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  • Subject: Halo Reach Did not Destroy the Canon
Subject: Halo Reach Did not Destroy the Canon

"What do you hear?"
"Nothing but the rain."
"Then grab your gun and bring in the cat."
"Boom, boom, boom!"

Posted by: hotshot revan II
And how the -blam!- did a Halycon class cruiser even landed on Reach??That ship can't fly in the goddamn atmosphere.


More then likely brought in by a few atmosphere capable ships.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
I pray to god that 343 industries will declare that game non canon.


You know they won't. They'll get them to mesh.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
The canon problem between the halo books and Reach can't be fixed


You're over-reacting. A lot of it has to do with fixing the dates and killing off Jun. That's about it.

I'm sitting on the fence for this one. On one hand, I agree with the people that say Reach broke canon. Dates are completely out of whack, as has been pointed out so many times before and I would have preferred a second class of S-IIs over S-IIIs and a slight change in the story.

But on the other hand...I enjoyed the game a little bit more. Not saying the book is bad, second favorite next to GoO but I prefer the more "it lasted longer then one day" approach. True, I have problem with a month long invasion but starting said attack somewhere in mid-August? I would have been fine with that IMO.

  • 01.21.2011 6:17 PM PDT


Posted by: AlphaZero X

Posted by: GrnDragn

They changed so much more than the dates. It's not just the time, it was the fact that it disregards previously established Halo Canon, all so that they could make a mediocre campaign.


I don't agree, having read all the books, Cryptum through Evolutions II, in the past 2 weeks. The campaign was great. I can look at Halowiki for the battle of Reach, and the timeline works out just fine for me. I don't bother worrying about semantics such as when the BR was introduced and all that. It doesn't disregard anything, it's just fitting more stuff in.

The back of the box for "Halo Combat Evolved" says "You are the last of your kind". So does that totally over screw ALL the books because, hey, the game box said I'm the last, so non of the books are canon, because I'm supposed to be the last, right?
That's the same type of wall you'll run into if you're sitting there obsessing about Reach falling in one day. August 30th becomes the day Reach fell. And reading the books, again, makes it highly probable that no human colony fell in a matter of 24 hours. But if you want to box yourself in to things said rather early in the franchise's development and stick with them to the bitter end, be my guest. Next Halo book please.


Nice point, Alpha, I couldn't agree more, I may only be so open minded to the changes Reach introduced because I'm a comparatively new member of the fandom, but it is still always a much better idea to not entrench oneself too deeply in an early development in a constantly evolving series.

Reach falling in a couple hours when other colonies lasted for much long, for instance Harvest, I know there were several battles there, but the UNSC forces lasted for much longer than 24 hours in the most of their battles.

I mean take Earth for instance, that lasted for a good long while, yes the UNSC did up the defenses after Reach fell, and it is humanities home world, but if it can last that long it makes no sense for Reach to fall in a couple hourse.

  • 01.21.2011 6:20 PM PDT


Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: AlphaZero X

Posted by: GrnDragn

They changed so much more than the dates. It's not just the time, it was the fact that it disregards previously established Halo Canon, all so that they could make a mediocre campaign.


I don't agree, having read all the books, Cryptum through Evolutions II, in the past 2 weeks. The campaign was great. I can look at Halowiki for the battle of Reach, and the timeline works out just fine for me. I don't bother worrying about semantics such as when the BR was introduced and all that. It doesn't disregard anything, it's just fitting more stuff in.

The back of the box for "Halo Combat Evolved" says "You are the last of your kind". So does that totally over screw ALL the books because, hey, the game box said I'm the last, so non of the books are canon, because I'm supposed to be the last, right?
That's the same type of wall you'll run into if you're sitting there obsessing about Reach falling in one day. August 30th becomes the day Reach fell. And reading the books, again, makes it highly probable that no human colony fell in a matter of 24 hours. But if you want to box yourself in to things said rather early in the franchise's development and stick with them to the bitter end, be my guest. Next Halo book please.


Nice point, Alpha, I couldn't agree more, I may only be so open minded to the changes Reach introduced because I'm a comparatively new member of the fandom, but it is still always a much better idea to not entrench oneself too deeply in an early development in a constantly evolving series.

Reach falling in a couple hours when other colonies lasted for much long, for instance Harvest, I know there were several battles there, but the UNSC forces lasted for much longer than 24 hours in the most of their battles.

I mean take Earth for instance, that lasted for a good long while, yes the UNSC did up the defenses after Reach fell, and it is humanities home world, but if it can last that long it makes no sense for Reach to fall in a couple hours.
exacly rech falling in a month is scary in a way

imagine this your on the other side of reach the navy you all fine but you see the army moving arou alot you leave it untill August 30th when 700 ships attack you think wow the army ONI didnt even tell the whole of reach covenant was attacking the viery terrtory,

or take into the marines account they wipe out the last of the advance party they cheer untill they get word of the 700 covenant ships swarming in. Your heart would sink to the depths of hell,

[Edited on 01.21.2011 6:32 PM PST]

  • 01.21.2011 6:32 PM PDT


Posted by: Alf stewert

Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: AlphaZero X

Posted by: GrnDragn

They changed so much more than the dates. It's not just the time, it was the fact that it disregards previously established Halo Canon, all so that they could make a mediocre campaign.


I don't agree, having read all the books, Cryptum through Evolutions II, in the past 2 weeks. The campaign was great. I can look at Halowiki for the battle of Reach, and the timeline works out just fine for me. I don't bother worrying about semantics such as when the BR was introduced and all that. It doesn't disregard anything, it's just fitting more stuff in.

The back of the box for "Halo Combat Evolved" says "You are the last of your kind". So does that totally over screw ALL the books because, hey, the game box said I'm the last, so non of the books are canon, because I'm supposed to be the last, right?
That's the same type of wall you'll run into if you're sitting there obsessing about Reach falling in one day. August 30th becomes the day Reach fell. And reading the books, again, makes it highly probable that no human colony fell in a matter of 24 hours. But if you want to box yourself in to things said rather early in the franchise's development and stick with them to the bitter end, be my guest. Next Halo book please.


Nice point, Alpha, I couldn't agree more, I may only be so open minded to the changes Reach introduced because I'm a comparatively new member of the fandom, but it is still always a much better idea to not entrench oneself too deeply in an early development in a constantly evolving series.

Reach falling in a couple hours when other colonies lasted for much long, for instance Harvest, I know there were several battles there, but the UNSC forces lasted for much longer than 24 hours in the most of their battles.

I mean take Earth for instance, that lasted for a good long while, yes the UNSC did up the defenses after Reach fell, and it is humanities home world, but if it can last that long it makes no sense for Reach to fall in a couple hours.
exacly rech falling in a month is scary in a way

imagine this your on the other side of reach the navy you all fine but you see the army moving arou alot you leave it untill August 30th when 700 ships attack you think wow the army ONI didnt even tell the whole of reach covenant was attacking the viery terrtory,

or take into the marines account they wipe out the last of the advance party they cheer untill they get word of the 700 covenant ships swarming in. Your heart would sink to the depths of hell,


It's scarier if a planet falls in a day! It shows that the Covenant are something to be feared. Not incompetent dolts.

  • 01.21.2011 7:08 PM PDT


Posted by: GrnDragn

Posted by: Alf stewert

Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: AlphaZero X

Posted by: GrnDragn

They changed so much more than the dates. It's not just the time, it was the fact that it disregards previously established Halo Canon, all so that they could make a mediocre campaign.


I don't agree, having read all the books, Cryptum through Evolutions II, in the past 2 weeks. The campaign was great. I can look at Halowiki for the battle of Reach, and the timeline works out just fine for me. I don't bother worrying about semantics such as when the BR was introduced and all that. It doesn't disregard anything, it's just fitting more stuff in.

The back of the box for "Halo Combat Evolved" says "You are the last of your kind". So does that totally over screw ALL the books because, hey, the game box said I'm the last, so non of the books are canon, because I'm supposed to be the last, right?
That's the same type of wall you'll run into if you're sitting there obsessing about Reach falling in one day. August 30th becomes the day Reach fell. And reading the books, again, makes it highly probable that no human colony fell in a matter of 24 hours. But if you want to box yourself in to things said rather early in the franchise's development and stick with them to the bitter end, be my guest. Next Halo book please.


Nice point, Alpha, I couldn't agree more, I may only be so open minded to the changes Reach introduced because I'm a comparatively new member of the fandom, but it is still always a much better idea to not entrench oneself too deeply in an early development in a constantly evolving series.

Reach falling in a couple hours when other colonies lasted for much long, for instance Harvest, I know there were several battles there, but the UNSC forces lasted for much longer than 24 hours in the most of their battles.

I mean take Earth for instance, that lasted for a good long while, yes the UNSC did up the defenses after Reach fell, and it is humanities home world, but if it can last that long it makes no sense for Reach to fall in a couple hours.
exacly rech falling in a month is scary in a way

imagine this your on the other side of reach the navy you all fine but you see the army moving arou alot you leave it untill August 30th when 700 ships attack you think wow the army ONI didnt even tell the whole of reach covenant was attacking the viery terrtory,

or take into the marines account they wipe out the last of the advance party they cheer untill they get word of the 700 covenant ships swarming in. Your heart would sink to the depths of hell,


It's scarier if a planet falls in a day! It shows that the Covenant are something to be feared. Not incompetent dolts.
Gotta say NO!! having humanity fight the advance party and win they cheer they feel great that they won... but a whole fleet of 700 ships swell that and there hearts sink, there mins boggle knowing they cant win or survive thats the scary side the meanacing side fighting winning after strong odds against them but them 700 ships enter the picture

[Edited on 01.21.2011 7:51 PM PST]

  • 01.21.2011 7:29 PM PDT

In memory of those fallen in the defense of Earth and her colonies.

March 3, 2553

My thoughts exactly.

Posted by: privet caboose
Reach did break canon.

Infact, it breaks canon within the first 5 minutes of the game. Reach fell on August 30th. That's the day the Covenant found Reach, and decimated the UNSC Fleet. All in one day.

The game says that the UNSC lost in over a months time. And without the UNSC even putting up a real fight. It was as if Reach was some random farmer colony.

  • 01.22.2011 2:58 AM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

Posted by: Alf stewert
exacly rech falling in a month is scary in a way

imagine this your on the other side of reach the navy you all fine but you see the army moving arou alot you leave it untill August 30th when 700 ships attack you think wow the army ONI didnt even tell the whole of reach covenant was attacking the viery terrtory,

or take into the marines account they wipe out the last of the advance party they cheer untill they get word of the 700 covenant ships swarming in. Your heart would sink to the depths of hell,


Reach falling in a month is bollocks, plain and simple.

Every other source of canon over the past 9 years has said it fell in a day, that's much more fearful than a month. In Halo Evolutions: Dirt, everyone is surprised to hear that Reach has just fallen, but in the game ONI cover up the invasion for a month and don't even enact the Cole Protocol.

It takes them a good week to actually formulate a defence force. And hell, there wasn't anywhere near 750 Covenant ships seen in the game, the most you see is about 7 exit slipspace in LNoS. And even then where are the Orbital MACs?

Making the battle a month long has done nothing but bring up negative repercussions on the rest of Halo's canon, Reach - humanity's military centre and the second-last bastion - falling in a day was much more of a terrifying affair because it all happened so quick.

  • 01.22.2011 3:59 AM PDT
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"Time was your ally human. But now it has abandoned you. The Forerunners....have returned. And this tomb... is now yours". - The Didact


Posted by: kit_103
Posted by: hotshot revan II
And how the -blam!- did a Halycon class cruiser even landed on Reach??That ship can't fly in the goddamn atmosphere.


More then likely brought in by a few atmosphere capable ships.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
I pray to god that 343 industries will declare that game non canon.


You know they won't. They'll get them to mesh.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
The canon problem between the halo books and Reach can't be fixed


You're over-reacting. A lot of it has to do with fixing the dates and killing off Jun. That's about it.

I'm sitting on the fence for this one. On one hand, I agree with the people that say Reach broke canon. Dates are completely out of whack, as has been pointed out so many times before and I would have preferred a second class of S-IIs over S-IIIs and a slight change in the story.

But on the other hand...I enjoyed the game a little bit more. Not saying the book is bad, second favorite next to GoO but I prefer the more "it lasted longer then one day" approach. True, I have problem with a month long invasion but starting said attack somewhere in mid-August? I would have been fine with that IMO.


-There are two scenerios with this:

1)Somehow during the battle when the UNSC desperatley needed every ship they can have to combat the covies and yet they use a few of them just to being down the Autumn?Doesn't makes any sense

2)Most likely what happened in the game:The autumn never fought in space combat it was all the time on ground(Halsey said on the 29th that autumn was already waiting)
.This ruins canon as well because who did dropped blue team at the spacestation?What happened with Red Team?....
Linda doesn't dies,James neither,no Red team jump,....

Canon=destroyed

-They should do it.I don't care if Reach get's declared non canon,that game didn't added anything cool to the halo universe except those data pads maybe .


-No just no.
It hasn't anything to do with just dates.
Explain me how Halsey was talking to the sII's during the operation red flag briefing on the 27th of august.

According to Jun Red Team was reassigned to civilian bla bla on the 23th of August.Why continue with the red flag briefing if you are in the middle of war?

And SWORD base was occupied by the covies at the 23th as well.Said by Jun as well

So please tell me how did Halsey talked with her sII's on the 27th if she was stuck in sword base between the 14th and 29th of August???

There are more other canon destruction things.
Why do bungie fans don't admit this,Reach wtfpwned the Halo canon.

The month long battle is BS.How could +150 ships survive a covie fleet(314-750 ships) for a month and ONI couldn't have kept the invasion as secret for a month for the following reasons

-The covenant glassed the citys around the circular lake during the 14th of august,this can be observed in the lnos level .
-The entire vierry territoy was at war on the 12th,it's the size of a large continent.You think civilians wouldn't have noticed that?
-The supercarrier destroying the UNSC fleet at Reach,something the civilians should have noticed as well
-New alexandira
-..many more

ONI couldn't have kept it a secret,but why not evacuate civilians?Last time i checked UNSC would always evacuate civilans if a planet get's attacked.And the cole protocl has not been used??Why????Give me one good reason for all of this.

And what's the ponit again of red flag briefing if the godamn covies were fighting above your head.

This games contradicts with all forms of previous canon,even with Halo ce and with the journal.
This game is a total disaster.

  • 01.22.2011 4:22 AM PDT


Posted by: ajw34307
Posted by: Alf stewert
exacly rech falling in a month is scary in a way

imagine this your on the other side of reach the navy you all fine but you see the army moving arou alot you leave it untill August 30th when 700 ships attack you think wow the army ONI didnt even tell the whole of reach covenant was attacking the viery terrtory,

or take into the marines account they wipe out the last of the advance party they cheer untill they get word of the 700 covenant ships swarming in. Your heart would sink to the depths of hell,


Reach falling in a month is bollocks, plain and simple.

Every other source of canon over the past 9 years has said it fell in a day, that's much more fearful than a month. In Halo Evolutions: Dirt, everyone is surprised to hear that Reach has just fallen, but in the game ONI cover up the invasion for a month and don't even enact the Cole Protocol.

It takes them a good week to actually formulate a defence force. And hell, there wasn't anywhere near 750 Covenant ships seen in the game, the most you see is about 7 exit slipspace in LNoS. And even then where are the Orbital MACs?

Making the battle a month long has done nothing but bring up negative repercussions on the rest of Halo's canon, Reach - humanity's military centre and the second-last bastion - falling in a day was much more of a terrifying affair because it all happened so quick.


No, falling in a couple hours is bullocks, especially when all other planets lasted FAR longer. Does Dirt just say mention Reach falling in passing without any real details? Or does talk about it for a bit? I haven't read it yet.

Hardly, if there's any covering up at all, it would only be before the Long Night of Solace decloaks and starts raining down fiery death everywhere. After we find out about it is when the evactuations and such would start happening. As for the Cole Protocol, as I've always understood it is that it wasn't enacted unless the Covies were right on the doorstep. Like for instance in First Strike the Cole Protocol is not enacted on CASTLE Base until the Covenant are banging on the door and digging their way in.

You obviously have no conception of how long it takes to mobilize sufficient forces for a large military op. And it didn't take a week to gather forces, I assume you are referring to Tip of the Spear, and that level happens right after the Nightfall mission. And as for the ships, we only get to see a couple before the satellite feed cuts out, but they're still coming in, you can see more of the slipspace rupture auras right as it's cutting out.And it never was 750 Covenant ships there, it's the same as it always was 300-something ships. We don't see the Orbital SMACs because they have nothing to do with Noble Team's story, and they wouldn't spend time on something that doesn't further the story being told.

  • 01.22.2011 9:21 AM PDT


Posted by: GrnDragn


It's scarier if a planet falls in a day! It shows that the Covenant are something to be feared. Not incompetent dolts.


It worked when there was no real backstory. How fearsome are the Covenant? They destroyed the planet in day. They must be mean. But this is the same Covenant that took 3 years to get from Harvest to Madrigal, and the same Covenant that, almost ridiculously, has not managed to find ONE single piece of Nav Data in all the Human colonies they've destroyed. Maintaining the Cole Protocol for 27 years was a stretch for me....it's hard to believe, but I'll go with it. They've never really gone into how long it takes the Covies to glass a planet, we've only seen glimpses and aftermaths. Jericho VII, even Reach in FOR, the actual Fall isn't very detailed, just the Spartan II's actions....there's plenty of room for embellishment.

  • 01.22.2011 11:25 AM PDT


Posted by: AlphaZero X

Posted by: GrnDragn


It's scarier if a planet falls in a day! It shows that the Covenant are something to be feared. Not incompetent dolts.


It worked when there was no real backstory. How fearsome are the Covenant? They destroyed the planet in day. They must be mean. But this is the same Covenant that took 3 years to get from Harvest to Madrigal, and the same Covenant that, almost ridiculously, has not managed to find ONE single piece of Nav Data in all the Human colonies they've destroyed. Maintaining the Cole Protocol for 27 years was a stretch for me....it's hard to believe, but I'll go with it. They've never really gone into how long it takes the Covies to glass a planet, we've only seen glimpses and aftermaths. Jericho VII, even Reach in FOR, the actual Fall isn't very detailed, just the Spartan II's actions....there's plenty of room for embellishment.


Exactly, you've got a good head up there, man, or woman, whichever you may be, there was very little detail about the Battle of Reach in TFoR, and there is plenty room for more additions, especially now that the whole affair is close to a month in length, rather than a day, which doesn't make sense anyway. Two weeks against the full Covenant might on Humanities second "homeworld" makes ever so much more sense than a couple hours, this is Reach we're talking about, just as valuable as Earth. And I don't think Reach was fully glassed anyway, I doubt any whole planet was, only the areas with the largest concentration of humans and where the biggest battles were fought.

  • 01.22.2011 12:31 PM PDT

Posted By: hotshot revan II
-There are two scenerios with this:

1)Somehow during the battle when the UNSC desperatley needed every ship they can have to combat the covies and yet they use a few of them just to being down the Autumn?Doesn't makes any sense

2)Most likely what happened in the game:The autumn never fought in space combat it was all the time on ground(Halsey said on the 29th that autumn was already waiting)
.This ruins canon as well because who did dropped blue team at the spacestation?What happened with Red Team?....
Linda doesn't dies,James neither,no Red team jump,....

Canon=destroyed


1. I believe that Kit probably wasn't talking Ship of the Line combat sort of ships, probably something small and like those rocket tugships we saw getting the Autumn off the ground.

2. Halsey did not say it was already waiting for them, she it will be awaiting their arrival. If it was on the ground all along then (which I highly doubt) then Red Team simply got to the generators a different way, and all those except the survivors in FS died/went MIA defending them, nothing ruined there. If the Circumference Op never happened, then Linda either dies a different way, or just doesn't die at all and is put with Red Team along with James.

-No just no.
It hasn't anything to do with just dates.
Explain me how Halsey was talking to the sII's during the operation red flag briefing on the 27th of august. And SWORD base was occupied by the covies at the 23th as well.Said by Jun as well.

So please tell me how did Halsey talked with her sII's on the 27th if she was stuck in sword base between the 14th and 29th of August???


Video Conference? :P
But seriously, either Red Flag briefing didn't happen, or it was earlier than the book said.

Jun never mentions anything about SWORD Base except his exclamation about "The Covenant own it now!" when they're told about the Torch and Burn Op.

The month long battle is BS.How could +150 ships survive a covie fleet(314-750 ships) for a month and ONI couldn't have kept the invasion as secret for a month for the following reasons

-The covenant glassed the citys around the circular lake during the 14th of august,this can be observed in the lnos level .
-The entire vierry territoy was at war on the 12th,it's the size of a large continent.You think civilians wouldn't have noticed that?
-The supercarrier destroying the UNSC fleet at Reach,something the civilians should have noticed as well
-New alexandira
-..many more

ONI couldn't have kept it a secret,but why not evacuate civilians?Last time i checked UNSC would always evacuate civilans if a planet get's attacked.And the cole protocl has not been used??Why????Give me one good reason for all of this.

And what's the ponit again of red flag briefing if the godamn covies were fighting above your head.

This games contradicts with all forms of previous canon,even with Halo ce and with the journal.
This game is a total disaster.


They do not last a month against 300-something ships, you're right about that. They last two weeks, last I checked a month was four weeks. The whole 750+ ships was an error, it's still 300-something Covie ships.

And as I have said quite a few times before, if it was kept secret at all, it was only until the Long Night of Solace was revealed.

Why create mass-panic and hysteria if it's only a handful of ships that can easily be dispatched, by saying the Covenant are on Reach?

What pray tell, does it conflict with CE about? You just pulled that statement out of your ass didn't you? And it can't contradict the Journal either, as the whole point of it was to explain questions raised by Reach, pulled that one out of your ass too didn't you?

Kit is right, you are overreacting.

  • 01.22.2011 12:53 PM PDT


Posted by: kit_103
True, I have problem with a month long invasion but starting said attack somewhere in mid-August? I would have been fine with that IMO.
The actual invasion started in Mid-August. The Covenant encountered before the ending cutscene of the level Long Night of Solace were more or less an expeditionary force.

  • 01.22.2011 12:56 PM PDT

If you're passionate about the thing you're talking about, I'll always lend an ear.

What i found worse was that they marketed Reach like it was a direct homage to the novel.

The whole glassing,dark, and helpless serious tone and even a possible Jame's reference was seen in that trailer.

Utter Dissapointment. "Thanks Bungie". You stuck by us fans....not

It didn't turn out that way at all. the closest thing i can think of that had any similarity was..... The WORD Reach not even the planet. Just the WORD. Can't believe i stuck by these people in terms of campaign experience.

  • 01.22.2011 1:45 PM PDT
  •  | 
  • Senior Mythic Member

Bunige never said that Reach was TFOR:The Game did they you simply "assumed" it would be.

  • 01.22.2011 2:03 PM PDT


Posted by: ninjakenzen
What i found worse was that they marketed Reach like it was a direct homage to the novel.

The whole glassing,dark, and helpless serious tone and even a possible Jame's reference was seen in that trailer.

Utter Dissapointment. "Thanks Bungie". You stuck by us fans....not

It didn't turn out that way at all. the closest thing i can think of that had any similarity was..... The WORD Reach not even the planet. Just the WORD. Can't believe i stuck by these people in terms of campaign experience.
Wait, didnt bungie say they were going to stray from the cannon?

  • 01.22.2011 2:25 PM PDT


Posted by: daman825

Posted by: ninjakenzen
What i found worse was that they marketed Reach like it was a direct homage to the novel.

The whole glassing,dark, and helpless serious tone and even a possible Jame's reference was seen in that trailer.

Utter Dissapointment. "Thanks Bungie". You stuck by us fans....not

It didn't turn out that way at all. the closest thing i can think of that had any similarity was..... The WORD Reach not even the planet. Just the WORD. Can't believe i stuck by these people in terms of campaign experience.
Wait, didnt bungie say they were going to stray from the cannon?


They didn't say that, but they did say that Reach would not be TFoR the Game. They said that Reach would be taking place on a different part of the planet than the events in TFoR.

  • 01.22.2011 2:28 PM PDT

If you're passionate about the thing you're talking about, I'll always lend an ear.

Posted by: DrMod
Bunige never said that Reach was TFOR:The Game did they you simply "assumed" it would be.

Somewhat, since the whole concept was based on Reach. A planet only explained by the novels.

With the introduction of Noble Team, i had suspected that the general summary of the novel would be mentioned indirectly as Noble Team is no where present in the Pre-established Canon.

However to my dismay. I found out that Noble Team, was a bunch of Power Rangers, each with their own 90210 emotional teenage angst issues.

Reach ,the planet, was in fact a rival to Harvest into which looked more crap and rural. The city was a nice homage to Halo Wars's Arcadia. But that's beyond the point. Reach was a military planet. It this game it wasn't.Simple as. So far off from it, it might have been on any other off-world planet. But the fact they marketed it as Reach, adds to Bungie's failure.

The story had been changed. I'm not going to go into detail but dates were thrown around and nonsensical events happened for the sake of adding it to gameplay.

They had killed the whole image of Spartans with the attitudes and actions of noble team.

They pictured Halsey as self-centered, jealous and even a somewhat crazy cat-owning lady at one point.
Halsey in all the novel adaptation has been seen as a respectable, do not cross figure. In this game the under qualified "special-ops" team are flying 1-up comments left and right at her. For example, in Ghost of Onyx, she had made sure to gain the new Spartan-III's respect even though they weren't hers. In the novels S-III's even acted like military personal, with a lifetime of training. They spoke when spoken too and had utmost respect and were always one step ahead of the game. I could kill this whole concept with 1 character in Reach.

Emile. Ever heard of discipline? Who talks to a squadmate in disgust even if they were in competition. Very Un-Spartan like.

Let me add another one.
Jorge- For a Spartan Solidier who had combat for 20 years, he sure is the opposite of what you would expect from any solidier. He's too emotionally attached and even sometimes tactically retarded. The end of the 1st level for example: he throws himself down to protect 1 civilian who had been the least targeted person in the room. He could have been stabbed at that time. What pure stupidity.

Spartan's beside "noble team" were not even present in the campaign apart from the last level in which they were tacked on with no explanation what-so ever. Why? Because bungie could that's why. :(

I could go on and on... It's just that overall bitter resentment i feel for Bungie now. How they turned their back on fans who had invested their time into the novels is evident in every cutscene. through the actions of characters and events of that were based towards an audience that didn't care for backstory.

Before I finish. Let me just point out 1 more thing.

Tip of the Spear.

The one battle cutscene that summarized this entire game's campaign experience. Disappointment.

One of the worst campaign storyline i've ever been following.

Well at least there is Mass Effect 3 to fill in the void of great science-fiction writing in-game.

  • 01.22.2011 2:36 PM PDT

"What do you hear?"
"Nothing but the rain."
"Then grab your gun and bring in the cat."
"Boom, boom, boom!"

Posted by: hotshot revan II
1)Somehow during the battle when the UNSC desperatley needed every ship they can have to combat the covies and yet they use a few of them just to being down the Autumn?Doesn't makes any sense


Posted by: OrderedComa
1. I believe that Kit probably wasn't talking Ship of the Line combat sort of ships, probably something small and like those rocket tugships we saw getting the Autumn off the ground.


Pretty much this.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
-No just no.
It hasn't anything to do with just dates.
Explain me how Halsey was talking to the sII's during the operation red flag briefing on the 27th of august.

According to Jun Red Team was reassigned to civilian bla bla on the 23th of August.Why continue with the red flag briefing if you are in the middle of war?

And SWORD base was occupied by the covies at the 23th as well.Said by Jun as well

So please tell me how did Halsey talked with her sII's on the 27th if she was stuck in sword base between the 14th and 29th of August???


I'd probably go with video communication. Pull them from their duties for a short bit, brief them on the the objective and let them go.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
-The entire vierry territoy was at war on the 12th,it's the size of a large continent.You think civilians wouldn't have noticed that?


Considering that the Viery region was nothing more then wastelands...that's a simple cover up.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
-The supercarrier destroying the UNSC fleet at Reach,something the civilians should have noticed as well
-New alexandira
-..many more


Of course people are gonna notice that, especially at the end of LNoS.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
ONI couldn't have kept it a secret,but why not evacuate civilians?Last time i checked UNSC would always evacuate civilans if a planet get's attacked.And the cole protocl has not been used??Why????Give me one good reason for all of this.


You just took out an assault carrier (or whatever the frack it's called) along with anything else on the ground. Pretty sure one would be feeling mighty victorious at that point. What's the point of evacing civvies when you "won"?

And I was under the impression Winter Contingency was higher priority then the Cole Protocol.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
This games contradicts with all forms of previous canon,even with Halo ce and with the journal.
This game is a total disaster.


Doesn't contradict Halo CE. It fits in perfectly. It does however, screw things up in the book.

Posted by: hotshot revan II
Why do bungie fans don't admit this,Reach wtfpwned the Halo canon.


It wtfpwned the last bit of FoR and the beginning of FS. Everything else is intact. We're gonna have to assume that Jun dies before reaching Castle Base, which would save GoO. I won't take legendary commentary as canon IMO.

I willing admit that yes, this game has screwed up canon. I won't argue against that. But it's fixable. Fix the dates. Fix how encounters went down. It's gonna be a messy job yes and people aren't gonna like it but in the end...it'll work.

Posted by: Plasma3150

Posted by: kit_103
True, I have problem with a month long invasion but starting said attack somewhere in mid-August? I would have been fine with that IMO.
The actual invasion started in Mid-August. The Covenant encountered before the ending cutscene of the level Long Night of Solace were more or less an expeditionary force.


True true. Thanks for the catch.

And Coma, I like you already. ^^

  • 01.22.2011 2:57 PM PDT


Posted by: ninjakenzen
Posted by: DrMod
Bunige never said that Reach was TFOR:The Game did they you simply "assumed" it would be.

Somewhat, since the whole concept was based on Reach. A planet only explained by the novels.

With the introduction of Noble Team, i had suspected that the general summary of the novel would be mentioned indirectly as Noble Team is no where present in the Pre-established Canon.

However to my dismay. I found out that Noble Team, was a bunch of Power Rangers, each with their own 90210 emotional teenage angst issues.

Reach ,the planet, was in fact a rival to Harvest into which looked more crap and rural. The city was a nice homage to Halo Wars's Arcadia. But that's beyond the point. Reach was a military planet. It this game it wasn't.Simple as. So far off from it, it might have been on any other off-world planet. But the fact they marketed it as Reach, adds to Bungie's failure.

The story had been changed. I'm not going to go into detail but dates were thrown around and nonsensical events happened for the sake of adding it to gameplay.

They had killed the whole image of Spartans with the attitudes and actions of noble team.

They pictured Halsey as self-centered, jealous and even a somewhat crazy cat-owning lady at one point.
Halsey in all the novel adaptation has been seen as a respectable, do not cross figure. In this game the under qualified "special-ops" team are flying 1-up comments left and right at her. For example, in Ghost of Onyx, she had made sure to gain the new Spartan-III's respect even though they weren't hers. In the novels S-III's even acted like military personal, with a lifetime of training. They spoke when spoken too and had utmost respect and were always one step ahead of the game. I could kill this whole concept with 1 character in Reach.

Emile. Ever heard of discipline? Who talks to a squadmate in disgust even if they were in competition. Very Un-Spartan like.

Let me add another one.
Jorge- For a Spartan Solidier who had combat for 20 years, he sure is the opposite of what you would expect from any solidier. He's too emotionally attached and even sometimes tactically retarded. The end of the 1st level for example: he throws himself down to protect 1 civilian who had been the least targeted person in the room. He could have been stabbed at that time. What pure stupidity.

Spartan's beside "noble team" were not even present in the campaign apart from the last level in which they were tacked on with no explanation what-so ever. Why? Because bungie could that's why. :(

I could go on and on... It's just that overall bitter resentment i feel for Bungie now. How they turned their back on fans who had invested their time into the novels is evident in every cutscene. through the actions of characters and events of that were based towards an audience that didn't care for backstory.

Before I finish. Let me just point out 1 more thing.

Tip of the Spear.

The one battle cutscene that summarized this entire game's campaign experience. Disappointment.

One of the worst campaign storyline i've ever been following.

Well at least there is Mass Effect 3 to fill in the void of great science-fiction writing in-game.
What it comes down to is this. If bungie made all the Spartans look and act the same, and made reach fall in a day. The campaign would have been crap. You wouldn't be able to distinguish between the Spartans unless they were talking, and you wouldn't be able to see as many locations like space and stuff.

  • 01.22.2011 3:09 PM PDT


Posted by: daman825

Posted by: ninjakenzen
[quote]Posted by: DrMod
Bunige never said that Reach was TFOR:The Game did they you simply "assumed" it would be.

Somewhat, since the whole concept was based on Reach. A planet only explained by the novels.

With the introduction of Noble Team, i had suspected that the general summary of the novel would be mentioned indirectly as Noble Team is no where present in the Pre-established Canon.

However to my dismay. I found out that Noble Team, was a bunch of Power Rangers, each with their own 90210 emotional teenage angst issues.

Reach ,the planet, was in fact a rival to Harvest into which looked more crap and rural. The city was a nice homage to Halo Wars's Arcadia. But that's beyond the point. Reach was a military planet. It this game it wasn't.Simple as. So far off from it, it might have been on any other off-world planet. But the fact they marketed it as Reach, adds to Bungie's failure.

The story had been changed. I'm not going to go into detail but dates were thrown around and nonsensical events happened for the sake of adding it to gameplay.

They had killed the whole image of Spartans with the attitudes and actions of noble team.

They pictured Halsey as self-centered, jealous and even a somewhat crazy cat-owning lady at one point.
Halsey in all the novel adaptation has been seen as a respectable, do not cross figure. In this game the under qualified "special-ops" team are flying 1-up comments left and right at her. For example, in Ghost of Onyx, she had made sure to gain the new Spartan-III's respect even though they weren't hers. In the novels S-III's even acted like military personal, with a lifetime of training. They spoke when spoken too and had utmost respect and were always one step ahead of the game. I could kill this whole concept with 1 character in Reach.

Emile. Ever heard of discipline? Who talks to a squadmate in disgust even if they were in competition. Very Un-Spartan like.

Let me add another one.
Jorge- For a Spartan Solidier who had combat for 20 years, he sure is the opposite of what you would expect from any solidier. He's too emotionally attached and even sometimes tactically retarded. The end of the 1st level for example: he throws himself down to protect 1 civilian who had been the least targeted person in the room. He could have been stabbed at that time. What pure stupidity.

Spartan's beside "noble team" were not even present in the campaign apart from the last level in which they were tacked on with no explanation what-so ever. Why? Because bungie could that's why. :(

I could go on and on... It's just that overall bitter resentment i feel for Bungie now. How they turned their back on fans who had invested their time into the novels is evident in every cutscene. through the actions of characters and events of that were based towards an audience that didn't care for backstory.

Before I finish. Let me just point out 1 more thing.

Tip of the Spear.

The one battle cutscene that summarized this entire game's campaign experience. Disappointment.

One of the worst campaign storyline i've ever been following.

Well at least there is Mass Effect 3 to fill in the void of great science-fiction writing in-game.


thing is spartan 3's are younger so there going to be Cocky and different in a sense

  • 01.22.2011 3:32 PM PDT
  • gamertag: An0nz
  • user homepage:

CoD is a good game, even if the Halo series are better in some aspects. Anyone who insults either is just bad in that game. Grow up.


Posted by: daman825

Posted by: ninjakenzen
Posted by: DrMod
Bunige never said that Reach was TFOR:The Game did they you simply "assumed" it would be.

Somewhat, since the whole concept was based on Reach. A planet only explained by the novels.

With the introduction of Noble Team, i had suspected that the general summary of the novel would be mentioned indirectly as Noble Team is no where present in the Pre-established Canon.

However to my dismay. I found out that Noble Team, was a bunch of Power Rangers, each with their own 90210 emotional teenage angst issues.

Reach ,the planet, was in fact a rival to Harvest into which looked more crap and rural. The city was a nice homage to Halo Wars's Arcadia. But that's beyond the point. Reach was a military planet. It this game it wasn't.Simple as. So far off from it, it might have been on any other off-world planet. But the fact they marketed it as Reach, adds to Bungie's failure.

The story had been changed. I'm not going to go into detail but dates were thrown around and nonsensical events happened for the sake of adding it to gameplay.

They had killed the whole image of Spartans with the attitudes and actions of noble team.

They pictured Halsey as self-centered, jealous and even a somewhat crazy cat-owning lady at one point.
Halsey in all the novel adaptation has been seen as a respectable, do not cross figure. In this game the under qualified "special-ops" team are flying 1-up comments left and right at her. For example, in Ghost of Onyx, she had made sure to gain the new Spartan-III's respect even though they weren't hers. In the novels S-III's even acted like military personal, with a lifetime of training. They spoke when spoken too and had utmost respect and were always one step ahead of the game. I could kill this whole concept with 1 character in Reach.

Emile. Ever heard of discipline? Who talks to a squadmate in disgust even if they were in competition. Very Un-Spartan like.

Let me add another one.
Jorge- For a Spartan Solidier who had combat for 20 years, he sure is the opposite of what you would expect from any solidier. He's too emotionally attached and even sometimes tactically retarded. The end of the 1st level for example: he throws himself down to protect 1 civilian who had been the least targeted person in the room. He could have been stabbed at that time. What pure stupidity.

Spartan's beside "noble team" were not even present in the campaign apart from the last level in which they were tacked on with no explanation what-so ever. Why? Because bungie could that's why. :(

I could go on and on... It's just that overall bitter resentment i feel for Bungie now. How they turned their back on fans who had invested their time into the novels is evident in every cutscene. through the actions of characters and events of that were based towards an audience that didn't care for backstory.

Before I finish. Let me just point out 1 more thing.

Tip of the Spear.

The one battle cutscene that summarized this entire game's campaign experience. Disappointment.

One of the worst campaign storyline i've ever been following.

Well at least there is Mass Effect 3 to fill in the void of great science-fiction writing in-game.
What it comes down to is this. If bungie made all the Spartans look and act the same, and made reach fall in a day. The campaign would have been crap. You wouldn't be able to distinguish between the Spartans unless they were talking, and you wouldn't be able to see as many locations like space and stuff.


They didn't need to make all Spartans identical. They needed to make them professional and with their own distinctions. That goes with Halsey as well.
And Reach officially fell in a day, but the ground battle, as proven by First Strike, was still happening after that. As well, if Bungie really made use of the time and came up with innovative events, they could have made the entire story ten times better, but as it stands it got worse than before.

To Alf...did you even read his post? He mentioned the Spartan IIIs on Onyx, which was from Gamma company and therefore THE youngest Spartan IIIs of all. Even they acted like military professionals, why would Noble team be different?

[Edited on 01.22.2011 3:35 PM PST]

  • 01.22.2011 3:34 PM PDT


Posted by: Beowolfe

Posted by: daman825

Posted by: ninjakenzen
Posted by: DrMod
Bunige never said that Reach was TFOR:The Game did they you simply "assumed" it would be.

Somewhat, since the whole concept was based on Reach. A planet only explained by the novels.

With the introduction of Noble Team, i had suspected that the general summary of the novel would be mentioned indirectly as Noble Team is no where present in the Pre-established Canon.

However to my dismay. I found out that Noble Team, was a bunch of Power Rangers, each with their own 90210 emotional teenage angst issues.

Reach ,the planet, was in fact a rival to Harvest into which looked more crap and rural. The city was a nice homage to Halo Wars's Arcadia. But that's beyond the point. Reach was a military planet. It this game it wasn't.Simple as. So far off from it, it might have been on any other off-world planet. But the fact they marketed it as Reach, adds to Bungie's failure.

The story had been changed. I'm not going to go into detail but dates were thrown around and nonsensical events happened for the sake of adding it to gameplay.

They had killed the whole image of Spartans with the attitudes and actions of noble team.

They pictured Halsey as self-centered, jealous and even a somewhat crazy cat-owning lady at one point.
Halsey in all the novel adaptation has been seen as a respectable, do not cross figure. In this game the under qualified "special-ops" team are flying 1-up comments left and right at her. For example, in Ghost of Onyx, she had made sure to gain the new Spartan-III's respect even though they weren't hers. In the novels S-III's even acted like military personal, with a lifetime of training. They spoke when spoken too and had utmost respect and were always one step ahead of the game. I could kill this whole concept with 1 character in Reach.

Emile. Ever heard of discipline? Who talks to a squadmate in disgust even if they were in competition. Very Un-Spartan like.

Let me add another one.
Jorge- For a Spartan Solidier who had combat for 20 years, he sure is the opposite of what you would expect from any solidier. He's too emotionally attached and even sometimes tactically retarded. The end of the 1st level for example: he throws himself down to protect 1 civilian who had been the least targeted person in the room. He could have been stabbed at that time. What pure stupidity.

Spartan's beside "noble team" were not even present in the campaign apart from the last level in which they were tacked on with no explanation what-so ever. Why? Because bungie could that's why. :(

I could go on and on... It's just that overall bitter resentment i feel for Bungie now. How they turned their back on fans who had invested their time into the novels is evident in every cutscene. through the actions of characters and events of that were based towards an audience that didn't care for backstory.

Before I finish. Let me just point out 1 more thing.

Tip of the Spear.

The one battle cutscene that summarized this entire game's campaign experience. Disappointment.

One of the worst campaign storyline i've ever been following.

Well at least there is Mass Effect 3 to fill in the void of great science-fiction writing in-game.
What it comes down to is this. If bungie made all the Spartans look and act the same, and made reach fall in a day. The campaign would have been crap. You wouldn't be able to distinguish between the Spartans unless they were talking, and you wouldn't be able to see as many locations like space and stuff.


They didn't need to make all Spartans identical. They needed to make them professional and with their own distinctions. That goes with Halsey as well.
And Reach officially fell in a day, but the ground battle, as proven by First Strike, was still happening after that. As well, if Bungie really made use of the time and came up with innovative events, they could have made the entire story ten times better, but as it stands it got worse than before.

To Alf...did you even read his post? He mentioned the Spartan IIIs on Onyx, which was from Gamma company and therefore THE youngest Spartan IIIs of all. Even they acted like military professionals, why would Noble team be different?


because even in military people will be different, and they did dont come and whine about "OH THEIR NOT SPARTANS BECASUE THEY DIED LIKE IDIOTS" to those who think this if you were in there situation not knowing what was Going to happend would you do the same? peope arae whining over how there dying is stupid and such but you know the outcome so you nitpick on it if you were there as a spartan you would be lost and confused.

  • 01.22.2011 3:53 PM PDT

If you're passionate about the thing you're talking about, I'll always lend an ear.

Posted by: daman825
What it comes down to is this. If bungie made all the Spartans look and act the same, and made reach fall in a day. The campaign would have been crap. You wouldn't be able to distinguish between the Spartans unless they were talking, and you wouldn't be able to see as many locations like space and stuff.

They could have made them professional. Much like all Spartans-II and III prior.

The campaign even when stretched out was just lacking any real desperateness and helplessness. The sense of urgency is never present. I'm looking for the quality of the time spent in Reach not the quantity.

The "identical" Spartans could also take off their helmets, much like the intro of the package in Halo Legends to distinguish them.

Locations like space and stuff?

You mean the 15 minuite dragged out space event in which you shoot banshees and a frigate engine?
The one that's been marketed for months on advertisements as being a innovative change to Halo's gameplay. Woah Space Battles!!! YAY.....

yeah you said it. Stuff. We sure wanted to fight in a farm and oh and then a shiny city. Great Stuff the kind of things great games all encompass. I'm sure Halo:Ce had as much variety with it's jungles, snow terrain, deserts covenant ships, forerunner structures, flood infected maps. All brand new concepts, just like Reach right?

Please, if you're gonna bring in the "what it come down to" at least bring in attributes seen previously which could supplement the game. Instead of argue against any possible further downfalls. Afterall we all wanted the game to be great. It fell short of what 1, 2 and 3 achieved in the gaming community. Not just campaign wise, but that's a separate issue and slightly off-topic.

LOL "the campaign would have been crap" you have obviously not thought about how relating any of the substance with the novels to the game, could have supplemented the story.Big Time.

[Edited on 01.22.2011 4:04 PM PST]

  • 01.22.2011 4:03 PM PDT


Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: ajw34307
Posted by: Alf stewert
exacly rech falling in a month is scary in a way

imagine this your on the other side of reach the navy you all fine but you see the army moving arou alot you leave it untill August 30th when 700 ships attack you think wow the army ONI didnt even tell the whole of reach covenant was attacking the viery terrtory,

or take into the marines account they wipe out the last of the advance party they cheer untill they get word of the 700 covenant ships swarming in. Your heart would sink to the depths of hell,


Reach falling in a month is bollocks, plain and simple.

Every other source of canon over the past 9 years has said it fell in a day, that's much more fearful than a month. In Halo Evolutions: Dirt, everyone is surprised to hear that Reach has just fallen, but in the game ONI cover up the invasion for a month and don't even enact the Cole Protocol.

It takes them a good week to actually formulate a defence force. And hell, there wasn't anywhere near 750 Covenant ships seen in the game, the most you see is about 7 exit slipspace in LNoS. And even then where are the Orbital MACs?

Making the battle a month long has done nothing but bring up negative repercussions on the rest of Halo's canon, Reach - humanity's military centre and the second-last bastion - falling in a day was much more of a terrifying affair because it all happened so quick.


No, falling in a couple hours is bullocks, especially when all other planets lasted FAR longer. Does Dirt just say mention Reach falling in passing without any real details? Or does talk about it for a bit? I haven't read it yet.
With the majority of other planets, the Covenant try to eliminate the human presence with ground forces first. They usually only glass if the ground battles are taking too long, or they're losing. This is outlined in one of the novels, even a specific battle. Fall of Reach[i] I believe.

Hardly, if there's any covering up at all, it would [i]only
be before the Long Night of Solace decloaks and starts raining down fiery death everywhere. After we find out about it is when the evactuations and such would start happening. As for the Cole Protocol, as I've always understood it is that it wasn't enacted unless the Covies were right on the doorstep. Like for instance in First Strike the Cole Protocol is not enacted on CASTLE Base until the Covenant are banging on the door and digging their way in.The Cole Protocol was to be enacted at the first sign of Covenant activity. That means the moment you detect them on long range scanners.

You obviously have no conception of how long it takes to mobilize sufficient forces for a large military op. And it didn't take a week to gather forces, I assume you are referring to Tip of the Spear, and that level happens right after the Nightfall mission. And as for the ships, we only get to see a couple before the satellite feed cuts out, but they're still coming in, you can see more of the slipspace rupture auras right as it's cutting out.And it never was 750 Covenant ships there, it's the same as it always was 300-something ships. We don't see the Orbital SMACs because they have nothing to do with Noble Team's story, and they wouldn't spend time on something that doesn't further the story being told.Actually, the edited version of FoR says ~750 ships. But I guess that doesn't count anyways, since the rest of the novel gets scrapped too.

  • 01.22.2011 4:07 PM PDT