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Subject: Why is Bungie so bad at writing back story for coop players?

Reach MMO. Here's to hoping.

And the people that believe "the hardcore playlists would be more popular if the rules were strictly MLG" can come off it, now. If you're not willing to support something close to your own setup, there's no reason for us to believe that cloning our own lists and stripping the variety down will attract more people. -- Shishka, Bungie.net

I can't tell if they are lazy or just poor writers, but it has always bothered me how Bungie gives little to no backstory or explaination to the other 3 coop players who you are blasting away with.

With ODST I thought there would be an obvious fix to this problem as there was already a squad in place.

But wouldn't you know, you play as one squad member at a time, and your other 3 player are just clones with extra guns I guess. Terrible.

So is Bungie actually going to figure it out with Reach and make the other three players mean something? Does anyone care or agree?

Just my thoughts, any others?

  • 09.29.2009 10:47 AM PDT

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it is just to keep things simple, a rule in developing things: K.I.S.S. Keep. it. simple. stupid. so they can maximise fun and not require 4 players to play the games campaign.

also the elites from halo 3, there you have just got problem solved my friend!

  • 09.29.2009 10:54 AM PDT

Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum viditur.

I can see your point. However in ODST, I thought it allowed for the co-op player to feel like they're the main character as well, as opposed to giving them a different personality and being just a sidekick.

[Edited on 09.29.2009 10:58 AM PDT]

  • 09.29.2009 10:56 AM PDT

If there are many spartans in reach shouldnt we be able to just play as our charcters from matchmaking

  • 09.29.2009 11:10 AM PDT

Excellent. Nod grows stronger by your victories.

Posted by: Tyguy101
I can't tell if they are lazy or just poor writers, but it has always bothered me how Bungie gives little to no backstory or explaination to the other 3 coop players who you are blasting away with.

With ODST I thought there would be an obvious fix to this problem as there was already a squad in place.

But wouldn't you know, you play as one squad member at a time, and your other 3 player are just clones with extra guns I guess. Terrible.

So is Bungie actually going to figure it out with Reach and make the other three players mean something? Does anyone care or agree?

Just my thoughts, any others?



bungie DID give you a backstory to "the other 3 people that you were blasting away with" in Halo 3. they didn't need to in odst.

  • 09.29.2009 11:39 AM PDT

Posted by: Duardo
I'd love to be a 10 year old and tell my mom I'm going on an adventure out into the world catching Pokemon, with her full support. Never mind the fact that there are rapists, criminals, and murders out there, or the fact that I may get killed by a Pokemon.

Luckily I have Pikachu.

It's a -blam!- videogame. Who cares? Be thankfull the game even has co-op becuase most games don't.

  • 09.29.2009 11:45 AM PDT

acctully every game i own except svr 08 has co-op but svr 09 has

  • 09.29.2009 11:48 AM PDT

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I am.......
312.
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XXXXXXX, XX, 2XXX - August 30, 2552

The tru7h is that there were many other ODST's in the drop other than the main six. Players 2, 3, and 4 are the "Other" ODSTs.

  • 09.29.2009 11:54 AM PDT

Written by a known Swedish Guy.

How any games do you have then? 4? 5?

  • 09.29.2009 11:55 AM PDT

Doc: "i'm a pacifist"
Caboose: "your a thing that babies suck on?"
Tucker: "no dude, that's a pedephile"
Church: "tucker, i think he means a pacifier"

Kind of hard to write seperate iterations of the campaign for the sake of having another player, then two more, then three more, it's redundant, not to mention tedious.

I understand the gripe, but for something like this it's not overly important. Look at it this way, all players are playing as the Rookie, just with other people. The POV is the same for everyone, who is to dictate who get's the side story? As mentioned above it's easier just to keep it simple.

  • 09.29.2009 11:57 AM PDT

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The Halo REACH Script (post thoughts in thread)

Writing Lead of Whisper Studios. Check out Heron!

Look... I'm on bungiepedia!

In REACH, the story should focus around a 5-man squad of Spartans from Team Beta. Each squad member should be a different "Class" like the Spartans of Blue Team in the novel had (sniper, scout, assault, etc.) but obviously we would be Spartans of Red Team.

Each should have their own personalities, strengths and weaknesses, and Spartan-259 is your single player character. He could issue basic squad commands (move here, reform on me, etc.). Maybe like in Brute Force you could switch between squad members on the fly.

This would allow for 5 player coop as well.

  • 09.29.2009 12:01 PM PDT
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  • Intrepid Legendary Member

Hello! I'm a male!

call of brute force vegas?

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
In REACH, the story should focus around a 5-man squad of Spartans from Team Beta. Each squad member should be a different "Class" like the Spartans of Blue Team in the novel had (sniper, scout, assault, etc.) but obviously we would be Spartans of Red Team.

Each should have their own personalities, strengths and weaknesses, and Spartan-259 is your single player character. He could issue basic squad commands (move here, reform on me, etc.). Maybe like in Brute Force you could switch between squad members on the fly.

This would allow for 5 player coop as well.

  • 09.29.2009 12:10 PM PDT

PLEASE DO NOT SEND ME GROUP INVITATIONS

The Halo REACH Script (post thoughts in thread)

Writing Lead of Whisper Studios. Check out Heron!

Look... I'm on bungiepedia!

Posted by: PMR NYM
call of brute force vegas?

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
In REACH, the story should focus around a 5-man squad of Spartans from Team Beta. Each squad member should be a different "Class" like the Spartans of Blue Team in the novel had (sniper, scout, assault, etc.) but obviously we would be Spartans of Red Team.

Each should have their own personalities, strengths and weaknesses, and Spartan-259 is your single player character. He could issue basic squad commands (move here, reform on me, etc.). Maybe like in Brute Force you could switch between squad members on the fly.

This would allow for 5 player coop as well.
omg bungie wold be totelly copiing all other games if they chang anything

Did you know that the Spartans had specialties? CLASSES. Kelly was a scout. Linda a Sniper. John an average "assault" soldier. Sam a heavy explosives expert. Will a close range expert. Li a zero-Gee master. etc. so if anything, Bungie would be copying... Bungie.

Not Brute Force. Not Call of Duty (I have absolutely no idea how you think my idea draws from COD) or Vegas (Vegas is a squad-dependent game, this would be the classic Halo with the ability to tell your guys to move up so they don't stand behind your Scorpion for 20 minutes while you try to get them to hop on)

[Edited on 09.29.2009 12:15 PM PDT]

  • 09.29.2009 12:15 PM PDT

Reach MMO. Here's to hoping.

And the people that believe "the hardcore playlists would be more popular if the rules were strictly MLG" can come off it, now. If you're not willing to support something close to your own setup, there's no reason for us to believe that cloning our own lists and stripping the variety down will attract more people. -- Shishka, Bungie.net

Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
In REACH, the story should focus around a 5-man squad of Spartans from Team Beta. Each squad member should be a different "Class" like the Spartans of Blue Team in the novel had (sniper, scout, assault, etc.) but obviously we would be Spartans of Red Team.

Each should have their own personalities, strengths and weaknesses, and Spartan-259 is your single player character. He could issue basic squad commands (move here, reform on me, etc.). Maybe like in Brute Force you could switch between squad members on the fly.

This would allow for 5 player coop as well.


You would assume Bungie would be smart enough to do something like this. But look at ODST, it was set up just as well for such a campaign, but all we got was faceless teammates.

  • 09.29.2009 12:39 PM PDT

~Cheers~

You always see the story from the point of view of the character you are playing as. It doesn't bother me at all playing as clones, because, adding up to three completely new stories just for coop would be way too much work.

  • 09.29.2009 1:29 PM PDT

Reach MMO. Here's to hoping.

And the people that believe "the hardcore playlists would be more popular if the rules were strictly MLG" can come off it, now. If you're not willing to support something close to your own setup, there's no reason for us to believe that cloning our own lists and stripping the variety down will attract more people. -- Shishka, Bungie.net

Posted by: kicktothethroat
You always see the story from the point of view of the character you are playing as. It doesn't bother me at all playing as clones, because, adding up to three completely new stories just for coop would be way too much work.


Halo: CE and H2 didn't provide an opportunity for it. H3 tried to incorporate it, but it was an afterthought.

ODST failed, but was set up prefectly.

Reach is set up perfectly and it really isn't that big of a deal to do it. I really would rather run around with 3-4 AI guys that are with you when you play solo and are characters that your coop teammates fill.

  • 09.29.2009 2:03 PM PDT

Reach MMO. Here's to hoping.

And the people that believe "the hardcore playlists would be more popular if the rules were strictly MLG" can come off it, now. If you're not willing to support something close to your own setup, there's no reason for us to believe that cloning our own lists and stripping the variety down will attract more people. -- Shishka, Bungie.net

Posted by: SweetTRIX
Kind of hard to write seperate iterations of the campaign for the sake of having another player, then two more, then three more, it's redundant, not to mention tedious.

I understand the gripe, but for something like this it's not overly important. Look at it this way, all players are playing as the Rookie, just with other people. The POV is the same for everyone, who is to dictate who get's the side story? As mentioned above it's easier just to keep it simple.


The campaign doesn't need to change just to give the other players backstories and purpose.

  • 09.30.2009 2:10 PM PDT

Doc: "i'm a pacifist"
Caboose: "your a thing that babies suck on?"
Tucker: "no dude, that's a pedephile"
Church: "tucker, i think he means a pacifier"

Posted by: Tyguy101
Posted by: SweetTRIX
Kind of hard to write seperate iterations of the campaign for the sake of having another player, then two more, then three more, it's redundant, not to mention tedious.

I understand the gripe, but for something like this it's not overly important. Look at it this way, all players are playing as the Rookie, just with other people. The POV is the same for everyone, who is to dictate who get's the side story? As mentioned above it's easier just to keep it simple.


The campaign doesn't need to change just to give the other players backstories and purpose.


Again, I see what your saying, but the type of campaign that ODST is makes it a little difficult to do so effectively. The campaign is supposed to be played through the POV of one ODST. Co-op will definately effect that, but forcing in stories for added characters just because seems a little unneccessary.

  • 09.30.2009 2:34 PM PDT

Reach MMO. Here's to hoping.

And the people that believe "the hardcore playlists would be more popular if the rules were strictly MLG" can come off it, now. If you're not willing to support something close to your own setup, there's no reason for us to believe that cloning our own lists and stripping the variety down will attract more people. -- Shishka, Bungie.net

Posted by: SweetTRIX
Posted by: Tyguy101
Posted by: SweetTRIX
Kind of hard to write seperate iterations of the campaign for the sake of having another player, then two more, then three more, it's redundant, not to mention tedious.

I understand the gripe, but for something like this it's not overly important. Look at it this way, all players are playing as the Rookie, just with other people. The POV is the same for everyone, who is to dictate who get's the side story? As mentioned above it's easier just to keep it simple.


The campaign doesn't need to change just to give the other players backstories and purpose.


Again, I see what your saying, but the type of campaign that ODST is makes it a little difficult to do so effectively. The campaign is supposed to be played through the POV of one ODST. Co-op will definately effect that, but forcing in stories for added characters just because seems a little unneccessary.


That is because that is the way Bungie made the campaign. It didn't need to be that way, they just made it that way. They could have made it so 4 pods separated at once and then you would have small squad. Or as you picked up other ODST's the other players filled those spots.

It isn't a hard concept 90% of other coop campaigns incorporate the other players.

  • 10.01.2009 7:03 AM PDT
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Posted by: Tyguy101
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
In REACH, the story should focus around a 5-man squad of Spartans from Team Beta. Each squad member should be a different "Class" like the Spartans of Blue Team in the novel had (sniper, scout, assault, etc.) but obviously we would be Spartans of Red Team.

Each should have their own personalities, strengths and weaknesses, and Spartan-259 is your single player character. He could issue basic squad commands (move here, reform on me, etc.). Maybe like in Brute Force you could switch between squad members on the fly.

This would allow for 5 player coop as well.


You would assume Bungie would be smart enough to do something like this. But look at ODST, it was set up just as well for such a campaign, but all we got was faceless teammates.


No, playing as the Rookie was supposed to be an 'Alone in a big city' feel. How do you have that atmosphere with 3 other ODSTs running around with you?

  • 10.01.2009 7:10 AM PDT

Reach MMO. Here's to hoping.

And the people that believe "the hardcore playlists would be more popular if the rules were strictly MLG" can come off it, now. If you're not willing to support something close to your own setup, there's no reason for us to believe that cloning our own lists and stripping the variety down will attract more people. -- Shishka, Bungie.net

Posted by: jordanJ
Posted by: Tyguy101
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
In REACH, the story should focus around a 5-man squad of Spartans from Team Beta. Each squad member should be a different "Class" like the Spartans of Blue Team in the novel had (sniper, scout, assault, etc.) but obviously we would be Spartans of Red Team.

Each should have their own personalities, strengths and weaknesses, and Spartan-259 is your single player character. He could issue basic squad commands (move here, reform on me, etc.). Maybe like in Brute Force you could switch between squad members on the fly.

This would allow for 5 player coop as well.


You would assume Bungie would be smart enough to do something like this. But look at ODST, it was set up just as well for such a campaign, but all we got was faceless teammates.


No, playing as the Rookie was supposed to be an 'Alone in a big city' feel. How do you have that atmosphere with 3 other ODSTs running around with you?


I certainly didn't get that alone in the big city 'feeling' when I was running around with my 3 other teammates.

You have just shown the reason why it is so annoying to me. They continue to make single player campaigns and then throw coop in as an afterthought.

  • 10.01.2009 7:16 AM PDT
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Posted by: Tyguy101
Posted by: jordanJ
Posted by: Tyguy101
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
In REACH, the story should focus around a 5-man squad of Spartans from Team Beta. Each squad member should be a different "Class" like the Spartans of Blue Team in the novel had (sniper, scout, assault, etc.) but obviously we would be Spartans of Red Team.

Each should have their own personalities, strengths and weaknesses, and Spartan-259 is your single player character. He could issue basic squad commands (move here, reform on me, etc.). Maybe like in Brute Force you could switch between squad members on the fly.

This would allow for 5 player coop as well.


You would assume Bungie would be smart enough to do something like this. But look at ODST, it was set up just as well for such a campaign, but all we got was faceless teammates.


No, playing as the Rookie was supposed to be an 'Alone in a big city' feel. How do you have that atmosphere with 3 other ODSTs running around with you?


I certainly didn't get that alone in the big city 'feeling' when I was running around with my 3 other teammates.

You have just shown the reason why it is so annoying to me. They continue to make single player campaigns and then throw coop in as an afterthought.


Then play it Solo!?

What do you want from ODST? It's a game meant to be played by yourself, you can easily tell that, Co-Op is just an afterthought and you should be gratefull it even has it, most games don't.

Firefight is the obvious exception to this but you're obviously focused on the campaign, not multiplayer.

  • 10.01.2009 7:19 AM PDT

Reach MMO. Here's to hoping.

And the people that believe "the hardcore playlists would be more popular if the rules were strictly MLG" can come off it, now. If you're not willing to support something close to your own setup, there's no reason for us to believe that cloning our own lists and stripping the variety down will attract more people. -- Shishka, Bungie.net

Posted by: jordanJ

Then play it Solo!?

What do you want from ODST? It's a game meant to be played by yourself, you can easily tell that, Co-Op is just an afterthought and you should be gratefull it even has it, most games don't.

Firefight is the obvious exception to this but you're obviously focused on the campaign, not multiplayer.


It's meant to be played by yourself...hmmmm. Haven't ever heard that from Bungie. My point is that is about time that Bungie makes 4 player coop better. It is about time I feel like a character when I am playing with my friends.

  • 10.02.2009 8:48 AM PDT

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