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This topic has moved here: Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]
  • Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]

i was definately thinking the same thing when i watched babysitter... im just hoping it wasnt the anime artists using artistic liberties. it just isnt right to play with our emotions like that.

  • 11.15.2009 11:46 PM PDT
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Creator of the forge map Actuality-Break which featured in the 2009 bungie vs the world playlist and subsiquent 7on7th playlists and double EXP maptackuler

I love a good post like this :-) I think the forunner trilogy of books will finley shed some light on what is one of the bigest mistories of te halo universe.

  • 11.17.2009 10:04 AM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]

A jewel. :-)

  • 01.03.2010 2:29 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors?
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

Posted by: P3P5I
Agustus, I have one problem with your theory: how did the forerunners find a way to defeat the flood and the pecursors (who were far more advanced) couldn't?

Wolverfrog, good theory (except the part about the de-evolution of the precursors).


the forerunners didn't defeat the flood, they just stopped it from spreading. while on the other hand humanity has indirectly deafeted the flood with borens syndrome. So if every human was born with borens syndrome we wouldn't be able tobe host for the flood thus deafeting them.

  • 01.03.2010 2:38 PM PDT

Life isn't like a box of chocolates, it's like a jar of Jalapeños, what you do today might come back to burn your backside tomorrow!

Since I have nothing useful to add to this great discussion all I am going to say is kudos to you OP. This is one of the most well thought out theories I have seen in an age. It fits way too well with all of the actual canon out there. Lets just hope that one day Bungie decides to allow us to sneak a larger peak at the huge tracts of lore that they are hiding within their huge trench coat that is the halo universe.

  • 01.04.2010 7:22 AM PDT
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Some can come away from reading "War and Peace" thinking it a simple adventure story, while others can read the ingredients on a gum wrapper and unlock the secrets of the universe.

What do you think could have happened (probably relating to the flood) that would have caused humanity and the Forerunner to be seperated?

And Humanity remaining extremely primitive 'till the Forerunners discovered them?

  • 01.04.2010 2:24 PM PDT

How did Frankie confirm the theory? The link is broken. =(

I'm on the edge of my seat now, haha.

  • 01.13.2010 2:02 PM PDT
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Some can come away from reading "War and Peace" thinking it a simple adventure story, while others can read the ingredients on a gum wrapper and unlock the secrets of the universe.

Which link?

  • 01.13.2010 2:23 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]

Sir. You have just blown my mind. Great descriptions by the way, I see exactly how you are putting this. That is a GREAT theory! This was really cool to read, and now I finally understand what Oonsk is from that post on NEO!

Oh, and isn't what kurt said in the tunnels when he touched the crystals similiar to, if not identical to what the Bungie Universe Banner says?

[Edited on 01.13.2010 5:14 PM PST]

  • 01.13.2010 5:04 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 1.1]

Private in Tactical Operations. Join up, fight with hardened warriors

I... Wow. Damn, that all actually makes sense. Thanks very much for posting this

  • 01.20.2010 12:58 AM PDT

O Rly?

I applaud you for thinking so deeply into this. And in the end, your theory made a lot of sense. Even cooler that it was basically confirmed.

Great job.

  • 01.20.2010 1:38 AM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]
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I know I am coming into this theory of yours WAY late. But if you don't mind I was going to add another twist that seems to work very well. *ahem* You see, I have always had one theory about the Halo universe, that being, Humans are in fact the Precursors. And like you this may be a very strong claim. BUT what if the entire universe of Halo (and a little thing to mess with our heads) is actually one big time paradox? Humans evolve, become advanced, "inherit" these things from the Forerunner, gain huge amounts of information, then in some cataclysm start the whole process over, and in doing so give the "mantel" to the Forerunner, who leave stuff behind, and give it BACK to humans/precursor. Now, think of what "precursor" means, I know this is very cheesy and typical but let us look to the definition of the word itself. "Precursor-1. a person or thing that precedes and shows or announces someone or something to come; harbinger" In other words, to signal the approach of things to come. This fits in perfectly with the idea that Humans are indeed the precursors themselves.

Now I know you had stated that Precursors had walked our steps before and potentially started from Earth. Well, what if they had? What if they are us, and we will move to "Reach" and make a civilization there, and what if we go through all these motions and re-inherit our birth right that our future selves left for us. But what if also in our infinite wisdom we "rebooted" time itself. Interesting little twist to be added to your theory no? Funny that I should stumble across your theory as well.

Edit: Think of this as one big vicious circle of time beginning with us and ultimately ending with us.

  • 01.20.2010 3:03 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors?
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I haz cookies.

I must say, i really do think you have found something here.

  • 01.20.2010 3:10 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]

I don't understand why you're looking at my profile. Just back off, and nobody gets hurt, okay?

Wow, VERY well thought out.

I like to come here and read intelligent, grammatically correct posts every once in a while to take a break from the Reach forum.

  • 01.20.2010 8:46 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors?

No trees were killed in the creation of this profile, but a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

To the original theory and subsequent updates to it, there's too many assumptions, not enough facts. You say such devices as the "Reach Crystal" seem to you far beyond Foreunner capability, yet they constructed the HALOs, built teleportation networks, and influenced the natural workings of star systems. To me, Foreunners are most certainly capable of constructing a crystal that can bend space-time.

And to wolverfrog, Spark may have acted Rampant, but he told the Master Chief in the Ark's cartographer that his knowledge was compartmentalized. Basically, the monitors are stewards of their respective rings, which corroborates his highly limited knowledge of the Ark and its systems.

Eh, this whole Precursors-are-humans theory is still murky to me. It needs more compelling points.

  • 01.27.2010 12:35 AM PDT
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Don't know why it calls me rubuilt gymnast 7, it's really UNSC595 in case you were wondering and I have played all of those games online

Wolverfrog, you just blew my mind

  • 01.30.2010 9:04 PM PDT

Had a good read of this at long last, Wolver, and I'm all for it. Not too sure on the demise of the Precursors part. I think there's more to it than that.

But it does make one section of the forum clear. As I and Agustus have already realised, Bungie like to put things in plain sight. And with our link with the Precursors in mind and the theory of genetic memory, it all points to one obvious quote:

"Oddly, this is familiar to you, as if it were from an old dream, but you can't exactly remember..."

This quote speaks volumes of mankind's ancient link. We all remember, somehow.

The Halo Encyclopedia also points towards this. In one section, it states that the Forerunners used/learned from previous, ancient races. If the Forerunners did indeed use a lot of Precursor designs then that would explain how humanity can used Forerunner technology.

  • 02.02.2010 5:14 AM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

Posted by: Wolverfrog


Now you see, it is talking about Earth, and the 'unique denizens' are humanity. It leaves you with the questions, why must we be researched? What answers can we give to the Forerunners? Surely simply being chosen by the Forerunners to carry on their work in the event that they perish does not grant us this amount of awe?


However, what if the Precursors had not been wiped out, but in fact, merely faded away, realising that omniscience was a terrible burden. A likely scenario is that the Precursors encountered the Flood, which would make the Flood much like the Reapers in Mass Effect; they wipe out cultures once they are advanced enough. The Flood could have forced the Precursors back into hiding, where they lost all their technology. Eventually, perhaps only one world, Earth, remained, and so eventually the Precursors had lost all of their knowledge and power, and became what we know today as humanity.

I know you think a species 'devolving' seems unlikely, but I will direct you here to the case of the Brutes. At one point in their history, they were as advanced as the Covenant, until a civil war threw them back into the industrial age. Something similar of this sort could have happened to the Precursors.

In the sixth terminal, the Librarian states this to the Didact.

We knew this was a special place because of them, but unless you've been here, you can't know.

Now that seems to be good proof. She is calling Earth a special place because of them. Just who are 'them?' Humanity springs to mind, but what if she was talking about the Precursors?



Update 1.2


Now let's jump to First Strike. Halsey and the Spartans discover a network of what they believe to be 'Forerunner caverns' underneath the ONI CASTLE facility. Inside these ruins, they discover a crystal, which can bend space and time. It seems awfully advanced, even for the Forerunners.

Now, what if the Forerunners hadn't built the caverns and crystal, but the Precursors had?



Overall it's a decent though unlikely theory, personally we don't know enough about the connection between the forerunners and precursors enough for any theory to have any sort of weight. the most we know is that the ruins in babysitter were not forerunner, which doesn't mean much because it was implied in "conversations of the universe" that another race might have let the flood out on delta halo. Honestly, for anybody doing any precursor theory, just wait for more info because we know nothing.


Now on to your theory.

1. The forerunners probably though we were special for our genetics or because of us in general. scientist find new animals daily and the "weird" ones fascinate them the most because they wonder what they can learn from them.

2.we honestly don't know anything on why the flood does what the flood do, hell the flood don't even know why other than it's natural to them. and comparing the flood to the reapers is unlikely because the forerunners found the flood, if that research team never went down on the moon they would still have their large empire today.

3. the Brutes didn't natively have technology advanced as the covenant, that was humanity and the Lekgolo. Brutes only started to developed space travel until they started to fight again, after that they were stuck on their homeworld.

4.the Librarian was talking about the humans, IRIS was an ARG based around humanity's relation to the forerunners and the forerunners fight with the flood. The precursors are a legend, noting more at this point.

5. The crystal is forerunner tech, it's much like the crystal from Sigma Octanus IV only with time bending ability's. The forerunner had a mastery of slipspace and this crystal is just another example of it, just because it was pretty far out doesn't mean it wasn't forerunner. Hell the ark wasn't even in our galaxy but we all know who made it. And for any constellation it was blue, the forerunners signature color. :)

and remember the forerunner did do things prior to meeting the flood, we don't know the date of when they made that complex but im sure it was made long before they met the flood.

  • 02.04.2010 7:49 AM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors?

God is our refuge and strength, a very present help in trouble. Therefore will not we fear, though the earth be removed, and though the mountains be carried into the midst of the sea; Though the waters thereof roar and be troubled, though the mountains shake with the swelling thereof.” – Psalms 46:1-3

wow man amazing Theory I read it twice that is how much i liked it!

  • 02.04.2010 8:28 AM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]

Do you serve a purpose, or purposely serve?

Wow, amazing theory! The best I've heard thus far for sure. After the Halo Legends stories are studied frame by frame and the Forerunner trilogy has been read line for line, perhaps more answers will become clear, I'll certainly be checking back in the future

  • 02.14.2010 3:06 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors?

Have you seen my mind anywhere? I seem to have lost it...

0x0 x0x 0x0 000 000 x0x 000
x0x 0x0 0x0 0xx 000 0x0 000
x0x x0x x00 0xx 0x0 x0x 0x0

I have seen you future

Posted by: S1eeping Giant

And to wolverfrog, Spark may have acted Rampant, but he told the Master Chief in the Ark's cartographer that his knowledge was compartmentalized. Basically, the monitors are stewards of their respective rings, which corroborates his highly limited knowledge of the Ark and its systems.


Since Spark only has his section of highly compartmentalized knowledge, how would he know that humans are forerunners?

And OP Excellent and well thought out theory, but the devolving theory seems like a stretch.

How about this;
As the precursors start to realize that they are losing the war with the flood they create the humans through their ability to accelerate evolution and hide them on earth. They also leave the forerunners to directly inherit all they created and told them not to disturb the humans. This way the forerunners would inherit the galaxy if the precursors fell and the humans would inherit it if the forerunners fall.

  • 02.15.2010 1:20 PM PDT
Subject: Humanity are not Forerunners, but in fact Precursors? [Update 2.0]

Name used to be "HaloNathan"... weird.
I blame stosh.
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So you're saying the guy I'm standing a few feet in front of in this picture, in the Halo universe, is a Precursor?

What about this idea?

In the Halo Universe:
The Precursors left our galaxy and passed down the mantle to the Forerunners.
I always wondered about the origins of the Flood and if they had anything to do with the Precursors.

The Flood originates from another galaxy at an Intergalactic Stage of Infection.
What if the Precursors were wiped out by the Flood?

The Flood gained a technologic advance to leave its galaxy and infect our, and possibly other, galaxies.
What if the Flood gained the Precursors ability to travel among galaxies by capturing their technology?


Who knows, the Precursors might have even made the Flood. More than 100,000 years into the future, Precursors are simply legend and history. There are no recorded sightings known of them ever revisiting the Milky Way after the Mantle is passed down.

Also Forerunners may have interest in humanity due to the fact that they have the ability learn about their past. Like scientists of today trying to find life on other planets, trying to answer the question of how life began.

[Edited on 02.15.2010 9:44 PM PST]

  • 02.15.2010 9:41 PM PDT

Most of the theories floating around which actually go in-depth -- beyond just putting numbers and dates together -- can be disproven somehow.

There may be opposing theories and solutions to yours, however there is easily no disproving evidence. 'Disproving' is not the same as 'opposing.'

Your theory goes miles not to disprove something else, but to explain a new, viable way of thinking about the relationship between Precursors, Forerunners, and Humans.

Hell, you got me to read it. And check Frankie's post. And read some of the replies.

Well-thought.

  • 02.15.2010 10:31 PM PDT

This is a real eye opener for me, and I think you have a pretty cool theory. But maybe the Forerunners and Precursors are not different entities from different times and different advancements in technology. Maybe they are two different nations of the same species, with different planets as different terratories, like countries in earth. And maybe these two racces were at war with each other. After the master chief sees the rock he recovered from Cote d'Azur durring an after mission briefing in the novel "The Fall Of Reach", he thinks to himself:
Deja had taught the Spartans about the Aztecs-how Cortes with superior tactics and technology had nearly obliterated an entire race.
I know that this refers to the human-covenent war, but it could also refere to a war between the Forerunners and Precursors. But that raises the question, who were the Aztecs and who was the race that they almost wiped out? whatever the answer,this theory also leads to the de-evolution theory. The Precussors may have been overpowered by the Forerunners, and have fled to earth, in the process losing all their technological advancements, similarly to the Brutes. Also, if the Forerunners and Precursors were simply different groups of the same species, this would explain why master chief and other humans can interact with Forerunner technologies, even if they are decended from the Precussors, as they would probably have similar, though not exactly the same, technologies. I know this is not a perfect theory, so feel free to voice your opinion on my opinion.

  • 02.17.2010 6:45 PM PDT