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Subject: Dual Weilding Re-fit.

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Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: zash208
Can we stop the," Dual weilding can't be in because of story, blah blah blah"

It is just a simple question should the player character be able to weild a Jackal Energy Shield, in any way, shape or form...
Wield it? Sure.
But your poll says "dual wield it" so I voted No, because I don't want dual wielding in the game as I think it butchers the weapon sandbox.


Dual weilding doesn't butcher the weapon sandbox, it opens it, and adds more VARIETY, isn't that what you want, seems like it by the was you post your ideas.

And as they say, variety is the spice of life.

  • 06.19.2009 4:39 PM PDT

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Posted by: zash208
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: zash208
Can we stop the," Dual weilding can't be in because of story, blah blah blah"

It is just a simple question should the player character be able to weild a Jackal Energy Shield, in any way, shape or form...
Wield it? Sure.
But your poll says "dual wield it" so I voted No, because I don't want dual wielding in the game as I think it butchers the weapon sandbox.


Dual weilding doesn't butcher the weapon sandbox, it opens it, and adds more VARIETY, isn't that what you want, seems like it by the was you post your ideas.

And as they say, variety is the spice of life.
It adds a new option to hold two weapons, but it also butchers the weapons which can be dual wielded. Remember the dual wieldable Halo 2 Needler? It was worthless because it was dual wieldable. When the Needler was single wieldable (H1 and H3) the weapon was actually worth using.

Same goes for the plasma weapons... they used to be much more unique. They had range, so they could be used more often. They had a stun, which no human weapon had, and they took off shields quicker than human weapons. You can DW them in H2 and H3, but now the plasma is less unique, and thus offer less variety.

[Edited on 06.19.2009 4:41 PM PDT]

  • 06.19.2009 4:40 PM PDT
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Yes. In fact, I can't remember which book it was in, I think it was Fall of Reach, but Spartans did use the Jackal arm shields to defend themselves at one point.

  • 06.19.2009 4:41 PM PDT

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Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: zash208
Can we stop the," Dual weilding can't be in because of story, blah blah blah"

It is just a simple question should the player character be able to weild a Jackal Energy Shield, in any way, shape or form...
Wield it? Sure.
But your poll says "dual wield it" so I voted No, because I don't want dual wielding in the game as I think it butchers the weapon sandbox.


actually duel weilding a sheild would make alot of sence due to the fact that spartans did use the sheilds befor they had regenerating sheilds implemented in the armour

also it would be pointless if you couldnt even use a pistol while having the sheild

  • 06.19.2009 4:41 PM PDT

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Posted by: Steven GB
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: zash208
Can we stop the," Dual weilding can't be in because of story, blah blah blah"

It is just a simple question should the player character be able to weild a Jackal Energy Shield, in any way, shape or form...
Wield it? Sure.
But your poll says "dual wield it" so I voted No, because I don't want dual wielding in the game as I think it butchers the weapon sandbox.


actually duel weilding a sheild would make alot of sence due to the fact that spartans did use the sheilds befor they had regenerating sheilds implemented in the armour

also it would be pointless if you couldnt even use a pistol while having the sheild

Actually you're right there. Mk V wouldn't need to track the Jackal shield held in your left hand, so you could wield a small weapon with one hand and still use a shield (though it wouldnt show up on the HUD). I wouldn't want any dual wieldable weapons, though.

  • 06.19.2009 4:42 PM PDT

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Posted by: Honourable Elite
Yes. In fact, I can't remember which book it was in, I think it was Fall of Reach, but Spartans did use the Jackal arm shields to defend themselves at one point.


Boom, right there. That is the information needed to apply this into the game, thank you.

  • 06.19.2009 4:42 PM PDT

Wait, you actually checked this?

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On topic, yes, I think that who/what ever we play as should be able to dual wield a jackal shield with some lightweight weapon (pistols, SMGs, etc.) or by itself.

  • 06.19.2009 4:43 PM PDT

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Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
No, there should be no dual wielding in Halo REACH. It wouldn't make sense in the timeline, and it flat-out ruins gameplay balance (compare Halo 2 Needler to Halo 1/3 Needler). Should we be able to wield one? Sure. But it would take both hands, maybe you could melee with it.
i don't think that dual wielding is a part of the story line it will be their. They didn't magicly gain the ability over night. From what you said, and i can understand is that their will also be no hijacking, why would they do that. people could dual wield after halo 1 why shouldn't they be able to dual wield before. i mean come on people can dual wield right now.

  • 06.19.2009 4:53 PM PDT

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Posted by: melanieadu
Maybe in ODST but in reach the spartans would be much too powerful


But as someone stated above this, the Spartans on Reach did use the energy shields, so the spartans should be able to use them in the game.

  • 06.20.2009 12:04 PM PDT

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They actually used the shields decades before Reach fell, when they had the MJOLNIR Mk IV (which didn't have shields except for in Halo Wars)

  • 06.20.2009 12:06 PM PDT

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Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
They actually used the shields decades before Reach fell, when they had the MJOLNIR Mk IV (which didn't have shields except for in Halo Wars)


As a statement to that, why did Ensemble make the Spartans in wars have shields?

  • 06.20.2009 12:08 PM PDT

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That would be pretty cool if Bungie let playable characters wield a Jackal's energy shield.

[Edited on 06.20.2009 12:10 PM PDT]

  • 06.20.2009 12:09 PM PDT

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Posted by: zash208
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
They actually used the shields decades before Reach fell, when they had the MJOLNIR Mk IV (which didn't have shields except for in Halo Wars)


As a statement to that, why did Ensemble make the Spartans in wars have shields?
Simply for gameplay, that's why HW isn't totally canon, only selectively canon.

  • 06.20.2009 12:10 PM PDT

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: zash208
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
No, there should be no dual wielding in Halo REACH. It wouldn't make sense in the timeline, and it flat-out ruins gameplay balance (compare Halo 2 Needler to Halo 1/3 Needler). Should we be able to wield one? Sure. But it would take both hands, maybe you could melee with it.


Dude, for being the idea man of Reach, you seem to be falling behind...

How would dual weilding "not fit into the timeline"?
Have you ever played Halo 1? No dual wielding there, Reach takes place before that.

And compare the Halo 2 Needler to the Halo 3 one. Remember how horrible it was compared to the one in H3? The same is the case for the Plasma Rifle, Plasma Pistol, and Pistol, when compared to their single-wieldable Halo 1 versions. In order to have dual wielding, weapons ranges' need to be cut in half, same with their power. Why not just have one strong weapon rather than two half-guns which are worthless without being paired with something else?


are you saying that Bungie should make a bad Halo Reach so Halo CE would be better?? man is a old game... time line and all those things doesn't make sense here, Bungie can do what they want in this game, this idea of the Jackal shield is great

  • 06.20.2009 12:24 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sp4rt4n119
Thank you sir, that was an epic rendition of this topic.


Posted by: Xx KNOX xX
and how!

I think it could also work as a piece of equipment.

When you pick it up it appears strapped on your left wrist [unless of course you could choose to be left handed, which I doubt we will be able to do] and when you press X you activate the shield and hold your weapon down at your side/pointed up to the sky.

When it is active another bar will appear below your shielding bar [providing we have shields] and as the shield gets hit it will deplete. If the bar hits zero the shield will "pop" and take ~15 or ~30 seconds to recharge, after which you can use it again.

Pressing X when it is active will lower the shield and allow you to fire your weapon again.

  • 06.20.2009 12:32 PM PDT

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Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: II Hunt3r II
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
But it's true... why didn't the Chief Dual wield in Halo: Combat Evolved? He only started when he got his new armor in Halo 2. Kelly dual wielded after the Spartans got the MJOLNIR upgrades in CASTLE base (they got them right before the new pistols and rifles).

Right, Chief must've gotten the idea to dual-wield after he saw Admiral Whitcomb do it to kill an Elite. The only reason he didn't do it Halo 1 was because that's how the game was set up, not because he physically couldn't. The man can flip a Scorpion tank, he can dual wield whenever he wants to.
What's your explanation for him not doing it in H1?

Mine is that the Mk V only tracked one weapon (maybe the upgrades in CASTLE base fixed this) -- would you like DW in REACH if you can only tell how much ammo you have in one of your weapons?
sorry i just read this but if this was true, he could use the shield because it doesn't have ammo right?

  • 06.20.2009 1:11 PM PDT

how about only having it in multiplayer, that way it wouldn't need to have any relavence to the halo time line or be limited by it.

[Edited on 06.20.2009 1:35 PM PDT]

  • 06.20.2009 1:33 PM PDT

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Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: zash208
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
They actually used the shields decades before Reach fell, when they had the MJOLNIR Mk IV (which didn't have shields except for in Halo Wars)


As a statement to that, why did Ensemble make the Spartans in wars have shields?
Simply for gameplay, that's why HW isn't totally canon, only selectively canon.


The gameplay wasn't totally canon, since it would be stupid if Spartans died after a few plasma shots, since they would just be slightly better marines.

The cutscenes were. In the cutscenes, they show no shields. They do show dual wielding.
This makes Spartans dual wielding before Mark VI armour canon.

Did they actually state that Mark V armour couldn't show information on 2 weapons? I lost my Halo 2 manual, so I'm not sure.


Yeah, Spartans did use Jackal Energy Shields before they got armour with Energy Shields, aswell as afterwards. Having wieldable energy shields would be pretty fun, but they have to make sure it isn't overpowered. It should only cover around half the head and half your legs if you're crouching, and only the torso if you're not.

I doubt they would have to show an "ammo" counter for the shields, colour coded works well for most people.

  • 06.20.2009 1:33 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sp4rt4n119
Thank you sir, that was an epic rendition of this topic.


Posted by: Xx KNOX xX
and how!

Posted by: Senni Ti
how about only having it in multiplayer, that way it wouldn't need to have any relavence to the halo time line or be limited by it.


In the novel Halo: First Strike the Spartans use Jackal arm shields, how does that limit being able to use them?

  • 06.20.2009 1:35 PM PDT

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Considering Spartans already have shields, I don't see why they would bother to take the time to remove a shield generator from a Jackal. They could just as easily rip the hood off a Warthog or pick up a Grunt to use as a shield.

There's no inherent advantage to the Jackal shield over any other piece of debris you might pick up and hold in front of you. So wielding a Jackal shield just becomes an unnecessary gimick.

  • 06.20.2009 1:39 PM PDT

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Posted by: TheCyberFreak
Considering Spartans already have shields, I don't see why they would bother to take the time to remove a shield generator from a Jackal. They could just as easily rip the hood off a Warthog or pick up a Grunt to use as a shield.

There's no inherent advantage to the Jackal shield over any other piece of debris you might pick up and hold in front of you. So wielding a Jackal shield just becomes an unnecessary gimick.


Too bad they do.
Their armour isn't invincible, you know.

Which would you choose:
A light, mobile, recharging and plentiful energy shield
A heavy, awkward to move, destructable piece of rock
A light, mobile but crap hood of a car that couldn't stop a few plasma bolts
A soft, squirming but hilarious Grunt shield

Well, I'd use the Grunt shield.
But if I was in a serious situation, I'd prefer the energy shield.

  • 06.20.2009 1:47 PM PDT

"If you fight it, you become it."

Sounds like a legit idea. -CB

  • 06.20.2009 1:49 PM PDT

Their power does not need to be cut in half. What matters more than power is accuaracy.

For dual wielding to work, their power could be the same as in Halo 1, but when you are dual wielding the accuracy is diminished.

That way, you can have powerfull weapons, but inaccurate dual wielding.

There you go, I fixed the problem in the best way possible.

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: zash208
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
No, there should be no dual wielding in Halo REACH. It wouldn't make sense in the timeline, and it flat-out ruins gameplay balance (compare Halo 2 Needler to Halo 1/3 Needler). Should we be able to wield one? Sure. But it would take both hands, maybe you could melee with it.


Dude, for being the idea man of Reach, you seem to be falling behind...

How would dual weilding "not fit into the timeline"?
Have you ever played Halo 1? No dual wielding there, Reach takes place before that.

And compare the Halo 2 Needler to the Halo 3 one. Remember how horrible it was compared to the one in H3? The same is the case for the Plasma Rifle, Plasma Pistol, and Pistol, when compared to their single-wieldable Halo 1 versions. In order to have dual wielding, weapons ranges' need to be cut in half, same with their power. Why not just have one strong weapon rather than two half-guns which are worthless without being paired with something else?

  • 06.20.2009 1:55 PM PDT
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I like it when they disappear after killing them, kinda like how the swords did in Halo: CE.

  • 06.20.2009 2:24 PM PDT

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