Halo: Reach Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: CTF flag bouncing
  • Subject: CTF flag bouncing

The best defense is a good one.

what does this have to do with reach they havent even said if there will be ctf in reach (though i thinks there will)

  • 10.19.2009 2:13 PM PDT

I don't want to join your group.

"In science one tries to tell people, in such a way as to be understood by everyone, something that no one ever knew before. But in poetry, it's the exact opposite." - Paul Dirac

Posted by: sweetgirl12
To get an idea if it is better with or without?
It's better without it,but i have to prove it.
which is something writing can't do.

That really doesn't explain much.

Let's start with baby steps.

What does the word "balance" mean to you, in the context of a video game?

  • 10.19.2009 2:14 PM PDT

I don't want to join your group.

"In science one tries to tell people, in such a way as to be understood by everyone, something that no one ever knew before. But in poetry, it's the exact opposite." - Paul Dirac

Posted by: sweetgirl12
Are you dumb i told you a number of times already the only way to test it is if bungie test it.
which is one of the many things i can't do.
Bungie has to test it!
Hence we find out what they learned when reach comes out.

That's not what I asked.

I simply want to know what your definition of the word "balance" is.

You used the word before, surely you know what it means?

  • 10.19.2009 2:19 PM PDT
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Posted by: Goat
Bungie, oh Bungie, oh Bungie,
Know what would really be fun, G?
I don’t wish to nag
But remake Coag,
Or die from a purple sword-lungie.

If you drop the flag in Halo 3, it plummets straight down.

I haven't witnessed anybody jumping and throwing the flag to run it faster, like they did in Halo 2. I've only seen people drop it, take a few steps, and then pick it back up. They're able to do that cause they're still right next to the flag.

  • 10.19.2009 2:21 PM PDT

Your Face!

SIP FTW Btw, You must Join or The Governator will Come after you!

http://www.bungie.net/fanclub/sip/Group/GroupHome.aspx

i'd like this to be fixed too because constantly hearing:

"Flag Dropped Flag Taken Flag Dropped Flag Taken Flag Dropped Flag Taken Flag Dropped Flag Taken Flag Dropped Flag Taken Flag Dropped Flag Taken Flag Dropped Flag Taken Flag Dropped Flag Taken Flag Captured"

Gets on my nerves(not so much the capture part that is my sanctity) Bungie please fix this in reach

  • 10.19.2009 2:25 PM PDT

I don't want to join your group.

"In science one tries to tell people, in such a way as to be understood by everyone, something that no one ever knew before. But in poetry, it's the exact opposite." - Paul Dirac

Posted by: sweetgirl12
Definition: equalized.

So, if something is balanced in your eyes, it only means that it's equal to other things?

In what respect? Is it equal in every way?

Is the Assault Rifle not a balanced weapon, because it's not exactly equal to any other weapon?

  • 10.19.2009 2:26 PM PDT

I don't want to join your group.

"In science one tries to tell people, in such a way as to be understood by everyone, something that no one ever knew before. But in poetry, it's the exact opposite." - Paul Dirac

Posted by: sweetgirl12
Posted by: SilentStorm20
Posted by: sweetgirl12
Definition: equalized.

So, if something is balanced in your eyes, it only means that it's equal to other things?

In what respect? Is it equal in every way?

Is the Assault Rifle not a balanced weapon, because it's not exactly equal to any other weapon?


Balanced.
A br works better at longer ranges than a Ar.
A Ar works better at closer ranges than a Br.

Both have their weakness's.

Juggling the flag is faster than walking with the flag.
Walking with the flag is more stealthy than juggling the flag.

Why is this not as valid?

  • 10.19.2009 2:34 PM PDT

I am an avid gamer with a passion to keep games fun and strategy provoking, rather than simply button mashing instant-reward games that plague the market nowadays. I'm not kind, but I'm rational, fair, and maybe, just maybe, somewhat intelligent.

Posted by: sweetgirl12

Can you jump? yes.
Can you jump a fair distance? yes.
can jump onto that ledge? yes
can you use that ledge to hide? yes

Its been a problem for sometime much like this one.


It depends where the person jumped to be considered cheating. If the person jumped somewhere technically outside the map's layout,such as above the map, or the majority of where HLG's hide. Most of their spots were in fact outside of the map so to speak and were exploits of the boundaries and physics. So your point is invalid.

  • 10.19.2009 2:41 PM PDT

I don't want to join your group.

"In science one tries to tell people, in such a way as to be understood by everyone, something that no one ever knew before. But in poetry, it's the exact opposite." - Paul Dirac

Posted by: sweetgirl12
Posted by: SilentStorm20
Posted by: sweetgirl12


Balanced.
A br works better at longer ranges than a Ar.
A Ar works better at closer ranges than a Br.

Both have their weakness's.

Juggling the flag is faster than walking with the flag.
Walking with the flag is more stealthy than juggling the flag.

Why is this not as valid?


Hiding out of the map is easier than camping
camping gives more opportunity than hiding out of the map.

This is a case by case subject.

Again, you didn't answer my question. Why is it that my flag example is not valid, but your AR/BR explanation is?

Also, I'm not sure where you're going with your hiding example.

The previous two examples (AR/BR, flag) involve a dilemma. You're often faced with a choice between the AR and the BR, because they're the two most common spawning weapons in the game, and in AR start gametypes, there are BRs all over most maps to pick up.

When you're trying to capture a flag, you often face a dilemma as well. You can either juggle it or carry it.

I can't think of a situation where I face a choice between camping and hiding. There's always a third option.

Additionally, I'm not convinced that hiding out of the map is easier than camping. The jumps required to reach hiding locations are often very difficult.

It seems like you're trying to shoehorn an HLG example into the conversation where it doesn't quite fit, because you know how unpopular HLG is, and you (perhaps subconsciously) think that you can sway the argument by appealing to emotion.

So again, I ask: Why is it that my flag example is not valid, but your AR/BR explanation is?

  • 10.19.2009 2:48 PM PDT
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Power corrupts. Nuclear power corrupts nuclei.

"Flag bouncing" or whatever you like to call it (my friends and I dubbed it "Flag-tossing" some time ago) does make for an interesting debate. There are equal and opposite arguments on both sides for just about every issue.

If you're a tosser, you gain speed but give away your position, whereas if you're a holder, you lose speed but stay concealed. The built-in slow mechanic suggests you're supposed to be slow while holding the flag, but the physics system treats the flag like a weapon that can thrown--just like juggling weapons so you have 3 handy--allowing you to be fast. Overall, since both teams can do this and it's a very easy tactic to master, it's not so much an issue of fairness as whether or not we interpret it as intentional.

I didn't play Halo 2 CTF very much so I don't know if it did indeed carry over similarly from that game. If it did, it's hard to argue that Bungie didn't intend for it to still exist. However, simply not bothering with changing the flag's "throw" physics or with imposing an extra rule on the flag carrier (e.g. a 2-second slow after dropping) could have created an identical environment with no real intention of doing so. At this point, I think Bungie just realizes it's a mechanic and since the playing field is even and there's a tactical tradeoff, they allow it to persist since it's very characteristic of Halo CTF.

All that rambling garbage said, I still do agree with the OP. I find the constant announcer chatter annoying and think it's a glorified exploitation of the physics system, but still I do it myself to stay competitive (it's not really a moral issue for me lol). I'd like to see it removed in Reach. It would make the game more tactically appealing in the sense of building group dynamics and protecting the flag carrier.

  • 10.19.2009 2:49 PM PDT

Posted by: sweetgirl12
Posted by: SilentStorm20
Posted by: sweetgirl12
Posted by: SilentStorm20
Posted by: sweetgirl12
Definition: equalized.

So, if something is balanced in your eyes, it only means that it's equal to other things?

In what respect? Is it equal in every way?

Is the Assault Rifle not a balanced weapon, because it's not exactly equal to any other weapon?


Balanced.
A br works better at longer ranges than a Ar.
A Ar works better at closer ranges than a Br.

Both have their weakness's.

Juggling the flag is faster than walking with the flag.
Walking with the flag is more stealthy than juggling the flag.

Why is this not as valid?


Hiding out of the map is easier than camping
camping gives more opportunity than hiding out of the map.

This is a case by case subject.

Guys by now it looks like you two are just arguing to argue. Please at least get back on the topic which you have seemed to have veered away from. Thanks.

  • 10.19.2009 2:51 PM PDT

i like me...

Posted by: TriggerHappyNDB
"Flag bouncing" or whatever you like to call it (my friends and I dubbed it "Flag-tossing" some time ago) does make for an interesting debate. There are equal and opposite arguments on both sides for just about every issue.

If you're a tosser, you gain speed but give away your position, whereas if you're a holder, you lose speed but stay concealed. The built-in slow mechanic suggests you're supposed to be slow while holding the flag, but the physics system treats the flag like a weapon that can thrown--just like juggling weapons so you have 3 handy--allowing you to be fast. Overall, since both teams can do this and it's a very easy tactic to master, it's not so much an issue of fairness as whether or not we interpret it as intentional.

I didn't play Halo 2 CTF very much so I don't know if it did indeed carry over similarly from that game. If it did, it's hard to argue that Bungie didn't intend for it to still exist. However, simply not bothering with changing the flag's "throw" physics or with imposing an extra rule on the flag carrier (e.g. a 2-second slow after dropping) could have created an identical environment with no real intention of doing so. At this point, I think Bungie just realizes it's a mechanic and since the playing field is even and there's a tactical tradeoff, they allow it to persist since it's very characteristic of Halo CTF.

All that rambling garbage said, I still do agree with the OP. I find the constant announcer chatter annoying and think it's a glorified exploitation of the physics system, but still I do it myself to stay competitive (it's not really a moral issue for me lol). I'd like to see it removed in Reach. It would make the game more tactically appealing in the sense of building group dynamics and protecting the flag carrier.


very well put

  • 10.19.2009 2:53 PM PDT

Posted by: C Dirty 4
Reach essentially has put the "I" in "Team".


Remember, the enemy's gate is down

Posted by: SilentStorm20
Posted by: HaVOk1228
LOL. That's your argument?

So I guess in a game where the lead changes quickly and you hear "Gained the lead", "Lost the lead" "Gained the lead" really quickly thats a glitch too. You must be exploiting a glitch in the game by having too many lead changes in a short time. Or when you got too many medals in a short time mix ups happen, its a glitch that you're exploiting.


Ah, Bungie would never design a game with more than one oddball, because of this possible glitch exploit.


I couldn't tell if you were being sarcastic or if you actually thought the occurnece in that video was a glitch, because it wasn't.

nevermind. After your other posts I get it.

Damn those cheaters who held the ball at the same time and made the announcer repeat himself.

[Edited on 10.19.2009 3:00 PM PDT]

  • 10.19.2009 2:58 PM PDT

Posted by: TriggerHappyNDB
I'd like to see it removed in Reach. It would make the game more tactically appealing in the sense of building group dynamics and protecting the flag carrier.


That was a nice nonsensical way of saying "it will slow down gameplay, and become less appealing to competitive gamers."

  • 10.19.2009 2:58 PM PDT

It takes more skill to sneak the flag at the slow pace than to grab and drop repeatedly. Both are valid tactics, though flag dropping is insainly annoying because of the announcer.

  • 10.19.2009 2:59 PM PDT

I don't want to join your group.

"In science one tries to tell people, in such a way as to be understood by everyone, something that no one ever knew before. But in poetry, it's the exact opposite." - Paul Dirac

Posted by: HaVOk1228
Posted by: SilentStorm20
Posted by: HaVOk1228
LOL. That's your argument?

So I guess in a game where the lead changes quickly and you hear "Gained the lead", "Lost the lead" "Gained the lead" really quickly thats a glitch too. You must be exploiting a glitch in the game by having too many lead changes in a short time. Or when you got too many medals in a short time mix ups happen, its a glitch that you're exploiting.


Ah, Bungie would never design a game with more than one oddball, because of this possible glitch exploit.


I couldn't tell if you were being sarcastic or if you actually thought the occurnece in that video was a glitch, because it wasn't.

It was sarcasm. :)

[Edited on 10.19.2009 3:01 PM PDT]

  • 10.19.2009 3:00 PM PDT

i like me...

Posted by: SMGstrings
Posted by: TriggerHappyNDB
I'd like to see it removed in Reach. It would make the game more tactically appealing in the sense of building group dynamics and protecting the flag carrier.


That was a nice nonsensical way of saying "it will slow down gameplay, and become less appealing to competitive gamers."


MLG can adjust to any change that bungie makes...they dont make games that MLG wants to play, bungie makes games that bungie wants to play.

[Edited on 10.19.2009 3:06 PM PDT]

  • 10.19.2009 3:04 PM PDT

Posted by: C Dirty 4
Reach essentially has put the "I" in "Team".


Remember, the enemy's gate is down

Posted by: Hiokami
If you drop the flag in Halo 3, it plummets straight down.

I haven't witnessed anybody jumping and throwing the flag to run it faster, like they did in Halo 2. I've only seen people drop it, take a few steps, and then pick it back up. They're able to do that cause they're still right next to the flag.


You look up when you drop it and it throws it, but still not as far as Halo2.

  • 10.19.2009 3:04 PM PDT