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Subject: Are you glad that reach is getting a new rank system

it resets every month!!!!

  • 09.06.2010 2:50 PM PDT

Add me if you're a serious MLG player.

No. In Halo 3, I could pretty accurately predict the skill of someone just by their rank (with the exception of second accounters). I can't say the same for Reach. There were staff captains that got placed in the Onyx division in the beta. In Reach, you are rewarded by how much you play, not how good you are. Furthermore, a ranking system based on individual stats just does not work in a game as teamwork-oriented as Halo.

[Edited on 09.06.2010 2:54 PM PDT]

  • 09.06.2010 2:53 PM PDT

-Its not true until its final

they said that they actually hated halo 3s because the '"poured sand into a wonderful system" now you get your true skill which resets each month which is like renewing your license only you actually have to "take the test" again and you can rank up on a different system so that players with less skill can actually make progression rather than hit level and be stuck

  • 09.06.2010 3:16 PM PDT

Nah, I think it's bogus. I hardly even play to begin with, so the fact that it resets every month just makes it useless for casual gamers.

And it will just promote stat-whoring even more. I already see far too many people charging in for kills rather than waiting and getting their teammates a good respawn as it is... or whatever else needs to be done at the time (sacrificing a death to get laser, taking rockets even though the camo guy should get them, etc.). This will just encourage more selfish play. What matters is who wins, not how well you personally do. Kills and assists aren't the only thing that matters.

  • 09.06.2010 3:57 PM PDT

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Posted by: HandDrawnHero
im just happy that now having a de-ranker on my team doesnt affect me individually, like we may still lose the game but at least i get judged on my performance and not worry about losing rank


This, the new system is fantastic and awards people who play the game legit and do there best every game.

  • 09.06.2010 3:58 PM PDT

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  • 09.06.2010 4:00 PM PDT

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There seems to be a lot of confusion, ignorance, and downright -blam!-gery in this thread so far.

First of all the "reset" is a soft reset. It gives you a new slate to play with in arena only. It also will match you with players who were previously in your division. The longer you play the game, and the more times you are in Onyx division, the more likely you are to play with the best of the best. Only a few games after reset will truly be lopsided.

Secondly, people complain about second accounts and boosters because THEY ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO BE PLAYING AT THE LOW LEVELS. The players being complained about have attained that "badge of honor" status, and have created a new account solely to stomp on other players of lower skill. WE ALL KNOW THIS! We also know they're not doing it for more bragging rights. They're doing it to be -blam!-s. Without boosters, de-rankers, and second accounts the trueskill system would work like it's supposed to. Instead there are thousands of people with skill 40-50 that don't deserve it. I can also attest personally to there being players at level 25-40 who deserve better.

Reach's new ranked matchmaking system is a wonderful change, and will alleviate many of the problems associated with Halos 2 and 3. People won't have to play ranked to achieve anything, and they can still have fun while avoiding all of the elitist jerks out there.

  • 09.06.2010 4:12 PM PDT

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Posted by: utAlpha09
they said that they actually hated halo 3s because the '"poured sand into a wonderful system" now you get your true skill which resets each month which is like renewing your license only you actually have to "take the test" again and you can rank up on a different system so that players with less skill can actually make progression rather than hit level and be stuck


Did I miss something? Since when did they say trueskill resets with your arena ranking? That doesn't make any sense at all. Why then would they have a matchmaking system in the first place? Why not just throw random people together in hopes that the matches aren't totally lopsided.

The way I read it was that trueskill will be constant, and your arena ranking will change. Trueskill will even factor into the matches you get in arena.

  • 09.06.2010 4:18 PM PDT

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Posted by: EndGame747
Nah, I think it's bogus. I hardly even play to begin with, so the fact that it resets every month just makes it useless for casual gamers.

And it will just promote stat-whoring even more. I already see far too many people charging in for kills rather than waiting and getting their teammates a good respawn as it is... or whatever else needs to be done at the time (sacrificing a death to get laser, taking rockets even though the camo guy should get them, etc.). This will just encourage more selfish play. What matters is who wins, not how well you personally do. Kills and assists aren't the only thing that matters.


Why do so many people not understand the new system?

Bungie already said that WINNING(or losing) will be a much bigger factor in your arena ranking than your individual performance. If your plan is to blindly charge at your enemy while disregarding your teammates completely then you're not going to score very well.

  • 09.06.2010 4:20 PM PDT


Posted by: CravenC21h30o2

Posted by: utAlpha09
they said that they actually hated halo 3s because the '"poured sand into a wonderful system" now you get your true skill which resets each month which is like renewing your license only you actually have to "take the test" again and you can rank up on a different system so that players with less skill can actually make progression rather than hit level and be stuck


Did I miss something? Since when did they say trueskill resets with your arena ranking? That doesn't make any sense at all. Why then would they have a matchmaking system in the first place? Why not just throw random people together in hopes that the matches aren't totally lopsided.

The way I read it was that trueskill will be constant, and your arena ranking will change. Trueskill will even factor into the matches you get in arena.

They haven't said anything either way, but I think it's far more likely that your TrueSkill is reset, seeing as that's how your Division is determined.

That would explain why you need to have a Daily Rating on X days to be put into a Division. It takes less than a dozen games to accurately determine someone's TrueSkill in Reach (due to the fact that they're using an unconstrained version of TrueSkill that moves up and down faster than it did in Halo 3). Daily Ratings are just a way of ensuring that someone's played enough to accurately measure their TrueSkill before putting them in a Division.


Anyway, I think Reach's system is an improvement over H3. It's far from perfect, as individual stats don't necessarily tell how much each person contributed. But I think it's less flawed than Halo 3, where it was assumed that everyone on the team contributed equally to the outcome.

[Edited on 09.06.2010 5:10 PM PDT]

  • 09.06.2010 4:35 PM PDT
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Posted by: King_of_slayer
No. Staff captains were onyx.
The ranking system sucks.


It's a completely different game. h3 ranks doesn't equal reach rank.

  • 09.06.2010 4:38 PM PDT
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A terrible player on Halo 3 is still a terrible player on Reach.

Lets go all, the way tonight. No regrets, just love. We can dance, until we die. You and I, we'll be young forever.

No because Reach is designed to make retarded kids (colonels, commanders, majors, staff captains, 1st lts etc) feel good about being terrible at a video game.

But guess what? The bad players from H3 wont get better and the better players will still be better. A colonel will not be better then a legitimate 50 just because its a new Halo.

  • 09.06.2010 4:38 PM PDT


Posted by: CravenC21h30o2

Posted by: EndGame747
Nah, I think it's bogus. I hardly even play to begin with, so the fact that it resets every month just makes it useless for casual gamers.

And it will just promote stat-whoring even more. I already see far too many people charging in for kills rather than waiting and getting their teammates a good respawn as it is... or whatever else needs to be done at the time (sacrificing a death to get laser, taking rockets even though the camo guy should get them, etc.). This will just encourage more selfish play. What matters is who wins, not how well you personally do. Kills and assists aren't the only thing that matters.


Why do so many people not understand the new system?

Bungie already said that WINNING(or losing) will be a much bigger factor in your arena ranking than your individual performance. If your plan is to blindly charge at your enemy while disregarding your teammates completely then you're not going to score very well.


People are stupid, won't understand the ranking, and will play like this regardless of whether or not winning is more beneficial. Hell, they already do right now when individual performance has nothing to do with trueskill.

Chill out, don't shoot the messenger.


Posted by: recarpo112320
Posted by: King_of_slayer
No. Staff captains were onyx.
The ranking system sucks.


It's a completely different game. h3 ranks doesn't equal reach rank.


Skill carries over.

Legit generals aren't gonna suddenly suck and Staff Captains aren't suddenly going to do well, the new ranking system will only lead them to believe that they've improved.

"It's a different game" but Halo is Halo. You might be a bit better or worse at certain ones, but at the end of the day you're either good or you're not. There aren't enough changes between the games to make a significant difference.

[Edited on 09.06.2010 4:44 PM PDT]

  • 09.06.2010 4:38 PM PDT

I don't care about numbers and symbols. Ultimately, if the new ranking system creates matches that are more FAIR and more FUN, I'll be happy.

I think a lot of you are too hung up on a stupid status symbol. It's only a videogame... nobody actually cares.

  • 09.06.2010 4:47 PM PDT

Yes as I love everything Reach, everything.

  • 09.06.2010 4:53 PM PDT

Hates to love and loves to hate.

Posted by: xParanoiaa
No. In Halo 3, I could pretty accurately predict the skill of someone just by their rank (with the exception of second accounters). I can't say the same for Reach. There were staff captains that got placed in the Onyx division in the beta. In Reach, you are rewarded by how much you play, not how good you are. Furthermore, a ranking system based on individual stats just does not work in a game as teamwork-oriented as Halo.

QFT

  • 09.06.2010 4:56 PM PDT

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Posted by: DIESTRONG86
They haven't said anything either way, but I think it's far more likely that your TrueSkill is reset, seeing as that's how your Division is determined.


If you played the BETA you would know that your division was determined based on a score that was calculated after said game. The score was based on win/loss and your individual performance within the game.

EDIT: Meaning division rank is NOT based on Trueskill.

[Edited on 09.06.2010 5:29 PM PDT]

  • 09.06.2010 5:23 PM PDT

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Posted by: EndGame747

Posted by: CravenC21h30o2

Posted by: EndGame747
Nah, I think it's bogus. I hardly even play to begin with, so the fact that it resets every month just makes it useless for casual gamers.

And it will just promote stat-whoring even more. I already see far too many people charging in for kills rather than waiting and getting their teammates a good respawn as it is... or whatever else needs to be done at the time (sacrificing a death to get laser, taking rockets even though the camo guy should get them, etc.). This will just encourage more selfish play. What matters is who wins, not how well you personally do. Kills and assists aren't the only thing that matters.


Why do so many people not understand the new system?

Bungie already said that WINNING(or losing) will be a much bigger factor in your arena ranking than your individual performance. If your plan is to blindly charge at your enemy while disregarding your teammates completely then you're not going to score very well.


People are stupid, won't understand the ranking, and will play like this regardless of whether or not winning is more beneficial. Hell, they already do right now when individual performance has nothing to do with trueskill.

Chill out, don't shoot the messenger.


What I was getting at is that your post about people acting like idiots in game will only work in lower skilled games where it's not going to matter all that much anyways. When playing with high ranked teammates this is unlikely to happen. Will we still see some selfish play at all levels? Yes, but not to the point where people are willing to sacrifice the win for a few extra kills.


  • 09.06.2010 5:28 PM PDT

Lone Wolves- 46| Terrible matchmaking warrior
Team Slayer- 50|
Team SWAT- 35|
Team Snipers- 44|
Team Doubles- 45|
MLG- 36|

Posted by: Vicious Truth

Posted by: Gig4t3ch

There's no longer the excuse of "2nd accounts" or "derankers" or whatever else people blame for being stuck at lower levels.


That wasn't a legitimate excuse anyway. People just like to blame anything but their own lack of ability for why they're terrible. What makes it even worse is when people start retreating into such a deep state of denial about it that they start with all this garbage BUNGLE crap to convince themselves of something or at the very least, to take their minds off of the daily poundings they'd be taking if they actually played the game.


.........You're amazing

  • 09.06.2010 5:32 PM PDT


Posted by: CravenC21h30o2

Posted by: DIESTRONG86
They haven't said anything either way, but I think it's far more likely that your TrueSkill is reset, seeing as that's how your Division is determined.


If you played the BETA you would know that your division was determined based on a score that was calculated after said game. The score was based on win/loss and your individual performance within the game.

No, your TrueSkill was adjusted after each game based on the TrueSkill of the players that got a higher and lower Game Rating than you. Game Ratings mean nothing outside of a single game.

Your TrueSkill and how it compares to the rest of the population is how your Division is assigned.

Here are a few quotes...

Bungie Weekly Update 04.30.2010
In the Arena, your Game Rating is a numeric evaluation of how well we think you performed in that game, against those opponents. A score, of sorts.

At the conclusion of a game, players will be ranked according to their rating for that game, and it is this ordering of players that is fed into the TrueSkill black box to determine which Division you belong in. The rating is also used to determine your Day Rating, but that is only used for your personal record keeping.


Posted by: ferrex
Posted by: GreenEyezFox4879
The way I'm understanding it then is that trueskill essentially works in the same way that it did back in H3, and after a set amount of games, everyone is placed on a large spectrum based on their numerical trueskill rank at which point the game divides up this spectrum based on percentiles and assigns each division a ... division.

Yeah?

Yep, that's the gist of it. The day ratings are just a measure of performance against your opponents on that day. Your Division assignment is where you really fall in the skill range.

  • 09.06.2010 5:32 PM PDT

Rarity FTW

Reach already has pretty much everything brand new. Ranking just makes it more complicated...

  • 09.06.2010 5:37 PM PDT

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Posted by: DIESTRONG86

Posted by: CravenC21h30o2

Posted by: DIESTRONG86
They haven't said anything either way, but I think it's far more likely that your TrueSkill is reset, seeing as that's how your Division is determined.


If you played the BETA you would know that your division was determined based on a score that was calculated after said game. The score was based on win/loss and your individual performance within the game.

No, your TrueSkill was adjusted after each game based on the TrueSkill of the players that got a higher and lower Game Rating than you. Game Ratings mean nothing outside of a single game.

Your TrueSkill and how it compares to the rest of the population is how your Division is assigned.

Here are a few quotes...

Bungie Weekly Update 04.30.2010
In the Arena, your Game Rating is a numeric evaluation of how well we think you performed in that game, against those opponents. A score, of sorts.

At the conclusion of a game, players will be ranked according to their rating for that game, and it is this ordering of players that is fed into the TrueSkill black box to determine which Division you belong in. The rating is also used to determine your Day Rating, but that is only used for your personal record keeping.


Posted by: ferrex
Posted by: GreenEyezFox4879
The way I'm understanding it then is that trueskill essentially works in the same way that it did back in H3, and after a set amount of games, everyone is placed on a large spectrum based on their numerical trueskill rank at which point the game divides up this spectrum based on percentiles and assigns each division a ... division.

Yeah?

Yep, that's the gist of it. The day ratings are just a measure of performance against your opponents on that day. Your Division assignment is where you really fall in the skill range.


Like I said before...

That makes no sense then. Why not just throw everyone into a pile and hope some similar skilled people land next to each other. I'm a 49 in Halo 3, and once Reach comes out I will be playing very little arena. It is pointless. Therefore you're telling me that I will NEVER recieve a trueskill rating, even an invisible one?

  • 09.06.2010 5:52 PM PDT

i have mixed feelings about the new rank system. It's got pros and definitely has cons. On paper it sounds more secure from people cheating the system. But we all know someone will find a way.

  • 09.06.2010 6:00 PM PDT

Posted by: CravenC21h30o2
Like I said before...

That makes no sense then. Why not just throw everyone into a pile and hope some similar skilled people land next to each other. I'm a 49 in Halo 3, and once Reach comes out I will be playing very little arena. It is pointless. Therefore you're telling me that I will NEVER recieve a trueskill rating, even an invisible one?

You will have a TrueSkill rating, it just gets reset every month from what I'm understanding.

It doesn't make much sense to reset someones Arena rank without resetting their TrueSkill, since your rank is directly related to your TrueSkill.

Sure, the first few games you play at the beginning of the Season will likely be unbalanced, but it should be fine after a few games now that TrueSkill works quicker.

[Edited on 09.06.2010 6:08 PM PDT]

  • 09.06.2010 6:04 PM PDT

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Posted by: DIESTRONG86
Posted by: CravenC21h30o2
Like I said before...

That makes no sense then. Why not just throw everyone into a pile and hope some similar skilled people land next to each other. I'm a 49 in Halo 3, and once Reach comes out I will be playing very little arena. It is pointless. Therefore you're telling me that I will NEVER recieve a trueskill rating, even an invisible one?

You will have a TrueSkill rating, it just gets reset every month from what I'm understanding.

It doesn't make much sense to reset someones Arena rank without resetting their TrueSkill, since your rank is directly related to your TrueSkill.

Sure, the first few games you play at the beginning of the Season will likely be unbalanced, but it should be fine after a few games now that TrueSkill works quicker.


Then why even bother giving people a trueskill rating if they're only playing social? If you're going to give social players trueskill, like I originally thought, then why would you reset their trueskill? That makes absolutely no sense. Social players would suffer because of the mucked up system once a month.

You see I thought I would be able to...

1. Play Social to avoid the rank elitists, and other online jerks.
2. Be invisibly ranked so that I play people of a similar skill.
3. Not have to worry about rank reset because I'm playing social.

If you add to that equation a trueskill reset every month then social games will GREATLY suffer.

[Edited on 09.06.2010 6:10 PM PDT]

  • 09.06.2010 6:07 PM PDT

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