Halo: Reach Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: A Suggestion: Remove Dual Wielding for Reach
  • Subject: A Suggestion: Remove Dual Wielding for Reach
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • of 3
Subject: A Suggestion: Remove Dual Wielding for Reach

I am an avid gamer with a passion to keep games fun and strategy provoking, rather than simply button mashing instant-reward games that plague the market nowadays. I'm not kind, but I'm rational, fair, and maybe, just maybe, somewhat intelligent.

I know that most of you who come to visit this thread based on the title will most likely disagree with me. However, I think that removing dual wielding will make Reach an over all better experience.

Somethings to know before hand, first of all, I am a "MLG" kid if do not know already. Second, keep the debate/discussion mature and in a on topic manner.

Now onto my main point.

I believe that dual wielding should be removed from Reach. First of all, if Bungie wants to keep the story lines accuracy, it should be removed. In Halo 2, the updated armor allowed the ability to dual wield. Second of all, if Bungie wishes to keep the game more realistic, a idea they seem to lean towards quite a bit, it is unrealistic to dual wield to sub machine guns. It is hard enough for one SMG, seeing how much recoil there is.

I will update this thread when I get a chance.

  • 09.17.2009 6:02 PM PDT

The Bring Back Bloodgulch Group have many members looking for more its kind of an unofficial petition to Bungie to bring back Bloodgulch in Reach http://www.bungie.net/fanclub/bx3g/Group/GroupHome.aspx

I think they need to make duel wielding fun and worth it again.... Just like in Halo Dos

  • 09.17.2009 6:15 PM PDT

PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME GROUP INVITATIONS

The Halo REACH Script (post thoughts in thread)

Writing Lead of Whisper Studios. Check out Heron!

Look... I'm on bungiepedia!

Remove it. Agreed.

  • 09.17.2009 6:18 PM PDT

http://achievementgen.info/view.php?ach=22555

I don't mind it in multiplayer, but in campaign it would make a lot of sense not to have it in.
If someone can pick up a turret then walk around gunning people down, you can surely dual wield SMG's It would make sense in multiplayer.

  • 09.17.2009 6:20 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

ah i never use duel anyway so it doesnt matter to me

  • 09.17.2009 6:20 PM PDT

"Everything works itself out. The only thing that matters is whether you want it to or not."

Last Refuge - Operation Phoenix is in effect. From the ashes, we will rise.

I'm pretty sure they should keep Dual-wielding in Reach, because you're playing as a Spartan. Even if ODST doesn't have dual-wielding, Reach should.

  • 09.17.2009 6:22 PM PDT

PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME GROUP INVITATIONS

The Halo REACH Script (post thoughts in thread)

Writing Lead of Whisper Studios. Check out Heron!

Look... I'm on bungiepedia!

Posted by: ShadowScythe159
I don't mind it in multiplayer, but in campaign it would make a lot of sense not to have it in.
If someone can pick up a turret then walk around gunning people down, you can surely dual wield SMG's It would make sense in multiplayer.
It's not about realism. It's about gameplay. Dual wielding as it exists in H2 and 3 breaks the gameplay because the weapons need to be nerfed and randomized to allow it in.

  • 09.17.2009 6:24 PM PDT

"Everything works itself out. The only thing that matters is whether you want it to or not."

Last Refuge - Operation Phoenix is in effect. From the ashes, we will rise.

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: ShadowScythe159
I don't mind it in multiplayer, but in campaign it would make a lot of sense not to have it in.
If someone can pick up a turret then walk around gunning people down, you can surely dual wield SMG's It would make sense in multiplayer.
It's not about realism. It's about gameplay. Dual wielding as it exists in H2 and 3 breaks the gameplay because the weapons need to be nerfed and randomized to allow it in.


I don't think the dual-wielded weapons need to be nerfed at all. They're all relatively weak on their own, so dual-wielding is the answer to their weakness. It doesn't make them really that strong, although for close range they can be quite the powerful weapons.

  • 09.17.2009 6:26 PM PDT

http://achievementgen.info/view.php?ach=22555

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: ShadowScythe159
I don't mind it in multiplayer, but in campaign it would make a lot of sense not to have it in.
If someone can pick up a turret then walk around gunning people down, you can surely dual wield SMG's It would make sense in multiplayer.
It's not about realism. It's about gameplay. Dual wielding as it exists in H2 and 3 breaks the gameplay because the weapons need to be nerfed and randomized to allow it in.

But, Bungie has done a good job with that already, sure it's a little odd with the guns being nerfed when dual wielded but like you said, it's for gameplay.

  • 09.17.2009 6:27 PM PDT

I thought you wanted this Cheehwawa..

  • 09.17.2009 6:30 PM PDT

Recoil is not an issue for spartans. So that reson for removing it is gone, As for the updated armor... A normal human could hold two guns reloading is impossible but it is a game.

I like the option to dule weild. getting rid of it would be retarted. What needs to go is the BR. becasue all anyone uses(Including me) is that BR. Every other weapon is totaly unused becaue of the BR.

  • 09.17.2009 6:31 PM PDT

PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME GROUP INVITATIONS

The Halo REACH Script (post thoughts in thread)

Writing Lead of Whisper Studios. Check out Heron!

Look... I'm on bungiepedia!

Posted by: Council Elite 12
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: ShadowScythe159
I don't mind it in multiplayer, but in campaign it would make a lot of sense not to have it in.
If someone can pick up a turret then walk around gunning people down, you can surely dual wield SMG's It would make sense in multiplayer.
It's not about realism. It's about gameplay. Dual wielding as it exists in H2 and 3 breaks the gameplay because the weapons need to be nerfed and randomized to allow it in.


I don't think the dual-wielded weapons need to be nerfed at all. They're all relatively weak on their own, so dual-wielding is the answer to their weakness. It doesn't make them really that strong, although for close range they can be quite the powerful weapons.
The fact that they're weak on their own is how it breaks the game balance... why should you have to pick up two guns to do any damage? Remember way back in Halo 1 when we could actually get kills with the PP and PR?

[Edited on 09.17.2009 6:33 PM PDT]

  • 09.17.2009 6:33 PM PDT

For every action, there is an equal and opposite airstrike.

Posted by: Council Elite 12
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: ShadowScythe159
I don't mind it in multiplayer, but in campaign it would make a lot of sense not to have it in.
If someone can pick up a turret then walk around gunning people down, you can surely dual wield SMG's It would make sense in multiplayer.
It's not about realism. It's about gameplay. Dual wielding as it exists in H2 and 3 breaks the gameplay because the weapons need to be nerfed and randomized to allow it in.


I don't think the dual-wielded weapons need to be nerfed at all. They're all relatively weak on their own, so dual-wielding is the answer to their weakness. It doesn't make them really that strong, although for close range they can be quite the powerful weapons.



Agreed. There was no point nerfing the power output from the sidearms. I have two guns, I should do twice the damage. On the flipside, my reload is much slower, meleeing disrupts the dual wield and greandes and equipment cannot be used - these are all expected. I wouldn't mind a slight accuracy penalty, such as the crosshair becoming like a venm diagram, where each gun's reticule is off-centre but they overlap slightly, would be fine.

After all, the wieldier is no longer holding the gun to their eye or have it in the center of their body so why is the crosshair still in the center?

  • 09.17.2009 6:35 PM PDT

PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME GROUP INVITATIONS

The Halo REACH Script (post thoughts in thread)

Writing Lead of Whisper Studios. Check out Heron!

Look... I'm on bungiepedia!

Posted by: TW InKoGnIto
I thought you wanted this Cheehwawa..
When I say "remove dual wielding" I really mean
remove dual wielding as it exists in Halo 2 and 3, and if it were to return, it should be as Inkognito suggested it" ... I'm just lazy :D

  • 09.17.2009 6:35 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Posted by: BIGNERENT
Recoil is not an issue for spartans. So that reson for removing it is gone, As for the updated armor... A normal human could hold two guns reloading is impossible but it is a game.

I like the option to dule weild. getting rid of it would be retarted. What needs to go is the BR. becasue all anyone uses(Including me) is that BR. Every other weapon is totaly unused becaue of the BR.
Well, that's because it's the only versatile weapon in the game, if every other weapon was versatile, there wouldn't be a problem...

...the problem is dual-wielding. Weapons that were once powerful, unique, and versatile, became worthless. Look at the Plasma Rifle...wait no, look at the Plasma Pistol in Halo 1. That gun was worth using. Charged shots actually did damage, and it didn't take like twenty regular shots to kill. Not to mention the useful stun effect.



[Edited on 09.17.2009 6:37 PM PDT]

  • 09.17.2009 6:36 PM PDT

"Everything works itself out. The only thing that matters is whether you want it to or not."

Last Refuge - Operation Phoenix is in effect. From the ashes, we will rise.

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: Council Elite 12
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: ShadowScythe159
I don't mind it in multiplayer, but in campaign it would make a lot of sense not to have it in.
If someone can pick up a turret then walk around gunning people down, you can surely dual wield SMG's It would make sense in multiplayer.
It's not about realism. It's about gameplay. Dual wielding as it exists in H2 and 3 breaks the gameplay because the weapons need to be nerfed and randomized to allow it in.


I don't think the dual-wielded weapons need to be nerfed at all. They're all relatively weak on their own, so dual-wielding is the answer to their weakness. It doesn't make them really that strong, although for close range they can be quite the powerful weapons.
The fact that they're weak on their own is how it breaks the game balance... why should you have to pick up two guns to do any damage? Remember way back in Halo 1 when we could actually get kills with the PP and PR?


I believe you're exaggerating too much. The Plasma Pistol and Plasma Rifle are both useful and strong, but in different ways. Each weapon has its strengths and weaknesses. The Plasma Pistol, when charged up, can wipe out an entire energy shield or disable a vehicle. A Plasma Rifle quickly dispatches an enemy's shielding. Don't forget that you don't always need to dual-wield the same two weapons. Great combinations are those such as the PR and the SMG, the PR for shielding and SMG for killing. Dual-wielding is for using combinations of guns so that you can also have extra space as well.

  • 09.17.2009 6:36 PM PDT

PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME GROUP INVITATIONS

The Halo REACH Script (post thoughts in thread)

Writing Lead of Whisper Studios. Check out Heron!

Look... I'm on bungiepedia!

Posted by: ShadowScythe159
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: ShadowScythe159
I don't mind it in multiplayer, but in campaign it would make a lot of sense not to have it in.
If someone can pick up a turret then walk around gunning people down, you can surely dual wield SMG's It would make sense in multiplayer.
It's not about realism. It's about gameplay. Dual wielding as it exists in H2 and 3 breaks the gameplay because the weapons need to be nerfed and randomized to allow it in.

But, Bungie has done a good job with that already, sure it's a little odd with the guns being nerfed when dual wielded but like you said, it's for gameplay.
I don't mean they're nerfed when dualed, I mean they're nerfed period. The PR, for example, is worthless on its own in Halo 2 and Halo 3 because it's dual wieldable. The only thing it's good for is taking down shields. It's not useful at all for finishing a kill. In Halo 1 it was a versatile weapon which did more shield damage than human weapons, but still did enough health damage (and even had a headshot damage increase for more skilled aimers).

  • 09.17.2009 6:37 PM PDT

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
The fact that they're weak on their own is how it breaks the game balance... why should you have to pick up two guns to do any damage? Remember way back in Halo 1 when we could actually get kills with the PP and PR?



Have you ever picked up an SMG? It will destroy the AR at close range, And the plasma rifle. Two shots and a beat down will kill a guy. It is acualy two shot. I tried it. Someone killed me with two shots and a beatdown and I though "No way" But I tried it and it worked. The weapons are powerfull enough on their own and even more when there is two.
The problem is that all people use is the BR. People think all the guns are underpowered pices of crap because the BR is an overpowered killing mechine...

  • 09.17.2009 6:39 PM PDT

"Everything works itself out. The only thing that matters is whether you want it to or not."

Last Refuge - Operation Phoenix is in effect. From the ashes, we will rise.

Posted by: MLG CheehwawaI don't mean they're nerfed when dualed, I mean they're nerfed period. The PR, for example, is worthless on its own in Halo 2 and Halo 3 because it's dual wieldable. The only thing it's good for is taking down shields. It's not useful at all for finishing a kill. In Halo 1 it was a versatile weapon which did more shield damage than human weapons, but still did enough health damage (and even had a headshot damage increase for more skilled aimers).

You make it sounds like the Plasma Rifle isn't good for absolutely anything, and that taking down shields is worthless. Taking down shields is a major factor in deciding who lives and who dies. You take down the shielding, you have a window of opportunity to finish them off.

  • 09.17.2009 6:40 PM PDT

ISU Cyclones!

Oh I'm dual-wielding my S-M-Gs...

Seriously though? It's usually not that practical since grenade to the foot is usually used more often. But don't remove it. Dual SMG's on the Pit can be beastly if you maneuver to get the right amount of distance between you and the enemy.

  • 09.17.2009 6:43 PM PDT

PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME GROUP INVITATIONS

The Halo REACH Script (post thoughts in thread)

Writing Lead of Whisper Studios. Check out Heron!

Look... I'm on bungiepedia!

Posted by: Council Elite 12
I believe you're exaggerating too much. The Plasma Pistol and Plasma Rifle are both useful and strong, but in different ways. Each weapon has its strengths and weaknesses. The Plasma Pistol, when charged up, can wipe out an entire energy shield or disable a vehicle. A Plasma Rifle quickly dispatches an enemy's shielding. Don't forget that you don't always need to dual-wield the same two weapons. Great combinations are those such as the PR and the SMG, the PR for shielding and SMG for killing. Dual-wielding is for using combinations of guns so that you can also have extra space as well.
I'm not exaggerating... pick up a Plasma Rifle in Halo 2 or 3. Shoot someone with it while they're fighting back with another weapon. You WILL NOT kill them if the match is anywhere near evenly matched. Guaranteed. You NEED to pair the weapon with something else - melee, grenade, or a second gun, in order to gain a kill.

The PR in Halo 1, on the other hand, could actually be used to kill someone. Not just take down their shields so you can finish them off with a melee or headshot with another weapon. It was a good gun.

Same with the Plasma Pistol. In Halo 2 and 3 it is only worth using for taking down shields. It is 100% useless to use it against someone to try and kill them. It takes, what, 20 headshots to kill an unshielded opponent with it? In Halo 1 a few charged shots would kill someone. They don't kill in Halo 2 and 3. You could also kill someone in a few extra shots than the PR. It was a good weapon all-around. Versatile. Now it's only good for taking out shields.

Either way you have variety.

With DW weapons can be paired, but the drawback is that they are worthless past close range or used alone. Without DW weapons cannot be paired as conveniently, but they can be more versatile (used on more situations) and more often, so there is more variety in combat.

I think that the latter form of variety is much more fun and rewarding...

  • 09.17.2009 6:46 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Posted by: BIGNERENT
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
The fact that they're weak on their own is how it breaks the game balance... why should you have to pick up two guns to do any damage? Remember way back in Halo 1 when we could actually get kills with the PP and PR?



Have you ever picked up an SMG? It will destroy the AR at close range, And the plasma rifle. Two shots and a beat down will kill a guy. It is acualy two shot. I tried it. Someone killed me with two shots and a beatdown and I though "No way" But I tried it and it worked. The weapons are powerfull enough on their own and even more when there is two.
The problem is that all people use is the BR. People think all the guns are underpowered pices of crap because the BR is an overpowered killing mechine...
Okay, let's say they take out the BR. There is no weapon that bridges the short-long range gap. There is no weapon that can ping snipers at a distance. You'd just be complaining about the Sniper Rifle, or should they remove that too?

Do you see where I'm getting at? Despite your hatred for it, the BR is essential weapon for Halo.

  • 09.17.2009 6:46 PM PDT
  • gamertag:
  • user homepage:
  • last post: 01.01.0001 12:00 AM PDT

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: Council Elite 12
I believe you're exaggerating too much. The Plasma Pistol and Plasma Rifle are both useful and strong, but in different ways. Each weapon has its strengths and weaknesses. The Plasma Pistol, when charged up, can wipe out an entire energy shield or disable a vehicle. A Plasma Rifle quickly dispatches an enemy's shielding. Don't forget that you don't always need to dual-wield the same two weapons. Great combinations are those such as the PR and the SMG, the PR for shielding and SMG for killing. Dual-wielding is for using combinations of guns so that you can also have extra space as well.
I'm not exaggerating... pick up a Plasma Rifle in Halo 2 or 3. Shoot someone with it while they're fighting back with another weapon. You WILL NOT kill them if the match is anywhere near evenly matched. Guaranteed. You NEED to pair the weapon with something else - melee, grenade, or a second gun, in order to gain a kill.

The PR in Halo 1, on the other hand, could actually be used to kill someone. Not just take down their shields so you can finish them off with a melee or headshot with another weapon. It was a good gun.

Same with the Plasma Pistol. In Halo 2 and 3 it is only worth using for taking down shields. It is 100% useless to use it against someone to try and kill them. It takes, what, 20 headshots to kill an unshielded opponent with it? In Halo 1 a few charged shots would kill someone. They don't kill in Halo 2 and 3. You could also kill someone in a few extra shots than the PR. It was a good weapon all-around. Versatile. Now it's only good for taking out shields.

Either way you have variety.

With DW weapons can be paired, but the drawback is that they are worthless past close range or used alone. Without DW weapons cannot be paired as conveniently, but they can be more versatile (used on more situations) and more often, so there is more variety in combat.

I think that the latter form of variety is much more fun and rewarding...
This.

100000x this.

  • 09.17.2009 6:46 PM PDT

Ah I see.

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Posted by: TW InKoGnIto
I thought you wanted this Cheehwawa..
When I say "remove dual wielding" I really mean
remove dual wielding as it exists in Halo 2 and 3, and if it were to return, it should be as Inkognito suggested it" ... I'm just lazy :D

  • 09.17.2009 6:47 PM PDT

  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • of 3