Halo: Reach Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach. (Update-7/16/09 : New weapons added.)
  • Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach. (Update-7/16/09 : New weapons added.)
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach. (Update-7/16/09 : New weapons added.)

Voilà!In view,a humble vaudevillian veteran,cast vicariously as both victim and villain by the vicissitudes of Fate.This visage, no mere veneer of vanity,is a vestige of the vox populi,now vacant, vanished.However,this valorous visitation of a by-gone vexation,stands vivified and has vowed to vanquish these venal and virulent vermin van-guarding vice and vouchsafing the violently vicious and voracious violation of volition.

May I have your attention please?
May I have your attention please?
Will the real MLG please stand up?
I repeat, will the real MLG please stand up?
We're gonna have a problem here..

No one here can say how MLG would deal without the BR unless Walshy just comes in and starts posting and I hope he or some MLG pro will, cause all you saying that MLG couldn't function without the BR are pissing me off stop speaking for an entire community like you know what they want. Also for those who are interested The Eakle and myself are collaberating on a pro AR/BR thread to find a solution that suits both ends, whether it be the casual or competitive players so if you have any addjustments to either weapon let us know and keep it clean



[Edited on 07.16.2009 9:19 PM PDT]

  • 07.16.2009 9:18 PM PDT

Posted by: PATTON 2007
*cough*

/thread

Here's an Idea. How about making the BR single shot, fire's as fast as you can pull the trigger and takes 12 shots to kill? Still as powerful, just single shot and different RoF.

  • 07.16.2009 11:10 PM PDT
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach

Masterchief=Chuck Norris

I didn't really read any of this, I just want to say one thing about when you say CE was good without the BR...

It had the uber pistol which was more overpowered than the BR.....

  • 07.16.2009 11:16 PM PDT

I'm not shocked that the ECKLE is a grade three commander...

  • 07.16.2009 11:35 PM PDT

Posted by: Jiggly Luv
So, why can't a weapon, whether it is a Rifle or a Magnum, be extremely accurate (M6D accurate) and be very strong (a 3-shot or a 4-shot)? Again, the answer seems obvious. The M6D was great fun, but grossly over powered. And, as expected, you are falling into calling a weapon overpowered, when indeed everything else is underpowered. You didn't even answer the question. You can have a strong weapon and have a balanced game; that is the problem with this topic. You think in order to balance it you should only decrease power in certain weapons; you can also increase power in certain weapons. Every weapon in Red Faction:Guerrilla is stronger than the H3 BR, and that game also has a much better balanced weapon set.

This is what I don't understand. He calls the BR overpowered, but jiggly luv states that the BR is not overpowered, but everything else is underpowered. THIS IS BASICALLY THE SAME STATEMENT.

It's true, you can have a strong weapon and a balanced game, but starting with this strong weapon, or littering it all over the map COMPLETELY ruins the idea of using other weapons.

So, you think we should INCREASE the power of every weapon? ALL that means is you want people to die faster. You may as well just make a custom game with no BR and lower shields/health of the players and BAM, you can go play it. You both think it should be even, just one wants to lower the power of the BR (in my opinion simpler, and better because I like how much damage other weapons give), or power up all weapons except the BR (which would just cause you to die faster, which would make it less like Halo). It's turned into an argument of whether we should die faster or not, am I wrong?

  • 07.16.2009 11:36 PM PDT
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In all honesty this isn't a discussion at all.

  • 07.16.2009 11:48 PM PDT
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach. (Update-7/16/09 : New weapons added.)
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Echo Charlie Hotel Oscar

Because of it's range and accuracy, it makes all dual wieldable weapons and ARs almost entirely useless. Because it out ranges power weapons like swords and shotguns, the only effective way to use them is camp. Thus, the BR promotes camping.Contradiction

It is often said that flag games become annoying with ARs because you cant kill the carrier from a distance, but none of these claims were made in Halo Combat Evolved because we didnt know of an unbalanced starting weapon, besides the pistol. We did just fine with our ARs up until Halo 2.People would always spawn and switch to their pistols to kill the flag carrier from a distance.

With Halo 2 came Halo's introduction to MLG. Without the Assault Rifle, the only main weapon to have was the BR, so it became MLG's main weapon. Halo 2 quickly became incredibly popular, and the BR came with it. Wrong. MLG was around with Halo: CE.

The BR is a favorite of many players because they live under the stereotype that it means they are "good" or "pro", when really it is an easy way to rack up kills.The BR takes more skill to use than the AR. Holding the right trigger on someone instead of having to have a consistent shot takes skill. Sorry, you're wrong again.

From looking at nearly anyone's service record you can see the BR as the Tool of Destruction. Why is this? Because if anyone comes up with a close range weapon they are killed before they get the chance to fight. Everyone get's kills with the Bettle Rifle because they can. Some great AR user can try to attack, but will get mowed down by a BR "noob" in almost any situation. The only way to counter the BR is to get close. But the BR is still powerful at that range. Three quick bursts then a melee put's the opposing player down. Even though the AR is meant for close range it often ends up "trading" with the BR. Because of this the only logical thing to do is get a more powerful weapon than the BR. Close range weapons will kill someone with a BR more times than not at close range. Shotguns, hammers, maulers, and swords all kill within one or two hits, so you make no sense here.

Your weapon choices are now Rocket, Sniper, Sword or Shotgun. People claim Rocket's are for noobs because anyone can kill with them and shotguns and swords are for noobs because of camping. The truth is that players turn to these weapons because the BR practically forces them to. Basically, if you are not good with a BR or sniper you are killed a lot or considered a noob. These weapons can be considered nooby, but when it takes skill to get them by knowing what time they spawn and by using a BR, they are not. Getting these power weapons is a reward of being good with a BR and having good teamwork.

Obviously, the BR is the root of all Halo's evil. I have shown you already that it promotes camping and "noob" weapons, but that's not all. When players are not good at the game what do they do? They dont care about winning and jut play for fun. How can you play for fun if a starting weapon dominates everything else? Just screw around. Drive off cliffs, speed around on a mongoose, try to get kills with a pistol, you name it. Any time someone is not trying to play Halo the "right" way, they are a by product of the BR. Any time you see someone killed repeatedly and hae an awful K/D ratio, think to yourself "What weapon was used to kill them so many times?" The BR is likely the answer. The BR is likely the answer because people realize it is the most versatile weapon.

So, the BR has reduced Halo to Brs, snipers, and "noobs." Is that a Halo we want to play? I dont think so. But what can fix this terrible world the BR has made? The answer seems obvious. The AR. It is the perfect starting weapon. It get's the job done without being the main weapon of the game. By scrapping both the BR and the MA5C (Our current Assault Rifle), then bringing back the MA5B (CE's Assault Rifle) Halo would be restored to it's former glory. Then there is no mid range weapon to use to kill the flag carrier like you said earlier...

But we need a new mid-long range weapon, right? I mean, the BR did have a purpose. . .Yes, otherwise the game is unbalanced.

Wrong. The BR's range was one of the main reasons it destroyed our beloved game. Another mid-long range weapon would likey also ruin it. To fill the gap left in all the "pro" players' hearts, we do need a new mid range balanced weapon. A new and improved pistol will do just fine. A new and improved pistol? People will complain it is overpowered just like the BR...

Take the Halo 3 pistol and slightly improve it. "But that pistol is bad!" Not true. The weapon is good if you know how to use it. Get in range, aim for the head, and fire while strafing away from the enemy's fire. Sounds a lot like a BR right? The only difference is that the pistol did not ruin Halo. The only issue with the pistol is that it's magazine does not hold enough ammo for multiple kills. By increasing the pistols clip size and adding a 1.5X scope, we wouls have a great new mid ranged weapon. Then we'd be playing Halo: CE again with a downgraded pistol...

The BR is fine. It is balanced enough where it is not overpowering like it was in Halo 2. At close range all of the short range weapons are better than it, and rockets and snipes are. Also, dual wielding can kill someone with a BR at close range. The BR honestly only dominates at mid range and is still decent enough to knock snipers out of scope at long range.

  • 07.16.2009 11:49 PM PDT
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Posted by: l EcHo 360 l
Because of it's range and accuracy, it makes all dual wieldable weapons and ARs almost entirely useless. Because it out ranges power weapons like swords and shotguns, the only effective way to use them is camp. Thus, the BR promotes camping.Contradiction

It is often said that flag games become annoying with ARs because you cant kill the carrier from a distance, but none of these claims were made in Halo Combat Evolved because we didnt know of an unbalanced starting weapon, besides the pistol. We did just fine with our ARs up until Halo 2.People would always spawn and switch to their pistols to kill the flag carrier from a distance.

With Halo 2 came Halo's introduction to MLG. Without the Assault Rifle, the only main weapon to have was the BR, so it became MLG's main weapon. Halo 2 quickly became incredibly popular, and the BR came with it. Wrong. MLG was around with Halo: CE.

The BR is a favorite of many players because they live under the stereotype that it means they are "good" or "pro", when really it is an easy way to rack up kills.The BR takes more skill to use than the AR. Holding the right trigger on someone instead of having to have a consistent shot takes skill. Sorry, you're wrong again.

From looking at nearly anyone's service record you can see the BR as the Tool of Destruction. Why is this? Because if anyone comes up with a close range weapon they are killed before they get the chance to fight. Everyone get's kills with the Bettle Rifle because they can. Some great AR user can try to attack, but will get mowed down by a BR "noob" in almost any situation. The only way to counter the BR is to get close. But the BR is still powerful at that range. Three quick bursts then a melee put's the opposing player down. Even though the AR is meant for close range it often ends up "trading" with the BR. Because of this the only logical thing to do is get a more powerful weapon than the BR. Close range weapons will kill someone with a BR more times than not at close range. Shotguns, hammers, maulers, and swords all kill within one or two hits, so you make no sense here.

Your weapon choices are now Rocket, Sniper, Sword or Shotgun. People claim Rocket's are for noobs because anyone can kill with them and shotguns and swords are for noobs because of camping. The truth is that players turn to these weapons because the BR practically forces them to. Basically, if you are not good with a BR or sniper you are killed a lot or considered a noob. These weapons can be considered nooby, but when it takes skill to get them by knowing what time they spawn and by using a BR, they are not. Getting these power weapons is a reward of being good with a BR and having good teamwork.

Obviously, the BR is the root of all Halo's evil. I have shown you already that it promotes camping and "noob" weapons, but that's not all. When players are not good at the game what do they do? They dont care about winning and jut play for fun. How can you play for fun if a starting weapon dominates everything else? Just screw around. Drive off cliffs, speed around on a mongoose, try to get kills with a pistol, you name it. Any time someone is not trying to play Halo the "right" way, they are a by product of the BR. Any time you see someone killed repeatedly and hae an awful K/D ratio, think to yourself "What weapon was used to kill them so many times?" The BR is likely the answer. The BR is likely the answer because people realize it is the most versatile weapon.

So, the BR has reduced Halo to Brs, snipers, and "noobs." Is that a Halo we want to play? I dont think so. But what can fix this terrible world the BR has made? The answer seems obvious. The AR. It is the perfect starting weapon. It get's the job done without being the main weapon of the game. By scrapping both the BR and the MA5C (Our current Assault Rifle), then bringing back the MA5B (CE's Assault Rifle) Halo would be restored to it's former glory. Then there is no mid range weapon to use to kill the flag carrier like you said earlier...

But we need a new mid-long range weapon, right? I mean, the BR did have a purpose. . .Yes, otherwise the game is unbalanced.

Wrong. The BR's range was one of the main reasons it destroyed our beloved game. Another mid-long range weapon would likey also ruin it. To fill the gap left in all the "pro" players' hearts, we do need a new mid range balanced weapon. A new and improved pistol will do just fine. A new and improved pistol? People will complain it is overpowered just like the BR...

Take the Halo 3 pistol and slightly improve it. "But that pistol is bad!" Not true. The weapon is good if you know how to use it. Get in range, aim for the head, and fire while strafing away from the enemy's fire. Sounds a lot like a BR right? The only difference is that the pistol did not ruin Halo. The only issue with the pistol is that it's magazine does not hold enough ammo for multiple kills. By increasing the pistols clip size and adding a 1.5X scope, we wouls have a great new mid ranged weapon. Then we'd be playing Halo: CE again with a downgraded pistol...

The BR is fine. It is balanced enough where it is not overpowering like it was in Halo 2. At close range all of the short range weapons are better than it, and rockets and snipes are. Also, dual wielding can kill someone with a BR at close range. The BR honestly only dominates at mid range and is still decent enough to knock snipers out of scope at long range.


Thank god someone took the time to post this.

  • 07.16.2009 11:53 PM PDT

Posted by: l EcHo 360 l
Because of it's range and accuracy, it makes all dual wieldable weapons and ARs almost entirely useless. Because it out ranges power weapons like swords and shotguns, the only effective way to use them is camp. Thus, the BR promotes camping.Contradiction

That would be a contradiction only if the first sentance was next to the last sentance. He is saying that anybody with a close range or dual wieldable weapon must camp to combat against anyone who has a BR. So they can camp, or grab a battle rifle.

Posted by: l EcHo 360 l
Obviously, the BR is the root of all Halo's evil. I have shown you already that it promotes camping and "noob" weapons, but that's not all. When players are not good at the game what do they do? They dont care about winning and jut play for fun. How can you play for fun if a starting weapon dominates everything else? Just screw around. Drive off cliffs, speed around on a mongoose, try to get kills with a pistol, you name it. Any time someone is not trying to play Halo the "right" way, they are a by product of the BR. Any time you see someone killed repeatedly and hae an awful K/D ratio, think to yourself "What weapon was used to kill them so many times?" The BR is likely the answer. The BR is likely the answer because people realize it is the most versatile weapon.

Which is a GREAT reason not to spawn with it

Posted by: l EcHo 360 l
So, the BR has reduced Halo to Brs, snipers, and "noobs." Is that a Halo we want to play? I dont think so. But what can fix this terrible world the BR has made? The answer seems obvious. The AR. It is the perfect starting weapon. It get's the job done without being the main weapon of the game. By scrapping both the BR and the MA5C (Our current Assault Rifle), then bringing back the MA5B (CE's Assault Rifle) Halo would be restored to it's former glory. Then there is no mid range weapon to use to kill the flag carrier like you said earlier...

The carbine does great, and not only do you not spawn with it ever, but it's not littered on maps, so it just seems less powerful, when really it is just as powerful, just balanced with a small amount of appearances. Something the BR could use is definitely less appearances.

Posted by: l EcHo 360 l
Wrong. The BR's range was one of the main reasons it destroyed our beloved game. Another mid-long range weapon would likey also ruin it. To fill the gap left in all the "pro" players' hearts, we do need a new mid range balanced weapon. A new and improved pistol will do just fine. A new and improved pistol? People will complain it is overpowered just like the BR...

Not if it is less powerful than the BR...

Posted by: l EcHo 360 l
Take the Halo 3 pistol and slightly improve it. "But that pistol is bad!" Not true. The weapon is good if you know how to use it. Get in range, aim for the head, and fire while strafing away from the enemy's fire. Sounds a lot like a BR right? The only difference is that the pistol did not ruin Halo. The only issue with the pistol is that it's magazine does not hold enough ammo for multiple kills. By increasing the pistols clip size and adding a 1.5X scope, we wouls have a great new mid ranged weapon. Then we'd be playing Halo: CE again with a downgraded pistol...
I don't even think the Magnum needs an upgrade, unless it's a scope. A scope on the Halo 3 pistol would be PERFECT.

  • 07.17.2009 12:46 AM PDT
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach

Multiplayer Gameplay
Halo:CE------------------Reach--------Halo2-----------------H alo3
Campaign Experience
Reach----Halo:CE-----------------ODST-----Halo2---------Halo3

Glad that Halo 3 garbage is dead, thanks to Reach.
Unfreakenbelievable!!

Posted by: Spartan 355
Posted by: Jiggly Luv
So, why can't a weapon, whether it is a Rifle or a Magnum, be extremely accurate (M6D accurate) and be very strong (a 3-shot or a 4-shot)? Again, the answer seems obvious. The M6D was great fun, but grossly over powered. And, as expected, you are falling into calling a weapon overpowered, when indeed everything else is underpowered. You didn't even answer the question. You can have a strong weapon and have a balanced game; that is the problem with this topic. You think in order to balance it you should only decrease power in certain weapons; you can also increase power in certain weapons. Every weapon in Red Faction:Guerrilla is stronger than the H3 BR, and that game also has a much better balanced weapon set.

This is what I don't understand. He calls the BR overpowered, but jiggly luv states that the BR is not overpowered, but everything else is underpowered. THIS IS BASICALLY THE SAME STATEMENT.

It's true, you can have a strong weapon and a balanced game, but starting with this strong weapon, or littering it all over the map COMPLETELY ruins the idea of using other weapons.

So, you think we should INCREASE the power of every weapon? ALL that means is you want people to die faster. You may as well just make a custom game with no BR and lower shields/health of the players and BAM, you can go play it. You both think it should be even, just one wants to lower the power of the BR (in my opinion simpler, and better because I like how much damage other weapons give), or power up all weapons except the BR (which would just cause you to die faster, which would make it less like Halo). It's turned into an argument of whether we should die faster or not, am I wrong?
I understand why you would say this, and I agree. I just want certain individuals to understand is that the BR isn't necessarily overpowered, nor was the M6D. Balance involves all weapons; not just one weapon that a person feels as being too good and unbalanced.

Yet, the OP fails to realize that the reason why the BR is the most effective (which is also equal to the effectiveness of the Carbine and slightly better than the M6G Magnum) is because it is one of the 3 mid-ranged weapons that have an obvious range advantage. Is it better for close-range than all the close-ranged weapons? No. The OP has a problem with the BR (other than any misconceptions toward the MLG community) because it is more versatile, or has more range, than all the weapons which only fit within the close-ranged niche of this game.

If you want it to do less damage, then fine. But, it better have a tradeoff; it better have alot more range, then. Either way, the advantage it has is the headshot bonus and range advantage. Eliminate the BR, then people will learn to use the other ranged weapons, and continue to dominate your face in with those weapons instead. The BR just fills that need for range and it is accesible. Replace it and then you will be complaining about that weapon. The only reason why some people aren't saying "OMG quit killing me with a Magnum" is because the BR is usually swapped for it. Beleve me when I say this...when I use the M6G, which is frequently in AR/M6G starts, people who run around with their precious close-ranged Melee whatever run away and hide. Why is this? The Magnum is only a 5-shot, but it gives people an advantage when used at mid and close range, because of that thing I like to call, a headshot.

Why should this game revolve around close-range? That is my problem with him wanting to nerf the BR even more. Why can't this game revolve around mid-range? That is what I want to know. When you balance a weapon set within a game, it must involve the balance of ALL weapons, which includes the Sniper and Rocket.

What I meant by "power" was overall effectiveness; not really the damage output. This includes accuracy, RoF, and damage.


Personally, I would love if Bungie was to combine the functionality of both the BR and AR into one weapon and make that the primary starting weapon, while also providing a strong Magnum as secondary that is hard to use but is more powerful. What I mean by this is a Rifle that is scoped and has automatic functionality but can be burst fired to make it accurate. The Magnum (M6D) could be an accurate 3-shot with less magnetism and auto-aim as Halo:CE, while the new Rifle is a more "nooby" alternative that is easy to use, but is slightly less powerful. Also, headshots should now deal more damage than body shots with all weapons (so the Magnum would need 2 or 3 headshot to be a 3-shot, instead of just 2 bodies and a headshot).

And then, balance the weapons around those two weapons. The Rocket and Sniper, and/or Laser, are all fine. The Plasma Rifle and Plasma Pistol become alot more accurate and have a health damage boost (as in Halo:CE) along with stun capabilities. The Shotgun and Sword, etc. are fine; maybe increase the range a little. The Carbine could function similar to the new Rifle (as in gets very inaccurate when auto'd and is very accurate when pulsed). The Needler would just need to be alot more accurate. The SMG would need to function like the new Rifle with just a little more Recoil, more damage output, and a little less range as the Rifle.

  • 07.17.2009 12:46 AM PDT

I don't think that the OP wants the game to revolve around close range, I just think he means that the BR kills that area of gameplay. He wants the game to revolve around ALL weapons, and it is currently running on the BR.

I also think that if they tone down the power of the BR, it would still be a versatile weapon with great abilities. I'd keep using it.

There are also more ways than just toning down power that we could help. Say we took off the scope. This would make it so you can't snipe with it. (Yes, I do think it can reach a tad to far).

This thread isn't meant to beat on the BR like SO MANY PEOPLE THINK. It's to find a balance, because it is clearly unbalanced. If there was a global weapon stats page, the BR would probably 15% of every kill made. They should all be about the same, some varying on favorite weapons and situations...

  • 07.17.2009 12:57 AM PDT

Eakle GTFO. They will not remove the br because of a random like you complaining that it's too over-powered. If you were a fan of the br we would not be having this discussion. you know it's true. In other words...GET GOOD BK

  • 07.17.2009 1:00 AM PDT
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach. (Update-7/16/09 : New weapons added.)

Multiplayer Gameplay
Halo:CE------------------Reach--------Halo2-----------------H alo3
Campaign Experience
Reach----Halo:CE-----------------ODST-----Halo2---------Halo3

Glad that Halo 3 garbage is dead, thanks to Reach.
Unfreakenbelievable!!

Posted by: ramenloverninja
May I have your attention please?
May I have your attention please?
Will the real MLG please stand up?
I repeat, will the real MLG please stand up?
We're gonna have a problem here..

No one here can say how MLG would deal without the BR unless Walshy just comes in and starts posting and I hope he or some MLG pro will, cause all you saying that MLG couldn't function without the BR are pissing me off stop speaking for an entire community like you know what they want. Also for those who are interested The Eakle and myself are collaberating on a pro AR/BR thread to find a solution that suits both ends, whether it be the casual or competitive players so if you have any addjustments to either weapon let us know and keep it clean

Why don't you go into the mlgpro.com forums and find your answers? But, I have seen the beginnings of MLG and understand why they do certain things. Most people played MLG settings during Halo:CE's time and didn't even know it. The M6D and Pro-like settings is why they do what they do. The M6D provided the best balance between the 3 1-hit kill weapons (Sniper, Rocket, and Shotgun), while everything else (except for the AR as secondary for close-ranged purposes) really had no purpose and seemed kind of dumb actually.

If you want an explanation of why they use certain settings for Halo 3, look here. In short, they found Halo:CE to be so much fun and balanced that they try and mirror similar settings and balance while creating that same fast-paced action.

The BR just gives them that range and power that they want. The Carbine works, but it shoots visible bullets which give away your position and is actually kind of dumb, and it can't be a starting weapon anyway. The M6G Magnum works, but it is unbalanced to Rockets and Snipers because it is a 5-shot and lacks enough range to defend against Snipers.

If they were to remove the BR from Halo 3's set of weapons, MLG which started during Halo:CE would either do one of two things. They would try and make it work with M6G starts while increasing the damage (but could mess up the balance in doing so), or they would just go back to Halo 2.

For Halo:Reach, they will just use the main human weapon that is accurate and strong, whatever weapon that is. If that weapon does not exist, then there better either be options to correct that horrifying thought of weapon design in a FPShooer, or they will just go back to Halo 3...well, until their fanbase begins to move on to other games.


And, if you really want to hear from a Pro, as in Walshy, listen to this interview on this podcast. He doesn't comment too much on weapon design, though. Also, MLG pros, and much of the MLG community, really never uses this forum; they actually laugh at this community behind your guys' backs. Most of the "old-timers" are pretty cool guys, though; maturity will do that to you.

  • 07.17.2009 1:10 AM PDT
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach

Bungie will lose a MAJOR part of its halo fanbase if they took out its BEST weapon.

  • 07.17.2009 1:14 AM PDT
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach. (Update-7/16/09 : New weapons added.)

Spartan Z97

I think everyone that just read this post got a whole lot dumber. Your logic is flawed. I get AR kills over BR kills all of the time. The only reason people get more BR kills than the AR kills is because BR's are on just about every map and have the gametype Team BR's. The fact that you want to add a scope to the AR is stuipid. The fact that you want get rid of the BR just proves that you suck with BR's and just because you suck with BR's does not mean you should write a 5 hour long post that no one wants to hear.

P.S. Next time spell check your work and I know that you are going to reply back calling me an idoit because you know your logic just got owned by mine so don't.

  • 07.17.2009 1:18 AM PDT
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Posted by: Spartan 355
I don't think that the OP wants the game to revolve around close range, I just think he means that the BR kills that area of gameplay. He wants the game to revolve around ALL weapons, and it is currently running on the BR.


Halo has always revolved around a mid-range weapon. Bungie has built Halo 3's weapons on a hierarchy. in Halo:CE it was the pistol, in H2 and H3 it was and is the battle rifle. What the OP is asking is to change an element of the game that has been prominent throughout all of Halo.

What it comes down too is that dual wieldable weapons are effective at close range, BR/Carbine are effective at mid-range, sniping is effective at long range.

In reality there is no FPS without complete balance between weapons, such a balance would make for bland gameplay - and it's only natural for the player to gravitate towards the middle ground weapon, where it is effective (to an extent) at all ranges.

Another point the OP brought up is that the BR can kill multiple people in one clip. Technically the BR can kill 4 (I believe) players with one clip. However, how many times have you seen it pulled off? I seriously doubt that everyone who picks a BR up walks around getting 4 kills per clip, let alone getting a clean 4-shot (especially on gametypes with damage at 100%, not 110% in MLG settings). The huge multi-kills you see are a reward of communication, coordination and team-shooting between a team: not one person.

(edit: typo)

The More I read these posts, the more I realize the lack of knowledge people have of game theory and what makes a game balanced, interesting and enjoyable. It's as though, for the majority of people on these forums, Halo is the one and only game you've ever played in your lives.

[Edited on 07.17.2009 1:26 AM PDT]

  • 07.17.2009 1:19 AM PDT

Posted by: Spartan Z97
I think everyone that just read this post got a whole lot dumber. Your logic is flawed. I get AR kills over BR kills all of the time. The only reason people get more BR kills than the AR kills is because BR's are on just about every map and have the gametype Team BR's. The fact that you want to add a scope to the AR is stuipid. The fact that you want get rid of the BR just proves that you suck with BR's and just because you suck with BR's does not mean you should write a 5 hour long post that no one wants to hear.

P.S. Next time spell check your work and I know that you are going to reply back calling me an idoit because you know your logic just got owned by mine so don't.

Why so mean? He states his opinion, and because you disagree you give him crap? At least explain why you disagree.

Also, in that last sentence about spell check, you misspelled idiot...

  • 07.17.2009 1:22 AM PDT

Multiplayer Gameplay
Halo:CE------------------Reach--------Halo2-----------------H alo3
Campaign Experience
Reach----Halo:CE-----------------ODST-----Halo2---------Halo3

Glad that Halo 3 garbage is dead, thanks to Reach.
Unfreakenbelievable!!

Posted by: BlackArmorHira
Another point the OP brought up is that the BR can kill multiple people in one clip. Technically the BR can kill 4 (I believe) players with one clip. However, how many times have you seen it pulled off? I seriously doubt that everyone who picks a BR up walks around getting 4 kills per clip, let alone getting a clean 4-shot (especially on gametypes with damage at 100%, not 110% in MLG settings). The huge multi-kills you see are a reward of communication, coordination and team-shooting between a team: not one person.
Actually, the BR can kill up to 3 people with all 4-shots. The BR has a clip size of 36 rounds/magazine. The BR can also kill up to 2 people with all body-shots. Either way, the BR's range really does not allow for consistent 4-shots. Not even real Pros can pull it off. I actually see that inconsistency as a bad thing, btw.

[Edited on 07.17.2009 1:27 AM PDT]

  • 07.17.2009 1:25 AM PDT

Posted by: BlackArmorHira
[quote][In reality there is no FPS without complete balance between weapons, such a balance would make for bland gameplay - and it's only natural for the player to gravitate towards the middle ground weapon, where it is effective (to an extent) at all ranges.

Well the is really no way to hold a perfect balance. Nothing is perfect. But to make all weapons balance more out, would not make it bland, but give great variety and add more decision making. It also depends on map. In a close quarters area of course I'm gonna dual SMGs or a shotgun over any mid-range weapon. Halo just seems to have quite a few open maps.

You're right however, most would gravitate toward a more mid-range weapon in most situations, because it is a weapon between close-range and long-range, it can possibly combat both. It's the fact that the BR can act as all three with (a lesser extent on close range) a bit to well. That is a reason people don't like to put it down, they can control most every situation with as little as 4-shots, with a variable on distance + opposing weapon (Example: Shotgun Point blank).

  • 07.17.2009 1:30 AM PDT
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach. (Update-7/16/09 : New weapons added.)

I am the Prophet of Tree's
fear me.

i tryed to read it i really did. too long but in general from the parts i read i totally agree. my tool of destrucion is melee

[Edited on 07.17.2009 1:39 AM PDT]

  • 07.17.2009 1:35 AM PDT

OP "What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent post were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."



ECHO 360 you are 100% right.

[Edited on 07.17.2009 1:37 AM PDT]

  • 07.17.2009 1:35 AM PDT

Posted by: BLUEelite52
OP "What you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent post were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this forum is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."



ECHO 360 you are 100% right.

Yeah that quote from Billy Madison sure makes a lot of sense here in this forum.
*END SARCASM*

The OP has good points. Stop hating because you like the BR, post reasons why you disagree, not altered movie quotes.

[Edited on 07.17.2009 1:41 AM PDT]

  • 07.17.2009 1:41 AM PDT
Subject: Remove the BR from Halo: Reach

It is the best weapon and it should not be removed and if u think it should be removed than it means u are not even good enough to use it.

  • 07.17.2009 1:50 AM PDT