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  • Subject: Unexplainable errors in the Halo canon. (Spoilers)
Subject: Unexplainable errors in the Halo canon. (Spoilers)

Posted by: MAXPWN197
Christ when are people going to accept the simple fact that Halo: Reach in terms of canon completely trumps The Fall of Reach. every other book, short movie, animation episode and game trumps TFoR, only the advertising campaigns like landfall and birth of a spartan are ranked lower in canon hierarchy. it is near rock bottom in terms of the truth.

END OF STORY PEOPLE
Normally that would be acceptable. However, in this case, they took something good and replaced it with shoddy work with holes everywhere.

Also, some of us are pissed that we paid for books that are now fanfiction.

  • 02.13.2011 11:41 AM PDT


Posted by: chickenlittle
Posted by: MAXPWN197
Christ when are people going to accept the simple fact that Halo: Reach in terms of canon completely trumps The Fall of Reach. every other book, short movie, animation episode and game trumps TFoR, only the advertising campaigns like landfall and birth of a spartan are ranked lower in canon hierarchy. it is near rock bottom in terms of the truth.

END OF STORY PEOPLE
Normally that would be acceptable. However, in this case, they took something good and replaced it with shoddy work with holes everywhere.

Also, some of us are pissed that we paid for books that are now fanfiction.


The books are still canon except for where the games contradict them.

  • 02.13.2011 1:06 PM PDT
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Posted by: mr _super sauce

Posted by: chickenlittle
Posted by: MAXPWN197
Christ when are people going to accept the simple fact that Halo: Reach in terms of canon completely trumps The Fall of Reach. every other book, short movie, animation episode and game trumps TFoR, only the advertising campaigns like landfall and birth of a spartan are ranked lower in canon hierarchy. it is near rock bottom in terms of the truth.

END OF STORY PEOPLE
Normally that would be acceptable. However, in this case, they took something good and replaced it with shoddy work with holes everywhere.

Also, some of us are pissed that we paid for books that are now fanfiction.


The books are still canon except for where the games contradict them.


Fanfiction is a ridiculous claim, since nothing what the novels themselves presented were disregarded. If you disagree, be ready to back up your statement with some evidence that shows direct contradiction in between the game and books.

  • 02.13.2011 1:20 PM PDT

Signatures are for squares.

Posted by: manwith
Posted by: mr _super sauce

Posted by: chickenlittle
Posted by: MAXPWN197
Christ when are people going to accept the simple fact that Halo: Reach in terms of canon completely trumps The Fall of Reach. every other book, short movie, animation episode and game trumps TFoR, only the advertising campaigns like landfall and birth of a spartan are ranked lower in canon hierarchy. it is near rock bottom in terms of the truth.

END OF STORY PEOPLE
Normally that would be acceptable. However, in this case, they took something good and replaced it with shoddy work with holes everywhere.

Also, some of us are pissed that we paid for books that are now fanfiction.


The books are still canon except for where the games contradict them.


Fanfiction is a ridiculous claim, since nothing what the novels themselves presented were disregarded. If you disagree, be ready to back up your statement with some evidence that shows direct contradiction in between the game and books.


...

Game: "COVENANT ARE ON REACH. I REPEAT, THE COVENANT ARE ON REACH." - July 24th/25th.

Ok, ok...

Game: Formal invasion date - August 14th.
Book: No covenant what-so-ever at Reach until August 30th.

  • 02.13.2011 2:39 PM PDT
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Posted by: privet caboose
Game: Formal invasion date - August 14th.
Book: No covenant what-so-ever at Reach until August 30th


I have never heard someone saying/referring/specifying that anywhere.

  • 02.13.2011 3:32 PM PDT


Posted by: manwith
Posted by: privet caboose
Game: Formal invasion date - August 14th.
Book: No covenant what-so-ever at Reach until August 30th


I have never heard someone saying/referring/specifying that anywhere.


http://halo.wikia.com/wiki/Battle_of_reach#Timeline

That may help with the issue of "OMG it changed entire battle!"

Edit: http://halo.xbox.com/en-us#/intel/featured/video/assault-on-t he-stars-3/1ebc1b7e-0aa9-4b28-a085-b0c84c317ae1

That video, from halo waypoint, explains some of the space battle towards the end. The fleet arrived after LNOS, and engaged the defenses. On August 30th, a fleet larger then the UNSC had ever seen arrived to sweep away the remaining defenses.

[Edited on 02.13.2011 5:31 PM PST]

  • 02.13.2011 4:11 PM PDT

I'm also curious as to why the frigate in LNoS was fighting the corvette using broadside guns. It makes no sense. UNSC ships are always - ALWAYS - dominated by Covenant ships 1 on 1, and they can't use their MAC from the side.

Since the destruction of the corvette wasn't intended, the frigate should have simply left, but instead stayed to engage broadside. Basically, the captain guaranteed his ship's annihilation for absolutely no reason.

  • 02.14.2011 12:04 AM PDT


Posted by: chickenlittle
I'm also curious as to why the frigate in LNoS was fighting the corvette using broadside guns. It makes no sense. UNSC ships are always - ALWAYS - dominated by Covenant ships 1 on 1, and they can't use their MAC from the side.

Since the destruction of the corvette wasn't intended, the frigate should have simply left, but instead stayed to engage broadside. Basically, the captain guaranteed his ship's annihilation for absolutely no reason.


If you had paid attention, he said "We are getting hit hard, we have to pull out."

Holland responded with "Our team is in, get out of there!"

At which point the frigate's reactor started going critical, leading to it's destruction.

  • 02.14.2011 12:19 AM PDT

'There are many aspects of the universe that still cannot be explained satisfactorily by science; but ignorance only implies ignorance that may someday be conquered. To surrender to ignorance and call it God has always been premature, and it remains premature today.'
-Isaac Asimov

I don't know if this has been said but when John is in a Pelican on his way to destroy the Circumference's NAV data a Covenant ship exits slipspace next to him and it is powered down for a few seconds. Meaning after a jump the ship has to power down at least some features. Now the Super-Carrier might have enough power to sustain all of its features even its cloaking ability after a jump but then again it might not.

or it just slowly made its way towards reach after jumping somewhere near it.

[Edited on 02.14.2011 1:42 AM PST]

  • 02.14.2011 1:41 AM PDT


Posted by: chickenlittle
I'm also curious as to why the frigate in LNoS was fighting the corvette using broadside guns. It makes no sense. UNSC ships are always - ALWAYS - dominated by Covenant ships 1 on 1, and they can't use their MAC from the side.

Since the destruction of the corvette wasn't intended, the frigate should have simply left, but instead stayed to engage broadside. Basically, the captain guaranteed his ship's annihilation for absolutely no reason.


It was there to help make sure the Sabres got aboard the Ardent Prayer, probably shoot down Seraph's and the like or to just help distract the Corvette. And then as Cmdr said the Savannah was starting to pull out when it got destroyed.

And actually they're not always dominated, it depends on the commander and the situation, IE, look at what Keye's did at Sigma Octanus, and I don't think those Corvettes have very strong weapon systems, they're pretty small and it doesn't seem like they have shields either, or at least not very strong ones.

[Edited on 02.14.2011 9:04 AM PST]

  • 02.14.2011 9:04 AM PDT

Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: chickenlittle
I'm also curious as to why the frigate in LNoS was fighting the corvette using broadside guns. It makes no sense. UNSC ships are always - ALWAYS - dominated by Covenant ships 1 on 1, and they can't use their MAC from the side.

Since the destruction of the corvette wasn't intended, the frigate should have simply left, but instead stayed to engage broadside. Basically, the captain guaranteed his ship's annihilation for absolutely no reason.


It was there to help make sure the Sabres got aboard the Ardent Prayer, probably shoot down Seraph's and the like or to just help distract the Corvette. And then as Cmdr said the Savannah was starting to pull out when it got destroyed.
It did assist the Sabres land. But it didn't leave right away. It kept engaging at the corvette. Hence why you see it getting destroyed several minutes after you enter the ship. Since the corvette was about to get refueled by the Supercarrier, it would have been able to leave without fear of the corvette following it.

And actually they're not always dominated, it depends on the commander and the situation, IE, look at what Keye's did at Sigma Octanus, and I don't think those Corvettes have very strong weapon systems, they're pretty small and it doesn't seem like they have shields either, or at least not very strong ones.The Keyes Loops was an extreme exception. That only happened because Keyes was a brilliant tactician, using the enemy plasma torpedoes against them, and got very lucky. If you look at the battle that immediately followed, the normal ratio followed. The UNSC uses the Cradle as a shield for the fleet, and takes the first plasma salvo. Despite that, several dozen UNSC ships are still wiped out, even with roughly half(~10) of the Covenant fleet out of commission.

Following that logic, the frigate in LNoS should have been annihilated immediately. Why did the Corvette not use its plasma torpedoes? Why did it completely ignore the frigate until the Sabres landed?



One more thing on this. It makes no sense for a corvette, likely the smallest Covenant capital ship, to need to be refueled by a carrier. They have stations for that, like Unyielding Heirophant. And why send your invasion fleet into battle without full supplies?

  • 02.14.2011 3:04 PM PDT

Um, it stayed to cover the Pelican with the slipspace drive.

Also, to your final statement. A: Why is it so odd that the super-carrier, a massive ship, was refueling a Corvette?
B: It wasn't an invasion fleet, it was a scouting force.

  • 02.14.2011 3:13 PM PDT

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Um, it stayed to cover the Pelican with the slipspace drive.
The Pelican that was either at the surface of the ship, where the guns couldn't hit it, and all the fighters were deestroyed, or the Pelican that was already inside the ship?
Also, to your final statement. A: Why is it so odd that the super-carrier, a massive ship, was refueling a Corvette?Because you send carriers to carry things. Dropships, troops, Seraphs, equipment. If you need to refuel something, you send a refueling station or specialized ship. And even worse, you don't send ships to enemy systems with empty gas tanks. Especially worse, the carrier didn't send any fighters to help the corvette, despite the crew knowing humans were attacking, and then on board.
B: It wasn't an invasion fleet, it was a scouting force.Irrelevant. The purpose of the ships sent would not affect what they arrived with.

  • 02.14.2011 3:26 PM PDT


Posted by: chickenlittle
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Um, it stayed to cover the Pelican with the slipspace drive.
The Pelican that was either at the surface of the ship, where the guns couldn't hit it, and all the fighters were deestroyed, or the Pelican that was already inside the ship?
Also, to your final statement. A: Why is it so odd that the super-carrier, a massive ship, was refueling a Corvette?Because you send carriers to carry things. Dropships, troops, Seraphs, equipment. If you need to refuel something, you send a refueling station or specialized ship. And even worse, you don't send ships to enemy systems with empty gas tanks. Especially worse, the carrier didn't send any fighters to help the corvette, despite the crew knowing humans were attacking, and then on board.
B: It wasn't an invasion fleet, it was a scouting force.Irrelevant. The purpose of the ships sent would not affect what they arrived with.


5 ships isn't an invasion force <_<.

Also, the reason the Savannah stayed around, was partly to protect the Pelican (Which had to wait for Six to open the hanger.) and to jam the comm systems of the Corvette. That is why the Carrier didn't send reinforcements. Once they received orders to pull out, it was too late.

I doubt the Corvette arrived with an empty gas tank. Maybe it was topping off the tank, or getting more fighters/vehicles/troops from the super-carrier.

  • 02.14.2011 3:57 PM PDT

Posted By:[/b]chickenlittle
It did assist the Sabres land. But it didn't leave right away. It kept engaging at the corvette. Hence why you see it getting destroyed several minutes after you enter the ship. Since the corvette was about to get refueled by the Supercarrier, it would have been able to leave without fear of the corvette following it.


As Cmdr pointed out it also had to ensure that the Slipspace "bomb" carrying Pelican got in too. And it was jamming the Corvette's comms too.

The Keyes Loops was an extreme exception. That only happened because Keyes was a brilliant tactician, using the enemy plasma torpedoes against them, and got very lucky. If you look at the battle that immediately followed, the normal ratio followed. The UNSC uses the Cradle as a shield for the fleet, and takes the first plasma salvo. Despite that, several dozen UNSC ships are still wiped out, even with roughly half(~10) of the Covenant fleet out of commission.

Following that logic, the frigate in LNoS should have been annihilated immediately. Why did the Corvette not use its plasma torpedoes? Why did it completely ignore the frigate until the Sabres landed?


Hardly, it was not an exception at all, it was a brilliant maneuver, but using their plasma against them is hardly an exception, any other CO could have utilized that. My point still stands, the UNSC are not always dominated, it's ridiculous to claim that they always are.

As I already said, I don't think the Corvettes we saw in Reach were that strong, one, they don't seem to have very much shielding at all, and I don't think that their weapon systems are that strong either, otherwise Sword Base would not still be standing. As for ignoring the Savannah, I would say for game-play simplicity, one less thing to animate in, the Savannah wasn't doing any fighting either, so it probably was for simplicity sake.

One more thing on this. It makes no sense for a corvette, likely the smallest Covenant capital ship, to need to be refueled by a carrier. They have stations for that, like Unyielding Heirophant. And why send your invasion fleet into battle without full supplies?

What makes you think they were sent in without full supplies?
And space stations like Unyielding Heirophant don't strike me as something terribly mobile, I don't think there'd be any way for something like the Heirophant to transition into Slipspace like a ship. The Super Carrier was there to serve a base role, hence why it was able to refuel the Corvettes.

  • 02.14.2011 5:37 PM PDT

Posted by: OrderedComa
Posted By:chickenlittle
It did assist the Sabres land. But it didn't leave right away. It kept engaging at the corvette. Hence why you see it getting destroyed several minutes after you enter the ship. Since the corvette was about to get refueled by the Supercarrier, it would have been able to leave without fear of the corvette following it.

As Cmdr pointed out it also had to ensure that the Slipspace "bomb" carrying Pelican got in too. And it was jamming the Corvette's comms too.
If the organizers of the plan had any sense, they would have had the Pelican waiting outside the hangar bay the moment the defenses were down and fighters were destroyed. There's no point "covering" something if there is nothing to attack it. And if the Savannah was "jamming" Covenant communications, there is no need for it to stay within weapons range. If it needed to stay so close, they may as well have sent a jammer aboard with the Pelican.

The Keyes Loops was an extreme exception. That only happened because Keyes was a brilliant tactician, using the enemy plasma torpedoes against them, and got very lucky. If you look at the battle that immediately followed, the normal ratio followed. The UNSC uses the Cradle as a shield for the fleet, and takes the first plasma salvo. Despite that, several dozen UNSC ships are still wiped out, even with roughly half(~10) of the Covenant fleet out of commission.

Following that logic, the frigate in LNoS should have been annihilated immediately. Why did the Corvette not use its plasma torpedoes? Why did it completely ignore the frigate until the Sabres landed?


Hardly, it was not an exception at all, it was a brilliant maneuver, but using their plasma against them is hardly an exception, any other CO could have utilized that. My point still stands, the UNSC are not always dominated, it's ridiculous to claim that they always are.
Wait, what? You are implying that any random UNSC Captain could have pulled of the Keyes Loop? Keyes was the top of his class, near the top of the UNSC in terms of navigation. If he had been a single degree off of his calculations, the Iroquois would have been torn in half. And that maneuver was done without an AI. And the UNSC is virtually always dominated. Every single victory save that initial fight with the Keyes Loop required minimum 3-1 odds for the UNSC for a fair fight, and that was their first major victory in years. If that doesn't indicate the UNSC was dominated in space, I'm not sure what will.

As I already said, I don't think the Corvettes we saw in Reach were that strong, one, they don't seem to have very much shielding at all, and I don't think that their weapon systems are that strong either, otherwise Sword Base would not still be standing. As for ignoring the Savannah, I would say for game-play simplicity, one less thing to animate in, the Savannah wasn't doing any fighting either, so it probably was for simplicity sake.The Corvettes don't have shields, that appears true. Which is pretty damn stupid. They have shields for every other capital ship. They have shields for their single craft(Seraphs). Why not for a minor capital ship? Also, "for gameplay simplicity" is not a valid excuse for something that important missing.

One more thing on this. It makes no sense for a corvette, likely the smallest Covenant capital ship, to need to be refueled by a carrier. They have stations for that, like Unyielding Heirophant. And why send your invasion fleet into battle without full supplies?

What makes you think they were sent in without full supplies?
And space stations like Unyielding Heirophant don't strike me as something terribly mobile, I don't think there'd be any way for something like the Heirophant to transition into Slipspace like a ship. The Super Carrier was there to serve a base role, hence why it was able to refuel the Corvettes.
If it had full supplies, including fuel, it would not need to refuel at the carrier in the middle of a pseudo-invasion. UNSC ships use nuclear fusion reactors that are rarely, if ever, refueled. The Covenant base their technology off of Forerunner tech, which is millenia ahead of humanity. Based on this, if the ships were in good order, there would be no need for refueling. As for the stations, how would it be immobile? Anything can get through Slipspace if it gets fast enough; asteroids have done so. What about High Charity? It slipped right above Delta Halo, and it was many times the size of Unyielding Heirophant, which was sitting a few systems over from Sol with a massive invasion fleet.

  • 02.14.2011 10:46 PM PDT

Posted By:chickenlittle
Wait, what? You are implying that any random UNSC Captain could have pulled of the Keyes Loop? Keyes was the top of his class, near the top of the UNSC in terms of navigation. If he had been a single degree off of his calculations, the Iroquois would have been torn in half. And that maneuver was done without an AI. And the UNSC is virtually always dominated. Every single victory save that initial fight with the Keyes Loop required minimum 3-1 odds for the UNSC for a fair fight, and that was their first major victory in years. If that doesn't indicate the UNSC was dominated in space, I'm not sure what will.


No, no, no, you got it all wrong, I know Keyes is special, and I'm saying anyone could pull off the Keyes Loop. You brought up the using Covenant's plasma against them, and I was saying anyone could pull that off, not just anyone could pull off the Keyes Loop. That was not the first major victory in years either, the UNSC won the Battles of Harvest, I'd call kicking the Covenant's collective butts off of Harvest at least twice victories.

The Corvettes don't have shields, that appears true. Which is pretty damn stupid. They have shields for every other capital ship. They have shields for their single craft(Seraphs). Why not for a minor capital ship? Also, "for gameplay simplicity" is not a valid excuse for something that important missing.

Gameplay simplicity is a completely valid excuse, it's one less thing to animate in, and having to dodge huge streams of plasma that would kill you in a single hit would make the gameplay way too hard. Especially if both ships were broadsiding each other. The capitol ships in Battlefront II don't fight you either, probably for the same reasons.

If it had full supplies, including fuel, it would not need to refuel at the carrier in the middle of a pseudo-invasion. UNSC ships use nuclear fusion reactors that are rarely, if ever, refueled. The Covenant base their technology off of Forerunner tech, which is millenia ahead of humanity. Based on this, if the ships were in good order, there would be no need for refueling. As for the stations, how would it be immobile? Anything can get through Slipspace if it gets fast enough; asteroids have done so. What about High Charity? It slipped right above Delta Halo, and it was many times the size of Unyielding Heirophant, which was sitting a few systems over from Sol with a massive invasion fleet.

We still don't know how everything on the Covenant ships work, and refueling does not necessarily mean that it's replenishing the fuel supply for its engines, could be refueling anything, or maybe the Corvettes in Reach do run through fuel faster than other ships in the Covenant fleet, there could be any number of reasons for why it would need refueling.
I don't think speed really has anything to do with transitioning into Slipspace, yes, the asteroids have gotten into Slipspace before, but it never says how they get in there. And I never said that space stations couldn't get into Slipspace, I said I don't think they have the means to do so on their own like a ship. The only space station like structure in the Haloverse that can get into and out of Slipspace on its own was the UNSC's hospital ship in GoO. I think the Unyielding Heirophant was assembled where the fleet was, I don't think it warped there. And High Charity is different, it's in the same sort of vein as the Death Star, minus the super-weapon aspect, it's supposed to be fully mobile.

  • 02.15.2011 11:48 AM PDT

Posted by: OrderedComa
Posted By:chickenlittle
Wait, what? You are implying that any random UNSC Captain could have pulled of the Keyes Loop? Keyes was the top of his class, near the top of the UNSC in terms of navigation. If he had been a single degree off of his calculations, the Iroquois would have been torn in half. And that maneuver was done without an AI. And the UNSC is virtually always dominated. Every single victory save that initial fight with the Keyes Loop required minimum 3-1 odds for the UNSC for a fair fight, and that was their first major victory in years. If that doesn't indicate the UNSC was dominated in space, I'm not sure what will.


No, no, no, you got it all wrong, I know Keyes is special, and I'm saying anyone could pull off the Keyes Loop. You brought up the using Covenant's plasma against them, and I was saying anyone could pull that off, not just anyone could pull off the Keyes Loop.
That would involve a captain or AI being able to evade the plasma torpedo in the first place, which was only possible because Keyes accelerated at full speed using gravity's help, so they didn't have time to change course of the torpedoes in time.

That was not the first major victory in years either, the UNSC won the Battles of Harvest, I'd call kicking the Covenant's collective butts off of Harvest at least twice victories.Harvest fell in 2524. The subsequent retaking of it was less than years years after. The battle at Sigma Octanus was in 2552, decades later. Quoted directly from the novel, "That's the reason we're here. We need a victory. It's been too damn long - us getting whittled to pieces by those alien bastards. So this has [i]got to be a win. No matter what it takes.[/i]"(Admiral Stanforth, page 160, TFoR). This single-handedly indicates the UNSC has been battered repeatedly over the years.

The Corvettes don't have shields, that appears true. Which is pretty damn stupid. They have shields for every other capital ship. They have shields for their single craft(Seraphs). Why not for a minor capital ship? Also, "for gameplay simplicity" is not a valid excuse for something that important missing.

Gameplay simplicity is a completely valid excuse, it's one less thing to animate in, and having to dodge huge streams of plasma that would kill you in a single hit would make the gameplay way too hard. Especially if both ships were broadsiding each other. The capitol ships in Battlefront II don't fight you either, probably for the same reasons.

Again, "because gameplay durrrr" is not a valid excuse. It excludes the game from having to make any sense. For example, the Pelicans in Combat Evolved didn't use turrets. Why? Because the ammunition store had been destroyed. And the capital ships in Battlefront II do attack you. I have been blown out of space multitudes of times by both the corvettes and main ship, until I destroyed its turrets.

If it had full supplies, including fuel, it would not need to refuel at the carrier in the middle of a pseudo-invasion. UNSC ships use nuclear fusion reactors that are rarely, if ever, refueled. The Covenant base their technology off of Forerunner tech, which is millenia ahead of humanity. Based on this, if the ships were in good order, there would be no need for refueling. As for the stations, how would it be immobile? Anything can get through Slipspace if it gets fast enough; asteroids have done so. What about High Charity? It slipped right above Delta Halo, and it was many times the size of Unyielding Heirophant, which was sitting a few systems over from Sol with a massive invasion fleet.

We still don't know how everything on the Covenant ships work, and refueling does not necessarily mean that it's replenishing the fuel supply for its engines, could be refueling anything, or maybe the Corvettes in Reach do run through fuel faster than other ships in the Covenant fleet, there could be any number of reasons for why it would need refueling.
OK. An undamaged, perfectly intact Covenant corvette. The smallest known capital ship in the Covenant fleet, uses fuel faster than any other ship in their arsenal, despite the fact that it is a fraction of their size. Makes perfect sense. For sanity's sake, I think we'll have to call this one a draw. There is no way for us to know for sure either way.

I don't think speed really has anything to do with transitioning into Slipspace, yes, the asteroids have gotten into Slipspace before, but it never says how they get in there. And I never said that space stations couldn't get into Slipspace, I said I don't think they have the means to do so on their own like a ship. The only space station like structure in the Haloverse that can get into and out of Slipspace on its own was the UNSC's hospital ship in GoO. I think the Unyielding Heirophant was assembled where the fleet was, I don't think it warped there. And High Charity is different, it's in the same sort of vein as the Death Star, minus the super-weapon aspect, it's supposed to be fully mobile.Both High Charity and Unyielding Heirophant had Slipspace drives, which is the entire reason they were able to get from place to place. It would be extremely implausible for High Charity to require the tiny-by-comparison cruisers and carriers to move it, and Unyielding Heirophant was a fraction of its size.

  • 02.15.2011 3:23 PM PDT


Posted by: chickenlittle
Again, "because gameplay durrrr" is not a valid excuse. It excludes the game from having to make any sense. For example, the Pelicans in Combat Evolved didn't use turrets. Why? Because the ammunition store had been destroyed. And the capital ships in Battlefront II do attack you. I have been blown out of space multitudes of times by both the corvettes and main ship, until I destroyed its turrets.


So, if that is true, then you should also be complaining about the fact that plasma rifles don't melt through a soldier's face. Or that a hunter's fuel rod doesn't blow somebody in half upon impact.

Because both of those are gameplay reasons why they don't do that but in reality, they would behave differently.

  • 02.15.2011 3:42 PM PDT

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: chickenlittle
Again, "because gameplay durrrr" is not a valid excuse. It excludes the game from having to make any sense. For example, the Pelicans in Combat Evolved didn't use turrets. Why? Because the ammunition store had been destroyed. And the capital ships in Battlefront II do attack you. I have been blown out of space multitudes of times by both the corvettes and main ship, until I destroyed its turrets.


So, if that is true, then you should also be complaining about the fact that plasma rifles don't melt through a soldier's face. Or that a hunter's fuel rod doesn't blow somebody in half upon impact.

Because both of those are gameplay reasons why they don't do that but in reality, they would behave differently.
Those are both fundamental to the game being allowed to release. Neither are something that have been wanted in the game by the developer, and as such they won't put them in. It's not just because it's easier for gameplay. They gave the ability, it's the attitude behind it.

  • 02.15.2011 5:28 PM PDT


Posted by: chickenlittle
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: chickenlittle
Again, "because gameplay durrrr" is not a valid excuse. It excludes the game from having to make any sense. For example, the Pelicans in Combat Evolved didn't use turrets. Why? Because the ammunition store had been destroyed. And the capital ships in Battlefront II do attack you. I have been blown out of space multitudes of times by both the corvettes and main ship, until I destroyed its turrets.


So, if that is true, then you should also be complaining about the fact that plasma rifles don't melt through a soldier's face. Or that a hunter's fuel rod doesn't blow somebody in half upon impact.

Because both of those are gameplay reasons why they don't do that but in reality, they would behave differently.
Those are both fundamental to the game being allowed to release. Neither are something that have been wanted in the game by the developer, and as such they won't put them in. It's not just because it's easier for gameplay. They gave the ability, it's the attitude behind it.


Well, concerning the Corvette not having shields, I give you this answer which does make sense.

Perhaps the refueling run was to get more soldiers, as well as recharge the generators. Thus shields were offline due to power being directed elsewere. Maybe the Commander, seeing the frigate not in a position to use the MAC, decided not to turn them on.

Though, something I just thought about. Covenant ships have to drop shields to open fire. The Savannah and the Corvette were broadsiding each other, not much sense to quickly be dropping and raising your shields.

  • 02.15.2011 5:33 PM PDT

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: chickenlittle
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: chickenlittle
Again, "because gameplay durrrr" is not a valid excuse. It excludes the game from having to make any sense. For example, the Pelicans in Combat Evolved didn't use turrets. Why? Because the ammunition store had been destroyed. And the capital ships in Battlefront II do attack you. I have been blown out of space multitudes of times by both the corvettes and main ship, until I destroyed its turrets.


So, if that is true, then you should also be complaining about the fact that plasma rifles don't melt through a soldier's face. Or that a hunter's fuel rod doesn't blow somebody in half upon impact.

Because both of those are gameplay reasons why they don't do that but in reality, they would behave differently.
Those are both fundamental to the game being allowed to release. Neither are something that have been wanted in the game by the developer, and as such they won't put them in. It's not just because it's easier for gameplay. They gave the ability, it's the attitude behind it.


Well, concerning the Corvette not having shields, I give you this answer which does make sense.

Perhaps the refueling run was to get more soldiers, as well as recharge the generators. Thus shields were offline due to power being directed elsewere.
If getting more troops, it would make more sense just to send Phantoms. We already know they are now apparently Slipspace-capable, so the corvette rendezvousing is unnecessary. And if it needed more troops, why call it refueling? As for the generator - with technology millenia ahead of humanity, why would they need to recharge it, while humanity doesn't? And where else would power be going? They're using the engines normally. Basic running, including life support is working normally. There is no reason the shields would need to be offline.
Maybe the Commander, seeing the frigate not in a position to use the MAC, decided not to turn them on.Odd, I was under the assumption that Elites were honourable but intelligent, not just stupid.

Though, something I just thought about. Covenant ships have to drop shields to open fire. The Savannah and the Corvette were broadsiding each other, not much sense to quickly be dropping and raising your shields.The shields are only down for a split second, and only around the weapons themselves. They don't stay off permanently during combat. This is outlined in the novel. "A pulse laser flashed a hundred metres away...blinked and saw a silvery film rush back around the bulbous base of the laser turret."(page 123, TFoR). There really isn't too much reason for the shields to be offline for other reasons, either. Chainguns aren't going to take them offline; we already know it takes a nuke or MAC round minimum to overload a shield generator.

  • 02.15.2011 9:07 PM PDT

If you can read this, that means I'm not a Shaolin monk...

yet.


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: chickenlittle
I'm also curious as to why the frigate in LNoS was fighting the corvette using broadside guns. It makes no sense. UNSC ships are always - ALWAYS - dominated by Covenant ships 1 on 1, and they can't use their MAC from the side.

Since the destruction of the corvette wasn't intended, the frigate should have simply left, but instead stayed to engage broadside. Basically, the captain guaranteed his ship's annihilation for absolutely no reason.


If you had paid attention, he said "We are getting hit hard, we have to pull out."

Holland responded with "Our team is in, get out of there!"

At which point the frigate's reactor started going critical, leading to it's destruction.

That was after he had stayed for too long.

  • 02.16.2011 6:35 AM PDT

If you can read this, that means I'm not a Shaolin monk...

yet.


Posted by: chickenlittle
Posted by: MAXPWN197
Christ when are people going to accept the simple fact that Halo: Reach in terms of canon completely trumps The Fall of Reach. every other book, short movie, animation episode and game trumps TFoR, only the advertising campaigns like landfall and birth of a spartan are ranked lower in canon hierarchy. it is near rock bottom in terms of the truth.

END OF STORY PEOPLE
Normally that would be acceptable. However, in this case, they took something good and replaced it with shoddy work with holes everywhere.

Also, some of us are pissed that we paid for books that are now fanfiction.

Pfft, Halo: Reach is fanfiction.

  • 02.16.2011 6:36 AM PDT

Posted by: TheGreenAlloy

Posted by: chickenlittle
Posted by: MAXPWN197
Christ when are people going to accept the simple fact that Halo: Reach in terms of canon completely trumps The Fall of Reach. every other book, short movie, animation episode and game trumps TFoR, only the advertising campaigns like landfall and birth of a spartan are ranked lower in canon hierarchy. it is near rock bottom in terms of the truth.

END OF STORY PEOPLE
Normally that would be acceptable. However, in this case, they took something good and replaced it with shoddy work with holes everywhere.

Also, some of us are pissed that we paid for books that are now fanfiction.

Pfft, Halo: Reach is fanfiction.
For all the problems inherent with it, it should be.

  • 02.16.2011 12:58 PM PDT