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This topic has moved here: Subject: MA37 ICWS AR. It should take 16 rounds to kill
  • Subject: MA37 ICWS AR. It should take 16 rounds to kill
Subject: MA37 ICWS AR. It should take 16 rounds to kill

Posted by: fez479
No it's perfect right now. The idea is that the magnum is a better choice to use at any point because if used correctly it can always kill an AR user. This is good because it rewards marksmanship as oppose to blind firing a machine gun. If we made the AR kill in 16 bullets then the AR would always dominate the Magnum, CQC would be a blind fire luck-fest with no true skill, and the Magnum would become useless.

The AR is meant to be better. The low accuracy would also reward marksmanship. If you can beat an AR with a pistol 9/10 times, then something is wrong.

  • 12.27.2010 1:51 PM PDT

I hate my gamertag AND my B.net name.


Posted by: RIZEUTO
Do NOT forget to post, not just vote or this will DIE!

http://www.bungie.net/Forums/posts.aspx?postID=48892966&p ostRepeater1-p=1 => For some reason it doesen't work when I make it a named hyperlink.


This old beta thread shows us exactly what problems the MA37 has.

It is too weak with a too low rate of fire.

The current number of rounds to kill is 18-20. That, along with the slow ROF and new melee system, makes the AR an unviable choice for CQB (Close Quarters Battle- meaning short range). You'd be better off meleeing with the DMR and getting the insta-kill headshot.

At Medium range it still loses out to most, if not all weapons because of it's long kill time.

This can be remedied somewhat, by increasing the damage of each single round, putting it at 16 to kill. That way the AR could get 2 perfect kills without reloading, which never happens anyway, but would help increase it's offensive power and balance it with other weapons. It would still be the underdog, but skilled players who know how to burst fire, and feather the AR would once again feel like god's own anti-SOBs.

EDIT: It already kills with 18 rounds- and it feels like it shoots hot popcorn. If it gets upgraded to 16 rounds to kill it would be perfect.

The AR ALWAYS MISSES AT LEAST ONE BULLET. So it would be very hard to kill 2 guys, and if someone does that, they damn well deserve it (Since they would have to hit each and every round).

By putting it down to 16, you would just upgrade the effectiveness of bursts, rewarding skill with an iconic Halo weapon.


Even in campaign on higher dificulties it is very weak.

Do you agree with this change?




New Intel: Thread


This thread here just goes to prove that the community agrees that the AR is preety much useless at the moment.

This change needs to be implemented.

Increasing the damage per round so that the AR kills in 16 shots.
cool story bro

  • 12.27.2010 1:51 PM PDT
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Posted by: Last Rogue
I remember a lot of Halo 3 forum members -blam!-ed about the AR being too powerful, making it "noob friendly". However, I think increasing the damage per bullet makes sense, and with the addition of AA's, it could make the AR a go-to weapon.

Also, I propose that the plasma repeater's accuracy be increased, so it's not such a "spray-and-pray" weapon.

In this universe, these rifles are their MAIN weapons, so we shouldn't switch to our side arms (pistols), because the rifles suck.


Is this a joke? The AR being the "go-to weapon" is the worst idea anyones ever had for Reach. Doing this would give no advantages at all, instead it would turn Halo Reach into a spray and pray game with no markmanship at all, which would be DAMN BORING and frustrating

  • 12.27.2010 1:53 PM PDT

Posted by: fez479

Posted by: Last Rogue
I remember a lot of Halo 3 forum members -blam!-ed about the AR being too powerful, making it "noob friendly". However, I think increasing the damage per bullet makes sense, and with the addition of AA's, it could make the AR a go-to weapon.

Also, I propose that the plasma repeater's accuracy be increased, so it's not such a "spray-and-pray" weapon.

In this universe, these rifles are their MAIN weapons, so we shouldn't switch to our side arms (pistols), because the rifles suck.


Is this a joke? The AR being the "go-to weapon" is the worst idea anyones ever had for Reach. Doing this would give no advantages at all, instead it would turn Halo Reach into a spray and pray game with no markmanship at all, which would be DAMN BORING and frustrating

The OP's suggestion would make "Spray and pray" less rewarding. It does not affect the accuracy, it only enhances bullet strength. This way. the player has to control his aim properly for full effect. That's marksmanship.

  • 12.27.2010 1:57 PM PDT
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Posted by: Snipers Paradox
Posted by: fez479
No it's perfect right now. The idea is that the magnum is a better choice to use at any point because if used correctly it can always kill an AR user. This is good because it rewards marksmanship as oppose to blind firing a machine gun. If we made the AR kill in 16 bullets then the AR would always dominate the Magnum, CQC would be a blind fire luck-fest with no true skill, and the Magnum would become useless.

The AR is meant to be better. The low accuracy would also reward marksmanship. If you can beat an AR with a pistol 9/10 times, then something is wrong.


Not true at all the AR is not meant to be better otherwise Bungie wouldve made it better. You don't understand the Magnum is there for pros who have great marksmanship skills, the idea is that if you are better than another player then you can kill them 9 times out of 10 in an equal battle. If you make it so that the AR is better than the Magnum then all the fights are run and spray with no strategy, skill, or marksmanship until you get better weapons. However, Magnum battles are much more skill based and require you to practice to win.

  • 12.27.2010 1:59 PM PDT

I hate my gamertag AND my B.net name.


Posted by: fez479

Posted by: Snipers Paradox
Posted by: fez479
No it's perfect right now. The idea is that the magnum is a better choice to use at any point because if used correctly it can always kill an AR user. This is good because it rewards marksmanship as oppose to blind firing a machine gun. If we made the AR kill in 16 bullets then the AR would always dominate the Magnum, CQC would be a blind fire luck-fest with no true skill, and the Magnum would become useless.

The AR is meant to be better. The low accuracy would also reward marksmanship. If you can beat an AR with a pistol 9/10 times, then something is wrong.


Not true at all the AR is not meant to be better otherwise Bungie wouldve made it better. You don't understand the Magnum is there for pros who have great marksmanship skills, the idea is that if you are better than another player then you can kill them 9 times out of 10 in an equal battle. If you make it so that the AR is better than the Magnum then all the fights are run and spray with no strategy, skill, or marksmanship until you get better weapons. However, Magnum battles are much more skill based and require you to practice to win.
cool story bro

  • 12.27.2010 2:00 PM PDT
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Posted by: Snipers Paradox
Posted by: fez479

Posted by: Last Rogue
I remember a lot of Halo 3 forum members -blam!-ed about the AR being too powerful, making it "noob friendly". However, I think increasing the damage per bullet makes sense, and with the addition of AA's, it could make the AR a go-to weapon.

Also, I propose that the plasma repeater's accuracy be increased, so it's not such a "spray-and-pray" weapon.

In this universe, these rifles are their MAIN weapons, so we shouldn't switch to our side arms (pistols), because the rifles suck.


Is this a joke? The AR being the "go-to weapon" is the worst idea anyones ever had for Reach. Doing this would give no advantages at all, instead it would turn Halo Reach into a spray and pray game with no markmanship at all, which would be DAMN BORING and frustrating

The OP's suggestion would make "Spray and pray" less rewarding. It does not affect the accuracy, it only enhances bullet strength. This way. the player has to control his aim properly for full effect. That's marksmanship.


Not at all, marksmanship is a headshot weapon. THERE I SAID IT. There is no marksmanship with an AR, it simply does not exist. In Magnum vs AR battles in close range the magnum can always win if the user is good at it, BUT the user has almost no life at the end. IF we made the AR kill in 2 more shots then the magnum user would have to get lucky for the AR to lose. The difference is that a missed shot with the AR has little consequences while a missed shot with the Magnum has high consequences, but the reward is greater, therefore making the Magnum a SKILL-BASED weapon.

  • 12.27.2010 2:03 PM PDT
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AR needs to be tweaked to halo 1 level. it now sounds weaker as well as being weaker now.

reach AR = ACR
Halo 3 AR = M4
Halo 1 AR = SCAR

its impossible to double kill with the AR unless opponents are <50% health/shields

  • 12.27.2010 2:03 PM PDT


Posted by: fez479

Posted by: Snipers Paradox
Posted by: fez479
No it's perfect right now. The idea is that the magnum is a better choice to use at any point because if used correctly it can always kill an AR user. This is good because it rewards marksmanship as oppose to blind firing a machine gun. If we made the AR kill in 16 bullets then the AR would always dominate the Magnum, CQC would be a blind fire luck-fest with no true skill, and the Magnum would become useless.

The AR is meant to be better. The low accuracy would also reward marksmanship. If you can beat an AR with a pistol 9/10 times, then something is wrong.


Not true at all the AR is not meant to be better otherwise Bungie wouldve made it better. You don't understand the Magnum is there for pros who have great marksmanship skills, the idea is that if you are better than another player then you can kill them 9 times out of 10 in an equal battle. If you make it so that the AR is better than the Magnum then all the fights are run and spray with no strategy, skill, or marksmanship until you get better weapons. However, Magnum battles are much more skill based and require you to practice to win.


You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. The AR takes just as much, if not more marksmanship skills than other precision weapons. Don't confuse your lack of skill with the AR and the the AR not taking skill with eachother.

The timing neccesary to effectively burst fire is extremely strict. If you're good with it, however, you'll be able to beat DMR's and other precision weapons. The reach AR is the worst AR for spraying, but it is the best burst fire AR, rivaling even precision weapons. Something, that was unthinkable in past halo's.

  • 12.27.2010 2:15 PM PDT

1% Onyx S9
2% Onyx S8
20% Onyx S7
LW 50
TS 50
TD 50
SWAT 50

I don't know what should happen, but CQC needs to be fixed. I avoid it at all costs because for a while I had negative kd with melees. I make wide turns around corners so if someone is camping I can take them out without a melee. I haven't had a chance to play much MLG, but I hear it is 3 melees, which sounds like a step in the right direction, although not the best solution.

  • 12.27.2010 2:23 PM PDT
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Posted by: Wobbly_guy

Posted by: fez479

Posted by: Snipers Paradox
Posted by: fez479
No it's perfect right now. The idea is that the magnum is a better choice to use at any point because if used correctly it can always kill an AR user. This is good because it rewards marksmanship as oppose to blind firing a machine gun. If we made the AR kill in 16 bullets then the AR would always dominate the Magnum, CQC would be a blind fire luck-fest with no true skill, and the Magnum would become useless.

The AR is meant to be better. The low accuracy would also reward marksmanship. If you can beat an AR with a pistol 9/10 times, then something is wrong.


Not true at all the AR is not meant to be better otherwise Bungie wouldve made it better. You don't understand the Magnum is there for pros who have great marksmanship skills, the idea is that if you are better than another player then you can kill them 9 times out of 10 in an equal battle. If you make it so that the AR is better than the Magnum then all the fights are run and spray with no strategy, skill, or marksmanship until you get better weapons. However, Magnum battles are much more skill based and require you to practice to win.


You obviously have no idea what you're talking about. The AR takes just as much, if not more marksmanship skills than other precision weapons. Don't confuse your lack of skill with the AR and the the AR not taking skill with eachother.

The timing neccesary to effectively burst fire is extremely strict. If you're good with it, however, you'll be able to beat DMR's and other precision weapons. The reach AR is the worst AR for spraying, but it is the best burst fire AR, rivaling even precision weapons. Something, that was unthinkable in past halo's.


this.

/conversation with misguided MLG wannabe.

  • 12.27.2010 2:40 PM PDT

get the sauc3

yea the AR's damage is negligible at best. in close quarters almost every gun is better than it, and if you dont even shoot you have an even better chance of coming out ahead.

pathetic game design imo

  • 12.27.2010 2:42 PM PDT

There is just something epic about pistols.

▀▄Halo 2 Strategy complete, Halo 3 Strategy in progress...▄▀
▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀MJOLNIR BATTLE TACTICS▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄

The magazine size needs to increase. Right now it takes exactly one clip to kill someone. WHAT!?!?!

  • 12.27.2010 2:46 PM PDT

There is just something epic about pistols.

▀▄Halo 2 Strategy complete, Halo 3 Strategy in progress...▄▀
▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀MJOLNIR BATTLE TACTICS▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄

Posted by: fez479

Posted by: Snipers Paradox
Posted by: fez479

Posted by: Last Rogue
I remember a lot of Halo 3 forum members -blam!-ed about the AR being too powerful, making it "noob friendly". However, I think increasing the damage per bullet makes sense, and with the addition of AA's, it could make the AR a go-to weapon.

Also, I propose that the plasma repeater's accuracy be increased, so it's not such a "spray-and-pray" weapon.

In this universe, these rifles are their MAIN weapons, so we shouldn't switch to our side arms (pistols), because the rifles suck.


Is this a joke? The AR being the "go-to weapon" is the worst idea anyones ever had for Reach. Doing this would give no advantages at all, instead it would turn Halo Reach into a spray and pray game with no markmanship at all, which would be DAMN BORING and frustrating

The OP's suggestion would make "Spray and pray" less rewarding. It does not affect the accuracy, it only enhances bullet strength. This way. the player has to control his aim properly for full effect. That's marksmanship.


Not at all, marksmanship is a headshot weapon. THERE I SAID IT. There is no marksmanship with an AR, it simply does not exist. In Magnum vs AR battles in close range the magnum can always win if the user is good at it, BUT the user has almost no life at the end. IF we made the AR kill in 2 more shots then the magnum user would have to get lucky for the AR to lose. The difference is that a missed shot with the AR has little consequences while a missed shot with the Magnum has high consequences, but the reward is greater, therefore making the Magnum a SKILL-BASED weapon.

That is why the AR clip size should be increased. It would not effect the skill difference between the AR and Magnum.

  • 12.27.2010 2:54 PM PDT

bump bump bump bump, ect ect ect.

  • 12.27.2010 2:58 PM PDT

"Light fuse... Run away..."

The AR was designed for multiplayer when Halo3 was in its beta.

It has become a weapon that (for best results) requires a combination of at least four patterns of use:
1.) AR + Melee
2.) AR + Grenades
3.) AR + Plasma pistol, DMR, etc.
4.) Focused fire

I would like a power upgrade, but a minor nudge above 100%.
one a seperate note: I really don't like the fact that many players ditch full-auto weapons for semi-auto and other weapons. Many weapons have been left pretty lonely in lieu of one "non-power" weapon.

  • 12.27.2010 3:29 PM PDT

There is just something epic about pistols.

▀▄Halo 2 Strategy complete, Halo 3 Strategy in progress...▄▀
▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀MJOLNIR BATTLE TACTICS▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄▀▄

Posted by: Frouste
The AR was designed for multiplayer when Halo3 was in its beta.

It has become a weapon that (for best results) requires a combination of at least four patterns of use:
1.) AR + Melee
2.) AR + Grenades
3.) AR + Plasma pistol, DMR, etc.
4.) Focused fire

I would like a power upgrade, but a minor nudge above 100%.
one a seperate note: I really don't like the fact that many players ditch full-auto weapons for semi-auto and other weapons. Many weapons have been left pretty lonely in lieu of one "non-power" weapon.

Yeah, in my opinion, I'd like a game much better if it ran on a basic system (would be exceptions) that the slower the RoF, the farther the range.

But the only fix for the AR I really want is for its clip size to be amped back to the way it used to be.

  • 12.27.2010 3:33 PM PDT
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Posted by: Frouste
The AR was designed for multiplayer when Halo3 was in its beta.

It has become a weapon that (for best results) requires a combination of at least four patterns of use:
1.) AR + Melee
2.) AR + Grenades
3.) AR + Plasma pistol, DMR, etc.
4.) Focused fire

I would like a power upgrade, but a minor nudge above 100%.
one a seperate note: I really don't like the fact that many players ditch full-auto weapons for semi-auto and other weapons. Many weapons have been left pretty lonely in lieu of one "non-power" weapon.


No one mentioned anything drastic. Just a small boost.

  • 12.28.2010 5:03 AM PDT
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Posted by: Th3 Gr3at Dan3
Posted by: Frouste
The AR was designed for multiplayer when Halo3 was in its beta.

It has become a weapon that (for best results) requires a combination of at least four patterns of use:
1.) AR + Melee
2.) AR + Grenades
3.) AR + Plasma pistol, DMR, etc.
4.) Focused fire

I would like a power upgrade, but a minor nudge above 100%.
one a seperate note: I really don't like the fact that many players ditch full-auto weapons for semi-auto and other weapons. Many weapons have been left pretty lonely in lieu of one "non-power" weapon.

Yeah, in my opinion, I'd like a game much better if it ran on a basic system (would be exceptions) that the slower the RoF, the farther the range.

But the only fix for the AR I really want is for its clip size to be amped back to the way it used to be.


A bigger magasine would not increase effectiveness, and would just promote spraying. I don't want a slow RoF SMG.

  • 12.28.2010 3:13 PM PDT
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Posted by: IC4I II URZA II
yea the AR's damage is negligible at best. in close quarters almost every gun is better than it, and if you dont even shoot you have an even better chance of coming out ahead.

pathetic game design imo


Exactly.

It doesen't have it's space in match making (or the sandbox in general).

This change..... would change that :D

  • 12.30.2010 1:57 PM PDT

They have the technology, but they don't have unlimited lives or the easy difficulty!

I wish i knew what the hell he said in the title. M38 DR12 HAOLL.

  • 12.30.2010 1:59 PM PDT
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Posted by: SeasickCheese
I wish i knew what the hell he said in the title. M38 DR12 HAOLL.


Official designation of the Halo: Reach Assault Rifle.

  • 12.30.2010 2:00 PM PDT

I think I have already posted this but I will say this again:

The AR either needs an accuracy boost (and or a bloom recovery time decrease), or the number of bullets to kill needs to be decreased to 16 instead of 20. (It was 22 in the Beta).

But every other weapon (except the DMR) needs a boost also. Especially the Plasma repeater, which needs to either kill faster, or overheat slower and be more accurate.

  • 12.30.2010 2:03 PM PDT

Jorge: Bad news is: timer's fried, gonna have to fire it manually.
Noble 6: That's a one way trip...
Jorge: We all make it sooner or later. Better get going, Six, they're gonna need you down there. Listen, Reach has been good to me, it's time to return the favor. Don't deny me this... Tell em' to make it count.

Uber n00b here

I burst fire the AR and win every time. Just saying. If people wanted to be better, don't approach while firing, back up and burst.

  • 12.30.2010 2:05 PM PDT

Jorge: Bad news is: timer's fried, gonna have to fire it manually.
Noble 6: That's a one way trip...
Jorge: We all make it sooner or later. Better get going, Six, they're gonna need you down there. Listen, Reach has been good to me, it's time to return the favor. Don't deny me this... Tell em' to make it count.


Posted by: TW InKoGnIto
But every other weapon (except the DMR) needs a boost also. Especially the Plasma repeater, which needs to either kill faster, or overheat slower and be more accurate.



The plasma repeater just needs it's projectiles to move faster.. Sad when you can use your plasma pistol with more success than the repeater

  • 12.30.2010 2:07 PM PDT