Halo: Reach Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: Possible reach story (referring to books and halo 1)
  • Subject: Possible reach story (referring to books and halo 1)
Subject: Possible reach story (referring to books and halo 1)

i dont agree with the time travel theories if im honest (it does look like a shield world to me at the end of halo 3), but has anybody pointed out that MC has already travelled back in time in one of the books.

i believe its in first strike? but after the destruction of the first halo, johnson, john and linda etc travel back to reach in the acendant justice, and experience a slipspace time event which seems to send them back, at which point they join up with halsey and other spartans to rescue them. They they head back to earth to warn people of the halos..

it was confusing to me at first but i read this information first on the halostory.bungie timeline page.. it points out events that loop back.. i originally read that john was with halsey on reach, when that time was in fact after he had left for the halo, and before he had destroyed it, pointing out that he had in fact gone back in time...

Now while another remote possibility, it may be that Reach is set between 1 and 2, and in fact deals with the events after jumping into slipspace and encountering this time travel effect. it may be possible that the spartans depicted here are the remaining few spartans AFTER the battle of reach, as depicted in the books. linda is noted as still alive (in a cryo pod) fred and james and kelly are all also still alive at this point (james only possibly as he was floating in space, yet only assumed dead), as is MC.

the only problem with this theory being that no spartan in the image resembles MC.

as there are scenes of reach under seige, its possible that either the story is set up by events before halo on reach, or it moves from before, to after, to before the events of halo 1.

This is honestly the most comprehendable scenario i can think of, and combines both prequel, and time travel, while leaving the ending to halo 3 and the shield world out of the equasion.

Any opinions????

[Edited on 08.06.2009 5:07 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2009 5:22 PM PDT

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He didnt travel back in time. The crystal altered the PoA's time in slipspace as well as the events at Halo, so they were all done by September 7th (when Fred and co. found it on Reach), due to an effect called time dilation.

The closer to the speed of light you go, the slower time is for you in your little "bubble" even though nothing in the "real world" is changed. For a good example of this, check out Dragonball Z's Room of Spirit and Time/Hyperbolic Time Chamber. They enter it and train for 1 year inside, but only 1 day passes in the "real world."

EX. you leave Earth at the speed of light and travel for a month, you come back basically the same age. But on Earth, 20 years might have gone by, and some of your friends may be dead.

So the PoA's computers believed that all the time had passes since it technically did for them, in their little bubble, but in the "real world" it was only September 7th. They returned to Reach in 20 hours whereas the trip should have taken around 20 days.

[Edited on 08.05.2009 5:40 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2009 5:33 PM PDT

Didn't they test this IRL and it works...several seconds though(just like they can make microscopic things invisible). In 100 years this world will be alot worse than the halo universes problems.

  • 08.05.2009 5:37 PM PDT

2552
Aug 30
"The remaining SPARTANS are divided into two teams: Red and Blue. John and the rest of Blue team (Linda and James), while on an orbital mission to ensure that a NAV database stays out of Covenant hands, end up onboard the Pillar of Autumn when she jumps away from the Reach system to evade Covenant forces. James is lost and Linda is mortally wounded, and the subsequent mission on Halo is left to the Master Chief to complete. "


this section shows when johns mission is completed and they initially jump to the first halo



2552
Sep 4
"Lieutenant Wagner returns to Earth and reports on the evident destruction of Reach to Colonel Ackerson, Admiral Hood, and General Strauss at an ONI facility in Sydney, Australia."


Reach has been destroyed and reported



2552
Sep 7
" The Time/Date Record Anomaly of Sep 23, 2552 most likely rejoins the timeline here. Dr. Halsey and members of Red team discover an enigmatic shard in an ancient installation below the ONI facility. Blue team (JOHNS TEAM) joins with team Gamma to retrieve Admiral Whitcomb, and rejoin the rest of Red team who have been besieged by the Covenant, who apparently revere the artifact that the humans have found. Dr. Halsey destroys ONI's underground facility CASTLE BASE on Reach, preventing the Covenant from gaining control of its secrets.


time anomaly and blue team join back


Unknown
The remaining Spartans, Admiral Whitcomb, Dr. Halsey, Sgt. Johnson, Lieutenant Haverson, Warrant Officer Polaski, and Corporal Locklear jump to Slipspace on board the Covenant/Human hybrid ship Gettysburg/Ascendant Justice, and discover that the shard seems to have the ability to bend both space and time.


everybody at this time including johnson and john etc slipspace back to earth for warning BEFORE SEP 12


2552
Sep 12
The Gettysburg/Ascendant Justice arrives for refit and provisioning in Eridanus system and meets with the rebels under Governor Jiles. Dr. Halsey sedates Spartan 087, Kelly, and absconds with her on Governor Jiles ship (the Beatrice), a Chiroptera-class vessel, the smallest UNSC classification that contains an SFTE. Before she goes, she gives the alien artifact to Corporal Locklear, with implicit instructions to destroy it.


merged ship with ascendant justice (which was at first halo un merged days later)


2552
Sep
13 Admiral Whitcomb and Lieutenant Haverson destroy the majority of the surrounding Covenant fleet by detonating the Unyielding Hierophant. John, Linda, Will, and Fred, the last known remaining Spartans, along with Sgt. Johnson, and, of course, Cortana, depart for Earth to warn of the impending Covenant invasion.


spartans together including john, yet at this point he is supposed to be en route to the halo on pillar of autumn.


2552
Sep 19
The Pillar Of Autumn arrives at Halo. A company of Orbital Drop Shock Troopers (UNSC Naval Special Forces) led by Major Antonio Silva and his second in command, Lieutenant Mellisa McKay land on Halo via 'Human Entry Vehicles' and establish an operational firebase situated near a mesa a few kilometers away from the Pillar of Autmun's crash site. Alpha Base, as it was designated, had been supplied and heavily fortified with what remained of the Pillar of Autmun's arsenal.


Believing that the Master Chief was hiding out at Alpha Base, Covenant ground and aerial forces commanded by Zuka 'Zamamee and Noga 'Putumee attack the base in an effort to capture the Chief. The attack fails and the base is held by Major Silva.

events of halo occur starting here


2552
Sep 22
The Master Chief and Cortana, onboard a Longsword in the debris field of the destroyed Halo, find one remaining Pelican containing Sgt. Johnson, Lieutenant Haverson, Warrant Officer Polaski, Corporal Locklear, and a set of cryotubes containing Spartan 058, Linda.


linda in cryotube (damaged before halo when left reach) however you see a few days before she was active with the rest of the spartans AFTER the events which immobilised her


2552
Sep 23
The Master Chief, Cortana, Linda, Polaski, Sgt. Johnson, Haverson, and Locklear depart for Reach via Slipspace aboard the Covenant Flagship Ascendant Justice, captured near the Halo debris field.
A Time/Date Record Anomaly continues from this point in the narrative, resolved above on Sep 7, 2552.

ascendant justice not merged with gettysburg here, even though this days AFTER merge occurs in timeline



So as you can see, this leads me to believe they do in fact travel in time back to before the events of halo, or during at least, and the story leads from there, which also goes along the lines of why they got back so early even though it should have taken longer, therefore managing to warn earth sooner.

While in effect they didnt jump through time, time shifts did occur.. whatever you want to call it, the fact remains that they were only gone for a fraction of the time it had seemed, and were able to "effectively" travel in time.

[Edited on 08.05.2009 5:58 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2009 5:55 PM PDT

Come on guys i would really like some opinions on this stuff. i believe its a good theory.. and a good setting for a story

  • 08.05.2009 6:24 PM PDT

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Posted by: Basic1
Come on guys i would really like some opinions on this stuff. i believe its a good theory.. and a good setting for a story
There was no time travel. The crystal causes Time Dilation

Time dilation is the phenomenon whereby an observer finds that another's clock, which is physically identical to their own, is ticking at a slower rate as measured by their own clock. This is often interpreted as time "slowing down" for the other clock, but that is only true in the context of the observer's frame of reference. Locally (i.e., from the perspective of any observer within the same frame of reference, without reference to another frame of reference), time always passes at the same rate. The time dilation phenomenon applies to any process that manifests change over time.

Meaning the events of Halo 1 all played out in a slowed "time bubble" where locally, about 20 days passed, but externally, in the "real world" (Earth, Reach, everything but Halo and the surrounding area) time went by normally, and it was only September 7th by the time the Chief left Halo and returned to the source of the time dilation, the crystal on Reach.

The planet at the end of Halo 3 looks absolutely nothing like Reach, so he's somewhere else.

[Edited on 08.05.2009 6:55 PM PDT]

  • 08.05.2009 6:54 PM PDT

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: Basic1
Come on guys i would really like some opinions on this stuff. i believe its a good theory.. and a good setting for a story
There was no time travel. The crystal causes Time Dilation

Time dilation is the phenomenon whereby an observer finds that another's clock, which is physically identical to their own, is ticking at a slower rate as measured by their own clock. This is often interpreted as time "slowing down" for the other clock, but that is only true in the context of the observer's frame of reference. Locally (i.e., from the perspective of any observer within the same frame of reference, without reference to another frame of reference), time always passes at the same rate. The time dilation phenomenon applies to any process that manifests change over time.

Meaning the events of Halo 1 all played out in a slowed "time bubble" where locally, about 20 days passed, but externally, in the "real world" (Earth, Reach, everything but Halo and the surrounding area) time went by normally, and it was only September 7th by the time the Chief left Halo and returned to the source of the time dilation, the crystal on Reach.

The planet at the end of Halo 3 looks absolutely nothing like Reach, so he's somewhere else.
Well, how do you know what Reach looked like after it was glassed?

  • 08.05.2009 7:04 PM PDT

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Posted by: in the Krutch
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: Basic1
Come on guys i would really like some opinions on this stuff. i believe its a good theory.. and a good setting for a story
There was no time travel. The crystal causes Time Dilation

Time dilation is the phenomenon whereby an observer finds that another's clock, which is physically identical to their own, is ticking at a slower rate as measured by their own clock. This is often interpreted as time "slowing down" for the other clock, but that is only true in the context of the observer's frame of reference. Locally (i.e., from the perspective of any observer within the same frame of reference, without reference to another frame of reference), time always passes at the same rate. The time dilation phenomenon applies to any process that manifests change over time.

Meaning the events of Halo 1 all played out in a slowed "time bubble" where locally, about 20 days passed, but externally, in the "real world" (Earth, Reach, everything but Halo and the surrounding area) time went by normally, and it was only September 7th by the time the Chief left Halo and returned to the source of the time dilation, the crystal on Reach.

The planet at the end of Halo 3 looks absolutely nothing like Reach, so he's somewhere else.
Well, how do you know what Reach looked like after it was glassed?
This is Harvest, partially glassed. Reach was completely glassed by September 7, except for a small part of a single mountain chain (what John observed from space in First Strike). So there would be no blue Forerunner lights on the planet. Also, the stars are different colors.

  • 08.05.2009 7:09 PM PDT

Signatures are for squares.

Cheewawa is 100% right on this one.

  • 08.05.2009 7:27 PM PDT

i dont know why your pointing out about it not being reach, that was obvious, and was an in fact part of what i said, the end of halo 3 shows distinct forerunner symbols as seen on every forerunner installation, leading many to believe its a shield world.

my point wasnt to prove you wrong, as you are right that it is time dilation, my point was, that which ever way you look at it... it "appears" as though they time travelled, which is effectively what time dilation would seem like.. although in reality you have slowed down, it would appear to you as though you had simply travelled forward and then backward, as your local time would not change.. this is an undisputable part of the dilation theorys.

the point i was making is that to them it would seem like time travel, so in "effect" time travel has and can occur in the halo series in the form of the time dilation, so it is entirely possible that we as the master chief will now travel back from the events of halo to september 7 and rescue the other spartans on reach..

which leads me to my key point...

this is a very possible outcome for the game "HALO: REACH" and incorporates time travel theory and the planet reach, while excluding the legendary ending, to create a game scenario that is entirely possible given the circumstances that creating a book based on all of the events in fall of reach would be hard, however creating a game based on this rescue mission and possibly exerps from before, would be possible.

discuss that....

  • 08.05.2009 7:48 PM PDT

Posted by: Ushan
Because Muslims surgically implant organic bombs in their testicles, which in turn will be injected into women during sex, which will grow into BABY BOMBS!

Posted by: Basic1
i dont know why your pointing out about it not being reach, that was obvious, and was an in fact part of what i said, the end of halo 3 shows distinct forerunner symbols as seen on every forerunner installation, leading many to believe its a shield world.

my point wasnt to prove you wrong, as you are right that it is time dilation, my point was, that which ever way you look at it... it "appears" as though they time travelled, which is effectively what time dilation would seem like.. although in reality you have slowed down, it would appear to you as though you had simply travelled forward and then backward, as your local time would not change.. this is an undisputable part of the dilation theorys.

the point i was making is that to them it would seem like time travel, so in "effect" time travel has and can occur in the halo series in the form of the time dilation, so it is entirely possible that we as the master chief will now travel back from the events of halo to september 7 and rescue the other spartans on reach..

which leads me to my key point...

this is a very possible outcome for the game "HALO: REACH" and incorporates time travel theory and the planet reach, while excluding the legendary ending, to create a game scenario that is entirely possible given the circumstances that creating a book based on all of the events in fall of reach would be hard, however creating a game based on this rescue mission and possibly exerps from before, would be possible.

discuss that....


You didn't even read what MLG Cheehwawa said did you? And if you did, you clearly didn't understand.

  • 08.05.2009 8:57 PM PDT
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Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: Basic1
Come on guys i would really like some opinions on this stuff. i believe its a good theory.. and a good setting for a story
There was no time travel. The crystal causes Time Dilation

Time dilation is the phenomenon whereby an observer finds that another's clock, which is physically identical to their own, is ticking at a slower rate as measured by their own clock. This is often interpreted as time "slowing down" for the other clock, but that is only true in the context of the observer's frame of reference. Locally (i.e., from the perspective of any observer within the same frame of reference, without reference to another frame of reference), time always passes at the same rate. The time dilation phenomenon applies to any process that manifests change over time.

Meaning the events of Halo 1 all played out in a slowed "time bubble" where locally, about 20 days passed, but externally, in the "real world" (Earth, Reach, everything but Halo and the surrounding area) time went by normally, and it was only September 7th by the time the Chief left Halo and returned to the source of the time dilation, the crystal on Reach.

The planet at the end of Halo 3 looks absolutely nothing like Reach, so he's somewhere else.



Cheehwawa is quite right in his definition of time dilation. However, in order for the time/date record anomaly to correctly occur, in terms of relativistic physics, everything except the Halo part of the story reference frame would have to be moving at near relativistic speeds. This is so that only a day or so passes on Reach while several weeks pass for the Autumn, her crew and the Covenant battlegroup that followed in pursuit. And for the record, I think the people that believe the time travel theories really need to look at things in a realistic manner. I mean, the portal from Earth to the Ark enabled instantaneous travel over distance, not time.

  • 08.05.2009 10:29 PM PDT

Posted by: Tucker 051

You didn't even read what MLG Cheehwawa said did you? And if you did, you clearly didn't understand.



You clearly didnt even read what i said did you? and if you did you would understand that i know exactly what Cheehwawa was saying, and infact agreed with him, merely correcting him that time travel "theory" is involved.... time dilation fits into the category of time theory.... Dont be a moron, of course its not technically time travel, however i was explaining to others who might not understand, that this is "IN EFFECT" a "FORM" of time travel, as it "APPEARS" as though they travel forward, and then backward, in time... while no time travel occurs, it seems as though it has.

What was your point here, to try and make out as though i was wrong merely to make yourself feel high and mighty.. you should actually read all of my post and understand it before you try ang belittle me and make out I dont understand.


Also, yes i know his definitions of time dilation were right, i didn't argue against this, im just stating that for all intensive purposes it appears as though they moved through time, which leaves the possibility of time "events", shall we say, to play a part in the story of halo reach.. while i disagree with most peoples assumption that it will be after halo 3, i support the fact that it is entirely possible that some kind of time events will play a part.

now.. can we stop discussing right or wrong, which there is none of, and discuss this possible story, as per the original intent of the post.

[Edited on 08.06.2009 3:11 PM PDT]

  • 08.06.2009 3:08 PM PDT

Yet you asked for our opinion? From what you said it doesn't sound like you even read the book. Frank and James? Who the hell is frank although there is a fred.. o and don't forget James was most likely kia on the space op from reach. Also about your scenario of "time travel" it doesn't work, because if you did read the books you would know that the crystal that caused the time dialation was destroyed, except for a few fragments that the covenant found in slipspace.

edit: I just noticed that you said Keys went back to Reach.. Did you play Halo 1 or 2?

[Edited on 08.06.2009 3:53 PM PDT]

  • 08.06.2009 3:50 PM PDT

How do typos mean that i have not read the book. I wouldnt comment if i didnt know these things, i know the situations of james etc and im assuming the possibility that he can still be alive. "frank" instead of "fred" was a typo, and so was keyes, i was just reeling off characters and totally glazed over it.
'
the scenario of "time travel" which, although it isnt, yet seems like it is from certain viewpoints, is entirely possible. At this point in the story the crystal hasnt been destroyed anyway, its after the events at reach that its destroyed so this is totally irrelevant... besides this, there is the possibility of other crystals like it existing. point rendered irrelevant.

STOP picking holes and give opinions on what you think of the idea that this is when the story is set. It is entirely possible given the books, and would allow for a small group of spartans to be involved, while keeping the majority of the fall of reach book out, as well as giving a good story setting.

[Edited on 08.06.2009 5:13 PM PDT]

  • 08.06.2009 5:12 PM PDT

Posted by: Basic1
i dont agree with the time travel theories if im honest (it does look like a shield world to me at the end of halo 3), but has anybody pointed out that MC has already travelled back in time in one of the books.[WRONG]

i believe its in first strike? but after the destruction of the first halo, johnson, john and linda etc travel back to reach in the acendant justice, and experience a slipspace time event which seems to send them back, at which point they join up with halsey and other spartans to rescue them. They they head back to earth to warn people of the halos.. [WRONG]

it was confusing to me at first but i read this information first on the halostory.bungie timeline page.. it points out events that loop back.. i originally read that john was with halsey on reach, when that time was in fact after he had left for the halo, and before he had destroyed it, pointing out that he had in fact gone back in time...[WRONG]

Now while another remote possibility, it may be that Reach is set between 1 and 2, and in fact deals with the events after jumping into slipspace and encountering this time travel effect. it may be possible that the spartans depicted here are the remaining few spartans AFTER the battle of reach, as depicted in the books. linda is noted as still alive (in a cryo pod) fred and james and kelly are all also still alive at this point (james only possibly as he was floating in space, yet only assumed dead), as is MC. [WRONG]

the only problem with this theory being that no spartan in the image resembles MC.

as there are scenes of reach under seige, its possible that either the story is set up by events before halo on reach, or it moves from before, to after, to before the events of halo 1.

This is honestly the most comprehendable scenario i can think of, and combines both prequel, and time travel, while leaving the ending to halo 3 and the shield world out of the equasion.

Any opinions????


Where did you get the info... Halsey's Crystal altered slipspace so that you could travel 10x faster or something. MC mad a blind jump to Reach by following the Cole Protocol before going to Earth to deliver info that the Covenent were going to attack Earth. Cortana intercepted a UNSC E-Band transmission playing Oly Oly Oxen Free, so MC new that the Spartans were alive. There was NO time travel...

  • 08.06.2009 5:38 PM PDT

Posted by: Basic1
How do typos mean that i have not read the book. I wouldnt comment if i didnt know these things, i know the situations of james etc and im assuming the possibility that he can still be alive. "frank" instead of "fred" was a typo, and so was keyes, i was just reeling off characters and totally glazed over it.
'
the scenario of "time travel" which, although it isnt, yet seems like it is from certain viewpoints, is entirely possible. At this point in the story the crystal hasnt been destroyed anyway, its after the events at reach that its destroyed so this is totally irrelevant... besides this, there is the possibility of other crystals like it existing. point rendered irrelevant.

STOP picking holes and give opinions on what you think of the idea that this is when the story is set. It is entirely possible given the books, and would allow for a small group of spartans to be involved, while keeping the majority of the fall of reach book out, as well as giving a good story setting.


My "opinion" is that this theory would just mean that bungie ran out of ideas and microsoft is milking the halo ip, also you didn't answer if you did read the books or not, cuz if you did you would know Linda is in a cyro sleep anymore. Also the last KNOWN spartans left are John, Linda, Kelly, and Fred along with the spartan lll gamma company. Sure you could say I want the game specially my way. My personal favorite theory ive read was how at the fall of reach they said there was 30 spartans at one point and at a different part of the story they said there was only 25. Which makes 5 spartans that show in the banner. Or the spartans beta team who defended the super mac reactors, whose fate was never told. Anyway why do you want chief to come back to Reach when there are plenty of other spartans who are better then him. Chief didn't beat anyone at any specific thing, but he was the luckiest.

  • 08.06.2009 5:59 PM PDT

Posted by: Lightning759
Where did you get the info... Halsey's Crystal altered slipspace so that you could travel 10x faster or something. MC mad a blind jump to Reach by following the Cole Protocol before going to Earth to deliver info that the Covenent were going to attack Earth. Cortana intercepted a UNSC E-Band transmission playing Oly Oly Oxen Free, so MC new that the Spartans were alive. There was NO time travel...


The information was gathered from all halo sources considered canon, and put into a site called halostory.bungie or something.. cba to find the whole link.. your right about the crystal, it caused time dilation..... HOW CAN YOU GUYS NOT READ SERIOUSLY... i know its not time travel, but it GIVES THE APPEARANCE of time travel, so it seems as though there is. they didnt blindly jump back to reach, they went back specifically, they made the blind jump to halo, although it wasnt actually blind as the co-ordinates were known (from this crystal thing) and it just so happend to follow the protocol.

What im saying is that the periods before halo (around reach) and after halo (rescuing the survivors from reach before returning to earth) would be a good story setting.

Posted by: tusunegia567
My "opinion" is that this theory would just mean that bungie ran out of ideas and microsoft is milking the halo ip, also you didn't answer if you did read the books or not, cuz if you did you would know Linda is in a cyro sleep anymore. Also the last KNOWN spartans left are John, Linda, Kelly, and Fred along with the spartan lll gamma company. Sure you could say I want the game specially my way. My personal favorite theory ive read was how at the fall of reach they said there was 30 spartans at one point and at a different part of the story they said there was only 25. Which makes 5 spartans that show in the banner. Or the spartans beta team who defended the super mac reactors, whose fate was never told. Anyway why do you want chief to come back to Reach when there are plenty of other spartans who are better then him. Chief didn't beat anyone at any specific thing, but he was the luckiest.


Yes i read the books, apart from the last couple, although they dont have anything to do with this conversation anyway.

This wouldnt be milking the game, it would be piecing together what happened and giving us a visual representation of what happens before and after halo 1. or just before if you can see it that way ( as everything that ive talked about would be happening on the 7th sept, even though they "appeared" to travel further into the future during halo...

it would provide a clear game representation of time dilation and allow us to understand how it all happened and the fate of other spartans, as well as play alongside some.. perfect story setting.

  • 08.07.2009 8:08 PM PDT

Nobody else actually going to give me an intelligent and non argumentative-to-the-point-of-immaturity responses?

  • 08.09.2009 1:39 PM PDT

B.U.M.P.

  • 08.12.2009 2:12 PM PDT

Halo without Bungie is like a cookie made without love.

HEAD HURTING. TOO MUCH. BIG WORDS. TIME IN CIRCLES.

  • 09.26.2009 5:57 PM PDT