Halo: Reach Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: the H3 BR is perfectly balanced
  • Subject: the H3 BR is perfectly balanced

Halo 2 BR is the only way to go.

  • 07.21.2009 12:11 PM PDT
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Despite the fact that the Halo 3 BR is far worse than the Halo 2 BR, I'll agree with any forum post that is in any support of the BR right now because I'm deathly afraid that Bungie will decide cutting the weapon out of Reach is a good idea.

God knows they seem to think that the casual community knows Halo better that the people who have played their series since Halo 1.

  • 07.21.2009 12:16 PM PDT

Doc: "i'm a pacifist"
Caboose: "your a thing that babies suck on?"
Tucker: "no dude, that's a pedephile"
Church: "tucker, i think he means a pacifier"

Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
Posted by: SweetTRIX
Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
the BR is not balanced for Halo3 gameplay. If it was you would notice a great mixture of weapon use, but you don't. People will stay in situations that allow them to capitolize on their BR, because it's so effective.

this is the part that really makes me shake my head

you dont notice a lot of weapons being used bcuz they are ALL CQC WEAPONS AND THE GAME IS CENTERED ON MID RANGE COMBAT


if there was a bunch of mid range weapons you would see tons of weapon variety


Then why aren't there nearly as many kills with Carbines as there are with BR's on maps which have both available? Please explain, I look forward to it.


bcuz they are just as effective as each other but people are more comfortable with the BR bcuz they are used to how it fires

so they will choose to use a BR over the carbine

not rocket science


If they were just as effective as eachother there would be no preference, please better explain you POV or stop presenting it. The Carbine is harder to use because of it's single shot placement, hence the preference of most people with the BR (see an explanation).

I know a few people that prefer the Carbine because if you are a good shot, it is better than the BR (according to them). The BR is an ease of use weapon from everything i've seen, read and experienced.

  • 07.21.2009 12:16 PM PDT

Doc: "i'm a pacifist"
Caboose: "your a thing that babies suck on?"
Tucker: "no dude, that's a pedephile"
Church: "tucker, i think he means a pacifier"

Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
your idea of gameplay balance literally makes no sense at all

Insult me all you want dude (the pop-up book crack was cute), that doesn't take away from the fact that your arguement is your opinion. Everything I've said is based off of a ton of community feedback and debate. Whether you want to believe it or not i've been in more of these BR threads than day's you've had this b.net account. I've even changed by POV on the subject as time has gone by because of people presenting solid arguements that are backed up by more than their own personal feelings.

Power and effectiveness do not equal balance, that is the bottom line. You want to keep spouting out FPS are predominantly mid-range games, but Halo wasn't like that until the BR came about, so you tell me was the BR balanced for Halo, or has Halo been changed to suit the BR?

Keep taking shots at my "flawed logic", most of what you say shows very little experience and very little insight to anything outside of your scope of preference.


the fact alone that you cannot recognizer this as an alt account shows you have limited knowledge of the working of these forums

but Halo wasn't like that until the BR came about,

like clockwork this point always comes around and shows where your faulty logic spouts from

the BR type weapon has been part of halo since day one

period


I'm quite aware it's a second account, I used the comparison because you've had it for 17 days, and i've taken part in more than a few dozen debates on this topic. All you've proved with your remark is that you are still not reading.

Halo has never been about a BR type weapon until the BR was made. Halo CE had a pistol, which wasn't a BR type weapon. It was a single shot weapon that could outshoot the sniper, and actually required aiming and did not allow for sweeping or spray and pray. Can't really call it a mid-range weapon when (for whatever reason) it was effective at all ranges.

In regards to your shots at my skill level and how pointless it is to debate skill with "a major grade 2", your proving more about yourself then you are about me. That is such a typical cop-out response on these forums. All it does is mask that you have no strong counter arguement against the BR being highly used due to it's ease of use, hardly what I would call a skillfull weapon. I didn't say that there is no difference between a skilled BR user and a typical BR user, that is an entirely different arguement all together. What I said was you don't have to be great at Halo to be good with a BR, big difference.

Although it doesn't really matter, the rank has nothing to do with a persons experience, for the record I am a LAN player, I hate xbl Halo because it isn't about skill, it's about exploits and better connections. I know what I know because I spend a lot of time on these forums (workplace boredom) and as mentioned, talked about this subject with several people that have different, well founded opinions.

In regards to naming an FPS that isn't based off of mid-range combat, it's an easy answer, non of them are. The designers can make a game with whatever intent they desire, it's the players that set the tone. If FPS games were made with mid-range as the focus there would be less weapons that excell at short range. I would bet my next pay check that Bungie had no intent of making either Halo2 or 3 to be streamlined BR fests, but that's where the players took it. Halo3 as of now is about mid-range, and once again (for the learning impared) it is that way because of the BR, not the other way around.

Bottom line, your personal shots at me are sad, and take away from you arguement.

  • 07.21.2009 12:35 PM PDT

Doc: "i'm a pacifist"
Caboose: "your a thing that babies suck on?"
Tucker: "no dude, that's a pedephile"
Church: "tucker, i think he means a pacifier"

Posted by: Napoleon Complex
Despite the fact that the Halo 3 BR is far worse than the Halo 2 BR, I'll agree with any forum post that is in any support of the BR right now because I'm deathly afraid that Bungie will decide cutting the weapon out of Reach is a good idea.

God knows they seem to think that the casual community knows Halo better that the people who have played their series since Halo 1.


I find that funny since there are several Halo CE fans that cannot stand what the BR has done to Halo gameplay, check the Halo CE forums. The BR was not a replacement for the pistol, in any way, it was a more reasonable weapon (a pistol should not be that awesome) but it was far more usefull then it should have been.

I use the BR all the time, that's not the issue behind my arguement. The issue is balance, not preference.

  • 07.21.2009 12:39 PM PDT

Doc: "i'm a pacifist"
Caboose: "your a thing that babies suck on?"
Tucker: "no dude, that's a pedephile"
Church: "tucker, i think he means a pacifier"

Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
bcuz they are just as effective as each other but people are more comfortable with the BR bcuz they are used to how it fires

so they will choose to use a BR over the carbine

not rocket science [/quote]

If they were just as effective as eachother there would be no preference, please better explain you POV or stop presenting it. The Carbine is harder to use because of it's single shot placement, hence the preference of most people with the BR (see an explanation).

I know a few people that prefer the Carbine because if you are a good shot, it is better than the BR (according to them). The BR is an ease of use weapon from everything i've seen, read and experienced.[/quote]

single shot is irrelevant...it has a much higher ROF



How is that irrelevant to a persons preference? It has a huge impact on shot placement, and requires one to aim more steadily than they need to with a BR, that's a pretty big contributing factor.

  • 07.21.2009 12:40 PM PDT

Doc: "i'm a pacifist"
Caboose: "your a thing that babies suck on?"
Tucker: "no dude, that's a pedephile"
Church: "tucker, i think he means a pacifier"

Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
Posted by: SweetTRIX
Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
your idea of gameplay balance literally makes no sense at all

Insult me all you want dude (the pop-up book crack was cute), that doesn't take away from the fact that your arguement is your opinion. Everything I've said is based off of a ton of community feedback and debate. Whether you want to believe it or not i've been in more of these BR threads than day's you've had this b.net account. I've even changed by POV on the subject as time has gone by because of people presenting solid arguements that are backed up by more than their own personal feelings.

Power and effectiveness do not equal balance, that is the bottom line. You want to keep spouting out FPS are predominantly mid-range games, but Halo wasn't like that until the BR came about, so you tell me was the BR balanced for Halo, or has Halo been changed to suit the BR?

Keep taking shots at my "flawed logic", most of what you say shows very little experience and very little insight to anything outside of your scope of preference.


the fact alone that you cannot recognizer this as an alt account shows you have limited knowledge of the working of these forums

but Halo wasn't like that until the BR came about,

like clockwork this point always comes around and shows where your faulty logic spouts from

the BR type weapon has been part of halo since day one

period


I'm quite aware it's a second account, I used the comparison because you've had it for 17 days, and i've taken part in more than a few dozen debates on this topic. All you've proved with your remark is that you are still not reading.

Halo has never been about a BR type weapon until the BR was made. Halo CE had a pistol, which wasn't a BR type weapon. It was a single shot weapon that could outshoot the sniper, and actually required aiming and did not allow for sweeping or spray and pray. Can't really call it a mid-range weapon when (for whatever reason) it was effective at all ranges.

In regards to your shots at my skill level and how pointless it is to debate skill with "a major grade 2", your proving more about yourself then you are about me. That is such a typical cop-out response on these forums. All it does is mask that you have no strong counter arguement against the BR being highly used due to it's ease of use, hardly what I would call a skillfull weapon. I didn't say that there is no difference between a skilled BR user and a typical BR user, that is an entirely different arguement all together. What I said was you don't have to be great at Halo to be good with a BR, big difference.

Although it doesn't really matter, the rank has nothing to do with a persons experience, for the record I am a LAN player, I hate xbl Halo because it isn't about skill, it's about exploits and better connections. I know what I know because I spend a lot of time on these forums (workplace boredom) and as mentioned, talked about this subject with several people that have different, well founded opinions.

In regards to naming an FPS that isn't based off of mid-range combat, it's an easy answer, non of them are. The designers can make a game with whatever intent they desire, it's the players that set the tone. If FPS games were made with mid-range as the focus there would be less weapons that excell at short range. I would bet my next pay check that Bungie had no intent of making either Halo2 or 3 to be streamlined BR fests, but that's where the players took it. Halo3 as of now is about mid-range, and once again (for the learning impared) it is that way because of the BR, not the other way around.

Bottom line, your personal shots at me are sad, and take away from you arguement.


you do realise that the HCE pistol had higher auto aim and bullet magnetism than the H3 BR and had a random spread

right?

as far as your the BR is easy to use point....simple response..why are most low ranked players TOD list usually topped by the AR and melee then

if it is an easier weapon to use then the CQC weapons then why do newer players gravitate towards the CQC weapons?


Your splitting hairs dude, easy to use doesn't mean easiest to use. While being a bit harder to use than an AR it isn't as hard to use as a Carbine or a Sniper Rifle. Perhaps easy was the wrong word, but it certainly isn't hard, and I have never felt it to be a skilled weapon. If it was a "skilled" weapon as you say the pool of those that use it would be smaller, making a bigger group relying on the AR. Not to mention a newer player may not be aware of the advantage offered by a BR, as I said, it is a trend set by the players. After awhile many acclimate BR gameplay, which is why it continues to be very popular. We can go in circles about this all day.

I never bolstered the pistols ease or difficulty of use against the BR, I simply stated that the pistol was not a BR type weapon, their effectiveness was totally different in their respective games, which has just as much to do with map design as it does with weapon balance. There is no point continuing this debate with you if your not going to read what i'm actually saying.

  • 07.21.2009 12:56 PM PDT

Doc: "i'm a pacifist"
Caboose: "your a thing that babies suck on?"
Tucker: "no dude, that's a pedephile"
Church: "tucker, i think he means a pacifier"

Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
Posted by: SweetTRIX
Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
bcuz they are just as effective as each other but people are more comfortable with the BR bcuz they are used to how it fires

so they will choose to use a BR over the carbine

not rocket science [/quote]

If they were just as effective as eachother there would be no preference, please better explain you POV or stop presenting it. The Carbine is harder to use because of it's single shot placement, hence the preference of most people with the BR (see an explanation).

I know a few people that prefer the Carbine because if you are a good shot, it is better than the BR (according to them). The BR is an ease of use weapon from everything i've seen, read and experienced.[/quote]

single shot is irrelevant...it has a much higher ROF



How is that irrelevant to a persons preference? It has a huge impact on shot placement, and requires one to aim more steadily than they need to with a BR, that's a pretty big contributing factor.


no

you can actually completely miss shots with the carbine and outgun someone who either missed half burst or was a victim of the spread and had perfect aim


Depends on the shooter, but your right, however the capability to do so obviously doesn't weigh in on peoples preference, otherwise it would be the darling weapon, not the BR. This still doesn't support your "because their essentially the same" theory. A weapons role doesn't play into how it handles, and why people prefer it.

  • 07.21.2009 12:58 PM PDT

Team Fortress 2 does arcade balance based on range pretty good. Maybe Bungie can take a few pointers on map design, range and accuracy. Of course, the maps are segmented in a way to where weapons fall into the proper range. Where Halo has always had huge open sight lines and maps like Sandtrap.

  • 07.21.2009 1:11 PM PDT

Challenge me to a Hawaiian Punch chugging contest. I dare you.


Posted by: mubox47
$.50 in store credit.

Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
Posted by: The EAKLE
ok heres the bottom line OP

20 pages...20 pages of people argueing with you...obviously theres a lot of people that like the status quo


its not changing
First post of yours i found in my thread. It disproves nothing, because in those twenty pages multiple people agreed that the BR should be altered.




lots of people agree..lots of people think it should stay the same...and if you go read the only BR theres lots of people think it should be stronger

again the status quo seems to fall right were everyone can accept it


and STIS is also me if youre looking thru your thread for my posts


Posted by: STiS
omfg

yes lets eliminate mid range combat what a great idea

facepalm


Posted by: STiS
honestly this is the stupidest thing i have ever read

OP all your points are based on the false logic that HCE had no BR

a dat dat HELLO...the pistol was the BR smarts


ya youre right the H3 BR is not balanced

the H2 BR was

if you suck at the game you should get owned by better players

theres a ranking system and MM...improve that stop holding bad players hands

and the OP responded rudely to the first few posts that i read so he does not get5 any common courtesy

Right there you say the H3 BR is not balanced.



thats halo gamplay...always has been always will be

its a circular weapon tree not a linear one


Posted by: STiS
Posted by: FinestCrimson
Posted by: STiS
thats halo gamplay...always has been always will be

What? Only using one weapon? In Halo 1 the pistol was used a lot but even the plasma rifle was useful. Now it is only good for taking out shields quickly, and even then not many people use it.


you didnt disprove me at all

HCE was centred around the pistol

H2-BR

H3-BR


thats halo...changing a winning formula would be retarded



if you cant understand my simple 3 words x 3 lines response then you need to get some tutoring so you can pass grade 3
I found that a little funny coming form someone that never uses punctuation.

Well, 10 pages in and that's all i've got so far. No disproving from either of your accounts yet.

  • 07.21.2009 1:15 PM PDT

Challenge me to a Hawaiian Punch chugging contest. I dare you.


Posted by: mubox47
$.50 in store credit.

Posted by: STiS
omg how is this thread still going

all the OP's points are based on faulty logic and misinformation

halo has always had a weapon that functioned like the BR...that point alone destroys the OP's arguement



OP you just got completely shat on


Posted by: STiS
People claim that teh BR is a needed weapon. That is flat out wrong. Halo: Combat Evolved was a fantastic game and it had no BR. It is often said that flag games become annoying with ARs because you cant kill the carrier from a distance, but none of these claims were made in Halo Combat Evolved because we didnt know of an unbalanced starting weapon. We did just fine with our ARs up until Halo 2.

BAM your point is moot

HCE had a BR...no it had a weapon that functioned like the BR but was even more effective

your whole OP is flawed and broken bcuz it is founded on misinformation
you almost had me! Too bad you didnt read the paragraph after that which explained why the Pistol in CE was different.

Posted by: STiS
Posted by: The EAKLE
Posted by: STiS
omg how is this thread still going

all the OP's points are based on faulty logic and misinformation

halo has always had a weapon that functioned like the BR...that point alone destroys the OP's arguement
Would it be too much to ask you to either actually contribute to the discussion, or not post?


your OP is a non started for a discussion...there is no discussion in this thread

there are people condemning your retarded logic and you denying it and then other people bumping it by having their own side discussions


Posted by: STiS
Posted by: FinestCrimson
Posted by: STiS
omg how is this thread still going

all the OP's points are based on faulty logic and misinformation

halo has always had a weapon that functioned like the BR...that point alone destroys the OP's arguement

He isn't suggesting that there shouldn't be a weapon like the BR, but one that replaces it and is more balanced (or if Bungie can, make the BR balanced).


ITS IS BALANCED

if anything it is underpowered for what it is....A UTILITARIAN WEAPON

its not just a weapon that fills some tiny niche in a linear weapon system

the fact that there is a utilitarian weapon is what makes halo MP gameplay unique...its what makes it halo



Posted by: STiS
Posted by: SlayPoX
If you want to remove the BR, go play another game seriously



exactly

honestly you people need to stop bending bungie's arm

halo has slowly but surely been creeping back to FPS 101 boring old linear weapon progression

its destroying what halo is


Posted by: STiS
Posted by: FinestCrimson

You are right, there is always a "well-rounded" weapon in Halo, but in Halo 1 a lot of the other weapons were still effective (a great example being the plasma rifle) and the gameplay was still great.


yes i completely agree

the problem with the sandbox now isnt the BR being overpowered its other weapons being underpowered

a lot of the weapons in this game are pretty much useless bcuz both the BR and the AR are better in practically every situation



yeas but your logic for removing it is completely faulty and almost laughable

Even though you still haven't proved it wrong. . .


uh....thats exactly how h3 works with the BR instead of the pistol

Three more pages, still not proven to be a giant fail.

Posted by: STiS
Posted by: The EAKLE
Posted by: STiS



the plasma rifle was perfectly balanced in HCE...just make it more like that
What about the SMG, and Spiker? They will become more powerful, and they were not in CE. What can we base them on? What about Bruteshots, maulers, hammers, and swords? This is not Halo: Combat evolved, so we can not turn to that for all our answers.


ugh you missed the point

im just saying...increasing the damage is not the only way to make a weapon more effective


That's all of them. page 14 has some posts by you, but none prove me wrong. So, you haven't proved my post is a logical failure, and you use absolutely nothing to back yours up.

[Edited on 07.21.2009 1:32 PM PDT]

  • 07.21.2009 1:24 PM PDT
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

if u want to be pro or anywhere close, learn to br, and also the sniper is good at any range depending on ur skill. i guarantee at close range i can snipe punch any ar noobs.

  • 07.21.2009 1:28 PM PDT

Blackness Confirmed. You've got soul.


The Ultimate Opinion.

How about we let bungie decide what they want to do and stop making <3 BR threads and "There better be a BR in H:Reach!" threads. Lets stay focus on the game, not if it will have a weapon or not, or if it will be balanced or not.

  • 07.21.2009 1:36 PM PDT

Challenge me to a Hawaiian Punch chugging contest. I dare you.


Posted by: mubox47
$.50 in store credit.

Posted by: LordAustin16
How about we let bungie decide what they want to do and stop making <3 BR threads and "There better be a BR in H:Reach!" threads. Lets stay focus on the game, not if it will have a weapon or not, or if it will be balanced or not.
I dont see an issue with making suggestions, all though the BR threads seem to be getting out of hand.

  • 07.21.2009 1:38 PM PDT

Posted by: The EAKLE
Posted by: LordAustin16
How about we let bungie decide what they want to do and stop making <3 BR threads and "There better be a BR in H:Reach!" threads. Lets stay focus on the game, not if it will have a weapon or not, or if it will be balanced or not.
I dont see an issue with making suggestions, all though the BR threads seem to be getting out of hand.


Well. Suggestions are nice, but we don't want Bungie to get confused. The Halo Combat Evolved, Halo 2, and Halo 3 fans all played different games, and have different opinions on what the game should be. Same with players of other FPS games. That's what I think happened when they changed Halo 3 to appease Halo Combat Evolved fans more by adding weapon leads back in during Halo 3. Halo 2 fans didn't seem to like the new weapon leads, and people still run around with basic point and shoot skills without taking lead into account. I think Bungie learned it's lesson though. You can't seem to please everyone. So might as well do research into weapon balance, and do what comes to mind.

  • 07.21.2009 1:45 PM PDT
  •  | 
  • Exalted Mythic Member
  • gamertag: Naqser
  • user homepage:

Join the Sphere

Read about my gaming here.

Posted by: ODST is a SCAM
Posted by: Naqser
Eat 20 strawberries every day for a year, and you'll eventually get tired of them.

That's how it is with the BR for me. It's the same freaking weapon all the time. BR BR BR BR BR BR BR BR!

Yes, it is a good weapon, but it gets repetative. Atleast they could reskin it.

The problem with presenting more weapons that are like a BR, is that it won't matter what gun you use then, they are all the same, only different skins. Bungie would need to be innovative and stuff, but it's not easy presenting a new weapon in a prequel, as it won't be in the sequels.

They had the Plasma Freeze in Halo CE. The needler is really fun and original, the Plasma Pistol has its uses, drop shields, stop vehicles.

Get more effects in there that could counter the BR, and I'd be a happy man. Well, I'll be a happy man anyway.

Or just have less BRs on the maps. Even though people are going to cry.


if you want less BR you need more mid range weapons

you cant just remove the BR...bcuz then youre removing mid range combat


Didn't you read or didn't you understand?

If you think you understood, please do explain what you think I said.

  • 07.21.2009 1:50 PM PDT