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This topic has moved here: Subject: Halo Reach Did not Destroy the Canon
  • Subject: Halo Reach Did not Destroy the Canon
Subject: Halo Reach Did not Destroy the Canon

Numba one Italian on da flud.

Also, Bungie said ''We will wear the spartans armours again!'' ''Lots of spartans'' etc...
And I've only seen 6 spartans in the whole campaign.
It seems like you are the last ''spartan team'' standing.

  • 11.18.2010 9:34 AM PDT

Signatures are for squares.

Posted by: flamedude
I just never felt overwhelmed or blown away by any battle in Halo Reach. We only had 1 tank in the whole Campaign (which was inexplicably just sitting in the middle of a warzone), we didn't fight any Scarabs for some mad reason, there were no 3-way battles like in Halo1 or Halo2.

I personally think it is the weakest Halo campaign in terms of storyline and gameplay. I think I might actually prefer the Halo 2 campaign, and I never thought I'd ever say that.


I have no idea what possessed Bungie to remove Scarabs as an enemy in Reach. It was just stupid. The covenant are invading and we, a team of spartans, don't fight a single one the entire campaign? We see 10+ Scarabs throughout the game, but I guess we weren't good enough to kill one.

I mean hell, Carter didn't need to kill himself. Emile or Six could've easily taken one down. Chief kills five scarabs in the last few months of the war, Fred and the rest of Blue team kill atleast one more while on Cuba, and even a team of ODST's kill one.

And yet Bungie wasted a spartan life for something a couple ODST's could kill. =/

  • 11.18.2010 9:44 AM PDT
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Posted by: privet caboose
Posted by: flamedude
I just never felt overwhelmed or blown away by any battle in Halo Reach. We only had 1 tank in the whole Campaign (which was inexplicably just sitting in the middle of a warzone), we didn't fight any Scarabs for some mad reason, there were no 3-way battles like in Halo1 or Halo2.

I personally think it is the weakest Halo campaign in terms of storyline and gameplay. I think I might actually prefer the Halo 2 campaign, and I never thought I'd ever say that.


I have no idea what possessed Bungie to remove Scarabs as an enemy in Reach. It was just stupid. The covenant are invading and we, a team of spartans, don't fight a single one the entire campaign? We see 10+ Scarabs throughout the game, but I guess we weren't good enough to kill one.

I mean hell, Carter didn't need to kill himself. Emile or Six could've easily taken one down. Chief kills five scarabs in the last few months of the war, Fred and the rest of Blue team kill atleast one more while on Cuba, and even a team of ODST's kill one.

And yet Bungie wasted a spartan life for something a couple ODST's could kill. =/
Bungie took the "Spartan III's are expendable" thing to a whole 'nother level. lol

[Edited on 11.18.2010 10:06 AM PST]

  • 11.18.2010 10:05 AM PDT

On Waypoint I'm rocketFox;
http://halo.xbox.com/forums/members/rocketfox/default.aspx

Old GTs; RebelRobot, Flamedude

I really disliked the handling of Carters fatal wounding. It seemed a bit lame, it surely could have been in the cutscene. It reminded me of the Chief somehow destroying the Mombasa Scarab in Halo 2, somehow he just destroyed it without any explanation.

So many things seem wrong with Reach that could have easily been avoided.

  • 11.18.2010 12:25 PM PDT

Signatures are for squares.

Posted by: flamedude
I really disliked the handling of Carters fatal wounding. It seemed a bit lame, it surely could have been in the cutscene. It reminded me of the Chief somehow destroying the Mombasa Scarab in Halo 2, somehow he just destroyed it without any explanation.

So many things seem wrong with Reach that could have easily been avoided.


Carters wounds didn't even make sense to me. He was perfectly fine and then next cutscene we see he's wounded without explanation and a few minutes later he's kamikazing into a Scarab that could've easily been killed.

As I played through ODST and Reach, I realized how much better a leader Buck was compared to Carter. Honestly, Kat felt like a better leader than Carter. =/

  • 11.18.2010 12:28 PM PDT

On Waypoint I'm rocketFox;
http://halo.xbox.com/forums/members/rocketfox/default.aspx

Old GTs; RebelRobot, Flamedude

I don't really care too much about canon consistency... but for me Halo Reach simply has a bad storyline and that's my problem with it. It makes no sense, and that is particularly disappointing when there is so much material available to create a mindblowing story that runs alongside the novel without breaking canon.

It just has so many elements in the storyline that make no sense and are completely unnecessary.

  • 11.18.2010 12:49 PM PDT


Posted by: major nolan
OKAY PEOPLE WHO CARES ABOUT CANNON. and incase you didnt know... the writers for the halo books arent bungie employees. and i dont know exavctly when but the fall of reach came outr a long time before reach. get a life its cannon. if you don't llike reach for canon mistakes take it back....god


While you ignorance would be fine in places like the Reach forum, this kind of attitude doesn't fly here. In-case you blew past the universe guidelines, which I'm positive you did. Just so we're on the same page here.

posted by: Duardo
Hi everyone and welcome to the Universe Forum!

The Bungie Universe Forum is for discussion of all elements of the storyline, backstory, plotline, and canon elements of all Bungie games.

Discuss the stories and universes of:
Halo
Oni
Marathon
Myth
And classic Bungie games


So canon does matter... so much for the majority of your argument. TFoR came was released less than a month before Halo CE. As for the matter of the majority of the Halo novels not being written by Bungie employees. That is irrelevant fact is these writers still had access to the Halo bible during the writing process. As such that basically makes it as much canon as anything else in the Halo series.

Beyond that the problem of Bungie making a piss poor excuse for a story comes into play as well. Fact is they messed with established canon and replaced it with... well as I said before a piss poor excuse for a story.

In short; get a clue.

  • 11.18.2010 1:38 PM PDT


Posted by: privet caboose
Posted by: flamedude
I just never felt overwhelmed or blown away by any battle in Halo Reach. We only had 1 tank in the whole Campaign (which was inexplicably just sitting in the middle of a warzone), we didn't fight any Scarabs for some mad reason, there were no 3-way battles like in Halo1 or Halo2.

I personally think it is the weakest Halo campaign in terms of storyline and gameplay. I think I might actually prefer the Halo 2 campaign, and I never thought I'd ever say that.


I have no idea what possessed Bungie to remove Scarabs as an enemy in Reach. It was just stupid. The covenant are invading and we, a team of spartans, don't fight a single one the entire campaign? We see 10+ Scarabs throughout the game, but I guess we weren't good enough to kill one.

I mean hell, Carter didn't need to kill himself. Emile or Six could've easily taken one down. Chief kills five scarabs in the last few months of the war, Fred and the rest of Blue team kill atleast one more while on Cuba, and even a team of ODST's kill one.

And yet Bungie wasted a spartan life for something a couple ODST's could kill. =/


My assumption would be that they didn't really know how to kill them yet, after MC killed the first one in New Mombasa people knew the weak point and how to take them out.

I think Carter went all Kamikaze was because he was already mortally wounded and, to me at least, seemed like he was dying, albeit slowly, so he thought something along the lines of "Hell, I'm probably going to die anyway might as well make sure Six and Emile get this package out of here before the damn Covenant get to them." And then presto, Scarab goes over the edge and can't bother you again.

  • 11.18.2010 2:08 PM PDT


Posted by: privet caboose
Posted by: flamedude
I really disliked the handling of Carters fatal wounding. It seemed a bit lame, it surely could have been in the cutscene. It reminded me of the Chief somehow destroying the Mombasa Scarab in Halo 2, somehow he just destroyed it without any explanation.

So many things seem wrong with Reach that could have easily been avoided.


Carters wounds didn't even make sense to me. He was perfectly fine and then next cutscene we see he's wounded without explanation and a few minutes later he's kamikazing into a Scarab that could've easily been killed.

As I played through ODST and Reach, I realized how much better a leader Buck was compared to Carter. Honestly, Kat felt like a better leader than Carter. =/


His wounding made sense to me, it drops you in on the Phantom and Banshees chasing and shooting at you, looked like they'd been at it for a while, people don't need an explanation for every single little detail of something.

I make no comment on his leadership, but I thought Carter was rather boring, no where near developed enough, I felt a connection with all of Noble except him. Buck is just a bad ass through and through, I mean if as an ODST he can survive Reach, then the statement "if he were any better he'd be a Spartan" is completely true.

  • 11.18.2010 2:15 PM PDT

On Waypoint I'm rocketFox;
http://halo.xbox.com/forums/members/rocketfox/default.aspx

Old GTs; RebelRobot, Flamedude

I wish I was as content with the way the Campaign played out as you OrderedComa.... I think the mortal wounding of a main character is an important moment to show, simply jumping ahead and Carter being fatally wounded with no explanation (with Six and Emile completely fine) doesnt seem right to me.

When I first saw Carter in the Pelican wounded my initial thoughts were "Wait.... what?". That moment of surprise served no purpose.

  • 11.18.2010 2:20 PM PDT

Signatures are for squares.

Carter honestly didn't seem that wounded. One plasma burn? Spartans have survived so much worse.

Regardless, the UNSC had been fighting Scarabs since 2531, atleast. And, they had simulations of fighting them. Johnson says so in Halo 2.

  • 11.18.2010 2:21 PM PDT

a stray bolt from the banshees hit carter as he was flying the pelican, just because it isnt explained doesnt mean you cant use common sense

[Edited on 11.18.2010 2:29 PM PST]

  • 11.18.2010 2:28 PM PDT
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When some things don't make sense to you, you may end up realizing something's up. Carter perhaps trying faking his death and not even piloting the pelican when it crashes.. now that would be hilarious.

I already feel like what Jorge did, didn't really make much sense, which is a reason why I believe he may have survived.

[Edited on 11.18.2010 2:29 PM PST]

  • 11.18.2010 2:29 PM PDT

Marine Corps.
Semper Fi.

Posted by: Wikked Navajoe
My problems [with Reach] are basically just full parties, mlg, and people who go out of their way not to get killed.

How do people still deny the game broke accepted canon? How?

  • 11.18.2010 2:46 PM PDT

Dianna Agron is the epitome of perfection.

Quinntology.

The writers of Reach spent too much time on the little details. It would not have been hard to synch up the days. Sure, it was cool to see Halsey, but there was no reason to show Keyes and the Pillar of Autumn (and how did Keyes go from black hair to grey hair in that amount of time). Sure, it was cool to see space combat, but there was no reason to introduce a brand new vehicle. And yeah, it was cool to see SPARTAN III's, but it was never explained when they got there or even HOW they got there. Etc.

It seems as though Bungie tried too hard to link up Reach with Halo: CE. In an effort to try and pull in the mediocore Halo gamer with familiar sites, they killed the story of Reach for every single person who has read the books or is familiar with the Halo Universe. The books are what made the Halo story great, and without them, it's just another generic Sci-Fi storyline.

  • 11.18.2010 2:53 PM PDT

On Waypoint I'm rocketFox;
http://halo.xbox.com/forums/members/rocketfox/default.aspx

Old GTs; RebelRobot, Flamedude

Posted by: Killed by Pasta
The writers of Reach spent too much time on the little details. It would not have been hard to synch up the days. Sure, it was cool to see Halsey, but there was no reason to show Keyes and the Pillar of Autumn (and how did Keyes go from black hair to grey hair in that amount of time). Sure, it was cool to see space combat, but there was no reason to introduce a brand new vehicle. And yeah, it was cool to see SPARTAN III's, but it was never explained when they got there or even HOW they got there. Etc.

It seems as though Bungie tried too hard to link up Reach with Halo: CE. In an effort to try and pull in the mediocore Halo gamer with familiar sites, they killed the story of Reach for every single person who has read the books or is familiar with the Halo Universe. The books are what made the Halo story great, and without them, it's just another generic Sci-Fi storyline.


They spent a lot of time on details yeah, but there were so many small details that would have been great but werent in the game. Mention of Blue Team, mention of James, Thel Vadamee, Elite-Brute rivalry, hell even small details like Halsey recoginising Jorge with his helmet on would have been glorious.

I think the story arc wasn't grand enough, and introduced too many unnecessary additions at the cost of not showing the things we all wanted to see. So many things were in place of other things;

Did anyone want a fighter sequence? Or would you have prefered to see a Super MAC tearing up Covenant ships?

Did anyone want to be a Spartan-III involved with outside events? Or did you want to be in the thick of it with Red Team?

  • 11.18.2010 2:59 PM PDT

On hiding dead bodies:
Posted by: Psuedo
Posted by: teh Chaz
Inside another dead body. It's the last place they'll look
A corpse within a corpse.
CORPSEPTION.
Win.

Posted by: flamedude
Did anyone want a fighter sequence? Or would you have prefered to see a Super MAC tearing up Covenant ships?

Did anyone want to be a Spartan-III involved with outside events? Or did you want to be in the thick of it with Red Team?
I was happy with playing as Noble's S-III team, but I would have preferred an explanation as to who the hell they are, and why they are still alive.
I would have enjoyed an ODST-style narrative, where Noble follows in the wake of an early-deployed Red Team, or vice versa, where you originally play as Red, and find clues about Noble's operations.

Most people didn't like the way ODST did that, but I would personally have enjoyed it.

Also, I would have preferred a big long cutscene to the first half of LNoS, just give me another mission somewhere else.
I would have far rather seen a 5 minute cutscene in which the UNSC fleet rallies to take down the Super Carrier a la the battle over the Ark Portal in Halo 3, only it fails and the ODPs and Fleet are damaged and destroyed. It would then set up the need to have done UPPERCUT the way they did far better than they had done.

  • 11.18.2010 3:05 PM PDT


Posted by: JDYeash937 MkII
Posted by: flamedude
Did anyone want a fighter sequence? Or would you have prefered to see a Super MAC tearing up Covenant ships?

Did anyone want to be a Spartan-III involved with outside events? Or did you want to be in the thick of it with Red Team?
I was happy with playing as Noble's S-III team, but I would have preferred an explanation as to who the hell they are, and why they are still alive.
I would have enjoyed an ODST-style narrative, where Noble follows in the wake of an early-deployed Red Team, or vice versa, where you originally play as Red, and find clues about Noble's operations.

Most people didn't like the way ODST did that, but I would personally have enjoyed it.

Also, I would have preferred a big long cutscene to the first half of LNoS, just give me another mission somewhere else.
I would have far rather seen a 5 minute cutscene in which the UNSC fleet rallies to take down the Super Carrier a la the battle over the Ark Portal in Halo 3, only it fails and the ODPs and Fleet are damaged and destroyed. It would then set up the need to have done UPPERCUT the way they did far better than they had done.


Cool idea, I really liked ODST type of play style, didn't like the Rookie's missions though, but other than that the campaign was really awesome. The big cutscene would also have been pretty cool. I like it the way it is though, it's still quite a lot of awesome fun for me.

  • 11.18.2010 4:37 PM PDT

.

"Happiness is like glass, you might not always notice it but if you change your view and then that glass will sparkle when it reflects the light."


Posted by: privet caboose
Carter honestly didn't seem that wounded. One plasma burn? Spartans have survived so much worse.

Regardless, the UNSC had been fighting Scarabs since 2531, atleast. And, they had simulations of fighting them. Johnson says so in Halo 2.
Carter was still being shot at after you jumped out so it is possible he was hit by a plasma shot or lost a lot more blood. Even if they got to the autumn carter would have died from the blood loss. The scarab was on a hill and would have chased them all the way to the autumn. This topic is going to go off topic at this rate.

  • 11.18.2010 5:13 PM PDT

On Waypoint I'm rocketFox;
http://halo.xbox.com/forums/members/rocketfox/default.aspx

Old GTs; RebelRobot, Flamedude

Even though Carters death did seem strange I do think it is very fitting of a Spartan-III. I've thought about his choice to sacrifice himself and perhaps he simply decided that the trade-off, in light of his wounds (sigh) and the stakes, was worth it.

It's the most dramatic death in the game, beside Six, and I did feel a rush of emotion when he gave his last message and smashed the Scarab.

  • 11.18.2010 5:17 PM PDT

Signatures are for squares.

Posted by: flamedude
Even though Carters death did seem strange I do think it is very fitting of a Spartan-III. I've thought about his choice to sacrifice himself and perhaps he simply decided that the trade-off, in light of his wounds (sigh) and the stakes, was worth it.

It's the most dramatic death in the game, beside Six, and I did feel a rush of emotion when he gave his last message and smashed the Scarab.


I didn't feel connected enough to care about Carters death. It wasn't until my second play through that I really felt anything about it.

Jorge had the most dramatic death, in my opinion.

  • 11.18.2010 5:20 PM PDT

On Waypoint I'm rocketFox;
http://halo.xbox.com/forums/members/rocketfox/default.aspx

Old GTs; RebelRobot, Flamedude

I thought Jorge had a dramatic death too. I liked how quickly he decided that there was no alternative but activate the slipspace bomb manually. I did immediately think that he might have survived the jump though, which kinda reduced the impact of his "death".

The only thing I dislike about situations like that with the bomb is that it is possible for a Marine to survive the showdown with the Elites. At which point any Marine worth his salt would understand that a Spartan is worth more to the war effort than himself, in which case Jorge wouldn't have "died".

These sorts of things always weigh on my mind, and my imagination seems to come up with alternatives.

  • 11.18.2010 5:25 PM PDT


Posted by: flamedude
I thought Jorge had a dramatic death too. I liked how quickly he decided that there was no alternative but activate the slipspace bomb manually. I did immediately think that he might have survived the jump though, which kinda reduced the impact of his "death".

The only thing I dislike about situations like that with the bomb is that it is possible for a Marine to survive the showdown with the Elites. At which point any Marine worth his salt would understand that a Spartan is worth more to the war effort than himself, in which case Jorge wouldn't have "died".

These sorts of things always weigh on my mind, and my imagination seems to come up with alternatives.


Jorge's death had very little affect on me if only for the fact that I was despising it for its clichedness, and Flamedude, I'd say the thread has already gone off topic, haha.

Shall we discuss Halo Legends, what did you guys think of it? I thought all the stories were good, but there were some things I thought stupid, like Homecoming, good story, but a lot of the details were either really or moderately dumb.

  • 11.18.2010 6:18 PM PDT


Posted by: flamedude
Even though Carters death did seem strange I do think it is very fitting of a Spartan-III. I've thought about his choice to sacrifice himself and perhaps he simply decided that the trade-off, in light of his wounds (sigh) and the stakes, was worth it.

It's the most dramatic death in the game, beside Six, and I did feel a rush of emotion when he gave his last message and smashed the Scarab.
While that one did feel the most epic death, that isn't exactly saying very much.

Further, I'd love to know exactly how the hell that Pelican was still airborne. In every single other instance in any game, a single banshee will take down any Pelican it sees. Bravo 22. Echo 419. Both Pelicans in Sierra 117. All by one banshee, the only exception being Miranda Keyes' invincible dropship, which she brought into the thick of combat unarmed and unguarded.

Yet now, Carter manages to get severely injured inside the Pelican's cockpit, which has suffered no physical damage aside from black smoke. And with the Pelican smoking, it continues to fly, while being continually shot at by banshees, for, what, 20 minutes? Yeah, fantastic.


Sorry about the off-topic, but this kind of thoughtlessness bothers me a lot.



Back on topic.

@ Caboose - I doubt you're getting through. While we cite events that are listed in the novels, the Bungie fanbois keep propping up speculation of what they think happened.

Might be best to create a timeline of both TFoR and the game, separately, then compare the two.

  • 11.18.2010 7:27 PM PDT