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Posted by: Achronos
It isn't our shiznit anymore.
Posted by: GhostlyInferno
1. Bungie already has full working AI code as seen in firefight. This is plenty sophisticated enough for the types of bots I would like to see.
Sure, but you don't make up the general consensus. You said you wanted bots so offline players could hone their skills and improve themselves. This is impossible with bots because they are very predictable and can be outplayed by anyone with at least a little game experience. The practice needed to make one good or even great with certain weapons (BR?) comes only from fighting against other players. If we fought bots that had the AI sophistication level of firefight, you would be fighting a few enemies on heroic difficulty (if that because the bots would have to be equal to the player to simulate an actual player). That is why there is so much AI in campaign, it makes up for its own stupidity by throwing mass numbers at you. Firefight AI is just Halo 3 campaign AI. And even that is extremely unsophisticated AI.
2. Why not make bots? I don't see why you would be against having a feature that would only add to the gameplay and wouldn't take anything away from it.
It takes away time that could be spent making other gametypes or improving on existing ones (forge, theater, Campaign, MM, etc.). The opportunity cost is just not worth it imo.
If you could fully customize their health, shields, speed, etc...you could create a whole new set of custom gametypes. Not to mention the benefit to people without internet or Live.
Granted, it would be fun to have bots you could customize. But once you put them in your custom maps (or even default maps) they fail extremely hard, this post explains it rather nicely:
Posted by: eraseme
you can program bots to have 0% to 100% accuracy, and everything in between. you can program them to wander around a simplistic map and notice enemies gears or firefight style. those maps are so simple for a reason. they consist of several spawn points for enemies, who proceed down one of several obvious travel paths, having only to navigate around small blocks of cover like cars, columns, and rocks.
you cant program them to know when to rush snipe tower on guardian, when to camp top gold to wait for camo, when to strongside to safety, when to bunny hop, when to go for the oddball, when to wait for your teamates, or when you need to sit in your base and wait for a powerdrain to deal with the warthog thats outside spawn killing.
since bungie cant figure out which weapons, equipment, or positions are powerful (nothing wrong with putting ov, carbine, needler, and snipe at snipe tower, and expecting the other team to be able to kill them with 1 br and a 90 second camo, right?). their ai would end up choosing useless weapons and dying constantly while trying to get to terrible positions.
add in ridiculously customizible maps and weapon layouts through forge and it gets worse. now they are getting stuck on boxes, crates, unable to find simple jumps to higher positions and unaware of the existance or value of say, rockets or lazer in the corner of the map. getting a forged set of rockets on guardian= instant win. rockets on sandtrap= less valueable then a br.The technology is simply nonexistent right now.
Posted by: GhostlyInferno
3. Since when does Microsoft not like their offline players? I'm pretty sure to Microsoft any 360 owner is a good 360 owner. Plus they do try and please the offline customer by offering plenty of offline options. People without live can download updates via xbox.com and burn them to a disc, a lot of blockbuster games with downloadable content get a rereleased edition which has all the extras on disc. Or how about Bungie's Halo 2 map pack which you could purchase all the extra maps on a disc for the offline peeps. Oh yeah...all of that tells me that Microsoft and Bungie doesn't give a **** about their offline customers.
It's not that they completely ignore the offline fans, it's that they discriminate against them and the online players by giving the online players so much more content (and often, earlier) than the offline players. Think of offline players as the younger brother, and online the older brother. The younger brother will get those clothes to wear, but the older brother will have worn them first and they become hand-me-downs by the time the younger brother gets them. It's not a very profitable move making a gametype that only helps the offline players when a majority(?) of xbox users have xbox live. It is like making Reach in the needs of MLG (no offense) and not casual players (casual players make up a majority of video game players).
I like the idea of bots in the game, it's just FPS AI sophistication is no where near where it should be to make an at least decent experience.