungie, don't make the same mistakes you made in halo 3
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As everyone with eyes saw in halo 3, the battle rifle dominated every aspect of game play. It was by far the most effective weapon in the campaign, none of the other weapon even came close. In multiplayer it was a must have weapon if you had any hopes of winning, and the it was practically everywhere.
This was an inevitable result of bungie's lack of foresight (one would hope this wasn't what they were aiming for). For one, they completely crippled the starting weapon. Bungie made the assault rifle the way it is to get players to use grenades and melee more, to counter act the trend of doing nothing but dual-wielding the entire game. First of all, the main reason that anyone duel-wielded in halo 2 was because the starting weapon the smg, and even then people rarely duel-wielded any longer than the time it took them to get to a non duelable weapon. All bungie needed to do in order to decrease the amount of time people spent duel-wielding was to change the starting weapon to a non duelable weapon. They didn't need to make the it nearly completely dependent on grenades and melee.
this is why the battle rifle is so popular. it can perform with grenades and melee (aside from the more obvious reasons).

What bungie should do (if the assault rifle and battle rifle will be in reach, which they more than likely will be) is make the following modifications to these two weapons.

Assault rifle
clip size 45
effective distance increased

Battle rifle
everything the same except a smaller aiming reticle

This should improve the assault rifles ability to perform in both campaign and multiplayer, and it should make the battle rifle harder to use at close range giving players with a battle rifle a better chance of winning.

The pistol should be more like it was in halo 2 and should serve as a default secondary weapon.

Bungie, if anything please don't cripple any more weapons by making them dependent on grenades and melee. This does nothing but make that weapon less appealing to players and hurt the game as whole (especially if that weapon is the starting weapon!).

  • 06.05.2009 8:08 PM PDT
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I expected you to be an MLG playlist addict, but apparently not.

The battle rifle is by far one of the most popular weapons in the Halo franchise, right after the sniper rifle and the roundhouse kick.

But you already knew that, I doubt they will remove it but they may reduce its use in an attempt to introduce new weapons?

  • 06.05.2009 8:12 PM PDT

Every time you sneeze into an open Febreze portal the boner-tree drive shaft will spin into ketchup. But it doesn't stop at the number two pizza bell, not even close. It continues into the seventy eight minute long pile of green, sobbing cheese trains with no more butter, but more like the steak owed the tin cans some lovin'.

Maybe the battle rifle should be more accurate but do a bit less damage, (maybe take 5 or 6 bursts to kill) so that it won't dominate so much at close range but still be a very useful mid rage weapon.

  • 06.05.2009 8:18 PM PDT
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Posted by: J dot Rizzle
I expected you to be an MLG playlist addict, but apparently not.

The battle rifle is by far one of the most popular weapons in the Halo franchise, right after the sniper rifle and the roundhouse kick.

But you already knew that, I doubt they will remove it but they may reduce its use in an attempt to introduce new weapons?

I hope that bungie doesn't remove the battle rifle, I just hope that they make it more of a situational weapon rather than one you can use nearly all the time.
I should have covered this in the initial post, but another mistake that bungie should avoid is adding new weapons that are too similar to existing weapons. if bungie is going to add more weapons then they should be unique.

  • 06.05.2009 8:19 PM PDT

"It is done. By my hands. The pyrrhic solution is ignited. All I have left is the quiet of space to lull me to sleep.
I will dream of you." - The Didact

I beg to differ. . .each weapon is balanced well. . .ya just gotta know how to use each weapon. I usually use the pistol now, and I can hold my own quite well with it even at a distance.

  • 06.05.2009 8:20 PM PDT

Its not pink.

I disagree. I will admit that if your good with the battle rifle, than you can pwn, but its not the greatest weapon. And you dont need grenades and melee to kill with the AR or the BR. It just makes it an easier kill, as with almost every other weapon. And at least the AR was in halo 3, unlike halo 2, so you dont know how it would have fared against the BR before halo 3. The result could probably been the same. Oh, and they are different types of weapons for a reason, to change up you tactics based on what is available to you.

(and i hope i am understanding you right with the whole "grenades and melee" thing)

  • 06.05.2009 8:20 PM PDT
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Just throwing it out there that the pistol in Halo:CE was a god-tier starting weapon that bordered on Game Breaker status, and the MP was still insanely fun.

  • 06.05.2009 8:21 PM PDT
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Posted by: headcrab53
Maybe the battle rifle should be more accurate but do a bit less damage, (maybe take 5 or 6 bursts to kill) so that it won't dominate so much at close range but still be a very useful mid rage weapon.

I thought about what might happen if the battle rifle was powered down and I don't think it would help things. The battle rifle needs have a certain amount of damage per bullet or people at a distance will be able to escape to cover too easily and that might make the battle rifle too ineffective.

  • 06.05.2009 8:22 PM PDT
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Posted by: GhostRyderCA941
I beg to differ. . .each weapon is balanced well. . .ya just gotta know how to use each weapon. I usually use the pistol now, and I can hold my own quite well with it even at a distance.

if the weapons are balanced so well then why is it that the battle rifle is used far more than all the other weapons by a very large margin?

  • 06.05.2009 8:24 PM PDT

Every time you sneeze into an open Febreze portal the boner-tree drive shaft will spin into ketchup. But it doesn't stop at the number two pizza bell, not even close. It continues into the seventy eight minute long pile of green, sobbing cheese trains with no more butter, but more like the steak owed the tin cans some lovin'.

Posted by: techfreak1
Posted by: headcrab53
Maybe the battle rifle should be more accurate but do a bit less damage, (maybe take 5 or 6 bursts to kill) so that it won't dominate so much at close range but still be a very useful mid rage weapon.

I thought about what might happen if the battle rifle was powered down and I don't think it would help things. The battle rifle needs have a certain amount of damage per bullet or people at a distance will be able to escape to cover too easily and that might make the battle rifle too ineffective.
With the battle rifle as it is now, you'll most likely need to use more than 4 shots for enough bullets to hit someone at such a range. Making the battle rifle more accurate as well as less powerful should be able to make it less useful at close range without hurting its mid range effectiveness.

  • 06.05.2009 8:28 PM PDT
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Posted by: LiteRED
I disagree. I will admit that if your good with the battle rifle, than you can pwn, but its not the greatest weapon. And you dont need grenades and melee to kill with the AR or the BR. It just makes it an easier kill, as with almost every other weapon. And at least the AR was in halo 3, unlike halo 2, so you dont know how it would have fared against the BR before halo 3. The result could probably been the same. Oh, and they are different types of weapons for a reason, to change up you tactics based on what is available to you.

(and i hope i am understanding you right with the whole "grenades and melee" thing)

"you dont need grenades and melee to kill with the AR"
Yes you are still capable of killing an opponent with the assault rifle with grenades or melee, but the thing is that certain distance so few of your shots hit than you don't have enough ammo per clip to finish off an opponent and you have to reload. Usually at that point you're screwed because your opponent can easily counter attack (assuming they aren't currently reloading as well).

  • 06.05.2009 8:29 PM PDT
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It's a popular weapon. And if you don't mind me asking were did you get these stats that the "battle rifle is used far more than all the other weapons by a very large margin" I could say the plasma pistol is used far more than all other weapons but without stats it means nothing.

  • 06.05.2009 8:34 PM PDT

The battle rifle is not too powerful. The problem it is too easily adaptable to players who don't know how to beat it. Once you become better at close quarter combat, you can easily defeat a BR user at close range unless he can catch you in a grenade trap (which doesn't happen much anymore).

  • 06.05.2009 8:35 PM PDT
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Posted by: headcrab53
Posted by: techfreak1
Posted by: headcrab53
Maybe the battle rifle should be more accurate but do a bit less damage, (maybe take 5 or 6 bursts to kill) so that it won't dominate so much at close range but still be a very useful mid rage weapon.

I thought about what might happen if the battle rifle was powered down and I don't think it would help things. The battle rifle needs have a certain amount of damage per bullet or people at a distance will be able to escape to cover too easily and that might make the battle rifle too ineffective.
With the battle rifle as it is now, you'll most likely need to use more than 4 shots for enough bullets to hit someone at such a range. Making the battle rifle more accurate as well as less powerful should be able to make it less useful at close range without hurting its mid range effectiveness.

Well after thinking about it, I guess I agree with you.
The changes you suggested as well as decrease in reticle size should do an adequate job of keeping the battle rifle's effective range at a distance.

  • 06.05.2009 8:37 PM PDT
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Congratulations you have turned a completely new forum into another BR argument forum, take your BR v AR arguments back to the Halo3 forum,

This is here to discuss the new game not to argue about if the BR should be weakened, Bungie decide on what they are going to do, and they arent going to listen to your rambling efforts, so instead of making pointless threads about the same things that are in every other thread, why dont you just post in them?

  • 06.05.2009 8:38 PM PDT

Posted by: Daedric Paladin
Congratulations you have turned a completely new forum into another BR argument forum, take your BR v AR arguments back to the Halo3 forum,

This is here to discuss the new game not to argue about if the BR should be weakened, Bungie decide on what they are going to do, and they arent going to listen to your rambling efforts, so instead of making pointless threads about the same things that are in every other thread, why dont you just post in them?

He isn't really flaming though. Please, show some respect. Its a valid suggestion, debate it politely, don't tell him to shut up and go away.

  • 06.05.2009 8:39 PM PDT
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Posted by: Uysie2
It's a popular weapon. And if you don't mind me asking were did you get these stats that the "battle rifle is used far more than all the other weapons by a very large margin" I could say the plasma pistol is used far more than all other weapons but without stats it means nothing.

The reason I said that was because in nearly all the games I play, the battle rifle is the most used weapon, and nearly every time I've checked other players stats, the battle rifle is usually their number one, if not at least always in their top five.

  • 06.05.2009 8:41 PM PDT
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I am not telling him to shut up and go away, But so many of these same threads are in the Halo3 forum, it is basically just the same things being said except in a different section

  • 06.05.2009 8:41 PM PDT
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Posted by: techfreak1
Posted by: Uysie2
It's a popular weapon. And if you don't mind me asking were did you get these stats that the "battle rifle is used far more than all the other weapons by a very large margin" I could say the plasma pistol is used far more than all other weapons but without stats it means nothing.

The reason I said that was because in nearly all the games I play, the battle rifle is the most used weapon, and nearly every time I've checked other players stats, the battle rifle is usually their number one, if not at least always in their top five.

Okay, what I meant was even if all the games you've been in have had the BR as the tool of destruction doesn't mean everyone's tool of destruction is automatically the BR.

  • 06.05.2009 8:44 PM PDT
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Posted by: Hylebos
The battle rifle is not too powerful. The problem it is too easily adaptable to players who don't know how to beat it. Once you become better at close quarter combat, you can easily defeat a BR user at close range unless he can catch you in a grenade trap (which doesn't happen much anymore).

Most players when they get a battle rifle avoid close range combat. The way that the maps are designed, there's a lot of wide open space which is perfect for the battle rifle. The battle rifle has almost a intrinsic advantage on most of the maps.

  • 06.05.2009 8:46 PM PDT
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Posted by: Daedric Paladin
I am not telling him to shut up and go away, But so many of these same threads are in the Halo3 forum, it is basically just the same things being said except in a different section

The whole reason I bring it up is because it's in this section. I figure this early in development bungie will be watching this forum to see what the people want.

  • 06.05.2009 8:56 PM PDT
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Posted by: Uysie2
Posted by: techfreak1
Posted by: Uysie2
It's a popular weapon. And if you don't mind me asking were did you get these stats that the "battle rifle is used far more than all the other weapons by a very large margin" I could say the plasma pistol is used far more than all other weapons but without stats it means nothing.

The reason I said that was because in nearly all the games I play, the battle rifle is the most used weapon, and nearly every time I've checked other players stats, the battle rifle is usually their number one, if not at least always in their top five.

Okay, what I meant was even if all the games you've been in have had the BR as the tool of destruction doesn't mean everyone's tool of destruction is automatically the BR.

I know that it doesn't necessarily mean that its everyone's most used weapon, but going off of what I've observed it seems more likely than not. Have you seen otherwise?

  • 06.05.2009 8:58 PM PDT
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i don't think the br was horrible at all (i am not into MLG) but who knows since they are taking it out of ODST

  • 06.05.2009 9:00 PM PDT
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Posted by: II Kalamity II
i don't think the br was horrible at all (i am not into MLG) but who knows since they are taking it out of ODST

Please tell me you're lying about ODST.

  • 06.05.2009 9:02 PM PDT

My spoon isn't the only thing that's too big

Please God, no equipment this time around.

  • 06.05.2009 9:04 PM PDT

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