Halo 3: ODST Forum
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  • Subject: How is ODST more of an expansion than COD: MW2?
Subject: How is ODST more of an expansion than COD: MW2?

Posted by: Smug Dark Loser


ODST's is a new setup, more like a spinoff. It too has what you could call a new multiplayer(the halo 3 disc) as it's what Call of Duty does--> same game, new maps.


Modern Warfare 2 is just a new game by name alone really. Just new maps and campaign.



I say Bungie should just take Halo 3's muliplayer, add 10 new maps, don't include the old maps, reskin the spartans to odsts, and then say it's a whole new multiplayer.

Pretty funny imo.


What I find funy is your ignorance. The fact that you said what you just said is completely twisted. You yourself are saying that any sequel, ANY is a simple expansion pack, Halo CE - Halo 2, GoW - GoW 2, Half Life - Half Life 2, need I continue? You simply gave the definition of a sequel, in a completely biased way.

Halo 3: ODST as already stated is a title which gives you a clear sense of it being an expansion to what game other than Halo 3? Its in the title! Secondly the fact that it uses the same engine, models, skins, and multiplayer is yet another reason to think of it as an expansion. If there were an ENTIRE new multiplayer system behind ODST, rank, levels, EXP. That added onto the skinned Halo 3 multiplayer would just begin to make it a sequel.

Get your head out of where it is and see the real facts, not the Bungie Bungie Bungie stuff.

  • 07.05.2009 4:01 PM PDT
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WoW is like Girls Gone Wild without the tits: idiots and douches taking turns doing anything to get noticed, and no one knows what a condom looks like.

Posted by: The_omen
MW2:
New campaign
New multiplayer
New Multiplayer modes
New perks
New guns
New Multiplayer Maps

ODST:
campaign
firefight

That's it. Everything else in ODST shouldn't be there in the first place and isn't technically part of ODST. It's part of Halo 3. It doesn't matter if MW2's stuff is essentialy the same. ODST has less content.

Of course one major difference between ODST and MW2 is that in MW2 you don't have to pay for something twice.

Can anyone here point me to the source that says that MW2 is using a new engine. ODST has new guns as well, btw, as well as new multiplayer maps. Even if the multiplayer is technically "new" it will follow the same format and gameplay as previous games. Perks have never been part of Halo, so you can't compare that. What new "multiplayer modes" are there. You can't call the new co-op new, because they just took it out of campaign and put it into a seperate mode(for story reasons, which I understand. It's just not new, though). You are also clearly biased, from the way you labeled it. It clearly tries to downplay the importance of campaign and firefight. For MW2 you labeled them all with "new", and you capitalized. I could also say that ODST has a new gameplay style. It looks relatively different from current Halo games. I don't know if ODST still merits being referred to as an expansion. Plenty of games with a single player alone have merited a $60 dollar price tag. So please don't use that lame excuse that "you are paying for something twice." MW2 is obviously the fuller game. More content. But you are wrong in saying that it doesn't matter that MW2 is essentially the same, but with new content. That is almost the very definition of expansion. You can't call something with an entirely different play style an expansion. Expansions supplement existing gameplay.

  • 07.05.2009 4:09 PM PDT

Posted by: tdawg5041
[quote]Posted by: Smug Dark Loser

Now if you answer this question, I'll say you win.

Why is Modern Warfare 2 anything more than an expansion?

The campaign to MW2 is just new levels to what could be COD4 and so is the multiplayer.

ODST's is a new setup, more like a spinoff. It too has what you could call a new multiplayer(the halo 3 disc) as it's what Call of Duty does--> same game, new maps.


Ok, now i'm waiting. I answered your question. Now, tell me I win.

[Edited on 07.05.2009 4:12 PM PDT]

  • 07.05.2009 4:12 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sebasness
It clearly tries to downplay the importance of campaign and firefight. For MW2 you labeled them all with "new", and you capitalized.
I'm glad you caught that. I'm trying out my persuasive argumental skills.

Needs more work :P

  • 07.05.2009 4:17 PM PDT
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______ ____(˜˜˜||˜˜˜˜||˜˜˜˜˜)_∏______
--------____.`=====.-.~:________\___|================[oo]
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why dont i ever get the snip3r rifl3?!
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(is it a spid3r } (.^. )o*

Posted by: Slegger
1. It's called Modern Warfare 2. Call of Duty has been taken out of the title.

2. Halo 3: ODST. Note the Halo 3 part.

3. Modern Warfare 2 is a sequel to the first game (CoD: Modern Warfare)

4. Halo 3: ODST is simply an expansion to the Halo 3 game.

5. My logic wins, your's fails.

6. You haven't played either game yet. How do you know the multiplayer maps in MW2 will be ripped off the Campaign? Idiot. Same with all the things you suddenly "assumed" will be/won't be in the game.

  • 07.05.2009 4:23 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sebasness
Can anyone here point me to the source that says that MW2 is using a new engine.


If you watch one of the videos on it, not sure which one, the developer says they put a new one to get rid of the "infinite amount of enemies" and you no longer have to step over an invisible line to stop them from coming.

  • 07.05.2009 4:23 PM PDT
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and there is no way it would take 2+ years to make a game using the same engine....

  • 07.05.2009 4:26 PM PDT
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WoW is like Girls Gone Wild without the tits: idiots and douches taking turns doing anything to get noticed, and no one knows what a condom looks like.

Posted by: Slegger
Posted by: Sebasness
Can anyone here point me to the source that says that MW2 is using a new engine.


If you watch one of the videos on it, not sure which one, the developer says they put a new one to get rid of the "infinite amount of enemies" and you no longer have to step over an invisible line to stop them from coming.


I have seen the video with that. They said they fixed it. Not that they implemented a new engine for it. It's not like a huge gameplay element. It would be a waste of time and resources to design a new engine to fix such an otherwise easily fixable element.

Edit-Plenty of games have used heavily upgraded versions of older engines. Take a look at Valves source engine. They still use that, and it looks fine. I could point to a million(exaggeration) other examples too.

[Edited on 07.05.2009 4:29 PM PDT]

  • 07.05.2009 4:28 PM PDT

Memento mori.

Posted by: Smug Dark Loser
I'm just curious on what you guys have to say in response to this.

Besides nominal qualities alone, why is ODST considered more of an expansion, and therefore not worth full price, when compared to Modern Warfare 2?

Let's just remind you guys.

Call of Duty, judging off the past, will have gameplay that is nearly identical. The campaign will pretty much be new levels and total about 5-7 hours. It'll include a multiplayer with perhaps a couple of new gametypes and basically be just new maps (ripped from campaign) besides that.

With ODST, you've got a new campaign as well. However, the gameplay is obviously much different as it's a (relatively) small open world acting as a hub and an with an original storyline that's not typical of halo. Then, it comes with Firefight, which is essentially a whole new game mode, and then pretty much what COD6 is dong with it's multiplayer--> taking it's old game and using new maps. Granted, there is only 3 new ones here, 13, if you haven't got the new maps, but pretty much the DLC is equal to the new mp in COD.


So umm.... yea. Explicate. What's the difference when it comes to the reality of it all? I don't think there's anything. In fact, I'd say COD6 is more of an expansion than Halo: ODST in reality. Remember again, as I said, I'm talking about actual product, not nominal qualities.

And anyway, inarguably, Isn't Halo 3: ODST actually a spin-off at least, not an expansion?As by tradition an expansion is just the same as what new levels are? Spin offs can be to a lower scale than the main series like an expansion, but they're not something you'd expect to come up in a latter level of the game.



Halo 3: ODST has a campaign that is slightly shorter than a full Halo game's campaign. MW2 has a full-fledged new campaign. Halo 3:ODST, granted, does bring in a new co-op game mode-but with no matchmaking, because it is BASED OFF HALO'S CO OP CAMPAIGN IDEA. MW2 has a brand new co-op game mode with a search for team option, and infinity ward has said that they are bringing in their own version of -blam!- Zombies, which COD4 DIDNT have. Halo 3: ODST has halo 3's multiplayer, but with a few new maps. MW2 has a brand new multiplayer using the new MW2 engine, and from what infinity ward has said, is better than the originals.

So, ODST is a spin off. MW2 is a brand new sequel.

[Edited on 07.05.2009 4:37 PM PDT]

  • 07.05.2009 4:28 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sebasness
Posted by: Slegger
Posted by: Sebasness
Can anyone here point me to the source that says that MW2 is using a new engine.


If you watch one of the videos on it, not sure which one, the developer says they put a new one to get rid of the "infinite amount of enemies" and you no longer have to step over an invisible line to stop them from coming.


I have seen the video with that. They said they fixed it. Not that they implemented a new engine for it. It's not like a huge gameplay element. It would be a waste of time and resources to design a new engine to fix such an otherwise easily fixable element.

Edit-Plenty of games have used heavily upgraded versions of older engines. Take a look at Valves source engine. They still use that, and it looks fine. I could point to a million(exaggeration) other examples too.


Still, it's basically a new engine because they will have to design the levels differently, and it's a huge change from the other games.

  • 07.05.2009 4:31 PM PDT

Posted by: Slegger
1. It's called Modern Warfare 2. Call of Duty has been taken out of the title.

2. Halo 3: ODST. Note the Halo 3 part.

3. Modern Warfare 2 is a sequel to the first game (CoD: Modern Warfare)

4. Halo 3: ODST is simply an expansion to the Halo 3 game.

5. My logic wins, your's fails.

6. You haven't played either game yet. How do you know the multiplayer maps in MW2 will be ripped off the Campaign? Idiot. Same with all the things you suddenly "assumed" will be/won't be in the game.


No real need for calling the thread maker an idiot, but those 6 points pretty much sum it up for me.

  • 07.05.2009 4:33 PM PDT

roflcopter.

Posted by: Slegger
1. It's called Modern Warfare 2. Call of Duty has been taken out of the title.

2. Halo 3: ODST. Note the Halo 3 part.

3. Modern Warfare 2 is a sequel to the first game (CoD: Modern Warfare)

4. Halo 3: ODST is simply an expansion to the Halo 3 game.

5. My logic wins, your's fails.

6. You haven't played either game yet. How do you know the multiplayer maps in MW2 will be ripped off the Campaign? Idiot. Same with all the things you suddenly "assumed" will be/won't be in the game.
they r always ripped from the campaign

  • 07.05.2009 4:39 PM PDT
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the OP has a point but he's using the wrong example

here you go:
is x-men origins wolverine a full $60 game?... yes

well let's see what we have, a campaign... it took me about 7 hours to beat it, oh some bonus where you fight other wolverines and unlock them to play in campaign..... ok,.... big news here.... that's it....... oh and credits, that's not important.

now lets look at ODST

campaign... it will be at least 6 hours long (halo 3 is 8 hours btw), not to mention he fact that it is open world gameplay. there is also 4 player co-op... wolverine doesn't have that.... hmmm, oh and did i mention there is a whole new frickin gametype that has infinite replay value....?

not to mention 3 new maps for halo 3, that will only be with odst

oh yeah there's this other stuff that's a cool bonus
1. reach beta
2. possible johnson (if pre-ordered)
3. controller (if buying LCE)
4. A WHOLE SECOND DISK THAT IS A BONUS WHICH GIVES YOU ALL OF THE MAPS FROM EVERY DOWNLOAD. ITS LIKE THEIR GIVING YOU HALO 3'S VERSION OF THIS!!!!

now do you see that ODST is basically a FULL GAME?

  • 07.05.2009 4:44 PM PDT
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WoW is like Girls Gone Wild without the tits: idiots and douches taking turns doing anything to get noticed, and no one knows what a condom looks like.

Posted by: Slegger
Posted by: Sebasness
Posted by: Slegger
Posted by: Sebasness
Can anyone here point me to the source that says that MW2 is using a new engine.


If you watch one of the videos on it, not sure which one, the developer says they put a new one to get rid of the "infinite amount of enemies" and you no longer have to step over an invisible line to stop them from coming.


I have seen the video with that. They said they fixed it. Not that they implemented a new engine for it. It's not like a huge gameplay element. It would be a waste of time and resources to design a new engine to fix such an otherwise easily fixable element.

Edit-Plenty of games have used heavily upgraded versions of older engines. Take a look at Valves source engine. They still use that, and it looks fine. I could point to a million(exaggeration) other examples too.


Still, it's basically a new engine because they will have to design the levels differently, and it's a huge change from the other games.

You don't understand. It would be impractical to release a new engine. Its a nice touch if true, but not needed. You don't need a new engine to remove the invisible tripwire. You just take it out, and instead, put a set amount of enemies. Much easier than making a brand new engine. It's probably, almost surely, a heavily modified CoD4:MW engine.

[Edited on 07.05.2009 4:45 PM PDT]

  • 07.05.2009 4:45 PM PDT

Every time you say something is old your dick shrinks.

"my logic wins yours fails" thats not logic

  • 07.05.2009 4:47 PM PDT

Here’s what Luke had to say about the differences in treatment between the Spartans and Elites in Reach:

“Instead of piece-by-piece customization like the Spartans, Elite customization is a full model swap with models selected from the various Elite classes appearing throughout the Campaign. There are all kinds of reasons for this, not the least of which is our continued emphasis on the Spartan as your identity in Reach.”

Posted by: Smug Dark Loser
As for the final one, I'm using history as a reference. Truth is none of us have played either game fully, so we can only go by the past and what we see. Since every single COD I have played pretty much straight up ripped their maps from the campaign, i have to assume MW2 will do the same. And regardlessly, that really doesn't matter in regards to the points I made.
Modern Warfare played completely differently than the earlier CODs. It was the first to have actual classes, in a modern setting, with vehicular support and bonuses for sprees. Add in the weapon upgrades and perks, you do have a completely new experience.

It broke the precedent of COD games being identical.

  • 07.05.2009 4:49 PM PDT
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WoW is like Girls Gone Wild without the tits: idiots and douches taking turns doing anything to get noticed, and no one knows what a condom looks like.

Posted by: Uncle Kulikov
Posted by: Smug Dark Loser
As for the final one, I'm using history as a reference. Truth is none of us have played either game fully, so we can only go by the past and what we see. Since every single COD I have played pretty much straight up ripped their maps from the campaign, i have to assume MW2 will do the same. And regardlessly, that really doesn't matter in regards to the points I made.
Modern Warfare played completely differently than the earlier CODs. It was the first to have actual classes, in a modern setting, with vehicular support and bonuses for sprees. Add in the weapon upgrades and perks, you do have a completely new experience.

It broke the precedent of COD games being identical.


Only to have the next 2 be the exact same formula. Most major games fall into that trap. Developers are afraid(or obliged) to follow that same winning formula.

  • 07.05.2009 4:51 PM PDT

Every time you say something is old your dick shrinks.

call of duty maps are allways riped. odst is a full game not an exspansion . call of duty is in the title. your logic sucks.

  • 07.05.2009 4:51 PM PDT
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Posted by: Sebasness
Posted by: Slegger
Posted by: Sebasness
Posted by: Slegger
Posted by: Sebasness
Can anyone here point me to the source that says that MW2 is using a new engine.


If you watch one of the videos on it, not sure which one, the developer says they put a new one to get rid of the "infinite amount of enemies" and you no longer have to step over an invisible line to stop them from coming.


I have seen the video with that. They said they fixed it. Not that they implemented a new engine for it. It's not like a huge gameplay element. It would be a waste of time and resources to design a new engine to fix such an otherwise easily fixable element.

Edit-Plenty of games have used heavily upgraded versions of older engines. Take a look at Valves source engine. They still use that, and it looks fine. I could point to a million(exaggeration) other examples too.


Still, it's basically a new engine because they will have to design the levels differently, and it's a huge change from the other games.

You don't understand. It would be impractical to release a new engine. Its a nice touch if true, but not needed. You don't need a new engine to remove the invisible tripwire. You just take it out, and instead, put a set amount of enemies. Much easier than making a brand new engine. It's probably, almost surely, a heavily modified CoD4:MW engine.


No, you do not understand. I said it's basically a new engine (meaning it's not, but it pretty much is) because they are forced to design the levels differently, instead of a big open area, they'll need closed in areas so you can't kill all the enemies real quick. Please, don't reply again until you understand what I'm saying, because I don't want to get pissed off, which I do when people are stupid and don't read my posts.

  • 07.05.2009 5:12 PM PDT

-I was here

i would just like to say that almost none of you know what you are talking about.
first off, even though halo 3 odst isn't exactly a sequel, it isn't just an expansion either. the campaign mode will have an open world concept as apposed to the previous halo games which had a set path. also, the health and damage system won't be the same either(since you arent the chief u dont have awsome armor and shields) and as for multiplayer, instead of being free for alls and team slayer games where you fight other players, you have firefight where you just have to survive waves of enemys. and there will be new weapons with new damage and range statistics and stuff. so, although the game is built on the same engine it is a brand new concept.

MW2 is a sequel but its built from the exact same concept as other cod games: you go through the missions on a set path, kill the enemys, certain number of shots and your dead, and the multiplayer maps are almost always based off of the levels in the game(ex: the boat level is taken from the first mission). i have heard that there will be that new multiplayer mode which means they did add something new. and as for the new weapons, its always the same, they have an equivilant of them in the previous games.

conclusion: mw2 is a sequel with the same concepts as the previous games, just a new story

halo 3 odst has the same engine as the previous halo games, but has a brand new concept

so, in a way, both are sequels(well, with odst its a prequel) AND expansions

  • 07.05.2009 5:51 PM PDT

Posted by: Duardo
I'd love to be a 10 year old and tell my mom I'm going on an adventure out into the world catching Pokemon, with her full support. Never mind the fact that there are rapists, criminals, and murders out there, or the fact that I may get killed by a Pokemon.

Luckily I have Pikachu.

1. Modern warfare 2 has a new multiplayer component.

2. Halo 3: ODST doesn't

  • 07.05.2009 6:26 PM PDT

Posted by: goatman327
i would just like to say that almost none of you know what you are talking about.
first off, even though halo 3 odst isn't exactly a sequel, it isn't just an expansion either. the campaign mode will have an open world concept as apposed to the previous halo games which had a set path. also, the health and damage system won't be the same either(since you arent the chief u dont have awsome armor and shields) and as for multiplayer, instead of being free for alls and team slayer games where you fight other players, you have firefight where you just have to survive waves of enemys. and there will be new weapons with new damage and range statistics and stuff. so, although the game is built on the same engine it is a brand new concept.

MW2 is a sequel but its built from the exact same concept as other cod games: you go through the missions on a set path, kill the enemys, certain number of shots and your dead, and the multiplayer maps are almost always based off of the levels in the game(ex: the boat level is taken from the first mission). i have heard that there will be that new multiplayer mode which means they did add something new. and as for the new weapons, its always the same, they have an equivilant of them in the previous games.

conclusion: mw2 is a sequel with the same concepts as the previous games, just a new story

halo 3 odst has the same engine as the previous halo games, but has a brand new concept

so, in a way, both are sequels(well, with odst its a prequel) AND expansions

Kind of what I was getting off.

ODST is more of a spin off. MW2 is a sequel with the same elements. MW2 plays much more like MW1. It doesn't even have to do with the amount of content.

  • 07.05.2009 6:31 PM PDT

-I was here

oh also, its all matter of perspective... what 1 person sees will be in a game can be translated differently by another person. which game you think will have better stuff in it is all up to you. if you think 1 game has more stuff than the other, buy it and stop complaining about the other 1. and also it depends on what kind of game you like. if you like a realistic game with actual weapons and human enemys but the same type of gameplay as the rest of the series, then you should get call of duty. if you like games where you fight aliens and have futuristic weapons and a different kind of storyline than the rest of the games in the series buy odst

  • 07.05.2009 6:45 PM PDT

-I was here

Posted by: The BS Police
1. Modern warfare 2 has a new multiplayer component.

2. Halo 3: ODST doesn't

they both have new multiplayer content (maybe you havent heard of somthing called firefight?)

oh and when they release odst, they will have new halo 3 multiplayer maps

[Edited on 07.05.2009 6:49 PM PDT]

  • 07.05.2009 6:48 PM PDT

Posted by: goatman327
oh also, its all matter of perspective... what 1 person sees will be in a game can be translated differently by another person. which game you think will have better stuff in it is all up to you. if you think 1 game has more stuff than the other, buy it and stop complaining about the other 1. and also it depends on what kind of game you like. if you like a realistic game with actual weapons and human enemys but the same type of gameplay as the rest of the series, then you should get call of duty. if you like games where you fight aliens and have futuristic weapons and a different kind of storyline than the rest of the games in the series buy odst

Oh, I wasn't debating quality. I'll probably end up getting both games eventually.

I was trying to get at the fact that ODST is essentially a different type of game while COD is more levels, maps, etc.

ODST doesn't really expand on Halo 3, it spins off of it.

MW2 expands on Modern Warfare 1.



[Edited on 07.05.2009 6:49 PM PDT]

  • 07.05.2009 6:48 PM PDT