Halo 3: ODST Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: Why forgable Fire Fight maps are possible.
  • Subject: Why forgable Fire Fight maps are possible.
Subject: Why forgable Fire Fight maps are possible.
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Forged firefight has no point?
firefight is a game
a game is ment for fun.
so their is no point in a game
and no point in having fun?

  • 06.22.2009 9:39 PM PDT

If it was not for forge I would not be playing Halo 3 still, I did the missions and now what do I do!!! I want to play with my friends some thing different and I am always on here looking for new maps and game types, thats what has made it fun for me!!

If bungie did do this it would be the same, people could make different maps that people could try and enjoy. Like it has been said playing the same map over and over again get boring really fast! If you want a game that you can play over and over again, you need forge and thats what has made Halo 3 so playable and has made it the 1# played game around ever!

I would love to try a map with everything taken out and no where to go and see how long we could last, now that would be fun! Then I would guess you would be able to increase the number of people that come at you. So that has just added more fun, increase the force and test your skills.
WE KNOW THAT THIS IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN BUTY WHY DO YOU HAVE TO BE SO -blam!- ABOUT IT, WE ARE JUST SAYING WHAT COULD BE.

If you think this is a dumb idea then dont talk about it go back to your boring same maps and play them over and over and over again!!! have fun!

[Edited on 06.23.2009 1:56 AM PDT]

  • 06.23.2009 1:54 AM PDT

You sir, truly understand. Cookies will be delivered to your door every week for the rest of your life.

  • 06.23.2009 6:28 AM PDT
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guys why do you think halo 3 is so popular? the campaign was nothing special
matchmaking is kinda standard too, halo 3 was so successful entirely because of custom games and forge

firefight, like -blam!- zombies and horde have been done before and will get boring after a while, forge makes the same map bearable cuse you can chang it without spending 800ms points on a new map

make a castle(Not impossible to attack but strong),make some weapons,make an area where the covanent drop,make a statue of yourself cuze u is a\/\/$0/\/\e, and defend to da last man!!!
it wouldnt have 2 be ranked and to keep it fair everything could be destructible

if you think this is pointless cuz bungie said no get a life they could reconsider
why does this guy get so much attention i created this topic weeks ago!!
wok on!


[Edited on 06.23.2009 8:00 AM PDT]

  • 06.23.2009 7:50 AM PDT

Posted by: redm0nkey
Bungie has already stated that there will be no forge in Firefight

Also we dont even know if this game mode will be in REACH. I mean hell we no very little about it and its a new engine too, maybe its like Battlefield and then it wouldnt make no since to put it in? You cant just say, oh hey lets give ideas for firefight in Reach, when we know absolutly nothing about game play and if it would work or not with the gameplay of Reach

  • 06.23.2009 7:51 AM PDT

"When life gives you lemons, don't make lemonade. Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don't want your damn lemons! What am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life's manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give EL1TE SUPR3MACY lemons! Do you know who I am? I'm the man who's gonna burn your house down! With the lemons! I'm gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!"

Posted by: TW InKoGnIto
The AI have set paths and you could block them[/quote]
From the pictures I have seen, enemies are dropped off by phantoms. This means that we cannot stop them from entering the level. And unnlike zombie mode, these enemies have weapons and can shoot you from a distance.

About the AI paths, they do not need to have set paths, all they need is a code that gives them this command:

Find the player, and kill them while avoiding obstacles

While I am no programmer, I do know that this type of coding is possible and has been done in other games for campaign, etc.


It's not as easy as typing in a command to seek out and destroy the player. From what I've seen in the Halo 3 ViDocs and my own expeiriences, Halo 3's AI involves both scripted and non-scripted events. There are multiple trigger points placed throughout a map that cause the AI to react in a certain way. It's not a "100% of the time" sort of trigger, but it makes it more likely for certain events to occur. For example, on the level Tsavo Highway, when you first leave the cave, if you take the left path instead of charging up the hill you will pass through a trigger barrier that can cause the Grunts to go into their "panic mode" and run away in fear.

Why I'm trying to point out is that even though AI can completely function on their own, they also rely on important places of interest Forging in these areas may block off the areas or cause the AI to behave inappropriately to certain events.

Believe me, I would love to see this idea to happen. Think about it for a bit though, if it were possible don't you think Bungie would have done it already?

  • 06.23.2009 8:00 AM PDT

Would you dance for it?

Very cool possibilities.


It would be awsome to make a machine that would destroy any enemies when they spawned.

Like make them walk through a tumbler or past a series of falling fusion coils.

  • 06.23.2009 9:05 AM PDT

I think if The only forge objects were NON-permanant objects (as in they can move when hit) Then it wouldn't be a problem. Casue the wraiths can blow up any human made bases. And they can push stuff out of the way. Also if catch skull is the first skull that's turned on the grunts/brutes and things will just throw grenades.

I think it's a good idea. at least as far as objects only.

  • 06.23.2009 9:15 AM PDT

It is possible to make a map creator and Bungie didn't do it. It is possible to let us fly a pelican, but Bungie didn't do it.

  • 06.23.2009 9:22 AM PDT

Posted by: ClassicalDonkey
If it was not for forge I would not be playing Halo 3 still, I did the missions and now what do I do!!! I want to play with my friends some thing different and I am always on here looking for new maps and game types, thats what has made it fun for me!!

If bungie did do this it would be the same, people could make different maps that people could try and enjoy. Like it has been said playing the same map over and over again get boring really fast! If you want a game that you can play over and over again, you need forge and thats what has made Halo 3 so playable and has made it the 1# played game around ever!

I would love to try a map with everything taken out and no where to go and see how long we could last, now that would be fun! Then I would guess you would be able to increase the number of people that come at you. So that has just added more fun, increase the force and test your skills.
WE KNOW THAT THIS IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN BUTY WHY DO YOU HAVE TO BE SO -blam!- ABOUT IT, WE ARE JUST SAYING WHAT COULD BE.

If you think this is a dumb idea then dont talk about it go back to your boring same maps and play them over and over and over again!!! have fun!


you are absolutely right!!! forge was the reason I traded in Call of duty 4 and 3 other games over halo 3 for red faction guerrilla, Halo 3's forge is what puts it apart from the "trade-in" pile

  • 06.23.2009 9:40 AM PDT

Posted by: EL1TE SUPR3MACY
Posted by: TW InKoGnIto
The AI have set paths and you could block them[/quote]
From the pictures I have seen, enemies are dropped off by phantoms. This means that we cannot stop them from entering the level. And unnlike zombie mode, these enemies have weapons and can shoot you from a distance.

About the AI paths, they do not need to have set paths, all they need is a code that gives them this command:

Find the player, and kill them while avoiding obstacles

While I am no programmer, I do know that this type of coding is possible and has been done in other games for campaign, etc.


It's not as easy as typing in a command to seek out and destroy the player. From what I've seen in the Halo 3 ViDocs and my own expeiriences, Halo 3's AI involves both scripted and non-scripted events. There are multiple trigger points placed throughout a map that cause the AI to react in a certain way. It's not a "100% of the time" sort of trigger, but it makes it more likely for certain events to occur. For example, on the level Tsavo Highway, when you first leave the cave, if you take the left path instead of charging up the hill you will pass through a trigger barrier that can cause the Grunts to go into their "panic mode" and run away in fear.

Why I'm trying to point out is that even though AI can completely function on their own, they also rely on important places of interest Forging in these areas may block off the areas or cause the AI to behave inappropriately to certain events.

Believe me, I would love to see this idea to happen. Think about it for a bit though, if it were possible don't you think Bungie would have done it already?


Ya I believe they tried to already but they ran out of time to make a fire fight mode for the origional halo 3, just like the 3 maps that were cut from the game.

You don't really need area scripting for this game mode. If grunts spawn and a brute spawns the brute is the leader. If the brute dies then the grunts panic, just like if a hunter dies the other hunter goes berserk. Or even more simply if there is a line of grunts with plasma pistols they aren't going to shoot each other in the back because they realize that there is another grunt infront of them. Campaign scripting was set because if all the enemies on the level spawned once the game started 2 things would happen. 1 it would cause major lag even for people who aren't playing co-op online. 2 all the AI would be aware of each other and if one grunt ran away to another area full of brutes and grunts then it would cause a chain reaction of enemies going to your position and it would just make the game not fun, and if you happened to kill all the brutes and grunts and jackals and what not then you wouldn't have any enemies to kill in other areas.

From what I understand Phantoms and Scarabs are the only major scripted enemies in the game, being that the phantom picks up and drops off enemies and the turrets connected to the phantoms are pretty much the only actual AI's. but the Scarab is a bit more advanced because it can follow, turn and shoot at you in a small area, what I mean by small area is that it can't follow you all around the map if it wanted to.

  • 06.23.2009 9:55 AM PDT
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Posted by: Safran888
Posted by: bigturns00
Forge adds no value to Firefight.

how so? just because you don't have the mental capacity to think of a way this feature can help, doesn't mean its impossible. I also don't see how a feature that you don't have to use can possibly hurt gameplay.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO PLAY THE STUPID MAPS, GET IT INTO YOUR THICK SKULLS!!!

So because I disagree with your desire to see Forge come to ODST, then, by your conclusion, I have a diminished mental capacity? What does yelling, on a opinion forum, say about ones 'mental capacity'?

Would you rather we all shared the same opinion my Borg brother?

My opinion is that Forge for Firefight is a waste of Bungie development resources / time. I'd much rather have Bungie focused on Reach and/or whatever else great games they have in store for the world. In addition to this, there are three new Mythic maps coming out upon the release of ODST. Three new maps to Forge upon. Maps which, though they do not offer the ability to fight AI, represent new canvases for the community to build upon.

In order for Forge to exist within ODST, the following would, in my opinion, need to be true as well.

1) Disable score / medals / achievements
2) Give players the ability to change enemy spawn locations.
3) Give players the ability to determine enemy spawn type / progression
4) Engine should certify enemy drop locations to ensure player Forged maps do not impede AI
5) Duplicate Forge distribution to be included on Disk 1.

All of which, going back to my original point, would require more Bungie development time. Time, which I believe, is better spent on new efforts than caving into the demands of a few uses.

[Edited on 06.23.2009 10:22 AM PDT]

  • 06.23.2009 10:20 AM PDT
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Your friendly and eccentric Sangheili forum-poster. :)

It's a good idea, it's just that people think the only thing that matters in this game is being pro, not having fun. It doesn't matter if someone makes it easy for themselves, let them, like the OP said they're not going to get any respect for it. Personally I'd mess around with the scenery and see what I could do, especially with Wraiths bombarding my position.

  • 06.23.2009 10:45 AM PDT

[Insert Catchy Phrase here]

What they need to do if Bungie makes fire fight maps forgeable is destroyable items. That way players can't but still can edit the map for fun.

  • 06.23.2009 10:54 AM PDT

Bigturns, you are thinking too much in the short term. You want to have a good game. Just like all of us.

But running around shooting people gets old. No matter how balanced, how great the maps and guns are, you will get bored.

But what if you could alter the maps. What if you could change the gameplay of a map. Just as Forgehub and Bungie say/said:

"Moving even one weapon or box can completely change the way the map is played".

That is true. If you could change the way a map is played, you could have a completely new experience with your friends in a custom game. Just for kicks!

That is the point of this: to stop people from getting bored, and increasing the playability of the game.

Posted by: bigturns00
All of which, going back to my original point, would require more Bungie development time. Time, which I believe, is better spent on new efforts than caving into the demands of a few uses.

  • 06.23.2009 1:09 PM PDT
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Now if Bungie were to give us full control over where / what / when the AI spawns as well as the ability to build Firefight maps via Forge... Then we'd have something. Just being able to drop / place new objects... I don't know, just feels like a half baked feature to me.

Forget all my nay saying. If this is something y'all want then keep pushing the issue. Who knows, perhaps Bungie will see it your way and provide Forge for Firefight via DLC?

  • 06.23.2009 3:58 PM PDT

Campiagn Kill Count :31,745. And growing.

The Revisionaries- One of the greatest screenshot groups on B.net. With 250 members and growing.

That's like saying the campaign doesn't really matter, so there could have been forge in there too. Bungie wants us to play their stuff the right way or not at all.

Bungie doesn't want us to abuse things like that, and Firefight it supposed to be too much of a competative gametype for any form of Forge or whatever. Plus all the leaderboards that exist would become void, something that I'm sure Bungie would like to avoid.

  • 06.23.2009 4:04 PM PDT
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They can just make it to where when enemies walk into obstacles, they would just push them away, like when a spartan runs into a fusion coil and bounces it.

  • 06.23.2009 4:05 PM PDT

Posted by: bigturns00
Now if Bungie were to give us full control over where / what / when the AI spawns as well as the ability to build Firefight maps via Forge... Then we'd have something. Just being able to drop / place new objects... I don't know, just feels like a half baked feature to me.

Forget all my nay saying. If this is something y'all want then keep pushing the issue. Who knows, perhaps Bungie will see it your way and provide Forge for Firefight via DLC?


No one is pushing any issue, we are trying to talk about what if we could have this!!! We dont care for people saying that bugie have already said that this will not be in the game. Good for you well done on reading. Now read what we are saying!!! This always about how forget is possable not that it is in the game or we want bungie to bow to us and make it in the game!

In the first couple of pages, you can read about people talking about how bungie could do it and how thing would work.

  • 06.24.2009 1:48 AM PDT

Does anyone even read these?

As great as this would be, I have serious doubts on it. Firefight stats are beign recorded aren';t they? If they are then most likely Bungie wouldn't not give us the option to boost up our stats with easy gameplay.

  • 06.24.2009 1:54 AM PDT

I want to make it clear that I am not having a dig at you Badball3r47, I am just using your post as an example. Don't want to anger anyone!

Posted by: BadBall3r47
As great as this would be, I have serious doubts on it. Firefight stats are beign recorded aren';t they? If they are then most likely Bungie wouldn't not give us the option to boost up our stats with easy gameplay.


I am sorry mate, but i dont think you understand very well!!1
1. Do you make your stats better when playing on a custom map? No
2. Do you get new stats if you play Matchmaking? (Same maps) Yes

Wow the same maps but two different ways of using them and having fun, wow who thought that great idea!???

If they can do it for the normal maps they can do it for the firefight maps. Please everyone use your brain before you post!!! People have said this way too much.

When posting do one thing READ WHAT HAS COME BEFORE YOU, AS IT HAS BEEN SAID ALREADY AND WE ARE GETTING ABIT BORED OF THE SAME THINGS OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN!!!!

SING A NEW SONG

[Edited on 06.24.2009 2:14 AM PDT]

  • 06.24.2009 2:07 AM PDT

Wish list

1. Being able to take everything from the map, so a shell that I can fight in with no where to hide!
2. Be able to move all the objects around to make a new form of the map and make it a little different to how it was played.
3. Change where the covent come from and how quick they come and what types.
4. Change the type of weapon that you can put on the maps.
5. Aswell as the skulls, be able to change other setting about the ODSTs like in a HALO 3 game type
6. Two score boards one for noraml Firefight, and 2nd with custom maps with link to map so other people can try it out. (the score is taken off if the map is deleted by the owner) Makes it so the owner cant make sure that he/she is the high score!

Please add to this!

[Edited on 06.24.2009 2:24 AM PDT]

  • 06.24.2009 2:22 AM PDT

Does anyone even read these?

Posted by: ClassicalDonkey
I want to make it clear that I am not having a dig at you Badball3r47, I am just using your post as an example. Don't want to anger anyone!

Posted by: BadBall3r47
As great as this would be, I have serious doubts on it. Firefight stats are beign recorded aren';t they? If they are then most likely Bungie wouldn't not give us the option to boost up our stats with easy gameplay.


I am sorry mate, but i dont think you understand very well!!1
1. Do you make your stats better when playing on a custom map? No
2. Do you get new stats if you play Matchmaking? (Same maps) Yes

Wow the same maps but two different ways of using them and having fun, wow who thought that great idea!???

If they can do it for the normal maps they can do it for the firefight maps. Please everyone use your brain before you post!!! People have said this way too much.

When posting do one thing READ WHAT HAS COME BEFORE YOU, AS IT HAS BEEN SAID ALREADY AND WE ARE GETTING ABIT BORED OF THE SAME THINGS OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN!!!!

SING A NEW SONG
Could you please link me to where it says our stats will not be recorded for Firefight mode?

  • 06.24.2009 2:40 AM PDT

I did not say it was the case, I said that they could do it that way!!! I was just saying that they could do it just like matchmaking normal. You get stats when you matchmake but not when you are just playing the maps with friends!

  • 06.24.2009 3:00 AM PDT