Halo: Reach Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: Leave Halo Alone
  • Subject: Leave Halo Alone
Subject: Leave Halo Alone
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Posted by: UNSC Spartan360
Posted by: Honourable Elite
I voted "not really", it was the exact same thing I was thinking when I read the title. The reason why is because, well. It's more than one reason to be honest.

People will start calling it a "Call of Duty rip off". And in this case, I would tend to agree. While I would welcome any drastic changes to gameplay Bungie have to offer with open arms, a Class System won't be one of them I'm afraid.

Another reason is because we have Forge now, and if we had a class system, it would completely eliminate a key point of having Forge and Custom Games, and even having weapons on the maps altogether.

Call of Duty 4, while having a great campaign and multiplayer experience (despite the campaign being really short), has an annoying issue with multiplayer. And that is everyone and their mothers have sniper rifles. I know what you're all thinking... I've been owned way too much by the sniper rifle. No, it's not because of that. It's because whenever I pick up a sniper rifle in that game, it no longer feels satisfying to get a kill with the thing, because everyone is killing their enemies in the exact same way. In short, the BR and Sniper Rifle are Halo's "pro" weapons, right? The same thing will happen. Everyone will pick the BR and Sniper Rifle as a starting weapon, and no one will get to use the other weapons, making them completely pointless in even being in the game's multiplayer.

I'm all for modifying weapons and such, but only for the campaign experience. Truth be told, I care mostly about the campaign. But the multiplayer is something I have to take into account since it's something me and my friends will be playing together once it is released.


But it really isn't classes just look. It would only be these three character models.




The class system I listed isn't even really classes just character models with some uniqe traits. They have different starting weapons that's all. You still run around pick up weapons and do whatever it's basically the same gameplay. Except you won't want to get too close to a Brute, and Spartans are quick. I don't care if you take sprinting away. This could really make for some fun and interesting gameplay. Matchmaking may end up a little more like custom games because you can change your stats based on how much armor you put on. Stats still wouldn't change that much though.




Idea for classes. Actually more like character models with traits.


Classification: Spartan
Starting Weapons: Assault Rife & Battle Rifle
Max Carrying Capacity: 2 weapons, 2 grenades, 1 equipment
Min-Max Armor Weight: 475-500 lbs
Min-Max Speed: 120-145%
Sprint Speed: 150-165%
Sprint TIme: 15 seconds
Sprint Recovery Time: 7 seconds
Shield Strength: 100%
Shield Recovery Time: 7 seconds
Meele Strength: 125%
Min-Max Jump Height: 4-10 feet
Health: 115-125%


Classification: Elite
Starting Weapons: Plasma Rifle & Carbine
Max Carrying Capacity: 2 weapons, 2 grenades, 1 equipment
Min-Max Armor Weight: 500-525 lbs
Min-Max Speed: 115-135%
Sprint Speed: 140-150%
Sprint Time: 10 seconds
Sprint Recovery TIme: 10 seconds
Shield Strength: 110%
Shield Recovery Time: 5 seconds
Meele Strength: 135%
Min-Max Jump Height: 3-7 feet
Health: 115-125%

Classification: Brute
Starting Weapons: Spiker & ?
Max Carrying Capacity: 2 weapons, 2 grenades, 1 equipment
Min-Max Armor Weight: 525-550 lbs
Min-Max Speed: 110-120%
Sprint Speed:125-135%
Sprint Time: 15 seconds
Sprint Recovery Time: 5 seconds
Shield Strength: 115%
Shield Recovery Time: 9 seconds
Meele Strength: 150%
Min-Max Jump Height: 1-3 feet
Health: 125-145%

Traits like speed, jump height, and health change depending on how much armor you put on your model. And each trait changes between the given ranges. For example:
Min-Max Speed: 115-135%
In custom games you can change the statistics even further for each model.


Add a knife and a cover system to that and you have defined the reason people like the OP are so pissed.

  • 07.04.2009 7:17 PM PDT

Check out my youtube channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/ultratog1028

Posted by: BJISADIRTYJAP
It is becoming increasingly obvious that the vast majority of the people on this forum starting playing Halo September 25, 2007, AKA the day Halo 3 was released. You have little experience with the Halo franchise and think it would be cool if Halo turned into a reskinned version of a title already on the market. Which is odd because you could simply proceed to play said game series instead.

Why would you want Halo to be class based or involve custom classes with customizable weapons that you can select at the start of the match? Have you once in your life ever played a simple match of Halo? Did you notice that mean guy who repeatedly killed you with the rockets, laser, sniper or shotgun? He had those powerful weapons because he rushed to them and took control of them. That is the point of Halo, to control a map specific set of power weapons in order to control the map. When you introduce selectable starting weapons you remove that aspect of the game, hence you are no longer playing a Halo game. No matter what the weapons and player models look like this is not a Halo game, your eyes would in fact be playing a cruel trick on you if you saw Halo related objects in a game featuring selectable starting weapons and/or classes.

Why would you want a cover system in Halo? For one the game is set to play too fast for that, you would be immediately be out maneuvered and killed and two a first person cover system would not work online. Even a game called Killzone 2 for the PS3 features a first person cover system but they disabled it for online for good reason.

What is the point of a combat knife or metallic sword? Hello this is the future. Our cyborg super soldier Spartans and their enemy fearsome enemies the Elites both feature metallic armor protected by an energy shield. This is not Lord of the Rings, Human swords became useless centuries ago.

So you want to sprint huh? Guess what a Spartan is always sprinting in game. If the movement wasn't slowed down so much for Halo 3 then even someone like you would be able to understand that.

So their you have it. All of your misguided attempts to ask for a completely generic experience are ridiculous. Had you played the previous Halo games you would have realized Halo is a great unique experience that does not need to be changed.


epic QFT.

  • 07.04.2009 7:22 PM PDT
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Having played Halo since November 2001, I feel that it is time for change, yet not in the change people are begging for. A class based Halo game would ruin the experience because of all the reasons in the initial thread post. However a positive change might be a squad based game, possible space missions, open world environments, or even different ammunition types. Just many minor things while retaining the basics of Halo.

  • 07.04.2009 7:24 PM PDT

Check out my youtube channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/ultratog1028

Posted by: Bullet _ Sponge
Posted by: UNSC Spartan360
Posted by: Honourable Elite
I voted "not really", it was the exact same thing I was thinking when I read the title. The reason why is because, well. It's more than one reason to be honest.

People will start calling it a "Call of Duty rip off". And in this case, I would tend to agree. While I would welcome any drastic changes to gameplay Bungie have to offer with open arms, a Class System won't be one of them I'm afraid.

Another reason is because we have Forge now, and if we had a class system, it would completely eliminate a key point of having Forge and Custom Games, and even having weapons on the maps altogether.

Call of Duty 4, while having a great campaign and multiplayer experience (despite the campaign being really short), has an annoying issue with multiplayer. And that is everyone and their mothers have sniper rifles. I know what you're all thinking... I've been owned way too much by the sniper rifle. No, it's not because of that. It's because whenever I pick up a sniper rifle in that game, it no longer feels satisfying to get a kill with the thing, because everyone is killing their enemies in the exact same way. In short, the BR and Sniper Rifle are Halo's "pro" weapons, right? The same thing will happen. Everyone will pick the BR and Sniper Rifle as a starting weapon, and no one will get to use the other weapons, making them completely pointless in even being in the game's multiplayer.

I'm all for modifying weapons and such, but only for the campaign experience. Truth be told, I care mostly about the campaign. But the multiplayer is something I have to take into account since it's something me and my friends will be playing together once it is released.


But it really isn't classes just look. It would only be these three character models.




The class system I listed isn't even really classes just character models with some uniqe traits. They have different starting weapons that's all. You still run around pick up weapons and do whatever it's basically the same gameplay. Except you won't want to get too close to a Brute, and Spartans are quick. I don't care if you take sprinting away. This could really make for some fun and interesting gameplay. Matchmaking may end up a little more like custom games because you can change your stats based on how much armor you put on. Stats still wouldn't change that much though.




Idea for classes. Actually more like character models with traits.


Classification: Spartan
Starting Weapons: Assault Rife & Battle Rifle
Max Carrying Capacity: 2 weapons, 2 grenades, 1 equipment
Min-Max Armor Weight: 475-500 lbs
Min-Max Speed: 120-145%
Sprint Speed: 150-165%
Sprint TIme: 15 seconds
Sprint Recovery Time: 7 seconds
Shield Strength: 100%
Shield Recovery Time: 7 seconds
Meele Strength: 125%
Min-Max Jump Height: 4-10 feet
Health: 115-125%


Classification: Elite
Starting Weapons: Plasma Rifle & Carbine
Max Carrying Capacity: 2 weapons, 2 grenades, 1 equipment
Min-Max Armor Weight: 500-525 lbs
Min-Max Speed: 115-135%
Sprint Speed: 140-150%
Sprint Time: 10 seconds
Sprint Recovery TIme: 10 seconds
Shield Strength: 110%
Shield Recovery Time: 5 seconds
Meele Strength: 135%
Min-Max Jump Height: 3-7 feet
Health: 115-125%

Classification: Brute
Starting Weapons: Spiker & ?
Max Carrying Capacity: 2 weapons, 2 grenades, 1 equipment
Min-Max Armor Weight: 525-550 lbs
Min-Max Speed: 110-120%
Sprint Speed:125-135%
Sprint Time: 15 seconds
Sprint Recovery Time: 5 seconds
Shield Strength: 115%
Shield Recovery Time: 9 seconds
Meele Strength: 150%
Min-Max Jump Height: 1-3 feet
Health: 125-145%

Traits like speed, jump height, and health change depending on how much armor you put on your model. And each trait changes between the given ranges. For example:
Min-Max Speed: 115-135%
In custom games you can change the statistics even further for each model.


Add a knife and a cover system to that and you have defined the reason people like the OP are so pissed.

you want an rpg? play d&d. or better yet MAKE one. but if halo EVER went RPG i would BURN everything i owned that was halo related.

every time i hear halo rpg i have an image of master chief and the rest of blue team fighting elites, final fantasy style in game boy advance graphics. just no.
NO.

  • 07.04.2009 7:26 PM PDT

Check out my youtube channel. http://www.youtube.com/user/ultratog1028

squad based (republic commando, brute force)-good
class based-FAIL

  • 07.04.2009 7:27 PM PDT

ಠ_ಠ

There are 2 times when a man doesn't understand a woman - before marriage and after marriage.

Close minded much? I admit I'm not a big fan of ideas like a class based system and CoD-esque perks and customization either but that doesn't mean that you should just completely shut out such ideas too. The way you talk makes it sound like all you want is a Halo 3 clone with potentially updated graphics and a different story, and if that is what you really want then just leave and keep playing your Halo 3 instead of complaining. Personally though I'd like fresh ideas and innovation

  • 07.04.2009 7:28 PM PDT
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Your friendly and eccentric Sangheili forum-poster. :)

Posted by: xSpartan 062
Having played Halo since November 2001, I feel that it is time for change, yet not in the change people are begging for. A class based Halo game would ruin the experience because of all the reasons in the initial thread post. However a positive change might be a squad based game, possible space missions, open world environments, or even different ammunition types. Just many minor things while retaining the basics of Halo.

That's exactly the kind of change I want, no copy and paste job, but a completely new and revolutionary change.

And a little off topic here guys, but how did something I post in another topic end up in this one?

  • 07.04.2009 7:31 PM PDT
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I think if there is ever a Halo class bases game it will be done by another development company like what we've seen with Halo Wars. Bungie probably got asked "Hey what about you guys make a Halo RTS?" then they simply replied "No we stick with FPS, hey Ensemble, you want to make the RTS?"

  • 07.04.2009 7:31 PM PDT
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I thick you are all missing the point you forgot its Bungie we are talking about know matter what thay add or keep it will still be the best game ever! hell I bet Bungie could make a good Halo game out of that crazy Wii Box stuff what do thay call it natal

  • 07.04.2009 7:32 PM PDT

I disagree. Unless you want to play Halo 3.5, the series needs to progress, and to progress, there must be change. It's what warrants a sequel.

Because if not, you get games like GOW2 and MW2, which are almost identical to their predecessors which get boring fast because you basically already played the game.

  • 07.04.2009 7:35 PM PDT
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So you calling Halo Wars a sequel?

  • 07.04.2009 7:40 PM PDT

Posted by: Buzz Killingtin
So you calling Halo Wars a sequel?

To the series yes, to the universe, it's a prequel.

  • 07.04.2009 7:41 PM PDT
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Posted by: ABotelho
I disagree. Unless you want to play Halo 3.5, the series needs to progress, and to progress, there must be change. It's what warrants a sequel.

Because if not, you get games like GOW2 and MW2, which are almost identical to their predecessors which get boring fast because you basically already played the game.


Not being a crappy knock off of CoD, Battlefield, or Gears does not mean it will be Halo 3.5, it just means it will be a quality Halo game. Pull your heads out of your asses there are other ways to change a game. First and foremost the existing features need to be done right, like equipment and dual wielding. Then we can worry about new and inventive things that can further expand the Halo gameplay while still remaining true to what makes Halo a great game.

  • 07.04.2009 7:44 PM PDT
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I dont know about you but I thick Halo Wars is more like Age of Empires than any Halo game I have played

  • 07.04.2009 7:45 PM PDT
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I 100% agree with you Bulled Sponge (:

  • 07.04.2009 7:47 PM PDT

How to spell "space"?

S-P-ACE! SPACE!

Simply, good point.
Cover system? Bad. Classes? Not for Halo! Camping? -blam!-!

  • 07.04.2009 7:53 PM PDT
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You know people criticize Bungie an awful lot about what they could have done and why they didn't add this and that. There are two main reasons, Time and Money. The video game world is always on a very tight schedule. Every month that the video game doesn't come out is one more month without major revenue to pay all of its many employees.

Look at what Bungie did, each game remained innovative.

Halo: Combat Evolved- FPS with vehicle use, wide variety of both human and alien weaponry, vast playing fields, great graphics (at the time), smarter team AI, compelling story, amazing cinematics.

Halo 2-Better vehicles, Better graphics, Better weaponry, bigger scale, smarter AI, more compelling story, even better cinematics, they added dual wielding, better armor, Xbox Live, downloadable content, boarding vehicles, and they made it so you can now play as different player models and even different characters in the campaign.

Halo 3-Better everything, the use of equipment, great cinematics, better and more compelling story line, active cheats (skulls), different online armor types, achievements, unlockables, ect.

The point is Bungie has always been innovative while keeping Halo's ideals the same. I am not worried, I am sure Bungie is going to blow our socks off with a fantastic game that is totally different yet still feels like Halo.

...I am also sure that about a month after its release I'll get on here and see more threads about what bungie should have done

  • 07.04.2009 7:54 PM PDT
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GRUNT BUD!!!!!

There is only ONE thing I would want changed in Halo and that is larger scale battles and I know people are going to reply big battles=lag well suck it up and fix ur connection because I almost never have lag on big team and when I do it's because multiple people leave at the same team. Its not the game that can't handle large scale battles. Its your connection

  • 07.04.2009 8:08 PM PDT

Let there be light, created from fire

I am all i am, i am a team player(when im not pissed), i make great strategies, i will punch you in the face after armor locking, you have to be at sniper distance to not get headshot by my DMR or pistol, wraiths beware, i am DxXOrangesXxD and i am ready to rumble! (When Halo 4 comes out cause Reach is nothing but crap players now)

I do not want to see Halo become just another shooter i just want more innovated and technologic ideas to be put into to make it a more unquie simple shooter, i thank all the people that have donated to my list so far, now if only we can get it on the pinned topics list, instead of that lame Halo Reach multiplayer wants and ideas topic thats 1200+ post of tons of the same ideas beign repeated over and over and not in a organized list

  • 07.04.2009 8:14 PM PDT

Let there be light, created from fire

I am all i am, i am a team player(when im not pissed), i make great strategies, i will punch you in the face after armor locking, you have to be at sniper distance to not get headshot by my DMR or pistol, wraiths beware, i am DxXOrangesXxD and i am ready to rumble! (When Halo 4 comes out cause Reach is nothing but crap players now)

Posted by: GRUNT BUD
There is only ONE thing I would want changed in Halo and that is larger scale battles and I know people are going to reply big battles=lag well suck it up and fix ur connection because I almost never have lag on big team and when I do it's because multiple people leave at the same team. Its not the game that can't handle large scale battles. Its your connection
its not so much as lag, its server power and engine power

  • 07.04.2009 8:16 PM PDT

well said.

[Edited on 07.04.2009 8:37 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2009 8:37 PM PDT

Why would you want a cover system in Halo?

There is one. It's called the "OH CRAP! My shields!"

What is the point of a combat knife or metallic sword?

One of the Spartans in The Fall of Reach was particularly skillful with his knife, if I recall.

Why would you want Halo to be class based or involve custom classes with customizable weapons that you can select at the start of the match?

Because not every Spartan carries the same traits. Master Chief showed brilliant leadership skills thus his nickname and rank. Others were good at different things. It's only natural to expect the same potential.

So you want to sprint huh? Guess what a Spartan is always sprinting in game. If the movement wasn't slowed down so much for Halo 3 then even someone like you would be able to understand that.

No. We jog.

I've been playing Halo since the original. So I assure you just because I recently got an Xbox 360 doesn't mean in the slightest that I don't understand Halo. I've beaten Halo CE on literally every difficulty. I've read the contents of every terminal on every difficulty. There is no lack of experience. I just want a Halo game that makes me feel more like a spartan, and less like a generic soldier with a personal shield.

I don't like knowing that my shield bar extends farther than what my health bar would. I don't like the fact that every game we all start with the same weapons. We are all the same. There is no personality or uniqueness unless you are fortunate enough to be spawned closest to your weapon of choice.

[Edited on 07.04.2009 9:26 PM PDT]

  • 07.04.2009 9:21 PM PDT

Posted by: Honourable Elite
Why would you have the same thing over and over again? Why would you want the exact same game just with a different location? Seems more like an expansion pack than a full game if nothing is changed. If you want the same so much, you can always stick to gee I dunno, the previous 3 games? Time for something revolutionary, immersive and unique. I don't know about you guys, but I am NOT paying £50 or $60 for a game that's going to be the exact same as it's previous, I blantantly refuse to pay for a game that has the exact same experience. I play new games for new experiences, new content, not old stuff.

We want a different game, not Halo 3.5. Or, considering that Halo 3 was 2.5, 3.

And before you ask, yes, I have played through all 3 games. Yes, I have completed them on Legendary. Yes, I have played the multiplayer of all 3 games. Yes, I know everything there is to know about the games, I know the secrets, the stories, the weapons, the vehicles. As said before, if you want the same game... Keep playing Halo 3, and stop trying to get Bungie to make a .5 out of everything.
Well good for you because the hundreds of thousands of people who will pay for any halo don't care.

  • 07.04.2009 9:37 PM PDT

I hunt for the Prophet of Contentment, the San 'Shyumm that murdered my son, and stole his birthright, his Energy Sword. They call our species Heretics. They claim to all that our tongues sting, our words a vile poison that feeds on the unworthy. I have seen the true face of Heresy. The head of a gallant warrior lay on the ground. His neck scorched and blistered, scarred by his own blade. I shall retrieve the weapon, and drive it through that bastard's heart! Punishment for his sins is nigh.

Posted by: Spartan 90210
Um all of what you stated was an opinion. Exactly like the people who post that they want this or that feature. I've been playing Halo since Halo 1 and i would personally like to see a class based Halo. Don't tell people what to think.

EDIT Title reminds me of a certain guy on youtube. ;)

Yes, a class based Halo would be cool, AS A SPINOFF. This is a direct game, it is (multiplayer wise) Halo 4. So we need things mostly the same, Class Based should be a spinoff like Halo Wars was.

  • 07.04.2009 9:40 PM PDT
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sig goes where?

Posted by: BJISADIRTYJAPYou have some interesting points, some of which I agree with, and some of which I disagree. I'm not goin to quote your entire post some I'm just going to reply to some points I paraphrased.

1. This is a Halo game, and core gameplay should not be changed
- While this is part of the Halo franchise, it is not part of the Halo trilogy, and as such, I think it gives Bungie more freedom to experiment with different ideas. However, this does not mean it will be entirely different, ALA TF2 or CoD.

2. Class based/Selected Spawning weapons destroys Map control
-Class based: Judging from the picture of the Spartans' silhouettes, a classed based Halo may infact be possible. Excluding FFA and Matchmade Teams, you may notice many high level players have a 'designated' role. One guy always gets the sniper, one guy is always the driver, another is always the gunner, would a class based system which lets people specialise in these role be such a bad idea? Noone is saying it would restrict you to that role.
-Selected Spawn Weapons: Doesn't mean you can spawn with a sniper and rockets, power weapons would remain power weapons, how ever the choice of AR vs BR as primary and Pistol vs SMG as secondary wouldn't do much except lessen all the QQ threads on the forums, and I fail to see how that is a bad thing.

3. Cover system wont work in a fast paced game such as Halo.
- This I agree with, a cover system wouldn't really work unless it was an ODST style game, as Halo has always been about Run And Gun, not Stop And Pop.

4. Human Melee Weapons are pointless (combat knife/katana etc)
- Agree with this, the shotgun essentially fills the role as a human CQC weapon

5. No need for sprint, you're sprinting already
- Agreed

6. Halo does not need to be changed.
-Disagree, I think something new and refreshing would be good for the franchise, as opposed to rehash after rehash, even each Halo game in the trilogy had a new feature or two (Dual Wield/Boarding, Equipment/Forge/Theater)

However well thought out post, you did make some good points.

  • 07.04.2009 9:58 PM PDT