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  • Subject: Enkidu
Subject: Enkidu
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" In this passage you kind of have to wonder,
is Enkidu trying to warn you because he/she cares
about your safety, or is he/she threatening you like
there may be some kind of misfortunate "accident"
that really won't be an accident, but instead the murder
of you by Enkidu?"-Tartarus

Yeah, that would make a lot of sense, Enkidu once
had a use for JD, but perhaps in his ramapancy,
JD is in the way of his "escape"

EDIT: I almost forgot. I agree fatal pigeon, Greek
myth is VERY similar to sumerian myth, especially
when it comes to floods.


[Edited on 5/1/2004 2:32:04 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 2:29 PM PDT
Subject: Enkidu - Cortana Letters Revisted?
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Fatal Pigeon - OK cool i see what you are saying. It still fits with what the Ingigi and Anunnaki were from what i found. One heavenly and one earthly. i also understand the deduction you made of one being good and one bad.

As far as the Greek mythology having similarites to Babylonian mythology (like like the epic of Gilgamesh), its becaause the greeks came later and rewrote it to fit their culture. Even the First Testament is based on ancient writings and has some similarities. It speaks of something like the Anunnki which get interpreted as "Giants" but infact the translation that is more exact is "coming down from the heaven".

Still, like you said i think the Greek stuff is good too, since the halo story uses other greek references (Spartans = Greek... most obvious)

  • 05.01.2004 2:32 PM PDT
Subject: About the Greek stuff...
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I want you guys to read my post about Greek
references to halo. I created some new stuff
that I've never heard before, and I want to know
what you think. The post is around page 12, and
I'll repost it here in an edit if you want. The post
relates to the floods and Enlil somewhat.

I found an interesting greek story related to Enkidu.

"I roamed the forests as I wished after Enlil starved
the gods." - Enkidu the A.I.

Enlil is a god related to the great flood in Sumero-
Babylonian myth. In a description of Enlil on
Pantheon.org, it states that the flood killed every
human but Atrahasis. I Googled Atrahasis and found
an interesting myth about the flood, but what was
more interesting was that the story related to greek
myth.

The Greek version of the flood myth has a hero
named Deucalion. Deucalion and Pyyhra were
the survivors of the Great Flood because they
were warned by Deucalion's father Prometheus.
(Prometheus is roughly translated as "forethought")
Deucalion is responsible for restoration of the
human race of the flood.(sounds like our good
friend John, No?)

Prometheus was a Titan who helped humans
survive by giving them fire. Prometheus' inclination
to help humans angered Zeus, so he was chained.

"Whoever made such a place must now live in chains;
there is no other explanation for their absence."
-Cortana

Prometheus=Forerunner
John 117=Deucalion (savior of human race)

To summarize, Prometheus seems to be related
to the Forerunner. The definition "Forethought" is an
obvious clue, and if the Forerunner created the humans,
like this allusion suggests, then they would have compassion
for humanity like Prometheus.
John 117 seems to be the son of Prometheus symbolically.
He is fighting the flood, and is mysteriously imbued with
knowlege of the forerunner. (How else would he know how
to work all those panels in alien languages?)

EDIT: John 117 was picked up in Elysium CIty when
he was six i think. In GreekMyth the Elysian Fields was
a place where the chosen ones of the Gods were sent.

The Cortana letter reference is too good. How could this
NOT be from bungie?

[Edited on 5/1/2004 2:46:33 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 2:37 PM PDT
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yeah repost it here eMCee so I don't have to look for it. It might be even more relevant now with the recent developements.

  • 05.01.2004 2:39 PM PDT
Subject: Cortana Letters...
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by the way, here's a link to the old Cortana Letters if anyone wants it.....
http://marathon.bungie.org/story/cortana.html

  • 05.01.2004 3:01 PM PDT
Subject: About the Greek stuff...
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I know the post about The Greek connections
is hard to understand, so I'll summarize what
I meant better.
John 117 seems to be connected to the forerunner.
The forerunner are revered as "Gods" by the covies,
so if the Greek gods are symbolic of the forerunner,
then its possible that the Forerunner were once
divided on what to do with humans, a lot like the
Titans and regular Gods. Think Ingigi and Anunnaki.
The Ingigi are evil, and want destruction of the humans,
or at least to limit their power, and the Anunnanki
thought they should flourish. Prometheus was like an
Anunnaki in that he wished the humans well, and if
Prometheus is a symbol of the "good" forerunner,
then it is possible that he created some kind of
"Ark" for the humans, leaving them with the necessary
tools to survive. (These Arks may not be just on earth
as the invisible Cortana letter hints to) John may also
be a descendant or creation of the forerunner "Gods"
a lot like Gilgamesh, who was two thirds god and one
third man.

Hopefully that's clearer. Thoughts are really hard to
write down sometimes.

[Edited on 5/1/2004 3:46:19 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 3:08 PM PDT
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Ok i have a problem with cortana and MC having anything to do with this yet. Because the dates of these terminals are before halo. I looked it up in the 1st book and found that as this is all going on John and cortana are on Reach. Plus the whole thing with them destroying Halo did not happen until 8-30-2552 to 9-something-2552 I Think that this has something to do with what cortana and MC will face in Halo 2.

Edit:So I think it is either a story that is going to explain something in Halo 2 that will come out or that this is part of a mission in halo 2. Let me know what you think

[Edited on 5/1/2004 3:29:46 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 3:27 PM PDT
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eMCee. that a really cool theory and find. I really think that you are onto something. i'm going to summerize the Atrathasis story right now though because i think that there are more connection even beyond the strong one that you made here. Awsome!

  • 05.01.2004 3:28 PM PDT
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In response to Jack, I think Enkidu is addresing some marine, ODST or other unusually talented soldier rather than the Master Chief. The time thing makes it very slightly impossible for Chief to be two places at once unless you want to bring time-travel into the mix.

  • 05.01.2004 3:41 PM PDT
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Here is the summary of the story of Atrathasis. In another post I'l say what i think is the conection to halo and these Enkidu letters along with the help of eMCee.

This is the best site that I found on the story of Atrathasis. http://faculty.gvsu.edu/websterm/Atrahasi.htm this summury is based on this site.

Basically the story tells that before man there were the lower gods and they had to do all the work. however these lower gods got sick of doing all the work and they went to the main god of the upper gods, Enlil, and were very angry (basically on strike. Enlil does not know what to do so he gets Anu (the god of sky) and Enki (clever god of waters). They descide to take one of these angry lower gods and sacrafic him, his name was Geshtu-e (god of intelligence). After killing him they take this lower god's blood and fleshand mix it with clay to make man kind.

Man-kind is then made and put upon the earth and does all the work on earth and does it very well. After a certain amount of time though, the population of humans gets very large which upsets Enlil. he gets upset because he cannot sleep from all the noise that the humans are making. Enlil then summons up the "surrupu disease" to break out.

Plague breaks forth and a wise man Antrathasis appeals to his god Eniki (clever god of waters) for his help. summerizing the web site, Eniki says to Atrathasisi to have all the humans stop worshiping their normal gods and to start worshiping the plague god, Namtar. Namtar then stops the plague because of shame.

Once again time passses and humans populate the earth and disturb Enlil. Enlil then wants to cause a famine so he goes to the god Adad (rain and thunder god) and ask him to hold back the rains. Again Atarthasis tells the people to pray to Adad. Adad then stops the dry spell and lets it rain again.

More time passes and then once again the human population grows to a point that it upsets Enlil. this time he declares an all out hault of natures gifts upon humans. Anu and Adad gaurded the heavens, Enlil the earth and Enki the waters so that Enlil's wishes would not be opposed.

It is unclear on the record but somehow Enki foils Enlil and lets fish get to the starving people. As punishent by Enlil, Enki is forced to create a flood and destoy humans for the last time. Enki does what he is suppose to but before he does he warns Atrathasis about the coming flood. Atrathasis then builds a boat and loads his family and two of every animal aboard. the flood comes and everyone on earth but who is on the boat are wiped out.

Now the mother godess gets upset and tells Enlil and Anu that they are bad decision makers. she will forever remember this great flood put upon earth. And so, I guess that the gods starved themselves because of the flood, but after 7 days and nights, the flood stopped and Atrathasis set upon land. He then offers the gods a sacrafice where all the hungry gods come together. Enlil sees the boat and Antrasthasis so he goes to Enki and confronts him for warning him.

Enki then works out a deal with Enlil that only two thirds of women will be able to give birth, as demon of sorts will come and snatch the babies away.










  • 05.01.2004 3:59 PM PDT
Subject: Enkidu - Cortana Letters Revisted?
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These are some random thoughts that may, or may not, have any further implication on this, or the HALO series in general.

If you look The Flood, MC knows instinctually how to operate the light bridge. He doesn't know how he knows, but he just knows. Now, take this information, and apply it to everything that we've seen thusfar. Everybody seems to ignore this one detail, and even though it only appears briefly, a lot of detail is put into it. Add in the fact that the alien artifact that he found in The Fall of Reach and the symbols are instinctually familiar, but he can't put a link to those familiar feelings.

Perhaps the Forerunners used humans as labor or something. Now, having to train stupid labor is, well, stupid. Pardon me if I'm stealing a bit from Snow Crash, but what if they programmed basic things into the human (or pre-human) brain? "Hit this button to do this." These could have stayed in there for generations. Who knows? They may have wanted the humans to "reclaim" the legacy of the Forerunners. Now, since AIs are based off of a human brain, some of this may carry over.

Of course, the timeframe is a little off. That would mess with a lot of human history. Well, as we know it. Then again, I could just be reading too much into this.

Now that we have that speculation out of the way, Enkidu still has a definate touch here. After all, Enkidu is the expert on the Sumarian legends, and I doubt that an alien AI, even if it took him (Yes, I like Enkidu too much for it not to be personalized as a "he" dangit!) over, would have the same fondness as Enkidu. Naming isn't just random, it helps to define who, and what, and AI will be. This does not mean that he hasn't been tainted, and transformed into something else.

Just something for you all to much on.

  • 05.01.2004 4:14 PM PDT
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Damn You Nylund! We know it's you! Come out of your little hidey-hole and tell us EVERYTHING

  • 05.01.2004 4:19 PM PDT
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You know, it's possible that even Dietz doesn't know what'sgoing on. Maybe Bungie them exactly what to do, but not why.


And we can't rule out the possibility that this is some elaborate fan-fic from Louis Wu and HBO. He may have even planned it himself. Maybe. But until they prove that, I have a strange feeling that Enkidu will be a character in Halo 2, that we have not met yet. And if they release anything else, it's going to start providing more questions than answers, leaving us even more baffled in the end. And with the addition of the forerunner artifact that messes with time, we can't leave out the possibility of time travel, or even the flood...

Here's a big mystery. Enkidu says, "I haven't felt like this since the week Shamhat and I... but that would be gossiping, too." They had sex. No other way around it, Shamhat was a harlot from ancient Summarian mythology and had such dealings with Enkidu. But the Enkidu we know is an AI...

  • 05.01.2004 4:35 PM PDT
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Talking of which have people seen the new entry?
EDIT: Oops, sorry

[Edited on 5/1/2004 4:40:22 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 4:37 PM PDT
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Again, The Flood (the book) provides us with a possible answer. If an AI is named after a figure in history, including myth, they tend to think of themselves as such. At least, I think it's that book. That's the only one I can't find.

  • 05.01.2004 4:46 PM PDT
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This is a collection of quotes that seem to tie in with
my earlier theory of the Forerunner's relation to
Greek Myth. All quotes from the Myth of Prometheus
are copywrited matieral and belong to the Order of
Prometheus and/or Roger Pray.(I'm not sure if I had
to mention that but it's better safe than sorry.)

EDIT-Important Notes:
-To better understand this post, or if you're simply
wondering what the heck I'm talking about, go
here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deucalion
(hopefully the link works)
-Prometheus is translated as "forethought," hence
the symbolism with the forerunner. Prometheus
created men in his own image according to the
myth. He also bestowed men with civilization, or
technology in Forerunner terms.
Prometheus="good"
-Zeus thought men were disrespectful, wild
creatures that did not deserve to be civilized, or
rather could not be civilized. Zeus="bad"
-The Greek Gods symbolize the Forerunner,
so they would be divided on the issue whether
men are capable of civilization or not, like Zeus
and Prometheus were.
-The Myth of Deucalion and the Flood relates
to the Master Chief because like Deucalion, MC
faces the flood threat and is responsible for
saving human kind.
-Also, Deucalion is the son of Prometheus. This
may explain the Master Chief's apparent prior
knowlege on how to work the Forerunner terminals
on Halo.

When reading remember that Prometheus is a
symbol of the "good" Forerunner that wishes men
to prosper, and Zeus is a symbol of the "bad"
Forerunner that wish to deny Men civilization.

1.) "Prometheus took some of this earth, and kneading
it up with water, made man in the image of the gods."
-Bulfinch's Mythology (Bulfinch.org)

If Prometheus is the symbolic representation of the
"good" Forerunner, or Anunnaki as Enkidu may have
meant, then this is possibly a clue to that the humans
might be the Forerunner, or VERY similar.

2.)"Zeus was angered by the brother's actions, he
forbade the pair from teaching Man the ways of
civilization, Athena chose to cross Zeus and taught
Prometheus so that he might teach Man."
-The Order of Prometheus/Roger Pray

Zeus represents the "bad" Forerunner, and does
not wish to give man civilation. Maybe the bad
Forerunner feared that man could equal their tech?

3.)"Upon reaching the lands of Men, Prometheus
gave to them the coals, breaking Zeus' order by
giving fire to Man." -The Order of Prometheus/Roger Pray

The good Forerunner give man the beginnings of
technology, furthuring their civilization.(Can anyone
tie this in to Enkidu?)

4.)"Zeus gathered the gifts of the Gods and created
Pandora and her box, into the box he placed all the
horors of the world. Pandora was sent to Prometheus
as a gift from Zeus himself."
-The Order of Prometheus/Roger Pray

"Horrors of the world?" The Flood maybe?

5.)"Zeus offered to free Prometheus if he would tell the
secret of the prophecy that told of the dethroning of Zeus
one day, Prometheus refused. The mother of Prometheus,
the Nymph Asia, also had the gift of Foresight and went
to Zeus and told him the secret of the prophecy. The
prophecy told that the offspring of Zeus and the Nymph
Clymene would one day rise up and destroy Zeus and
Gods."-The Order of Prometheus/Roger Pray

Could the Covies be the symbolic "offspring" of the bad
Forerunner? If so, then some interesing things will
happen in Halo 2 indeed...

6.)"Zeus sent Heracles to free Prometheus from the rock,
but required that Prometheus still be bound to the rock
for the rest of eternity. A link of the chain he had been
bound with was set with a chip of the rock and
Prometheus was required to carry it with him always.
Men also created rings with stones and gems set into
them to commiserate with him and to honor Prometheus
for the actions he had taken on their behalf."
-The Order of Prometheus/Roger Pray

Rings to commiserate? This one speaks for itself.







[Edited on 5/1/2004 8:02:35 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 4:57 PM PDT
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Wow you guys know your -blam!- dont you?
To be honest, it's so much now that it's become unreadable

  • 05.01.2004 5:00 PM PDT
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I agree. I think that we may need a restatement of basics, because I've had to reread this thread a few times myself in order to keep up. That's a LOT of reading! Besides, simple reviewals sometimes provide a person with new insights.

  • 05.01.2004 5:04 PM PDT
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Dagoonite,

You're right, we've been discussing this
for a while now, and there is A LOT of
stuff here, but to be honest, almost all
of it is good information that would take
us just as long to tell over again. If you have
any specific questions however, I'd be happy
to answer them if I can.

  • 05.01.2004 5:10 PM PDT
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WOW... 59 posts since I was last on 9 hours ago... nice work

My Postion: it's my belief that Enkidu hasn't merged with another AI but simply gone a little nutty with the information overload when connected to the Forerunner systems.

I posted something about page 12/13 that you guys seem to have missed during your recent speculation... (I think it was on the Blast from the Past analysis)

- I speculated that Enkidu still believe's itself to be JD's friend... but thinks that JD is following the wrong path and working against himself...

This may have been skiped because it's stupid... but it's relevant to the who's good who's bad theorys

Another titbit that I noticed was when JD reads the captains mail... We knew that Captain Terry Mathers and a skeleton crew (including JD) were going to perform a slingshot around the primary sun - we also know that there was a boarding action by the covies - which makes me wonder how many are still alive on the UNSC Lebanon....
- JD reading Cap's mail = Captain is dead (and Marge a widow)
- If the Cap is dead and the AI on Frigid... who is piloting the UNSC Lebanon?
- leads me to think JD is more or less alone up there...
- and JD is looking more like a high ranking soldier/intellegence officer or Spartan

let the specualtion run as rampant as Enkidu...



[Edited on 5/1/2004 5:15:58 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 5:12 PM PDT
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Here's my question then:
Can you summarise EVERYTHING that's been talked about here, or at leas the best ideas, into something short? Including what updates have been seen on that thing, so that people know where they are,

  • 05.01.2004 5:15 PM PDT
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remember the 3 spartans that were not on reach maybe the letters are to one or all of them

  • 05.01.2004 5:15 PM PDT
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Whether Enkidu is good or bad is very much
a mystery, but I agree that Enkidu is still a
friend. I apolizgize if you said this already
GOD Halo Fan, but Enkidu rewrote the story
of Gilgamesh and said that he wept for his
friend, meaning he has compassion. Perhaps
the rampant version of Enkidu is merely
using a more forceful method of encouragement.
Kind of like how a coach yells obscenities at his
players in crunch time. Also the tone in "It's A Cold
Day Here In Hell" seems supportive of JD.

EDIT: In response to Mad Conquerer,
No, it would be really hard to summarize
everything in this thread because it
branches off so much, but if you skim
through and read what interests you,
Im sure you can catch up.

[Edited on 5/1/2004 5:27:00 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 5:24 PM PDT
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Hey guys I think that i found a clue that these Enkidu letters are real.

If you go the the bungie webcams which I have put right here: http://www.bungie.net/Inside/Page.aspx?section=WebCams&su bsection=Main&page=1, the Halo bible is sitting right there is the middle camera's frame! It looks like it is at one of the desk that are in the top camera's frame. Whoever's desk that is, it looks like they have been referencing the HALO story bible to post these Enkidu Letters.

I think that they have done this to give us a clue that the Enkidu terminal is real.

  • 05.01.2004 5:59 PM PDT
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Posted by: MoDaConQuErOr
Here's my question then:
Can you summarise EVERYTHING that's been talked about here, or at leas the best ideas, into something short? Including what updates have been seen on that thing, so that people know where they are,


not really possible at the moment... as soon as you finished there would be more screens... more info... different spin on previous theorys...

check out what Hamish did for the Cortana Letters after the tru7h was revealed... I can see something similar happening after the tru7h is revealed for the Enkidu Terminals

[Edited on 5/1/2004 6:16:44 PM]

  • 05.01.2004 6:15 PM PDT