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Subject: Datapad AIs and their link to 'ancient humanity' [Version 1.0]

Here's a stab at a theory. I was going to wait until the release of Cryptum but I'm bored, so here it is now. I'll update it/scrap it (depending on what the book contains) accordingly once I've read Cryptum.

Okay, so, the Halo: Reach datapads. Curious things, seemingly detailing some of the exploits of a group of AIs who seem to be ensuring humanity's survival behind the scenes.

A proper summary can be read here.

Now before we carry on, let's jump back 100,000 years or so in the fiction. As recently revealed, humanity was once an interstellar race who colonised multiple worlds, until we got into a war with the Forerunners for some unknown reason and were devolved and exiled to Earth.

Now, I'm assuming that this 'ancient' humanity, for want of a better term, was more advanced than the humanity in 2552. Perhaps even matching the Forerunner's technological level, maybe even surpassing it (it's possible that the Forerunners won only due to superior numbers, after all.)

This ancient humanity would no doubt have AIs more advanced than the ones we see in the Halo games. AIs advanced enough to, say, have achieved full sentience, reaching the theoretical state of meta-stability.

When I first heard about the AIs in the datapads I was a little confused, reading the conversations that took place. The AIs were doubtlessly created by humans, referring to us often as their creators, but their knowledge far surpassed that of humanity in 2552. So they can't be Forerunner either.

This puzzled me awhile. It all makes sense now, in light of Cryptum's revelations.

The AIs were created by the ancient humanity, and were tasked with watching over us after our devolution and exile. They have done so for over 100,000 years.

Now that all is said, I'll explain my reason for believing this.

The AIs far surpass anything humanity in 2552 could have created. They seem even more advanced than Forerunner AIs, acting almost as gods guiding us. They identified the Covenant long before any humans did, hinting again to technology beyond our grasp in 2552.

One of the AIs also suggests that the humans being allowed to examine them. If they were created by 2552's humanity, why would that need to be the case?

They instigated the Spartan II program, again alluding to some prescient knowledge surpassing our own. Indeed, I think it a possibility that the Forerunners affect the "genas" of some humans 100,000 years ago (as shown in Cryptum), and the descendants of these affected humans are the ideal genetic candidates for the Spartan program. Were the AIs remnants of the ancient humanity, they would know this.

The fact that they are willing to make huge sacrifices to ensure humanity's survival in the long term (it is implied that they bombed Haven, for example) hints to the fact that these AIs have been doing this for a very long time (this also leads to interesting questions about what else these AIs have done throughout human history; could they have, for example, set World Wars in motion to advance our technology and culture?)

It's also shown that this committee of AIs possess weapons that could threaten the human race. Perhaps these weapons are remnants of the technology ancient humanity possessed? It's also stated that the AIs know of planets containing technology that would be dangerous for humanity to possess in 2552; I had assumed it was Forerunner but it could in fact by ancient human, some technology that was not razed by the Forerunners.

Anyway, until Cryptum is released we won't know for sure, maybe not even then. But I thought it would be fun to discuss the, in my opinion, likely possibility in the meantime. If this theory were true then it would explain much which does not make sense in the data-pads.

tl;dr version - The AI assembly in the Halo Reach datapads were created by the ancient humanity which warred with the Forerunners, and were tasked with ensuring our long-term survival.

[Edited on 01.01.2011 10:51 AM PST]

  • 01.01.2011 10:49 AM PDT

I don't recall anything implying they possess weapons of any sort, beyond knowledge. They may have allowed something to fall (indeed, they adopted a plan of feeding human population centers to the Covenant to slow them down) but they certainly do nothing directly.

All your points aside, you have my theory as well. But the biggest indicator is we have clearly stable A.I's kicking around hundreds of years before we really invent them.

  • 01.01.2011 10:55 AM PDT

That too.

It is implied that the AIs have the means to interfere in the war directly. I'm assuming that means weapons, or at least, the knowledge of weapons that could be passed to us.

  • 01.01.2011 10:58 AM PDT

Oh hey there

Posted by: petarded2
It's a metaphor for the 07s' lack of identity. too old to be newfa­g, yet too new to be oldfa­g, we wander b.net in search of a home, forever trying to be something we are not.

I don't see any reason why the Committee can't have a revolving membership. Instead of being incredibly advanced AI from ancient humanity that are metastable, The Committee could merely have been started by the first true AI's created several hundred years before the events of Halo. Then as members of the council and committee fall into rampancy and are destroyed they are replaced by a new generation of AI's.

If it is the case that they are not ancient advanced AI's that are metastable their purpose, maintaining the survival of humanity, makes much more sense as they need humanity to continue to advance the development of AI's hopefully leading to the discovery of a way to avoid rampancy, as was seen when Halsey thought about using slipspace as a way to increase their information storage exponentially thus staving off rampancy. The committee wanted all resources diverted to her and her project to be encouraged. I don't remember the exact wording but it was something along the lines of, this is what they had been waiting for.

If you think of it like that I think it makes much more sense that they are current AI's not ancient metastable ones. This was just my first reaction to the data pads and cryptum, I haven't really thought it out all that much.

[Edited on 01.01.2011 11:10 AM PST]

  • 01.01.2011 11:08 AM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: Wolverfrog
That too.

It is implied that the AIs have the means to interfere in the war directly. I'm assuming that means weapons, or at least, the knowledge of weapons that could be passed to us.

data Pad 16
>> While this body has already gone far down the road to active participation in our creator's war-fighting efforts, we must Now ask ourselves: is there a point at which we strip away all vestiges of secrecy, and become active participants in the hostilities?
If the Minority knew we were wavering, it boggles the Mind what sorts of weapons they would propose we use. >>
>> And if we brought these weapons to bear - if we too became wolves - would there still be a human race to save when we were through? >>

It does seem to indicate that they have some sort of Ace in the Hole.

However, there is one thing. In Data Pad 6 they talk about the discovery of Onyx (Zeta Doradus) and decide to obfuscate its existence from most of Humanity. You get the impression that they do not know its origins, saying things like "While the absence of any living representatives implies this intelligence is defunct". Wouldn't they identify that as Forerunner immediately?

Also, they considered contacting the Flood in 2531 (Data Pad 15). If they were from the old times, wouldn't they know exactly what this Flood was and know to stay well away?

  • 01.01.2011 11:23 AM PDT

the "revolving door membership" thing is part of my theory. I think the reason that they have so much potential and influence is because they keep building upon their own records, with each generation of AI being able to do more and making their plan more and more successful.

I think that your theory is plausible though. It is possible that the AI are metastable. It seems to me though, that they have a bunch of AI in the Committee together. Also, where are the AI that they cannot be found by humanity, but still manage to wind up in datapads on Reach? And what source of power supplies them that lasts so long?

[Edited on 01.01.2011 11:25 AM PST]

  • 01.01.2011 11:24 AM PDT
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I disagree with the revolving door for a few reasons.

1) In order for that theory to be true, there must be a continual renewal of AI's for the committee, and if they are human AI's, how would humans NOT notice all these disappearing AI's?
2) They would be required to be Smart AI's, as Dumb AI's couldn't simply change their function to the sustainability of the Human race. And Smart AI's are very potent entities, and are closely monitored. Not to mention hard to creates (or at least difficult/complicated), thus increasing the need to monitor them.
3) These AI's seem to have been in this committee for longer than Smart AI's have been around. The variety and complexity of their task, again, indicates they simply must be Smart AI's.

So unless there is some Mad Scientist making these AI's since before the Human race as a whole knew how to, and that since the MS's demise the AI's have had the ability to create other Smart AI's without Human notice. The simplest answer seems to be they are from ancient Humanity, who may or may not had already used slipspace to create AI's. Which would explain their interest in Halsey, because they would already know the outcome, which would create these meta-AI's and they could then return to Humanity without revealing their true creators: Ancient Humanity.

  • 01.01.2011 1:04 PM PDT


Posted by: modest too
I disagree with the revolving door for a few reasons.

1) In order for that theory to be true, there must be a continual renewal of AI's for the committee, and if they are human AI's, how would humans NOT notice all these disappearing AI's?
2) They would be required to be Smart AI's, as Dumb AI's couldn't simply change their function to the sustainability of the Human race. And Smart AI's are very potent entities, and are closely monitored. Not to mention hard to creates (or at least difficult/complicated), thus increasing the need to monitor them.
3) These AI's seem to have been in this committee for longer than Smart AI's have been around. The variety and complexity of their task, again, indicates they simply must be Smart AI's.

So unless there is some Mad Scientist making these AI's since before the Human race as a whole knew how to, and that since the MS's demise the AI's have had the ability to create other Smart AI's without Human notice. The simplest answer seems to be they are from ancient Humanity, who may or may not had already used slipspace to create AI's. Which would explain their interest in Halsey, because they would already know the outcome, which would create these meta-AI's and they could then return to Humanity without revealing their true creators: Ancient Humanity.
I agree. Ancient Humanity seems to have been more advanced then in 2552 and the AIs from the data pads more than likely are relics from that time and have spend the past several thousand years protecting and guiding human redevelopment.

  • 01.01.2011 1:14 PM PDT

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Now before we carry on, let's jump back 100,000 years or so in the fiction. As recently revealed, humanity was once an interstellar race who colonised multiple worlds, until we got into a war with the Forerunners for some unknown reason and were devolved and exiled to Earth.
WTF when was this decided?

  • 01.01.2011 1:24 PM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: WEE MAN MJJC
Now before we carry on, let's jump back 100,000 years or so in the fiction. As recently revealed, humanity was once an interstellar race who colonised multiple worlds, until we got into a war with the Forerunners for some unknown reason and were devolved and exiled to Earth.
WTF when was this decided?


the first two chapters of cryptum.

So what about the past?

  • 01.01.2011 1:28 PM PDT


Posted by: modest too
I disagree with the revolving door for a few reasons.

1) In order for that theory to be true, there must be a continual renewal of AI's for the committee, and if they are human AI's, how would humans NOT notice all these disappearing AI's?
2) They would be required to be Smart AI's, as Dumb AI's couldn't simply change their function to the sustainability of the Human race. And Smart AI's are very potent entities, and are closely monitored. Not to mention hard to creates (or at least difficult/complicated), thus increasing the need to monitor them.
3) These AI's seem to have been in this committee for longer than Smart AI's have been around. The variety and complexity of their task, again, indicates they simply must be Smart AI's.

So unless there is some Mad Scientist making these AI's since before the Human race as a whole knew how to, and that since the MS's demise the AI's have had the ability to create other Smart AI's without Human notice. The simplest answer seems to be they are from ancient Humanity, who may or may not had already used slipspace to create AI's. Which would explain their interest in Halsey, because they would already know the outcome, which would create these meta-AI's and they could then return to Humanity without revealing their true creators: Ancient Humanity.


Actually, Smart AIs wouldn't disappear to go to the committee, just have it as some sort of hidden subroutine and conference while doing their tasks. Plus, if Smart Ai have a lifespan of 7 years without rampancy, then humanity has to make more of them (unless they cannot due to some kind of restraint)

  • 01.01.2011 1:33 PM PDT

Online Gaming's pretty much like a zombie movie. There are a lot of mindless idiots roaming around but you find some survivors on the way.
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Posted by: grey101

Posted by: WEE MAN MJJC
Now before we carry on, let's jump back 100,000 years or so in the fiction. As recently revealed, humanity was once an interstellar race who colonised multiple worlds, until we got into a war with the Forerunners for some unknown reason and were devolved and exiled to Earth.
WTF when was this decided?


the first two chapters of cryptum.

So what about the past?

Ok so how come all this isnt on halopedia?

  • 01.01.2011 1:39 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

*sigh* human AIs are deleted after 7 years for FEAR of rampancy. that doesn't mean right after 7 years they go crazy.

Could these AIs be the "knowledge" that halsey was talking about during "the package"?

  • 01.01.2011 1:40 PM PDT
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If they are human AI's why do they propose to let Humans study them? If Humans created them, and have frequent interactions with them, what would we need to study? The information they withheld from us? No, they would have stated as so, not as they did. I believe, beyond radical doubt, that they are not, in fact, Human (of the UNSC variety) AI's.

  • 01.01.2011 1:43 PM PDT


Posted by: grey101
*sigh* human AIs are deleted after 7 years for FEAR of rampancy. that doesn't mean right after 7 years they go crazy.

Could these AIs be the "knowledge" that halsey was talking about during "the package"?


But there must be a large number of AI that go rampant after nearly 7 years or else it would be a waste of AI to delete every AI over 7 years. (that or Bungie just put that in because of their love of 7)

  • 01.01.2011 1:48 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: modest too
If they are human AI's why do they propose to let Humans study them? If Humans created them, and have frequent interactions with them, what would we need to study? The information they withheld from us? No, they would have stated as so, not as they did. I believe, beyond radical doubt, that they are not, in fact, Human (of the UNSC variety) AI's.


Becuase they are from our advanced past, you didn't read cryptum did you?

Posted by: Gruntpocalypto

Posted by: grey101
*sigh* human AIs are deleted after 7 years for FEAR of rampancy. that doesn't mean right after 7 years they go crazy.

Could these AIs be the "knowledge" that halsey was talking about during "the package"?


But there must be a large number of AI that go rampant after nearly 7 years or else it would be a waste of AI to delete every AI over 7 years. (that or Bungie just put that in because of their love of 7)


It is just a precaution, just like you get a shot after a wild animal bites you for fear of rabies; while in fact you may or may not have rabies.

It was stated/hinted in evolutions that halsey did something to cortana's memory lessening the chances of her going rampant.
so she is in fact crazy becuase she thinks she is going to go crazy.

[Edited on 01.01.2011 1:52 PM PST]

  • 01.01.2011 1:49 PM PDT

Btu why are people afriad of rabies? a long time ago, someone made the connection that getting bit by a foamy-mouthed, crazy animal makes you crazy. Now everyone gets Rabies shots after getting bitten by a crazy animal as a precaution.

Something must have happened that caused them to take that precaution.

  • 01.01.2011 1:56 PM PDT
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Posted by: grey101

Posted by: modest too
If they are human AI's why do they propose to let Humans study them? If Humans created them, and have frequent interactions with them, what would we need to study? The information they withheld from us? No, they would have stated as so, not as they did. I believe, beyond radical doubt, that they are not, in fact, Human (of the UNSC variety) AI's.


Becuase they are from our advanced past, you didn't read cryptum did you?


exactly what I'm getting at. The AI's are from Pre-Devolution Humans, set as a final precaution to watch over Humans and continue their existence.

  • 01.01.2011 1:57 PM PDT
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Posted by: Gruntpocalypto
Btu why are people afriad of rabies? a long time ago, someone made the connection that getting bit by a foamy-mouthed, crazy animal makes you crazy. Now everyone gets Rabies shots after getting bitten by a crazy animal as a precaution.

Something must have happened that caused them to take that precaution.


AI's have a tendency to begin the stages of rampancy after 7 years. Well AI's created by the UNSC Humans, Humans from the Human-Forerunner war might have been able to create AI's beyond that limitation.

However that in and of itself poses a new question: If Humans could make Non-Rampant AI's, could the Forerunners?

Guilty Spark 343 and Mendicate Bias seem to say no.

  • 01.01.2011 2:00 PM PDT

Wasn't it already postualted in the Op that humans may hve been more advanced than Forerunner? Maybe they were the Precursor (as stated in the corresponding theory topic) that may be a little far fetched though

  • 01.01.2011 2:03 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: modest too
Posted by: Gruntpocalypto
Btu why are people afriad of rabies? a long time ago, someone made the connection that getting bit by a foamy-mouthed, crazy animal makes you crazy. Now everyone gets Rabies shots after getting bitten by a crazy animal as a precaution.

Something must have happened that caused them to take that precaution.


AI's have a tendency to begin the stages of rampancy after 7 years. Well AI's created by the UNSC Humans, Humans from the Human-Forerunner war might have been able to create AI's beyond that limitation.

However that in and of itself poses a new question: If Humans could make Non-Rampant AI's, could the Forerunners?

Guilty Spark 343 and Mendicate Bias seem to say no.


the forerunners could you just forget that they have personalites.

Yes 343 did go rampant due to time.

2401 seemed highly stable, despite being in the graveminds hands.

Medicant Bias (my favorite halo character as of now) went rampant due to choice, and then reached meta stablity.

"The knowing" was stable

686 was crazy by design,etc.

  • 01.01.2011 2:05 PM PDT
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Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?


Posted by: Gruntpocalypto
Wasn't it already postualted in the Op that humans may hve been more advanced than Forerunner? Maybe they were the Precursor (as stated in the corresponding theory topic) that may be a little far fetched though
no, we were advanced but not "as" advanced as the forerunner. if we were we wouldn't have lost.

It was confirmed in cryptum that the precursors are a completly separate race. unless halo has a naruto idea playing along and the humans and forerunner are both desendants of the precursor

  • 01.01.2011 2:07 PM PDT

ahh. I haven't read any of Cryptum yet. I need to buy it when it comes out

  • 01.01.2011 2:11 PM PDT
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So, Humans lost to the Forerunners, and knew they were to be 'punished' but would not be extinct due to the Mantle. And as a security measure, created a committee of AI's to watch over our species and ensure its ongoing survival. When the Forerunners disappeared (or became extinct) due to the firing of the Halos (from which we were protected [by the Librarian?]) these AI's worked to remove the devolution imposed upon us and ward off threats to the survival of the species.

The last bit is a speculation, but are we more or less agreed the AI's are pre-devolution Human AI?

Also, where is this committee located? As an AI can only exist in a electronic unit of some sort (computer or housing case). Where were they during the time Humans did not have technology? Perhaps in a splispace station? If so thats probably where they still are.

And a final far-fetch theory just for kicks: maybe Bornsteller everlasting whatever his name is created the AI's after realizing he had released the Flood (Says he plays a major part in the preface of Cryptum) because he believed that Humans had a characteristic that the Forerunners did not which could save the Galaxy? Just something to chew over.

  • 01.01.2011 2:22 PM PDT

Posted by: grey101

Posted by: Gruntpocalypto
Wasn't it already postualted in the Op that humans may hve been more advanced than Forerunner? Maybe they were the Precursor (as stated in the corresponding theory topic) that may be a little far fetched though
no, we were advanced but not "as" advanced as the forerunner. if we were we wouldn't have lost.

It was confirmed in cryptum that the precursors are a completly separate race. unless halo has a naruto idea playing along and the humans and forerunner are both desendants of the precursor


As I said my friend, the Forerunners may have had superior numbers. Throw enough swordsmen against a cluster of gunmen and eventually they're going to run out of bullets.

  • 01.01.2011 2:22 PM PDT

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