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This topic has moved here: Subject: Single shot BR for Campaign, Burst for Multiplayer. What do you think?
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Subject: Single shot BR for Campaign, Burst for Multiplayer. What do you think?

Here’s what Luke had to say about the differences in treatment between the Spartans and Elites in Reach:

“Instead of piece-by-piece customization like the Spartans, Elite customization is a full model swap with models selected from the various Elite classes appearing throughout the Campaign. There are all kinds of reasons for this, not the least of which is our continued emphasis on the Spartan as your identity in Reach.”

The single shot weapon will be the carbine.

Keep the BR the way it is in Halo 3, with a 3-4x scope and more time between bursts.

  • 10.10.2009 12:26 PM PDT
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Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Ummmm. MLG played Halo before the BR was introduced. Back then the midrange weapon (Pistol) was single shot, not burst. If anything, burst fire ruined what MLG had going due to it being so random online.


I think that the BR made the halo MLG community what it is today.

  • 10.10.2009 12:26 PM PDT

;)

You mean the carbine right?

  • 10.10.2009 12:46 PM PDT

Go Rams and Missouri!

I have an idea. Give the BR a function where you choose between single-shot and burst. However, leave it as Campaign only. For multiplayer you would have the normal BR. The reason for that is because it would be useless. The only reason I propose making a single-shot function for Campaign is so that it can be more efficient and accurate against Grunts, Jackals, and Drones, but then changed to a burst for bigger enemies like Elites and Hunters.

  • 10.10.2009 12:48 PM PDT

I am open to doing free clan tags for anyone. Contact me on my deviant art profile through a note and NOT on my comments page as they will not be acknowledged.

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Reverse roles, keep the three-shot burst for campaign and make a silenced one shot battle rifle for MP.

And I mean SILENCED!

  • 10.10.2009 12:55 PM PDT
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I'm just going to copy and paste my response:

1. Being a burst weapon is fine. Heck, we have automatic weapons in Halo. The problem with this burst weapon, however, is that it's headshot capable. Think about SWAT and how easy it is to get headshots on unshielded people as opposed to using a single magnum or carbine. BRs allow you to swipe shoot and it makes headshotting take 0 skill.

2. But what about all those times you're in an epic battle with someone because you can't get the headshot at the range you're at? Doesn't that mean it does take aim? Not at all. Just think about all the complaints about the BR's accuracy. It is random at all but the closest medium range situations (it starts to go at a distance from gold to in front of snipe on guardian). This randomness makes for imprecise battles and can cause the victor not to be the one with the most skill, but the one who got the lucky break.

3. Of course a lot of weapons work that way, and we don't want a sniper, right? Well, how many snipers take 12 bullets to kill? The BR and carbine are both intended to be medium/medium-long weapons. When you make the core weaponset (those weapons which control the map the best, but aren't power weapons - so you can find them more readily)random, it means that you are randomizing the most used guns in the game. When you do that, it means you downplay skill. So how can you make a core weapon be just that - a great map controlling weapon - but one that is not a sniper and overpowered? I'll tell you.

What needs to be done for a headshot capable, core weapon, is to not have burst, first of all. When that's completed, the accuracy needs to be bumped up to almost perfect. On top of that, the zoom may be toned down just a bit, or maybe kept the same. Think about how hard it would be to headshot someone across standoff, even if the BR accuracy was almost perfect. The lack of zoom on the reticule makes it harder to hit targets because you're not zoomed in. The same thing applies to any of you hunters out there. You know what I'm talking about, when you move from your 22 with the dinky scope to your 243 with the massive scope.

This will allow the BR to be a skilled, accurate core weapon, but it will actually make it harder to get headshots at range (you can't get lucky with a random burst), but doable with skill. This not only makes the gameplay much better and more consistent, but it makes the skill gap larger too, which would be great. Compare the amount of those in the 40s from H3 to H2. It's gross.

4. Finally, if you still think the BR would be like a sniper, think about this. If the BR were made to be single fire, you would then technically need 12 bullets to kill. I think that's a little too much, and should either bump up the rate of fire, or move it down to 8 shots to kill (same as carbine). The big thing with these tweaks are to play with the power and rate of fire to make the BR kill in the amount of time you want it to be able to kill (around the time it kills now). With this and the single shot implemented, you have to skillfully land 8-12 different shots, rather than allow the burst to help you get lucky (or unlucky) at times.

Yes, that sounds similar to the carbine, and it is. However, what weapons don't have clones? Also, you could manipulate the rate of fire and/or power to make it kill in less/more shots but with the same speed, making it feel different than the carbine. Or, just take away the HS capability, bump up the power a little (so it takes 6 bursts or so to kill to the body) and now you have a medium ranged weapon that would suck at CQ, but still pings snipers out at medium ranges and can kill. It wouldn't be as accurate as the carbine, giving the carbine its own little niche.

5. I think the BR, and other long range weapons should have decreased melee damage, forcing them to play at their distances rather than being a jack of all trades (melee - burst to head = death). This would create a more balanced BR and allow for more tactical thinking in terms of weapon selection.

As it stands, the current BR is very used because it's a core weapon, it's powerful, and it's prevalent. However, it is a random, lucky, and easy weapon (in terms of HS anyway). They need to fix it to be a fine tuned, sklled, consistent weapon that will increase the skill gap. We need a core weapon, but it should not be the BR as it is now.

[Edited on 10.10.2009 1:00 PM PDT]

  • 10.10.2009 12:56 PM PDT
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Posted by: ClaySomeMore
Posted by: MLG Cheehwawa
Ummmm. MLG played Halo before the BR was introduced. Back then the midrange weapon (Pistol) was single shot, not burst. If anything, burst fire ruined what MLG had going due to it being so random online.


I think that the BR made the halo MLG community what it is today.


I agree to an extent. But you have to remember that it was the Halo 2 BR that made the MLG community. And what's the difference? The H2 BR was almost like a single shot weapon. Yes, it had a burst, but due to the magnetism and tight spread of the burst, all of the bullets landed quite precisely. It was still a cheap way to get a HS on an unshielded person because swipe shooting was very easy with the burst (manipulating the spread on the burst by sweeping while shooting, maximizing your chance for a headshot instead of having to be precise).

Today, the MLG community doesn't love the BR as much as everyone thinks. From my understanding, they hate the randomness it brings to the table with an imprecise burst. They would much rather have a precise weapon, like the one in H2. So why don't they use carbines? Well, even carbines have a random spread on the successive shots, but on top of that, you can't even use carbines in the game. I guarantee you MLG would much rather have an accurate weapon (which is typically characterized by single shot weapons - what other weapon do you know that's HS capable in Halo and fires multiple bullets in a burst?).

  • 10.10.2009 1:06 PM PDT
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Posted by: ClaySomeMore
There has been alot of threads about how to handle the BR for Reach.

My idea, is to have a Prototype style BR with single shot, and the regular 3-burst BR for multiplayer, to make sure stuff like MLG is not ruined.

Please vote...


The reasoning behind keeping the BR in MP as it is now shouldn't be to keep MLG alive. MLG would survive regardless of the BR, as would all competitive Halo gaming, although it wouldn't be at the caliber it is now were the BR to be removed, and there are far better reasons for keeping the BR as it is now than MLG. I see no reason to alter the BR, make it 1 shot and it's exactly like the pistol but with a greater range, more accuracy and damage. I say keep it the same.

  • 10.10.2009 1:11 PM PDT

I'm xAssault12x, and I love the Halo Universe. Discussion please!

Why not both?

I have details in my thread. Here's the link. I'm too lazy to type it out.

http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=37737640

  • 10.10.2009 1:50 PM PDT

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