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This topic has moved here: Poll [40 votes]: The Forerunners VS the Ancients (From Stargate)
  • Poll [40 votes]: The Forerunners VS the Ancients (From Stargate)
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Subject: The Forerunners VS the Ancients (From Stargate)

Poll: The Forerunners VS the Ancients (From Stargate)  [closed]
The Forerunners:  57%
(23 Votes)
The Ancients:  42%
(17 Votes)
Total Votes: 40

*Long read*

Based on what I know I believe that the Forerunners would win. Both the Forerunners and the Ancients have very similar technology so the main reason I believe the Forerunners would win is because of tactics. When the Ancients fought the war with the Wraith they were first very arrogant and underestimated their enemy. When they Wraith finally became a real threat they still would not go to the levels to win the war that the Forerunners did. The Forerunners destroyed first destroyed planets that the Flood had infected an eventually started destroying entire star systems to destroy the flood a feat that the Ancients were capable of doing but would not. The closest thing that they had to that was Project Arcturus which could have won the war with the Wraith but did not commit to it, and in terms of power generations the ancients cannot even come close to the forerunners, it takes 3 zpms to power atlantis while high charity (which is the size of a small moon) can operate on a fraction of the forerunner ships engines, and the forerunner ship's hull takes several MAC hits which would have the strength of a nuclear bomb and doesn't even slow down, something even wraith hulls cannot do. So imagine a giant daedalus powered by at least 50 zpm's with plasma beam weapons and a hull that can take half a dozen MAC shots which are nuclear level in power and you'll have some idea of a what a forerunner ship can do and the forerunners had thousands of ships at the height of their empire.


Tell me who you think would win and why.

[Edited on 10.31.2010 3:06 AM PDT]

  • 10.31.2010 3:05 AM PDT
  •  | 
  • Fabled Mythic Member

“Strange,” mused the Director, as they turned away, “strange to think that even in Our Ford’s day most games were played without more apparatus than a ball or two and a few sticks and perhaps a bit of netting. imagine the folly of allowing people to play elaborate games which do nothing whatever to increase consumption.”

The Black Chapter!

Well, the ancients had the ability to ascend. And then they get to throw flashy lights around.

No contest.

  • 10.31.2010 3:13 AM PDT

Umm there isn't really enough info on the Forerunners for me to make an honest opinion.

  • 10.31.2010 3:17 AM PDT

I do not fear death, in view of the fact that I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it. ~ Mark Twain

Wraith = Flood and Forerunners = Ancients.

Just it all was a bit different in the different galaxy and all.

The Chief is now about to fight the Wraith.

  • 10.31.2010 4:03 AM PDT

Shield World + Halo = /thread

  • 10.31.2010 6:43 AM PDT

Forerunners - died/left the galaxy.

Ancients - Became immortal, are able to traverse the universe.

Need more be said?

Edit: Halo would do little as the Ancients were spread across the universe, not just in the galaxy like the Forerunners.

[Edited on 10.31.2010 7:57 AM PDT]

  • 10.31.2010 7:56 AM PDT

I do not fear death, in view of the fact that I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born, and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it. ~ Mark Twain

Posted by: Wolverfrog
Forerunners - died/left the galaxy.

Ancients - Became immortal, are able to traverse the universe.

Need more be said?


No lol.

  • 10.31.2010 7:57 AM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

The Ancients had time travel technology. That tends to bottom line it I think.

  • 10.31.2010 10:00 AM PDT

The Past Is For Reference Not For Residents

How can you judge one of them is set 200
years into the future (halo)

  • 10.31.2010 10:08 AM PDT

*Facepalm*
and what gun doesn't tear though flesh? a squirt gun?

Forklifts don’t die. They’re just missing in action.

Pooping isn't something I enjoy, nor is it something that takes time. I get in there, drop the packages, then get out. I'm like UPS. What can brown do for you?


Posted by: Wolverfrog
Forerunners - died/left the galaxy.

Ancients - Became immortal, are able to traverse the universe.

Need more be said?

Edit: Halo would do little as the Ancients were spread across the universe, not just in the galaxy like the Forerunners.
this right here

  • 10.31.2010 10:44 AM PDT

http://i.imgur.com/fsISj.png

The Precursors would kick both their asses.

  • 10.31.2010 10:53 AM PDT


Posted by: annoyinginge
The Precursors would kick both their asses.

Does the thread say anything about Precursors? No. It's between Ancients and Forerunners, so why would you bring up Precursors?

It's like arguing who would win; Lions or Bears, and then you come all alpaca out of nowhere, and say "Doesnt matter, everyone knows a T-Rex would kick both of their asses."

[Edited on 10.31.2010 11:04 AM PDT]

  • 10.31.2010 11:03 AM PDT

...

You make good points...

But-the Forerunners were only in one galaxy. The Alterans had a empire that stretched across multiple. So Halo=fail.

Drones ignore shields. Pretty good penetration too, but probably wouldn't be able to cut through an entire Forerunner ship... unless they swarm.

The Alterans against the Wraith... the Alterans didn't take the Wraith seriously at first, then when the Wraith irked them too much, didn't the Alterans nearly wipe them out? Then they sent Aurora-class ships on search and destroy patrols deep into the heart of Wraith territory. After the Wraith managed to capture 3-5 of these vessels, they immediately began cloning themselves like alien lab rabbits. Then the Wraith basically won the war by a uber-Zerg rush. The Alterans were knocked down to one planet in 2 days, their fleets were wrecked simultaneously across the galaxy by uberhives and their battlegroups... Even then the Alterans managed to hold out for a VERY long time.

The Forerunners made almost the same mistake.

Problem with Forerunner-Ancient battles, the Ancients have one little bonus... they can ascend. Being on a higher plane of existence= insta-win.

Atlantis needs 3 zpms for full power

Do you even realize how powerful a ZPM is? The power of a galaxy in a small container. 1 ZPM >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>& gt;>>>>>>>>>>>>>>&g t;>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ;>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>& gt;>>>>>>>>>>>>>>&g t;>>>>>>>>>>> probably the entire output of energy of a Forerunner battlegroup.

And the Ancients could churn those out...

  • 10.31.2010 1:29 PM PDT

the Ancients are the technologically superior race for me, lets break down why I personally think this:

1) Destiny: this ship has been flying solo, for millions of years, it has travelled the universe, been through tens, hundreds, maybe thousands of galaxies and its still functioning, that is the ultimate testament to how resilient Ancient technology can be if they put their minds to it.

2) Stargates: near instant travel between two planets in different galaxies, the extent to how advanced this technology is is unbelievable. the amount of energy to do this is beyond comprehension, and the power is provided by a small power generator in the DHD, and that can create a wormhole between two gates (inside the same galaxy) but thousands of light years apart, its like the Ark portal but so much more advanced.

3) Shields: always a weird topic for me regarding the Ancients, they shield technology is unbelievably advanced. Atlantis was submerged for untold number of years, protected from thousands of feet of water by a shield for that much time, again serious technology. Even Puddle Jumpers can be shielded, and then survive multiple Drone impacts, they are smaller than Pelicans.

4) Time Travel: the Ancients possessed the means to travel through time, several pieces of technology have been shown throughout the Stargate Universe (all Ancient) capable of this function.

5) Propulsion: the Ancients were capable of trans-galactic travel, travelling between galaxies is an impressive thing, also Ancient ships are capable of travelling at like 99.999% the speed of light on sub-light engines.

6) Dakara Weapon: it does the exact same as the Halo Installation only it is much much much smaller and can be re-programmed to change its effects, plus the effect travels through Stargates.

7) Cloaking: Puddle Jumpers possess absolutely perfect cloaking technology, it is absolutely 100% invisible and seems to require tiny amounts of power to operate and can be used for extended periods.

8) Power Generation: Zero Point Energy Modules are very very advanced batteries, one ZPM was shown to allow the battlecruiser Daedalus survive an engagement with multiple Wraith Hive Ships and Cruisers for and extended period of time, not to mention that ZPM had been buried for thousands of years in Egypt, and when hooked upto the Hyperspace Drive allowed the Daedalus to cover the distance between Galaxies in days!

8.1) Project Arcturus: The thing that would make ZPMs look like 'alkaline batteries' as quoted from Mckay, harnessing the zero-point energy from our own universe, the ultimate, almost limitless power source.

9) Attero Device: another Ancient 'Super Weapon' was kind of an Endgame weapon in the war against the Wraith, had some nasty side effects!

the list continues, sure the Forerunners built the Halos and the Ark, but as far as general technologies go, I think the Ancients are by far the more impressive of the two races.

  • 11.02.2010 9:24 AM PDT

Posted by: PLUT0NIUM 235
the Ancients are the technologically superior race for me, lets break down why I personally think this:

1) Destiny: this ship has been flying solo, for millions of years, it has travelled the universe, been through tens, hundreds, maybe thousands of galaxies and its still functioning, that is the ultimate testament to how resilient Ancient technology can be if they put their minds to it.

2) Stargates: near instant travel between two planets in different galaxies, the extent to how advanced this technology is is unbelievable. the amount of energy to do this is beyond comprehension, and the power is provided by a small power generator in the DHD, and that can create a wormhole between two gates (inside the same galaxy) but thousands of light years apart, its like the Ark portal but so much more advanced.

3) Shields: always a weird topic for me regarding the Ancients, they shield technology is unbelievably advanced. Atlantis was submerged for untold number of years, protected from thousands of feet of water by a shield for that much time, again serious technology. Even Puddle Jumpers can be shielded, and then survive multiple Drone impacts, they are smaller than Pelicans.

4) Time Travel: the Ancients possessed the means to travel through time, several pieces of technology have been shown throughout the Stargate Universe (all Ancient) capable of this function.

5) Propulsion: the Ancients were capable of trans-galactic travel, travelling between galaxies is an impressive thing, also Ancient ships are capable of travelling at like 99.999% the speed of light on sub-light engines.

6) Dakara Weapon: it does the exact same as the Halo Installation only it is much much much smaller and can be re-programmed to change its effects, plus the effect travels through Stargates.

7) Cloaking: Puddle Jumpers possess absolutely perfect cloaking technology, it is absolutely 100% invisible and seems to require tiny amounts of power to operate and can be used for extended periods.

8) Power Generation: Zero Point Energy Modules are very very advanced batteries, one ZPM was shown to allow the battlecruiser Daedalus survive an engagement with multiple Wraith Hive Ships and Cruisers for and extended period of time, not to mention that ZPM had been buried for thousands of years in Egypt, and when hooked upto the Hyperspace Drive allowed the Daedalus to cover the distance between Galaxies in days!

8.1) Project Arcturus: The thing that would make ZPMs look like 'alkaline batteries' as quoted from Mckay, harnessing the zero-point energy from our own universe, the ultimate, almost limitless power source.

9) Attero Device: another Ancient 'Super Weapon' was kind of an Endgame weapon in the war against the Wraith, had some nasty side effects!

the list continues, sure the Forerunners built the Halos and the Ark, but as far as general technologies go, I think the Ancients are by far the more impressive of the two races.


This.

Don't drone weapons ignore shields? Wasn't Destiny launched almost a trillion years ago?

  • 11.03.2010 12:40 PM PDT

If they ascended, a better comparison would be the Precursors vs the Ancients.

Remember, Precursors, as transsentient beings, could be easily considered on the level of godhood (are also described as "superbeings" in Halo: Cryptum's synopsis)

Otherwise it'd be gods vs mortals (Ancients vs Forerunners) unless there's something about the Forerunners we don't know, the only possible fair fight is

1) Precursors

2) before the Ancients ascended.

[Edited on 11.03.2010 3:51 PM PDT]

  • 11.03.2010 3:50 PM PDT

no we don't need to bring the fact the ancients ascended into this, because all the technology they left behind was pre-ascension, therefore when they ascended (millions of years ago?) they were already more advanced than any races in Halo Universe.

drones do indeed simply bypass shields, although they cannot bypass ancient shields or asgard shields. all other shields are penetrated outright by drones (ancients make sense, since they made the things and asgard perhaps based on ancient shields?).

but the asgard said the ancients were basically the most advanced of the great alliance. also worth noting that the orion, aurora and tria (ancient warships, not even the best ones apparently) are like 3,500 metres long or something along those lines, so they are about 2/3 the length of an assault carrier. in one episode an ancient warship (orion) survives a super-volcano eruption with heavy damage, minimal shield power, etc. without suffering any more damage so their shields are obviously very very powerful, though their hulls seem pretty weak.

  • 11.03.2010 4:33 PM PDT

On Waypoint I'm rocketFox;
http://halo.xbox.com/forums/members/rocketfox/default.aspx

Old GTs; RebelRobot, Flamedude

Firstly there isnt enough information on the Forerunners to make a comparison. Secondly the Halo universe is, for the most part, a quality science fiction and the Stargate universe is cheesy, cliched, poor, makes no sense and is a prime example of the "JUST MAKE IT BIGGER/STRONGER FOR NO REASON!!" writing method.

  • 11.03.2010 4:46 PM PDT

The Razor.

For the honour of the Mirratord.

Ancients win.

Reason? It's their Destiny.

  • 11.03.2010 4:46 PM PDT

yeah don't get me wrong, i much prefer the halo universe for its attention to detail and for the most part continuity. but the whole idea of stargate being bad because its the 'prime example of ...' is a little flawed, since that happens in almost all science fiction, though granted much less severe in the halo universe. sorry but the prime example of that is star wars, with its rediculous 'throwing' around of huge numbers with little thought into what they mean, stargate isn't even close to as bad as that...!

there is 'some' information on the forerunner to base a conclusion on, weapons we have seen, technologies we have seen, etc. but again look at the onyx sentinels, a massive example of science fiction 'cheese', and clearly not consistant with forerunner constructs. i think the forerunner and the ancients are one in the same in their respective universes, though the forerunner build really really huge things with terrible defensive capabilities, and the ancients build much smaller things with unholy defensive capabilities, look at drones for example, they are the mother of all missiles, and even the 'tiny' puddle jumpers have drones onboard, funny to think a puddle jumper could take out a UNSC frigate...!

though i will grant you stargate is extremely cheesy, hugely cliched and pretty inconsistant at best, especially scales in, some of the ship scaling is hilariously bad!

  • 11.03.2010 5:48 PM PDT

What about forerunners vs. prometheans? The prometheans are the advanced race that is now exstinct in the mass effect universe. And the mass effect universe is pretty detailed, far more detailed and consistent than the stargate universe. I also thin there are far more similarities between the Prometheans and the forerunners.

One being neither of them 'asended'. I could probaly think of more but i haven't played mass effect in months so i forget alot of the details.

  • 11.04.2010 2:08 AM PDT

Ascending can't be brought into this as when the Ancients have ascended they can no longer- apart from a few occasions- interfere with events at a mortal level.

  • 11.04.2010 2:58 AM PDT


Posted by: Yanksck73
What about forerunners vs. prometheans? The prometheans are the advanced race that is now exstinct in the mass effect universe. And the mass effect universe is pretty detailed, far more detailed and consistent than the stargate universe. I also thin there are far more similarities between the Prometheans and the forerunners.

One being neither of them 'asended'. I could probaly think of more but i haven't played mass effect in months so i forget alot of the details.

Protheans weren't an powerful ancient race, the Reapers arrive when the Galactic Civilzation reaches a certain tech level, the Reapers were suposed to arrive earlier in ME, but their plan failed, I wouldn't be suprised if the Asari have a higher tech level then the Protheans. An Everest class Dreadnought deals out 38 kiloton damage with a shot from it's main gun, that is seen as powerful in the ME universe, 38 kiloton is a joke in the Haloverse. Protheans got stomped by the Reapers, Reapers might be defeated by the UNSC, depends on their numbers, Covies would stomp the Reapers, Forerunners would laugh their ass off. Forerunners with their superior Slipspace drives could travel through the galaxy without use of the Mass Relays, Protheans need them, becasue they have inferior FTL speeds without the Relays. Forerunners would just camp...
Or Forerunners could just cheat and use the Array....

Remember, what is powerful in one universe doesn't means it's powerful in another one.

And back ontopic, we don't know enough of the Forerunners for this kind of battles, but from what we know the Ancients would win, what is not suprising since Stargate was never designed to feel like a realstic Sci-Fi, they just put all the cool stuff they could come up with in the series, who cares it doesn't make sense? It's cool! I'm not hating, I like Stargate, but that doesn't mean I can't see the flaws.

[Edited on 11.04.2010 11:25 AM PDT]

  • 11.04.2010 9:00 AM PDT

Oh hey there

Posted by: petarded2
It's a metaphor for the 07s' lack of identity. too old to be newfa­g, yet too new to be oldfa­g, we wander b.net in search of a home, forever trying to be something we are not.

Ancients pre or post ascension? Pre Forerunner win. Post Ancients.

  • 11.04.2010 11:17 AM PDT

On Waypoint I'm rocketFox;
http://halo.xbox.com/forums/members/rocketfox/default.aspx

Old GTs; RebelRobot, Flamedude

Posted by: PLUT0NIUM 235
yeah don't get me wrong, i much prefer the halo universe for its attention to detail and for the most part continuity. but the whole idea of stargate being bad because its the 'prime example of ...' is a little flawed, since that happens in almost all science fiction, though granted much less severe in the halo universe. sorry but the prime example of that is star wars, with its rediculous 'throwing' around of huge numbers with little thought into what they mean, stargate isn't even close to as bad as that...!

there is 'some' information on the forerunner to base a conclusion on, weapons we have seen, technologies we have seen, etc. but again look at the onyx sentinels, a massive example of science fiction 'cheese', and clearly not consistant with forerunner constructs. i think the forerunner and the ancients are one in the same in their respective universes, though the forerunner build really really huge things with terrible defensive capabilities, and the ancients build much smaller things with unholy defensive capabilities, look at drones for example, they are the mother of all missiles, and even the 'tiny' puddle jumpers have drones onboard, funny to think a puddle jumper could take out a UNSC frigate...!

though i will grant you stargate is extremely cheesy, hugely cliched and pretty inconsistant at best, especially scales in, some of the ship scaling is hilariously bad!


I actually agree with you. But Star Wars and Stargate are terrible for different reasons. Star Wars, the core, is still amazing but the expanded universe and the unnecessary need to drive real world values into the franchise really does more damage than good. Gigaton yield turbolasers...... yeah right. I much prefer how Star Trek tackled scientific values... just make up a new unit (isotons). Much better.

I used to like Stargate, like most people, in the first handful of series when it was still fresh and full of interesting original(ish) storylines. But the need to come up with new enemies and the inexplicable "They're just stronger than the previous enemies, ok?" attitude of the writers just sucked. Eurgh, the Ori. I preferred the older episodes like the "groundhog day" episode when they were fun and interesting, rather than just terrible non sense.

I suppose the driving force behind those two franchises becoming....... less focused.... is the need to create new material to make money and the fragmentation of having too many contributors. I'd prefer quality over quantity. For instance, does anyone watch Stargate Universe anymore??

  • 11.04.2010 11:59 AM PDT

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