Halo: Reach Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: Have you seen the future of gaming? I hope THIS is it.
  • Subject: Have you seen the future of gaming? I hope THIS is it.
Subject: Have you seen the future of gaming? I hope THIS is it.

Verbose, as usual.

BUNGiE has likely been in the loop regarding "NATAL:" for like seventeen years...

IF "HALO: REACH" is going to take any kind of usable advantage of their seven year leg-up on the lame dudes at EA... they're gonna use this:

Head tracking.

It has the potential to crush everything out there... it will replace what Rainbow Six did with peeking, what "Greg Hastings" tried to accomplish with his crap ass namesake replication of the sport, and it might actually force us to use cover in "Gears of War".

We've been very close to the MATRIX for quite some time.

Please...
Plug us in.

[Edited on 08.20.2009 4:47 AM PDT]

  • 08.09.2009 7:02 AM PDT
Subject: Kinda expecting this:

Ok
I have some questions about how people think Reach will work with natal.
-If it utilizes "head tracking", how do you keep looking at the tv without making the game feel awkward? Like turning around? How do you turn around?
-How do you navigate in a 3D environment? Do you jog in place or something? lol
-If natal is 1-1 motion technology, how are we compatible with spartan movements, such as jump height and speed?

Theres a lot of other things I'm sure I'm not mentioning that could be potential fundamental problems, but I cant see a way for natal+reach not to be a disappointment.

But I would like to add that if there are ways that it could be done, I would be a supporter in the fullest.

  • 08.09.2009 7:52 AM PDT

Posted by: Master Megatron
As long as it's just an option to use and not required, I'm fine.


I second that but I am pretty sure if Bungie utilizes it, they will make it an option because they will lose so much money if it requires Natal. Also, I don't understand how Natal will recognize the little movements like pulling a trigger and stuff like that.

  • 08.09.2009 10:08 AM PDT

Here’s what Luke had to say about the differences in treatment between the Spartans and Elites in Reach:

“Instead of piece-by-piece customization like the Spartans, Elite customization is a full model swap with models selected from the various Elite classes appearing throughout the Campaign. There are all kinds of reasons for this, not the least of which is our continued emphasis on the Spartan as your identity in Reach.”

Posted by: xUS Navy Sealx
Posted by: Master Megatron
As long as it's just an option to use and not required, I'm fine.


I second that but I am pretty sure if Bungie utilizes it, they will make it an option because they will lose so much money if it requires Natal. Also, I don't understand how Natal will recognize the little movements like pulling a trigger and stuff like that.
The way I thought they might use it could be like the PS3's motion sensor controller, tilting it to the left pulls up a menu, etc.

  • 08.09.2009 12:21 PM PDT
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Posted by: ThermalHawk
Ok
I have some questions about how people think Reach will work with natal.
-If it utilizes "head tracking", how do you keep looking at the tv without making the game feel awkward? Like turning around? How do you turn around?
-How do you navigate in a 3D environment? Do you jog in place or something? lol
-If natal is 1-1 motion technology, how are we compatible with spartan movements, such as jump height and speed?

Theres a lot of other things I'm sure I'm not mentioning that could be potential fundamental problems, but I cant see a way for natal+reach not to be a disappointment.

But I would like to add that if there are ways that it could be done, I would be a supporter in the fullest.

He did not say the whole damn game will be 100% NATAL, just one feature.

  • 08.09.2009 12:25 PM PDT

thats true man.

I just dont think Halo is a great idea for natal. too many holes in the controls imo

  • 08.09.2009 4:39 PM PDT

Signatures are for squares.

If natal is even in the game, it'd probably be for small parts in the Campaign.

  • 08.09.2009 4:44 PM PDT

Here’s what Luke had to say about the differences in treatment between the Spartans and Elites in Reach:

“Instead of piece-by-piece customization like the Spartans, Elite customization is a full model swap with models selected from the various Elite classes appearing throughout the Campaign. There are all kinds of reasons for this, not the least of which is our continued emphasis on the Spartan as your identity in Reach.”

Posted by: privet caboose
If natal is even in the game, it'd probably be for small parts in the Campaign.
Puzzles!

  • 08.09.2009 4:50 PM PDT

You say tomato; I say potato.

Lets see what The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy has to say about Natal and all controls for that matter.
A loud clatter of gunk music flooded through the Heart of Gold cabin as Zaphod searched the sub-etha radio wave bands for news of himself. The machine was rather difficult to operate. For years radios had been operated by means of pressing buttons and turning dials; then as the technology became more sophisticated the controls were made touch sensitive--you merely had to brush the panel with your fingers; now all you had to do was wave your hand in the general direction of the components and hope. It saved a lot of muscular expenditure, of course, but meant that you had to sit infuriatingly still if you wanted to keep listening to the same program.
-Chapter 12

  • 08.09.2009 5:06 PM PDT

Verbose, as usual.

HALO: CE was produced as an amazing game designed for all of us... and none of us had an XBOX at the time. Just because none of us have NATAL attached to our XBOX now, doesn't mean developers are going to ignore the possibilities presented by head tracking technology. Granted it might be as Gnome13 quotes from THGttG if the developers shoot for, and botch, a "Minority Report" style menu system, where we're moving information around with a wave of our hands. However, what I'm hoping is that BUNGiE and other top tier developers use NATAL and head tracking to present the game to us in a whole new way, rather than trying to use NATAL to kill the Wii.

I don't think we'll be running around in our living rooms actually jumping and jogging in place. That's ridiculous.
If something such as head tracking were in the game, we'd likely use a controller in the same manner we always have. The only real difference between HALO we play now, and the HALO with head tracking integrated into the game is that the game can use all sorts of trickery to convince our brains that we're looking upon a true three dimensional scene. (The video very clearly and elegantly explains the concept in great detail) In that respect, I don't know why you'd ever want the option to turn it off.

Now, if they wanted to take a small leap into letting players control their characters with their bodies, the smartest way to do it is to recycle the head tracking information already being collected and used to generate the pseudo 3D image. Because the game knows where our head is in relation to the image on the television screen, it can translate that information to our characters. If you've played Medal of Honor: Airborne (and there's a demo available from the XBL Marketplace) you'll see how the peeking system used in that game could be vastly improved by head tracking technology.

Lets raise the bar like only BUNGiE can.
1. Introduce Halo Reach as a package deal with NATAL.
2. Include a motion sensitive Assault Rifle shaped novelty controller, A-La Rock Band.
3. Replace the torso of the Spartan characters with information gathered from the controller and NATAL body recognition technology.

This is a completely feasible way to explode our minds. If you look at the way the animations in HALO work now, the legs and torso are animated completely independently of each other. If a motion sensitive Assault Rifle shaped controller were available to gamers, NATAL could replace the top half of your Spartan's animations with input from how you're holding your body in the real world. The Assault Rifle controller could easily be designed with all of the buttons and control sticks found on the current iteration of the XBOX 360 controller. Players would control their characters as they always have, using buttons on the foregrip to reload, jump, crouch and throw grenades. (although I'd love to see melee attacks bound to your motion capture input.) The main difference is that players would use the the a thumbstick to frame enemies, and the motion sensitive Assault Rifle to actually do the aiming. Combine that with head tracking presenting a very convincing false three dimensional environment, and NATAL translating your upper body movements onto your Spartan, and we'll be one step closer to The Matrix, my friends.

  • 08.09.2009 7:29 PM PDT

Posted by: ThermalHawk
Ok
I have some questions about how people think Reach will work with natal.
-If it utilizes "head tracking", how do you keep looking at the tv without making the game feel awkward? Like turning around? How do you turn around?
-How do you navigate in a 3D environment? Do you jog in place or something? lol
-If natal is 1-1 motion technology, how are we compatible with spartan movements, such as jump height and speed?

Theres a lot of other things I'm sure I'm not mentioning that could be potential fundamental problems, but I cant see a way for natal+reach not to be a disappointment.

But I would like to add that if there are ways that it could be done, I would be a supporter in the fullest.



leave that to the professionals, possibly they are laughing about comments like yours...
I'm not saying that natal will be great, but leave the problems to the people working on it.
Besides that you are thinking in a very extreme way
is like " we will use the hole body to play " no, we don't know how bungie will use it.

  • 08.09.2009 7:43 PM PDT

Ugh...

First on a BWU.. yeah, I'm cool.

ODST;MYTHIC Screenshot winner! One of the first to get their hands on the mythic map pack.

I really don't think so, and I really hope not.

  • 08.09.2009 7:55 PM PDT
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Posted by: Achronos
It isn't our shiznit anymore.

Posted by: ThermalHawk
Ok
I have some questions about how people think Reach will work with natal.
-If it utilizes "head tracking", how do you keep looking at the tv without making the game feel awkward? Like turning around? How do you turn around?
-How do you navigate in a 3D environment? Do you jog in place or something? lol
-If natal is 1-1 motion technology, how are we compatible with spartan movements, such as jump height and speed?

Theres a lot of other things I'm sure I'm not mentioning that could be potential fundamental problems, but I cant see a way for natal+reach not to be a disappointment.

But I would like to add that if there are ways that it could be done, I would be a supporter in the fullest.


Actually, Bungie can perfectly integrate Natal into Reach. It won't be 1-1 motion tracking because, well that's impossible. I could give you a long list of solutions for those problems, but I'll let your imagination solve it. The problem is not whether it can be integrated, it is whether the community will accept a new change in gameplay and actually have to do a little exercise (less than the Wii). Humans are conservative by nature.

  • 08.09.2009 8:25 PM PDT

Verbose, as usual.

Ur totally missing the point of the thread here. NATAL is simply an additional sensory package for the XBOX 360 which can be used to locate and track (apparently broad) movements of the human body. Its up to the programmers how they use that information. I guarantee that BUNGiE won't have us in our media rooms jogging in place and doing crouch-jumps. They might not even use anything like head tracking at all. What I'm hoping for is that BUNGiE will use this opportunity to make something completely new and utterly kickass. If the game were presented in pseudo 3D like J Lee's video implies can be done, this game will render everything else on the market completely obsolete. Its got nothing to do with actually controlling your guy. Sweet mercy guys the video can't be any more clearly presented.

  • 08.10.2009 3:43 AM PDT

Mate!
That video was.......... well possibly the best visual advance in gaming I've seen. Makes me wana by a bigger TV. I have been waiting for this for a long time expecting a VR head set or something.

Great find mate, Bungie has a habit of raising the bar.

  • 08.10.2009 4:28 AM PDT

Grenades! Beatdowns! Driving! Squad Orders (You charge that door. You take out that sniper)! Reloads! Precision Shooting (optional)!

  • 08.10.2009 5:13 AM PDT

You say tomato; I say potato.

I do not like the idea of this natal thing, but if any company can figure out how to make it fun, it is Bungie.

  • 08.10.2009 5:20 AM PDT
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nobody needs AN*L...so stfu about this -blam!- Thing.

  • 08.10.2009 5:28 AM PDT
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Posted by: StormyHeart
HALO: CE was produced as an amazing game designed for all of us... and none of us had an XBOX at the time. Just because none of us have NATAL attached to our XBOX now, doesn't mean developers are going to ignore the possibilities presented by head tracking technology. Granted it might be as Gnome13 quotes from THGttG if the developers shoot for, and botch, a "Minority Report" style menu system, where we're moving information around with a wave of our hands. However, what I'm hoping is that BUNGiE and other top tier developers use NATAL and head tracking to present the game to us in a whole new way, rather than trying to use NATAL to kill the Wii.

I don't think we'll be running around in our living rooms actually jumping and jogging in place. That's ridiculous.
If something such as head tracking were in the game, we'd likely use a controller in the same manner we always have. The only real difference between HALO we play now, and the HALO with head tracking integrated into the game is that the game can use all sorts of trickery to convince our brains that we're looking upon a true three dimensional scene. (The video very clearly and elegantly explains the concept in great detail) In that respect, I don't know why you'd ever want the option to turn it off.

Now, if they wanted to take a small leap into letting players control their characters with their bodies, the smartest way to do it is to recycle the head tracking information already being collected and used to generate the pseudo 3D image. Because the game knows where our head is in relation to the image on the television screen, it can translate that information to our characters. If you've played Medal of Honor: Airborne (and there's a demo available from the XBL Marketplace) you'll see how the peeking system used in that game could be vastly improved by head tracking technology.

Lets raise the bar like only BUNGiE can.
1. Introduce Halo Reach as a package deal with NATAL.
2. Include a motion sensitive Assault Rifle shaped novelty controller, A-La Rock Band.
3. Replace the torso of the Spartan characters with information gathered from the controller and NATAL body recognition technology.

This is a completely feasible way to explode our minds. If you look at the way the animations in HALO work now, the legs and torso are animated completely independently of each other. If a motion sensitive Assault Rifle shaped controller were available to gamers, NATAL could replace the top half of your Spartan's animations with input from how you're holding your body in the real world. The Assault Rifle controller could easily be designed with all of the buttons and control sticks found on the current iteration of the XBOX 360 controller. Players would control their characters as they always have, using buttons on the foregrip to reload, jump, crouch and throw grenades. (although I'd love to see melee attacks bound to your motion capture input.) The main difference is that players would use the the a thumbstick to frame enemies, and the motion sensitive Assault Rifle to actually do the aiming. Combine that with head tracking presenting a very convincing false three dimensional environment, and NATAL translating your upper body movements onto your Spartan, and we'll be one step closer to The Matrix, my friends.


Why would you aim using an assault rifle? That'd just be weird if you are using any other weapon, like a lazer, energy sword, battle rifle, etc. It'd most probably look like a stick you point at the spot you want to aim.

  • 08.10.2009 6:54 AM PDT

Verbose, as usual.

Why do you play Metallica songs in Guitar Hero using a Les Paul shaped controller, when thsoe guys play with ESP Guitars? Why not just use a straight stick with a little flapper on it and five buttons? Whats the point of shaping it into a generic looking guitar?

It doesn't matter what the controller itself looks like, just that the game engine can track where you're pointing your controller. In fact, they could manufacture controllers configured to look like any of the two handed weapons in the game.

You've completely missed the future of displaying video games, by the way. Did you finish watching the video? Poor you.

  • 08.20.2009 4:43 AM PDT