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This topic has moved here: Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]
  • Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]

marines hooah !!!!!!!

i think that the humans are the forrunners just a more primitive mindset

  • 11.27.2010 11:37 PM PDT

In memory of those fallen in the defense of Earth and her colonies.

March 3, 2553

You have opened my mind more to the halo universe. I always knew that in some way, Humans were like the forerunners, but i couldn't quite connect the dots. You've done that, nice job.

  • 11.28.2010 4:42 AM PDT

The precursors wanted the forerunners to complete their work and the forerunners wanted humanity to complete their work. Humanity is the forerunners "sacred race" and they thought it was well worth their sacrifice(halo array) to save humans from the flood

  • 11.28.2010 10:07 AM PDT

I had Disembodied Soul reply to one of my threads... Nuff' Said.

Posted By: Disembodied Soul
My absence has been greatly exaggerated.

I think humans, brutes, grunts, jackals, skirmishers, prophets, etc. are all the forerunners as a whole. And they are all needed to activate the halo array.

ex.

Prophets understand forerunner artifacts

Humans can activate them

[Edited on 12.04.2010 9:52 AM PST]

  • 12.04.2010 9:50 AM PDT

Ok you can't take what they did in halo ledgends seriously its an Anime made by japanese people that is why all the buildings look japanese. Nothing but artistic license. About what the ODST said
"The architecture is not Covenant design and it sure as hell wasn't built by humans. It pre-dates both sides."
The ODST and humanity as a whole did not know much about the forunners because ONI kept it locked down. But as you said Spark says "you are forunner" he is crazy but the only humans are able to activate forunner tech. MC is called a relcaimer because he is reclaiming what the forunners had lost to the flood. You ask why would forunners build all these instilations if they were losing a war. I ask how the forunners would change all there tech to acommidate humans and not anyone else. Forunners could create entire planets and suns they had the tech to create the crystal in first strike also. Precursers were teir 0 they either left the galaxy are trancended time and space. The forunners recived their religion "the mantle" from the precursers before the precursers dissapeared. The forunners wouldn't allow the precursers to de-evolve after recieving the mantle.

  • 12.04.2010 10:20 PM PDT

Wow good job mate. I've never thought of an idea so crazy, yet plausible, as this. I guess it makes sense.

  • 12.05.2010 2:17 AM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

Posted by: Cladblackninj4
Ok you can't take what they did in halo ledgends seriously its an Anime made by japanese people that is why all the buildings look japanese. Nothing but artistic license.


It's still canon, Frankie even suggested that the architecture wasn't Forerunner so who says it can't be Precursor. The ruins on Installation 05 inside the Forerunner shrines looks similar.

they had the tech to create the crystal in first strike also.

That is never confirmed to be of Forerunner origin, and I doubt it is.

  • 12.05.2010 5:31 AM PDT

I had Disembodied Soul reply to one of my threads... Nuff' Said.

Posted By: Disembodied Soul
My absence has been greatly exaggerated.

bumped for justice

  • 12.06.2010 7:39 AM PDT

This sir, is full of win...

  • 12.11.2010 5:14 AM PDT

Posted by: Cladblackninj4
Ok you can't take what they did in halo ledgends seriously its an Anime made by japanese people that is why all the buildings look japanese. Nothing but artistic license. About what the ODST said
"The architecture is not Covenant design and it sure as hell wasn't built by humans. It pre-dates both sides."
The ODST and humanity as a whole did not know much about the forunners because ONI kept it locked down. But as you said Spark says "you are forunner" he is crazy but the only humans are able to activate forunner tech. MC is called a relcaimer because he is reclaiming what the forunners had lost to the flood. You ask why would forunners build all these instilations if they were losing a war. I ask how the forunners would change all there tech to acommidate humans and not anyone else. Forunners could create entire planets and suns they had the tech to create the crystal in first strike also. Precursers were teir 0 they either left the galaxy are trancended time and space. The forunners recived their religion "the mantle" from the precursers before the precursers dissapeared. The forunners wouldn't allow the precursers to de-evolve after recieving the mantle.



I can reach that conclusion if I like; it's my theory.

Frank O' Connor pretty much stated that the buildings weren't Forerunner.

- When Spark says "You are Forerunner" he either is off his head or, a more likely scenario, is referring to the Precursors; to the Forerunners as we know them, the Precursors would seem as Forerunners to them.

- Sure, the Forerunners could create semblances of planets and stars, but an object that manipulates space-time? I don't know about that.

- Precursors were Tier 0 indeed, but your suggestion that they left the galaxy is baseless conjecture, when you think about it.

- You don't know that they received the mantle before then.

- At the time of the Precursors succumbing to whatever brought about their ruin, I imagine that the Forerunners were of a similar technological level as humanity when the Forerunners were toppled. What were they supposed to do?

  • 12.11.2010 3:32 PM PDT

Seriously Oak, Ive been doing this -blam!- for 16 years, gimmie my Friggen starter Pokemon and dont call me till im the champion! ¬_¬

One of the most Awesome theories ive ever seen for the halo story Ever

It makes perfect sence, and i suppose the question is along the lines of "What happened to humanity to make them primitive?"

Or even if they had? Maybe the forerunners used the technology the precursors had to rebuild a human being, and bring them back from extinction

And maybe humanity will return the favour

Still though, fun question, is the Legendary planet Forerunner, or precursor? :O :O :O

And Oh, intresting thought, is there any evidence of the forerunners Actually Refering to themselves as "ForeRunner", since the disambugation of the word means "Those who come before"

[Edited on 12.12.2010 11:13 AM PST]

  • 12.12.2010 11:08 AM PDT

Can't we all just get along?

Finally! A crackpot theory which constructs a well thought out and believable argument.

So much so that it may not be a crackpot theory at all...

  • 12.15.2010 1:45 AM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors?

To be honest, when I first saw all this in the weekly update I thought 2 things.
#1- there is an actual legendary ending but,
#2- No matter what anyone does,(kill all the bobs, hit all switches etc) that until the "time" mentioned in "There'll be another time..." is reached there won't be a legendary ending.

The weekly update by bungie has slowed my hardcore search for what unlocks the legendary ending.


Posted by: Crimius
I can definitely see the validity this theory holds, however i have reservations about saying that the precursors "devolved" into humanity. such advanced races don't simply fade out, there's some sort of event that either kills them or forces them to leave. In the Precursors case, it might have been a flood outbreak, they might have simply moved into a different dimension (because from what little we know of them, they were even more advanced at traversing the dimensions than the forerunners were, so this may have been a trivial matter). I highly doubt they all just devolved into humanity though.
In the beastarium included in the halo 3 legendary edition (i think), it says that the precursors were higher than the forerunner in technology, so if you piece this together, they could have been able to know more things than the forerunner can even understand.the precursors were at tier 0 technology level, while the forerunners had a tier 1 tech level.
Humanity is at tier 3, while The Covenant is at tier 2.
More info can be found on halopedian.com (halopedia has moved from wikia and has become independent).
Source:Technological_Achievement
http://www.halopedian.com/(new halopedia)

  • 12.16.2010 3:40 PM PDT

To be honest, when I first saw all this in the weekly update I thought 2 things.
#1- there is an actual legendary ending but,
#2- No matter what anyone does,(kill all the bobs, hit all switches etc) that until the "time" mentioned in "There'll be another time..." is reached there won't be a legendary ending.

The weekly update by bungie has slowed my hardcore search for what unlocks the legendary ending.

while it may be wrong of guilty spark saying that MC is forerunner, (because he could be confused AND rampent), why has it been I have seen NOTHING from the grave mind. I could swear something he said had to do with him. That could be a huge changer in this entire forum.
Also, Halo Wars could possibly be added with some info to help us understand if we are forerunner or precursors. At least the technology and stuff.

  • 12.16.2010 3:46 PM PDT
  • gamertag: l roo
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im thinking a bit grate jorny thing mabe thay evolved beoyond bodiely bounds and went levle 0 on the mantle thing

  • 12.23.2010 8:52 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]

United States Military Academy Class of 2015

Question though, in the halo 3 terminals; the librarian discovers Earth and humanity on accident at the very end of the forerunner vs. flood conflict. The librarian called them special and built the ark so that humanity would survive the firing of the rings. And because the librarian found humanity "special" they made it so that humanity could use forerunner technology. Why is there so much being looked into them being the precursors unless there is some information I have not seen?

Now I have no knowledge of "The Babysitter" and I would really like to know more about that but could it not be that the Forerunner built structures with humanity's image before the rings were activated?

  • 12.23.2010 10:20 PM PDT

This is profile number 4

actually been a member of Bungie.net since March-April 2004

... I have a tendency to lose my passwords...

Chapter one and two of Cryptum seem to indicate that humanity once was a very powerful possibly tier 2 or 1 civilization +10,000 years before the flood war and was wiped out in a human-forerunner war. I'd say its a pretty good chance that it was this ancient human civilization that built those structures on Heian.

  • 12.23.2010 10:58 PM PDT

United States Military Academy Class of 2015


Posted by: Terminus
Chapter one and two of Cryptum seem to indicate that humanity once was a very powerful possibly tier 2 or 1 civilization +10,000 years before the flood war and was wiped out in a human-forerunner war. I'd say its a pretty good chance that it was this ancient human civilization that built those structures on Heian.


Why would the librarian be surprised to find humanity living on Earth and act like they had no knowledge of humanity before? If they had fought another tier 2 civilization some data would have been stored on it and humanity wouldn't have been a surprise find.

  • 12.23.2010 11:02 PM PDT

This is profile number 4

actually been a member of Bungie.net since March-April 2004

... I have a tendency to lose my passwords...

Posted by: Warriersolid47

Posted by: Terminus
Chapter one and two of Cryptum seem to indicate that humanity once was a very powerful possibly tier 2 or 1 civilization +10,000 years before the flood war and was wiped out in a human-forerunner war. I'd say its a pretty good chance that it was this ancient human civilization that built those structures on Heian.


Why would the librarian be surprised to find humanity living on Earth and act like they had no knowledge of humanity before? If they had fought another tier 2 civilization some data would have been stored on it and humanity wouldn't have been a surprise find.


Perhaps we can look at what the Librarian said a little differently then, perhaps she was not going on about discovering humanity at the last minute perhaps she was talking about discovering something in humanity at the last minute. Does put a whole new spin on the whole Reclaimer thing.

(But as I have not read the relevant quotes from the Librarian in a while I may be talking out of my ass)

*Also Crytum says that the Librarian had been on Earth for thousands of years before the Firing of the Halos

  • 12.23.2010 11:13 PM PDT

heres hoping your right remember the OTHER Big thread about Blue team and all the effort put into it only to be Glassed per say

[Edited on 12.23.2010 11:55 PM PST]

  • 12.23.2010 11:48 PM PDT

Posted by: Warriersolid47

Posted by: Terminus
Chapter one and two of Cryptum seem to indicate that humanity once was a very powerful possibly tier 2 or 1 civilization +10,000 years before the flood war and was wiped out in a human-forerunner war. I'd say its a pretty good chance that it was this ancient human civilization that built those structures on Heian.


Why would the librarian be surprised to find humanity living on Earth and act like they had no knowledge of humanity before? If they had fought another tier 2 civilization some data would have been stored on it and humanity wouldn't have been a surprise find.


I imagine that Cryptum has retcon'd the terminals where necessary; it is stated very clearly in Cryptum that there was a human-Forerunner war which humanity lost, before being devolved and exiled to Earth.

This changes the theory a little bit. It's possible they're still the final remnants Precursors and the Forerunners don't know it, and so they ironically exile the beings they worship, but I admit it is unlikely.

We'll have to wait for the book to fully be released. This theory did get a few things right in connecting the dots to guess that humanity had once been interstellar, but they may not be Precursors.

Oh well. You win some, you lose some.

  • 12.24.2010 2:45 AM PDT


Posted by: Wolverfrog
Posted by: Warriersolid47

Posted by: Terminus
Chapter one and two of Cryptum seem to indicate that humanity once was a very powerful possibly tier 2 or 1 civilization +10,000 years before the flood war and was wiped out in a human-forerunner war. I'd say its a pretty good chance that it was this ancient human civilization that built those structures on Heian.


Why would the librarian be surprised to find humanity living on Earth and act like they had no knowledge of humanity before? If they had fought another tier 2 civilization some data would have been stored on it and humanity wouldn't have been a surprise find.


I imagine that Cryptum has retcon'd the terminals where necessary; it is stated very clearly in Cryptum that there was a human-Forerunner war which humanity lost, before being devolved and exiled to Earth.

This changes the theory a little bit. It's possible they're still the final remnants Precursors and the Forerunners don't know it, and so they ironically exile the beings they worship, but I admit it is unlikely.

We'll have to wait for the book to fully be released. This theory did get a few things right in connecting the dots to guess that humanity had once been interstellar, but they may not be Precursors.

Oh well. You win some, you lose some.


Do we even know if that the Precursors actually/accidently had their civilization destroyed?

  • 12.24.2010 2:54 AM PDT

No, but something had to happen to them. It's possible that something cataclysmic occurred which forced them to retreat back to this galaxy. They may have referred to themselves as humanity, and the Forerunners just termed them with 'Precursors' for lack of a better word -- it basically means 'those who came before.'

This weakened humanity may have encountered the Forerunners (who they encountered thousands of years previously, affecting their gene strain), and have forgotten over time their role in the Forerunners' growth. A war may have ensued, with the Forerunners coming out on top. Humans at the time may have had more advanced technology but their numbers would be few and the technology outdated/old/failing.

That's a way it could have happened. It's not especially likely, but we'll just have to wait and see.

  • 12.24.2010 2:59 AM PDT

Well, when you think about it, Halo has a sense of irony when it comes to the antagonist's view on the protagonists: they are fighting and killing those they should worship instead. (Covenant vs Reclaimers)

I suppose if that sense of irony persists, the Forerunners were fighting humanity and at the same time trying to find out what happened to the Precursors--what did they do to anger them into leaving--when the whole while they were fighting the Precursors in s severely weakened and ungodly state.

And if that's true: why is it we are always the center of religions? And on that same note, why do we ALWAYS get our ass kicked by every race out there?

  • 12.24.2010 8:01 AM PDT

Also, is it also not a possibility that the Precursors ascended?

Here me out: The Mantle of Life is a very important piece of Forerunner ideologies. It was supposedly passed down to the Forerunners by the Precursors just before the latter vanished.

Now, it would seem that whoever holds the Mantle is "special" in some way shape or form, and they ALWAYS seem to disappear seemingly without a trace as to where they went.

Covenant religion states that firing the Halo Rings opens the Path to Godhood, the Great Journey. And as a matter of fact, they were close to getting it right, but they missed one very important detail: the Forerunners left the galaxy AFTER they fired the Rings, not BECAUSE they fired the Rings, but they did leave, and to where, no one knows.

The Great Journey is real, it was a real Forerunner undertaking; they wanted to "Follow in their footsteps" as has been stated countless times throughout these forums. Their meaning Precursor, and the Covenant ideology of ascending to Godhood most likely came from a similar ideology from the Forerunners, of partaking in this Great Journey to ascendance (because that ideology didn't come from no where).

It would appear all holders of the Mantle of Life undertake this Great Journey once they're time with it is finished and they pass it down to the next Reclaimer Race, and the Cycle of Life repeats until it is their time, and so on and so on forever.

In keeping with how the Gravemind symbolizes the Devil, it could be said he is trying to break into this Godhood that the Precursors could have denied him (I'm under the possibly insane impression the Mind is a Precursor trapped forever in this world as punishment for whatever he may have done to piss the Precursors off, like Lucifer being banished to Hell).

Notice how the Mind seems to always have a personal vendetta against the Mantle Holders? Maybe he feels like he can continue to defy the Precursors if he destroys the Mantle Races. For whatever reason, out of the galaxies he must have consumed over his time, the Milky Way seems to be the one he has the most trouble with and the one he REALLY wants most.

In my eyes, I think at the end of it all, we'll pass the Mantle down to the Elites, as they were the ONLY race in the galaxy willing to put aside old differences and do what was obviously right for the galaxy, but that's just a blind assumption.

Anyway, don't know if this ammounts to anything, but from what I've seen, it does make sense. Perhaps the Legendary Planet holds all the answers...

  • 12.24.2010 8:25 AM PDT