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This topic has moved here: Subject: My Halo theses...long read
  • Subject: My Halo theses...long read
Subject: My Halo theses...long read
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This is my Halo story...so I hope you can understand why I have come to my conclusions.

I used to play alot of Atari when I was younger, I played games like Froger and Pitfall. I then graduated to Nintendo and played games like Mario Bros., Zelda and Simons quest, awesome games that really made you want to beat them. Along came N64 and Goldeneye. It was like holy**** I am actually in a three dimensional building blasting the *** out of my brothers and their friends. This was a new and very competitive concept, My skill with my weapon determines the outcome of victory.

Years later after I had given up gaming for the most part I one day went to my friends house who had an xbox. He mention that I should play a game called Halo with him. At first I sort of shrugged him off mentioning something like "what the *** is an xbox?". He insisted that we play, so I did. I was immediately captivated! I could not believe what I was experiencing. It was like Goldeneye times 100. There were about 6 of us playing this game 3v3 of course and it was just the most fun I had ever had with a gaming console. I was getting beat down, but it was fun none the less. I knew if I had this game I would get better and be the one handing out the *** whoopins.

So the next week I purchased an xbox and Halo and played the game religiously for months, months turned into a year. Every sunday me and my buddies would drag our tvs and xboxes to our friends house and play this game for hours on in, 12 hours at a time most of the time. The game was just so much damn fun to play, and addicting. I would practice my aiming skills and prepare for the up coming sunday. We did this for about a year strait!

One day I received an email form xbox confirming my request to be a beat tester for their new service named xbox live in which you could play online and communicate with others. I was obviously excited about this and a couple weeks later received my live starter kit. It was kind of weird the first time, there were people actually talking through this headset thingy. But that initial strange feeling subsides and you start trash talking with the best of them. It was cool talking and playing on live but the games were just garbage. I remember being in a game and talking to my teammates on how bad *** it would be to play Halo online. Then out of no where someone says "you can". I was like what? How?. He said xbconnect.com. You use their program on your computer to play others online. It was a good thing I got xbox live so I would find out about xbconnect :)

I told my buddies about xbc and they all were as surprised as me. We all bought computers and routers and everything we needed to be online with Halo. That was the end of our lan parties sadly. The competition online was fierce. We all thought we were the best in the world at Halo, It was a big wake up call. Not only were we not the best in the world but we were not even in the "know" as far as Halo combat tactics. Things like 3 shot kills, instant kills from the back, humping a corpse after a humiliating frag, things of this nature. We all quickly caught on and after years of playing Halo on xbc we became pretty formidable players. Always practicing to get better, and always having a blast with this game that is a masterpiece in every respect.

The anticipation of Halo 2 was extremely high. I tried to get as much info on this game as possible, always online and always on the look out for more tid bits. Watching the E3 demo was astonishing, the game looked so damn nice. I would finally be able to compete on xbox live with the game that would be the game of all games! I think that everybody that played Halo would agree that the biggest draw to the game is that "feeling" of actually being in the game. The sense that you really feel like your there in the game and in complete control of your facilities. Halo 2 was going to be the ultimate competition. Only the best would be victorious. Millions would experience what my friends and I have been experiencing for years. Unfortunately this would not be.

Everything that could have been done wrong with Halo 2 was done wrong. Its like a nightmare. The switching of physics engines was just the start. There was no longer that smooth feel for being in the game, the new physics engine eliminated that, everything is now glitchy and jumpy. The weapons were all toned down, the auto aim has been increased so that any kid can now frag someone with out much skill needed. The FOV has been shrinked and now you get a very closed in claustrophobic sort of vision in the game. Real time humping has been eliminated. Lunging melees has been introduced along with a giant noob stick. Everything that could have been done to make it easier for any average little kid to play this game was done, and it was done obviously for $$$. Halo 2 is just like every other average FPS and takes no skill to play, anybody can kill anybody and its just not a fun game to play period.

The genius behind the original award winning Halo physics engine Alex Seropian left Bungie along with other original Bungie developers to form wideload studios. Was this because the saw what was coming from the Microsoft Bungie merger? Did they see that Halo was going to become a giant noob friendly joke of a game to please the majority of kids? Perhaps. All I know is that shortly after Halo 2 was released my friends and I that have been playing Halo for years stopped playing xbox all together and have graduated to computer games like world of warcraft and call of duty. Games that take skill to play. With the release of xbox 360 I hope our interest with console play is revived, but in order for that to happen the games have to be good.


Bottom line: I loved the hell out of Halo 1, I feel completely the opposite about Halo 2.

  • 11.01.2005 9:06 PM PDT
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Posted by: Orbitron414
This is my Halo story...so I hope you can understand why I have come to my conclusions.

I used to play alot of Atari when I was younger, I played games like Froger and Pitfall. I then graduated to Nintendo and played games like Mario Bros., Zelda and Simons quest, awesome games that really made you want to beat them. Along came N64 and Goldeneye. It was like holy**** I am actually in a three dimensional building blasting the *** out of my brothers and their friends. This was a new and very competitive concept, My skill with my weapon determines the outcome of victory.

Years later after I had given up gaming for the most part I one day went to my friends house who had an xbox. He mention that I should play a game called Halo with him. At first I sort of shrugged him off mentioning something like "what the *** is an xbox?". He insisted that we play, so I did. I was immediately captivated! I could not believe what I was experiencing. It was like Goldeneye times 100. There were about 6 of us playing this game 3v3 of course and it was just the most fun I had ever had with a gaming console. I was getting beat down, but it was fun none the less. I knew if I had this game I would get better and be the one handing out the *** whoopins.

So the next week I purchased an xbox and Halo and played the game religiously for months, months turned into a year. Every sunday me and my buddies would drag our tvs and xboxes to our friends house and play this game for hours on in, 12 hours at a time most of the time. The game was just so much damn fun to play, and addicting. I would practice my aiming skills and prepare for the up coming sunday. We did this for about a year strait!

One day I received an email form xbox confirming my request to be a beat tester for their new service named xbox live in which you could play online and communicate with others. I was obviously excited about this and a couple weeks later received my live starter kit. It was kind of weird the first time, there were people actually talking through this headset thingy. But that initial strange feeling subsides and you start trash talking with the best of them. It was cool talking and playing on live but the games were just garbage. I remember being in a game and talking to my teammates on how bad *** it would be to play Halo online. Then out of no where someone says "you can". I was like what? How?. He said xbconnect.com. You use their program on your computer to play others online. It was a good thing I got xbox live so I would find out about xbconnect :)

I told my buddies about xbc and they all were as surprised as me. We all bought computers and routers and everything we needed to be online with Halo. That was the end of our lan parties sadly. The competition online was fierce. We all thought we were the best in the world at Halo, It was a big wake up call. Not only were we not the best in the world but we were not even in the "know" as far as Halo combat tactics. Things like 3 shot kills, instant kills from the back, humping a corpse after a humiliating frag, things of this nature. We all quickly caught on and after years of playing Halo on xbc we became pretty formidable players. Always practicing to get better, and always having a blast with this game that is a masterpiece in every respect.

The anticipation of Halo 2 was extremely high. I tried to get as much info on this game as possible, always online and always on the look out for more tid bits. Watching the E3 demo was astonishing, the game looked so damn nice. I would finally be able to compete on xbox live with the game that would be the game of all games! I think that everybody that played Halo would agree that the biggest draw to the game is that "feeling" of actually being in the game. The sense that you really feel like your there in the game and in complete control of your facilities. Halo 2 was going to be the ultimate competition. Only the best would be victorious. Millions would experience what my friends and I have been experiencing for years. Unfortunately this would not be.

Everything that could have been done wrong with Halo 2 was done wrong. Its like a nightmare. The switching of physics engines was just the start. There was no longer that smooth feel for being in the game, the new physics engine eliminated that, everything is now glitchy and jumpy. The weapons were all toned down, the auto aim has been increased so that any kid can now frag someone with out much skill needed. The FOV has been shrinked and now you get a very closed in claustrophobic sort of vision in the game. Real time humping has been eliminated. Lunging melees has been introduced along with a giant noob stick. Everything that could have been done to make it easier for any average little kid to play this game was done, and it was done obviously for $$$. Halo 2 is just like every other average FPS and takes no skill to play, anybody can kill anybody and its just not a fun game to play period.

The genius behind the original award winning Halo physics engine Alex Seropian left Bungie along with other original Bungie developers to form wideload studios. Was this because the saw what was coming from the Microsoft Bungie merger? Did they see that Halo was going to become a giant noob friendly joke of a game to please the majority of kids? Perhaps. All I know is that shortly after Halo 2 was released my friends and I that have been playing Halo for years stopped playing xbox all together and have graduated to computer games like world of warcraft and call of duty. Games that take skill to play. With the release of xbox 360 I hope our interest with console play is revived, but in order for that to happen the games have to be good.


Bottom line: I loved the hell out of Halo 1, I feel completely the opposite about Halo 2.


Every single thing you said in your thesis was the exact same thing that happened to me. I completely relate to every thing you typed, and if i could have put my experiance into words, it would have been what you have said.

  • 11.01.2005 9:37 PM PDT
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I am very sympthetic that you don't like halo2 and I'm pleased to say I enjoy both games unlike you. I read through the start about how you went to a friends and got addicted to halo (like me :) ...but near the end it turned out to be a load of crap whining about how halo2 is a "noob game".

  • 11.01.2005 9:43 PM PDT
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Posted by: grunts_r_us
I am very sympthetic that you don't like halo2 and I'm pleased to say I enjoy both games unlike you. I read through the start about how you went to a friends and got addicted to halo (like me :) ...but near the end it turned out to be a load of crap whining about how halo2 is a "noob game".


He was merely showing discontent about how he had waited and anticipated the coming of halo 2 only to discover that it wasn't the game he thought it was going to be. I'm sure many of us, including me, have experianced this.

  • 11.01.2005 10:15 PM PDT
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Its amazing how many different experiences a game like Halo can create...Theres nothing better than being with your friends, playing halo in the basement...mmm...warm fuzzy feelings.

  • 11.01.2005 10:33 PM PDT
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Your story makes my heart heavy and my prostate weak, my bladder is full to bursting
Sorry, that was a quote from Kung Pow. I'm using humor because you story touched my heart, or something. It definetly touched somewhere. Everything you said is so true, and it makes me wonder. hmmmmm. Your story isn't the forst that I have heard trashing Halo 2, and it's not like people that Hate Halo 2 are just ranting. Halo 2 haters bring very real and very important facts to the table about why Halo 2 is inferior in almost every aspect to Halo 1. Also Rippon (May he live forever) is one of the best Halo 2 players, and he openly trashes it in favor of H1, so obviously it can't be because of lack of skill.
My question is, how can Bungie NOT want to make Halo 3 more like Halo 1? Is there some doubt in their mind that what they made was inferior and a dissapointment to most real gamers everywhere? (with the exception of Jupiter and uranus). Or does Bungie not care about the real gamers, the hardcore pros; do they favor noobs just because they have cash? Even noobs bought Halo 1, but I never bought Halo 2 because I found out what it was like before I had time to waste my money. I can almost guarentee that the noobs will buy Halo 3 if it is like Halo 1, but I cannot guarentee that pros will buy Halo 3 if it is like Halo 2. (sorry if that was a little confusing)
Bungie, I am down on my knees begging you to not ruin Halo 3 (which makes it difficult to type) please consider what we have brought to the table.
OK, I am done, I'm going to go make myself a sandwich or something.

  • 11.02.2005 2:17 PM PDT
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Orbitron, your theses are not explained enough and have no backup.

1--The energy sword.
It's not a noob weapon. It only works at close range. Time and time again, I say this: If there is a sword-user, STAY OUT OF CLOSE RANGE, and you won't fall victim to it. Instead, snipe the enemy.

The lunge was added to give the sword an advatnage; without it, it would take two normal slashes to kill, which is the equivalent to using an ammo-less brute shot. So the lunge is there to balance that out. Therefore, the energy sword is not a noob stick. Learn how to avoid and kill its user, and you're fine.

2--Your actual theses.

Well, over half your post is spent delivering a boting history of your gaming life. I think many of us have been through those stages before.

3--The physics.

You didn't bother to explain where you thought the physics engine needed work. Besides, the physics were fine, and I could think of many things where Halo 1's physics engine didn't act realistic, either.
Dude, this is a futuristic sci-fi video game. A video game. It is not supposed to be a cut'n'pasted version of reality.


4--Halo 2 noobs.

Look back at halo 1. Look back at its multiplayer. Did it not have "noobs" hogging the RL, SR, and pistol? it certainly did. In fact, very rarely did you ever find someone using a covenant weapon, with the exception of grenades. Halo 2 does not "power down" its weapons. For the most part, it creates a balance so that the player can use several different weapons in order to win, not just a three-hit pistol that required absolutely no skill to use.


5--Auto-aim.
The auto-aim is not that noticeable in Halo 2. The only way it can actually stick p=out is if you are standing still and you make an experiment. And halo 1's conditions are very similar.

  • 11.03.2005 4:58 PM PDT
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Orbitron, I agree with you until your last paragraph. There, the award goes to Vitamin.

I did have the same disappointment with the campaign, and the MP was hard to adapt to, unlike Halo 1's. But after playing a bit, I guess it was good enough, but it would never replace my Halo.

But I do have to agree with the Autoaim... Saying that Halo 2's is slightly more noticeable. (Maybe that's why there was never any Team Swat in Halo 1...) Lol... Just a bad first experience -_-

  • 11.03.2005 5:31 PM PDT
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"He's already pulled over....he can't pull over any further!" supertroopers

Orbitron .....GREAT POST....almost my experience exactly

I just wish bungie would have release h2 with a different name with diff characters n such....because it is not halo (to me)

h2 is a great game, but IT IS NOT HALO

BUT they fixed WAY too many things that WERE NOT BROKEN (the physics in h1 still give me a stiffy)
....yes i play h2 xbl because of how easy it is to get a game larger than 2v2

(h1 xbc is still the sheot tho)

  • 11.03.2005 7:39 PM PDT
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Posted by: Vitamin Zawaz
1--The energy sword.
It's not a noob weapon. It only works at close range. Time and time again, I say this: If there is a sword-user, STAY OUT OF CLOSE RANGE, and you won't fall victim to it. Instead, snipe the enemy.

The lunge was added to give the sword an advatnage; without it, it would take two normal slashes to kill, which is the equivalent to using an ammo-less brute shot. So the lunge is there to balance that out. Therefore, the energy sword is not a noob stick. Learn how to avoid and kill its user, and you're fine.

There are several ways the sword could have been balanced without the lunge. Just because some of us want the lunge removed, doesn't mean we want everything else to stay the same.

And the problem with staying out of close range... small maps with many corner and short ranged spawn weapons. And running backwards is slower than running forwards (so unless you're back is turned and you're straight running the opposite direction, the sword wielder will move slightly faster than you and close the gap).

Posted by: Vitamin Zawaz
3--The physics.

You didn't bother to explain where you thought the physics engine needed work. Besides, the physics were fine, and I could think of many things where Halo 1's physics engine didn't act realistic, either.
Dude, this is a futuristic sci-fi video game. A video game. It is not supposed to be a cut'n'pasted version of reality.

The physics engine in Halo 2 is very glitchy (hence superbounces, objects falling through maps, etc.) It's very easy to see why someone would not like it. As for weird glide feel of the jumps and grenades that seem magnetically attracted to the floor, that's all gaming preference. But the glitches, that's another story. NO ONE should agree with superbounces and random fall-through-the-map guardian deaths.

Posted by: Vitamin Zawaz
4--Halo 2 noobs.

Look back at halo 1. Look back at its multiplayer. Did it not have "noobs" hogging the RL, SR, and pistol? it certainly did. In fact, very rarely did you ever find someone using a covenant weapon, with the exception of grenades. Halo 2 does not "power down" its weapons. For the most part, it creates a balance so that the player can use several different weapons in order to win, not just a three-hit pistol that required absolutely no skill to use.

The pistol TSK requires no skill? If the Halo:CE pistol requires no skill in your opinion, than Halo 2 would have to require less than no skill, since it's obviously easier to four shot with a BR than it is to three shot with a Halo:CE pistol. There's no denying that. Especially if you've ever played Halo:CE on XBC.

Posted by: Vitamin Zawaz
5--Auto-aim.
The auto-aim is not that noticeable in Halo 2. The only way it can actually stick p=out is if you are standing still and you make an experiment. And halo 1's conditions are very similar.

The autoaim itself isn't very noticeable. It's effects, however, are obvious. Hence why I nail repeated four shot BR kills, and in Team Hardcore games my kills and headshots are usually about the same.

The only reason it's not noticeable is because you're trying to hit the person. In situations where you're trying to MISS the person (example, Lockout firing from BR tower to Sniper tower trying to hit the explosives behind the sniper, and you just can't seem to MISS the sniper) the autoaim is very noticeable. Or when using a Rocket Launcher - you can try to shoot past a corner at a person sticking half way out from the corner, and the rocket will angle out towards the center of the opposing player and hit the corner. Or with plasma rifles trying to hit a running target, you lead the shots in front of them, but the shots angle out towards the opposing player and fly harmlessly behind them.

[Edited on 11/4/2005]

  • 11.04.2005 6:05 AM PDT