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Subject: Castle base
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Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Ha ha.

No. There's no way they would write it off like that and fail to mention it to ONI.

There's no way.


I didn't say that they wouldn't mention it, I said that given what they know no one would have any cause for concern.

Remember, they don't know the Flood like we do.
You mean a parasitic alien organism that quickly overruns and consumes all that it comes into conflict with is not a cause for concern?

  • 10.29.2009 10:33 AM PDT

Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Ha ha.

No. There's no way they would write it off like that and fail to mention it to ONI.

There's no way.


I didn't say that they wouldn't mention it, I said that given what they know no one would have any cause for concern.

Remember, they don't know the Flood like we do.
You mean a parasitic alien organism that quickly overruns and consumes all that it comes into conflict with is not a cause for concern?


Not when there has only been one encounter, on the other side of the galaxy.

  • 10.29.2009 10:34 AM PDT
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Posted by: Wolverfrog
Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Ha ha.

No. There's no way they would write it off like that and fail to mention it to ONI.

There's no way.


I didn't say that they wouldn't mention it, I said that given what they know no one would have any cause for concern.

Remember, they don't know the Flood like we do.
You mean a parasitic alien organism that quickly overruns and consumes all that it comes into conflict with is not a cause for concern?


Not when there has only been one encounter, on the other side of the galaxy.
Which they would assume is not the only location the whole galaxy.

You have to know that they would assume the worst here.

  • 10.29.2009 10:37 AM PDT

Wherever you roam
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you'll be safe from peril
life threatening and terrible
if you avoid David Powel
and keep track of your towel.

Posted by: Wolverfrog
Oh, it's certainly possible; but I'm saying that as of now, the fact stated in the canon is just that, fact. Anything else is just a theory.

And they declared the Master Chief KIA; did they find his body? Exactly.


I'm aware that it's a theory, like I said the Timeline implies not states.

KIA status is often given to people who suffered events that they couldn't survive. Their probable explanation for what happened to the Dawn was that the portal collapsed as the ship was traveling through it so that the rear half was stuck on the other side. With the Halo going off any sentient being would be killed almost instantly.

That's a theory by the way, in case I didn't imply it strongly enough.

  • 10.29.2009 10:38 AM PDT
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Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Wolverfrog
Oh, it's certainly possible; but I'm saying that as of now, the fact stated in the canon is just that, fact. Anything else is just a theory.

And they declared the Master Chief KIA; did they find his body? Exactly.


I'm aware that it's a theory, like I said the Timeline implies not states.

KIA status is often given to people who suffered events that they couldn't survive. Their probable explanation for what happened to the Dawn was that the portal collapsed as the ship was traveling through it so that the rear half was stuck on the other side. With the Halo going off any sentient being would be killed almost instantly.

That's a theory by the way, in case I didn't imply it strongly enough.
Not really, because the way you said it made it sound like that's exactly what the timeline said, and what happened.

  • 10.29.2009 10:40 AM PDT

Wherever you roam
so far from home
you'll be safe from peril
life threatening and terrible
if you avoid David Powel
and keep track of your towel.

Posted by: Deleted
Which they would assume is not the only location the whole galaxy.

You have to know that they would assume the worst here.


They have enough worst to be assuming, what with the Covenant hellbent on annihilating them with their vastly superior technology and numbers.

Really I think that they'd want there to be more Flood, they could maybe use such a powerful organism against the Covenant.

  • 10.29.2009 10:41 AM PDT
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Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Which they would assume is not the only location the whole galaxy.

You have to know that they would assume the worst here.


They have enough worst to be assuming, what with the Covenant hellbent on annihilating them with their vastly superior technology and numbers.

Really I think that they'd want there to be more Flood, they could maybe use such a powerful organism against the Covenant.
Yeah, because the Covenant are pushing them to edge, they're gonna assume that the Flood are all fine and dandy, because if they weren't, well that just wouldn't be fair.

  • 10.29.2009 10:44 AM PDT

Wherever you roam
so far from home
you'll be safe from peril
life threatening and terrible
if you avoid David Powel
and keep track of your towel.

Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Wolverfrog
Oh, it's certainly possible; but I'm saying that as of now, the fact stated in the canon is just that, fact. Anything else is just a theory.

And they declared the Master Chief KIA; did they find his body? Exactly.


I'm aware that it's a theory, like I said the Timeline implies not states.

KIA status is often given to people who suffered events that they couldn't survive. Their probable explanation for what happened to the Dawn was that the portal collapsed as the ship was traveling through it so that the rear half was stuck on the other side. With the Halo going off any sentient being would be killed almost instantly.

That's a theory by the way, in case I didn't imply it strongly enough.
Not really, because the way you said it made it sound like that's exactly what the timeline said, and what happened.


It's not my fault that the word implies didn't communicate it's meaning properly to certain people.

Look back to my posts, I never say "the Timeline says" I always say " the Timeline implies".

  • 10.29.2009 10:44 AM PDT
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Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Wolverfrog
Oh, it's certainly possible; but I'm saying that as of now, the fact stated in the canon is just that, fact. Anything else is just a theory.

And they declared the Master Chief KIA; did they find his body? Exactly.


I'm aware that it's a theory, like I said the Timeline implies not states.

KIA status is often given to people who suffered events that they couldn't survive. Their probable explanation for what happened to the Dawn was that the portal collapsed as the ship was traveling through it so that the rear half was stuck on the other side. With the Halo going off any sentient being would be killed almost instantly.

That's a theory by the way, in case I didn't imply it strongly enough.
Not really, because the way you said it made it sound like that's exactly what the timeline said, and what happened.


It's not my fault that the word implies didn't communicate it's meaning properly to certain people.

Look back to my posts, I never say "the Timeline says" I always say " the Timeline implies".
Except that you were wrong as to what it says.

Saying that it implied something which it very clearly did not according to Wolverfrog, is misleading. You didn't really make it sound like a theory.

  • 10.29.2009 10:48 AM PDT

Wherever you roam
so far from home
you'll be safe from peril
life threatening and terrible
if you avoid David Powel
and keep track of your towel.

Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Which they would assume is not the only location the whole galaxy.

You have to know that they would assume the worst here.


They have enough worst to be assuming, what with the Covenant hellbent on annihilating them with their vastly superior technology and numbers.

Really I think that they'd want there to be more Flood, they could maybe use such a powerful organism against the Covenant.
Yeah, because the Covenant are pushing them to edge, they're gonna assume that the Flood are all fine and dandy, because if they weren't, well that just wouldn't be fair.


Not "the Flood, Scourge of the Universe that even the Might Forerunners could Defeat only by Galactic Suicide", "nameless parasitic superorganism with a resemblance to various zombie myths which possess no apparent means of extraterrestrial travel and inhabited a now destroyed planet".

  • 10.29.2009 10:49 AM PDT
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Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Which they would assume is not the only location the whole galaxy.

You have to know that they would assume the worst here.


They have enough worst to be assuming, what with the Covenant hellbent on annihilating them with their vastly superior technology and numbers.

Really I think that they'd want there to be more Flood, they could maybe use such a powerful organism against the Covenant.
Yeah, because the Covenant are pushing them to edge, they're gonna assume that the Flood are all fine and dandy, because if they weren't, well that just wouldn't be fair.


Not "the Flood, Scourge of the Universe that even the Might Forerunners could Defeat only by Galactic Suicide", "nameless parasitic superorganism with a resemblance to various zombie myths which possess no apparent means of extraterrestrial travel and inhabited a now destroyed planet".
I never said they knew what they were. I just used Flood in my reply, because we know the term. I sincerly doubt the UNSC would so naive to assume the Flood as non-threatening. This would be the second hostile alien life form they've encountered, and after the first one, I'd assume that to be a cause for concern.

  • 10.29.2009 10:52 AM PDT

Wherever you roam
so far from home
you'll be safe from peril
life threatening and terrible
if you avoid David Powel
and keep track of your towel.

Posted by: Deleted
Except that you were wrong as to what it says.

Saying that it implied something which it very clearly did not according to Wolverfrog, is misleading. You didn't really make it sound like a theory.


No, Wolverfrog says what it states. I said what it implies by stating that.

The Timeline entry emphasizes that it was ONI that declared the ship "lost with all hands" and notes that the friends and family of said hands continue to hope that the ship will return with their loved ones aboard. To me this implies that the ship was able to make contact and that it's actions on the Shield World were classified.

Cross-referencing The Fall of Reach the three Spartans aboard the Spirit of Fire clearly need to survive and take part in the Battle of Reach. Which leads me to the conclusion that the ship did in fact make it back to UNSC space in some form or another and that this was covered up in order to maintain the secrecy of the Forerunner ruins and for the sake of general morale. It's not the parasite that would effect morale by the way but rather the fleet of Forerunner warships that was almost activated.

  • 10.29.2009 10:57 AM PDT

Wherever you roam
so far from home
you'll be safe from peril
life threatening and terrible
if you avoid David Powel
and keep track of your towel.

Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord

Not "the Flood, Scourge of the Universe that even the Might Forerunners could Defeat only by Galactic Suicide", "nameless parasitic superorganism with a resemblance to various zombie myths which possess no apparent means of extraterrestrial travel and inhabited a now destroyed planet".
I never said they knew what they were. I just used Flood in my reply, because we know the term. I sincerly doubt the UNSC would so naive to assume the Flood as non-threatening. This would be the second hostile alien life form they've encountered, and after the first one, I'd assume that to be a cause for concern.


Of course they would recognize them as dangerous animals. Dangerous and extinct animals.

  • 10.29.2009 10:59 AM PDT
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Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Except that you were wrong as to what it says.

Saying that it implied something which it very clearly did not according to Wolverfrog, is misleading. You didn't really make it sound like a theory.


No, Wolverfrog says what it states. I said what it implies by stating that.

The Timeline entry emphasizes that it was ONI that declared the ship "lost with all hands" and notes that the friends and family of said hands continue to hope that the ship will return with their loved ones aboard. To me this implies that the ship was able to make contact and that it's actions on the Shield World were classified.

Cross-referencing The Fall of Reach the three Spartans aboard the Spirit of Fire clearly need to survive and take part in the Battle of Reach. Which leads me to the conclusion that the ship did in fact make it back to UNSC space in some form or another and that this was covered up in order to maintain the secrecy of the Forerunner ruins and for the sake of general morale. It's not the parasite that would effect morale by the way but rather the fleet of Forerunner warships that was almost activated.
You really can't use the Spartan numbers as reference points. They've always been shaky and inconsistent.

Also, how exactly would that effect morale in a bad way? That would be an UNSC victory, a devastating one over the Covenant. If anything it would improve morale, showing humanity that the UNSC successfully stopped the Covenant's destructive plan.

[Edited on 10.29.2009 11:02 AM PDT]

  • 10.29.2009 11:00 AM PDT
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Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord

Not "the Flood, Scourge of the Universe that even the Might Forerunners could Defeat only by Galactic Suicide", "nameless parasitic superorganism with a resemblance to various zombie myths which possess no apparent means of extraterrestrial travel and inhabited a now destroyed planet".
I never said they knew what they were. I just used Flood in my reply, because we know the term. I sincerly doubt the UNSC would so naive to assume the Flood as non-threatening. This would be the second hostile alien life form they've encountered, and after the first one, I'd assume that to be a cause for concern.


Of course they would recognize them as dangerous animals. Dangerous and extinct animals.
You're totally ignoring what I'm saying.

Good job.

  • 10.29.2009 11:00 AM PDT

Wherever you roam
so far from home
you'll be safe from peril
life threatening and terrible
if you avoid David Powel
and keep track of your towel.

Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord
Posted by: Deleted
Posted by: EldritchWarlord

Not "the Flood, Scourge of the Universe that even the Might Forerunners could Defeat only by Galactic Suicide", "nameless parasitic superorganism with a resemblance to various zombie myths which possess no apparent means of extraterrestrial travel and inhabited a now destroyed planet".
I never said they knew what they were. I just used Flood in my reply, because we know the term. I sincerly doubt the UNSC would so naive to assume the Flood as non-threatening. This would be the second hostile alien life form they've encountered, and after the first one, I'd assume that to be a cause for concern.


Of course they would recognize them as dangerous animals. Dangerous and extinct animals.
You're totally ignoring what I'm saying.

Good job.


You're also totally ignoring what I'm saying. Your entire case is based on the UNSC "assuming the worst" when it comes to anything. This clearly makes sense from your perspective on the Flood but you are failing to take their perspective (which is really the one that matters).

What do they know about the Flood?

Unnamed parasitic superorganism; some suggestion of intelligence, can take control of host bodies, no known native technology, no known methods of interplanetary travel, entire encountered population has since been eliminated by the destruction of its habitat planet. Species is presumed extinct.

  • 10.29.2009 11:14 AM PDT

Wherever you roam
so far from home
you'll be safe from peril
life threatening and terrible
if you avoid David Powel
and keep track of your towel.

Posted by: Deleted
You really can't use the Spartan numbers as reference points. They've always been shaky and inconsistent.

Also, how exactly would that effect morale in a bad way? That would be an UNSC victory, a devastating one over the Covenant. If anything it would improve morale, showing humanity that the UNSC successfully stopped the Covenant's destructive plan.


I wasn't going by numbers, I was going by subtractions from that number. The book states that all but three surviving and active Spartan-IIs are gathered. These three are deployed to distantly to be easily summoned. Of the Spartan-IIs who graduated there have been 3 KIAs and one too wounded to continue active duty. Those three KIAs are accounted for so they couldn't be Red Team on the Spirit of Fire (which was declared KIA remember? so either those Spartans were there at the summit or considered KIA, or perhaps they're the three deployed too distantly which would still mean that they get back and are deployed again).

Yes the Covenant were defeated but they were defeated because of the Forerunner warships and the design of the Shield World which ONI would not want to reveal. The morale was only a supplemental element of my theory and the theory in general remains valid with or without the preservation of morale as one of ONI's motivations.

[Edited on 10.29.2009 11:28 AM PDT]

  • 10.29.2009 11:22 AM PDT

I too thought it would be good for introducing sentinels and flood but ive heard of a bunch of new ideas on this thread keep up the good work

  • 10.29.2009 1:45 PM PDT

One theory ive been sitting on is that Serena is closing on rampancy by the time the Spirit of Fire returns to UNSC controlled borders.While sifting through her data crystals the ONI brass find all of her data on the flood.Also a mission could be to get into castle base and help a high ranking ONI personnel out but end up getting trapped and accidently releasing the flood and activating the operating sentinal units.

  • 10.29.2009 1:51 PM PDT

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