Bungie Universe
This topic has moved here: Subject: Necromorphs vs The Flood
  • Subject: Necromorphs vs The Flood
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • of 4
Subject: Necromorphs vs The Flood

___.............._______/```````````````:::--.
|.==,-.~;. ____:._______ __’__’__’_ _ _\===
|................--:---:--:--‘---:,, ,,, ,,, ,,,:---: /=
`-.,.__._._,,...---:::"
Halo Waypoint Stats

Flood

  • 01.31.2011 1:40 PM PDT

@Issac Clarke (lol)

"The Flood are much more adaptable."

I take it you've never heard of the Flood Super Cell. From the Encyclopedia: "Flood biomass is composed of an undifferentiated cell type that is referred to as the Flood Super Cell (FSC), which can be described as aproximating "thinking muscle." The FSC closely resembles neurons or glial cells in structure. The Flood can arrange these cells to mimic any organ they might need."

So if they need a Flood to, say, break tanks apart or at least take on heavy armor, the Flood Super Cell will create a specialized organ or even entire creature to counter the armor.

In fact, they did that with the Thrasher Form in Halo Wars. It was built for the specific purpose of crushing tanks, and being able to take multiple direct tank shells.

Necromorphs would infect the parasite of the flood, and take over it with a decentralized nervous system.

There's actually significant evidence suggesting that's impossible. The Halo 3 Besterium desribes the Flood and the Gravemind to be a singular "macro-organism." There are no individuals in the Flood, merely extensions of the Gravemind's "body."

The venus flytrap in Halo 2 you speak too is not so much the Gravemind itself as it is the organ it uses to speak verbally. (of course, it is later revealed he doesn't need a mouth since he's telepathic). Trying to infect the Flood with anything at all would result in one of the following.

1) The Form will simply die the same as a bullet would kill it. Difference is the Necros need to kill their prey first. Note that Flood can live through incredible pain if the infection is undamaged (read The Flood book. They're a lot like the Necros.) This suggests pure Flood would have to be ripped so apart they'd be useless to the Necros.

2) Infecting would have no effect at all on the Flood Super Cell, and it would simply reject it.

3) As the Flood is somewhere in between living and dead, and that Necros can only infect dead, AND as the Flood is not individulastic but rather a single super organism sharing the same cell structure and mind, it would likewise be impossible to infect the Flood. It would take the instantanious death of every Flood in the galaxy to be able to infect the Gravemind/Flood.

4) If the Necros DO infect the Flood, the FSC will inform the Gravemind instantly about how the Necros work. Mind will in turn exploit this to his advantage. It is stated in Halo: Cryptum that even dead Flood can still infect, so the celluar structure is still alive (another reason why Necros can't infect the Flood. They can't infect what is still alive).

By contrast, the Flood can very easily infect the Necros and defeat them.

1) They can infect both living AND dead flesh. So long as they have a nervous system (which Necros do), the Flood can infect them. And even if the Necros are so utterly FUBARed to tiny pieces, the FSC can still use the flesh to add to the Flood's overall biomass, thus churning out more Pure Forms, which in turn can serve any purpose the Gravemind wants it to and take any form.

2) The Gravemind itself does not have a corporeal body to target and kill that will destroy the entire species, unlike the Necromorphs. He is rather a distibuted telepathic "ghost", I suppose you could say, that dictates the Flood biomass. The Flood biomass and everything it has infected or taken over itself is its "body." But kill the Hivemind or destroy the Marker and you beat the Necros.

3) As well, the Gravemind is of a vast, nearly omnipotent intellect. He has the knowledge of at least an entire galaxy in time. The Necro Hivemind by contrast seems more animalistic. Now I haven't played Dead Space 1 yet, but I have seen the boss battle. It doesn't strike me as anything more then an animal. But I may be wrong.

4) The Flood do not require the infection of other races to reproduce. In fact, when the coordinate stage is reached, the infected forms are repurposed to either defend important Flood controlled areas, such as planets or hives. Or they are melted down for clacium to further the construction of more Pure Forms. Dead Pure Forms are likely re-melted to create even more Pure Forms.

Pure Forms themselves are given a frontlines offensive role. This makes sense as the Gravemind can create literally whatever he deems fit for a specific task. Whatever he needs he creates.

The Flood will essentially harvest the Necros for more and more parts. It isn't like humans fighting where when a human kills a Necro, the Necros lose one Necro.

It is rather, when the Flood kill a Necro, they lose one AND the Flood gain at least one more. When the Necros kill a Flood, the Flood reharvest the "dead" Flood and create another, stronger Pure Form.

Add on Flood>Necro reason #5) The Flood can use weapons, technology, can highjack computers, and learn, and the Flood are simply better then Necros.

Also consider the Flood would reach billions in a single swarm of Pure Forms.

Quite frankly, the design of the Flood is ingenious. They really are the perfect enemy.

  • 01.31.2011 3:00 PM PDT

I am a monument to all your sins


Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: Darthbill99

Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: Darthbill99
Posted by: ROBERTO jh


And (I don't know if the Necros can do this, but, eh) the Flood is also an airborne disease as well.

Flood>Necros
I dont think the flood is actually airborne. If they were then infection forms would be redundant. The only thing the spores do is spread biomass and create growth pods. The only time we see anything that suggests an airborne infection is in Halo wars, but the flood in that have so many inconsistencies that its impossible to say whats really canon. plus the gravemind was breathing spores everywhere in Halo 2, and the arbiter didnt get infected (he lacks an air filter like mastercheif)


"Your environment suit should serve you well when the Flood begins to malt(or something) in the atmosphere. You are a good planner."

--343 Guilty Spark

Remember, the Gravemind controls every aspect of the Flood, right down to who gets the axe and when and how. If he doesn't want the Arbiter dead, then he won't kill him with spores.
the spores might be able to choke and kill people, and then convirt them into biomass. however to create a combat form the flood needs to hack the hosts nervous system with a penetrator and then inject them with flood super cells. The spore might be able to inject the supercell, but without the infection forms nervous system hacking the host cant be used in combat


It would appear The Mona Lisa would have something to say about that. Those were not normal combat forms; they still looked human, but were absolutely insane.

It always gave me the impression they breathed the spores rather then just got infected normally.

So essentially, the Flood Spores CAN convert people to combat forms, just not the ones we're used too. I thought everyone knew this?
no they were ordinary combat forms, they were mistaken for humans sometimes because it was very dark, and they didnt want to believe what they were seeing. not to mention infection forms are referenced to be in the form's chest cavity multiple times. plus if spores could infect, why were Henry and the other guy (I forget his name) not infected? they were there for days and there were spores all over the place, surly they would have breathed some spores in

[Edited on 01.31.2011 6:04 PM PST]

  • 01.31.2011 5:59 PM PDT

Message me if you want, I will try to get back as soon as possible.

See you on the forums and in the games.

Also, I believe Necros need genetic material to infect a host, without the host having infect-able genetics, it would be impossible, pure forms are all calcium, no genes, I think. That means the Gravemind could just endlessly send these forms to the Necros, diminishing their number and not having to worry about them expanding. Does this sound right anyone?

  • 01.31.2011 7:19 PM PDT


Posted by: Darthbill99

Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Posted by: Darthbill99
Posted by: ROBERTO jh


And (I don't know if the Necros can do this, but, eh) the Flood is also an airborne disease as well.

Flood>Necros[/quote]I dont think the flood is actually airborne. If they were then infection forms would be redundant. The only thing the spores do is spread biomass and create growth pods. The only time we see anything that suggests an airborne infection is in Halo wars, but the flood in that have so many inconsistencies that its impossible to say whats really canon. plus the gravemind was breathing spores everywhere in Halo 2, and the arbiter didnt get infected (he lacks an air filter like mastercheif)


"Your environment suit should serve you well when the Flood begins to malt(or something) in the atmosphere. You are a good planner."

--343 Guilty Spark

Remember, the Gravemind controls every aspect of the Flood, right down to who gets the axe and when and how. If he doesn't want the Arbiter dead, then he won't kill him with spores.
the spores might be able to choke and kill people, and then convirt them into biomass. however to create a combat form the flood needs to hack the hosts nervous system with a penetrator and then inject them with flood super cells. The spore might be able to inject the supercell, but without the infection forms nervous system hacking the host cant be used in combat


It would appear The Mona Lisa would have something to say about that. Those were not normal combat forms; they still looked human, but were absolutely insane.

It always gave me the impression they breathed the spores rather then just got infected normally.

So essentially, the Flood Spores CAN convert people to combat forms, just not the ones we're used too. I thought everyone knew this?
no they were ordinary combat forms, they were mistaken for humans sometimes because it was very dark, and they didnt want to believe what they were seeing. not to mention infection forms are referenced to be in the form's chest cavity multiple times. plus if spores could infect, why were Henry and the other guy (I forget his name) not infected? they were there for days and there were spores all over the place, surly they would have breathed some spores in


Rtas even said the spores were dangerous "One. Single. Flood spore. can destry. a species"

Then you have the spore cloud from Halo Wars infecting people.

So we know the spores are exceptionally dangerous and all game evidence points to them being possible infection sources.

Either way, it doesn't matter in this fight. Necros don't breath, do they?

  • 02.01.2011 5:26 AM PDT

Wake me when the jews are gone.

"The Flood are much more adaptable."

I take it you've never heard of the Flood Super Cell. From the Encyclopedia: "Flood biomass is composed of an undifferentiated cell type that is referred to as the Flood Super Cell (FSC), which can be described as aproximating "thinking muscle." The FSC closely resembles neurons or glial cells in structure. The Flood can arrange these cells to mimic any organ they might need."

So if they need a Flood to, say, break tanks apart or at least take on heavy armor, the Flood Super Cell will create a specialized organ or even entire creature to counter the armor.

In fact, they did that with the Thrasher Form in Halo Wars. It was built for the specific purpose of crushing tanks, and being able to take multiple direct tank shells.Necromorphs would infect the parasite of the flood, and take over it with a decentralized nervous system. There's actually significant evidence suggesting that's impossible. The Halo 3 Besterium desribes the Flood and the Gravemind to be a singular "macro-organism." There are no individuals in the Flood, merely extensions of the Gravemind's "body."

The venus flytrap in Halo 2 you speak too is not so much the Gravemind itself as it is the organ it uses to speak verbally. (of course, it is later revealed he doesn't need a mouth since he's telepathic). Trying to infect the Flood with anything at all would result in one of the following.

1) The Form will simply die the same as a bullet would kill it. Difference is the Necros need to kill their prey first. Note that Flood can live through incredible pain if the infection is undamaged (read The Flood book. They're a lot like the Necros.) This suggests pure Flood would have to be ripped so apart they'd be useless to the Necros.

2) Infecting would have no effect at all on the Flood Super Cell, and it would simply reject it.

3) As the Flood is somewhere in between living and dead, and that Necros can only infect dead, AND as the Flood is not individulastic but rather a single super organism sharing the same cell structure and mind, it would likewise be impossible to infect the Flood. It would take the instantanious death of every Flood in the galaxy to be able to infect the Gravemind/Flood.

4) If the Necros DO infect the Flood, the FSC will inform the Gravemind instantly about how the Necros work. Mind will in turn exploit this to his advantage. It is stated in Halo: Cryptum that even dead Flood can still infect, so the celluar structure is still alive (another reason why Necros can't infect the Flood. They can't infect what is still alive).

By contrast, the Flood can very easily infect the Necros and defeat them.

1) They can infect both living AND dead flesh. So long as they have a nervous system (which Necros do), the Flood can infect them. And even if the Necros are so utterly FUBARed to tiny pieces, the FSC can still use the flesh to add to the Flood's overall biomass, thus churning out more Pure Forms, which in turn can serve any purpose the Gravemind wants it to and take any form.

2) The Gravemind itself does not have a corporeal body to target and kill that will destroy the entire species, unlike the Necromorphs. He is rather a distibuted telepathic "ghost", I suppose you could say, that dictates the Flood biomass. The Flood biomass and everything it has infected or taken over itself is its "body." But kill the Hivemind or destroy the Marker and you beat the Necros.

3) As well, the Gravemind is of a vast, nearly omnipotent intellect. He has the knowledge of at least an entire galaxy in time. The Necro Hivemind by contrast seems more animalistic. Now I haven't played Dead Space 1 yet, but I have seen the boss battle. It doesn't strike me as anything more then an animal. But I may be wrong.

4) The Flood do not require the infection of other races to reproduce. In fact, when the coordinate stage is reached, the infected forms are repurposed to either defend important Flood controlled areas, such as planets or hives. Or they are melted down for clacium to further the construction of more Pure Forms. Dead Pure Forms are likely re-melted to create even more Pure Forms.

Pure Forms themselves are given a frontlines offensive role. This makes sense as the Gravemind can create literally whatever he deems fit for a specific task. Whatever he needs he creates.

The Flood will essentially harvest the Necros for more and more parts. It isn't like humans fighting where when a human kills a Necro, the Necros lose one Necro.

It is rather, when the Flood kill a Necro, they lose one AND the Flood gain at least one more. When the Necros kill a Flood, the Flood reharvest the "dead" Flood and create another, stronger Pure Form.

Add on Flood>Necro reason #5) The Flood can use weapons, technology, can highjack computers, and learn, and the Flood are simply better then Necros.

Also consider the Flood would reach billions in a single swarm of Pure Forms.

Quite frankly, the design of the Flood is ingenious. They really are the perfect enemy.
this is The guy.

  • 02.01.2011 8:40 AM PDT

>>/INFO_ONISEC1SER3
/CLASSIFICATION>> CLASS ?
/MISSION_CONTROL>> BASE ALAMO
/CODENAME>> FACOTA FI
/MISSON_LOCATION>> CLASSIFIED
/MISSION_STATUS >> 7H+IN_PROGRESS
>>END //INFO_ONISEC1SER3 >>CLEAR

I believe why spores don't infect people so much is that humans have means to fight them too. Like we can fight bacteria and viruses too. It's the fact that when flood infection forms enter the body and inject massive amounts of the spores they take over.

But it can and will happen (The infection) with less spores in more time if not cleared by body or other means.

Yeah, Flood would win, hands down.
Why is described by people before me in this very thread.

  • 02.01.2011 10:46 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Solving problems you could have solved by yourself since 1968.
[i]- Veteran Stormtrooper Clarke of the Ordo Malleus[/i]

Life is too short to get irritated because someone's preferences differ from yours.
~ACP Cataclysm

Posted by: AngrydoG
Posted by: SraKe
Really this isn't a question of eneimes, this is a question of heros.
Master Chief is 8 Foot tall supersoldier. Well yea.
But on the other Hand, Issac Clarke is an Degree carrying engineer.
And the as we see in half life, the badass scientist always wins.


Clarke was also a merchant Marine. So he was a soldier.
I was never "technically" a soldier. I was a worker in emergency repair response around the shipping lines.

[Edited on 02.01.2011 1:24 PM PST]

  • 02.01.2011 1:20 PM PDT


Posted by: Isaac Clarke
Posted by: AngrydoG
Posted by: SraKe
Really this isn't a question of eneimes, this is a question of heros.
Master Chief is 8 Foot tall supersoldier. Well yea.
But on the other Hand, Issac Clarke is an Degree carrying engineer.
And the as we see in half life, the badass scientist always wins.


Clarke was also a merchant Marine. So he was a soldier.
I was never "technically" a soldier. I just worker in emergency repair around the shipping lines.
Quick Question: Hundreds of well trained soldiers died to them, yet you, a person who never killed something in your life, somehow survive not only an infected ship, but also an infected city. How can this be?

  • 02.01.2011 1:23 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Solving problems you could have solved by yourself since 1968.
[i]- Veteran Stormtrooper Clarke of the Ordo Malleus[/i]

Life is too short to get irritated because someone's preferences differ from yours.
~ACP Cataclysm

Posted by: Plasma3150

Posted by: Isaac Clarke
Posted by: AngrydoG
Posted by: SraKe
Really this isn't a question of eneimes, this is a question of heros.
Master Chief is 8 Foot tall supersoldier. Well yea.
But on the other Hand, Issac Clarke is an Degree carrying engineer.
And the as we see in half life, the badass scientist always wins.


Clarke was also a merchant Marine. So he was a soldier.
I was never "technically" a soldier. I just worker in emergency repair around the shipping lines.
Quick Question: Hundreds of well trained soldiers died to them, yet you, a person who never killed something in your life, somehow survive not only an infected ship, but also an infected city. How can this be?
Necromorphs love the element of surprise. Once you know that they are there (or that they may be there), they lose this element of surprise. I think that if you survive your first encounter, Necros lose a lot of their ability to quickly kill you.

Also, I'm a BAMF.

  • 02.01.2011 1:26 PM PDT

I am a monument to all your sins

Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Rtas even said the spores were dangerous "One. Single. Flood spore. can destry. a species"

Then you have the spore cloud from Halo Wars infecting people.

So we know the spores are exceptionally dangerous and all game evidence points to them being possible infection sources.

Either way, it doesn't matter in this fight. Necros don't breath, do they?
Rtas may have been talking about infection forms (they are often mistakenly called spores), or maybe he was refering to the spore's ability to rapidly create growth pods. As for the spores in Halo Wars I believe that that was just another liberty Ensemble made for gameplay. For example, the Spartans wore mk. IV armor with shields, a feature lacking until the invention of the mk.V armor decades later. The flood are also incapable of infecting grunts and jackals due to the former being too small, and the later lacking sufficient bone calcium. to create a combat form and infection form must tap the hosts spine in order to control it. the spores might be able to grow biomass on a dead host, but to reanimate and control it it needs the spinal tap.

  • 02.01.2011 1:46 PM PDT


Posted by: Darthbill99
Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Rtas even said the spores were dangerous "One. Single. Flood spore. can destry. a species"

Then you have the spore cloud from Halo Wars infecting people.

So we know the spores are exceptionally dangerous and all game evidence points to them being possible infection sources.

Either way, it doesn't matter in this fight. Necros don't breath, do they?
Rtas may have been talking about infection forms (they are often mistakenly called spores), or maybe he was refering to the spore's ability to rapidly create growth pods. As for the spores in Halo Wars I believe that that was just another liberty Ensemble made for gameplay. For example, the Spartans wore mk. IV armor with shields, a feature lacking until the invention of the mk.V armor decades later. The flood are also incapable of infecting grunts and jackals due to the former being too small, and the later lacking sufficient bone calcium. to create a combat form and infection form must tap the hosts spine in order to control it. the spores might be able to grow biomass on a dead host, but to reanimate and control it it needs the spinal tap.
I do believe that the Spores are capable of reanimating corpses if given enough time. They kill their target by suffocation (Amassing in the lungs). Form there, slowly infect the various cells until the biomass connects to a nerve. From there, it has a straight shot to the Central Nervous System.

  • 02.01.2011 2:14 PM PDT

I am a monument to all your sins

Posted by: Plasma3150

Posted by: Darthbill99
Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Rtas even said the spores were dangerous "One. Single. Flood spore. can destry. a species"

Then you have the spore cloud from Halo Wars infecting people.

So we know the spores are exceptionally dangerous and all game evidence points to them being possible infection sources.

Either way, it doesn't matter in this fight. Necros don't breath, do they?
Rtas may have been talking about infection forms (they are often mistakenly called spores), or maybe he was refering to the spore's ability to rapidly create growth pods. As for the spores in Halo Wars I believe that that was just another liberty Ensemble made for gameplay. For example, the Spartans wore mk. IV armor with shields, a feature lacking until the invention of the mk.V armor decades later. The flood are also incapable of infecting grunts and jackals due to the former being too small, and the later lacking sufficient bone calcium. to create a combat form and infection form must tap the hosts spine in order to control it. the spores might be able to grow biomass on a dead host, but to reanimate and control it it needs the spinal tap.
I do believe that the Spores are capable of reanimating corpses if given enough time. They kill their target by suffocation (Amassing in the lungs). Form there, slowly infect the various cells until the biomass connects to a nerve. From there, it has a straight shot to the Central Nervous System.
I concur that if the spores can infect than this is how they would do it, but it would take it a releatively long time, and is unlikely to happen often as an infection form would probibly get to them first.

  • 02.01.2011 2:19 PM PDT


Posted by: Darthbill99
Posted by: Plasma3150

Posted by: Darthbill99
Posted by: ROBERTO jh

Rtas even said the spores were dangerous "One. Single. Flood spore. can destry. a species"

Then you have the spore cloud from Halo Wars infecting people.

So we know the spores are exceptionally dangerous and all game evidence points to them being possible infection sources.

Either way, it doesn't matter in this fight. Necros don't breath, do they?
Rtas may have been talking about infection forms (they are often mistakenly called spores), or maybe he was refering to the spore's ability to rapidly create growth pods. As for the spores in Halo Wars I believe that that was just another liberty Ensemble made for gameplay. For example, the Spartans wore mk. IV armor with shields, a feature lacking until the invention of the mk.V armor decades later. The flood are also incapable of infecting grunts and jackals due to the former being too small, and the later lacking sufficient bone calcium. to create a combat form and infection form must tap the hosts spine in order to control it. the spores might be able to grow biomass on a dead host, but to reanimate and control it it needs the spinal tap.
I do believe that the Spores are capable of reanimating corpses if given enough time. They kill their target by suffocation (Amassing in the lungs). Form there, slowly infect the various cells until the biomass connects to a nerve. From there, it has a straight shot to the Central Nervous System.
I concur that if the spores can infect than this is how they would do it, but it would take it a releatively long time, and is unlikely to happen often as an infection form would probibly get to them first.
Indeed. But it does guarantee infection of the races that the Infection Formes cannot infect, increasing both the intelligence of the Gravemind and the overall biomass.

[Edited on 02.01.2011 2:25 PM PST]

  • 02.01.2011 2:22 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Solving problems you could have solved by yourself since 1968.
[i]- Veteran Stormtrooper Clarke of the Ordo Malleus[/i]

Life is too short to get irritated because someone's preferences differ from yours.
~ACP Cataclysm

Posted by: ROBERTO jh
@Issac Clarke (lol)

"The Flood are much more adaptable."

I take it you've never heard of the Flood Super Cell. From the Encyclopedia: "Flood biomass is composed of an undifferentiated cell type that is referred to as the Flood Super Cell (FSC), which can be described as aproximating "thinking muscle." The FSC closely resembles neurons or glial cells in structure. The Flood can arrange these cells to mimic any organ they might need."

So if they need a Flood to, say, break tanks apart or at least take on heavy armor, the Flood Super Cell will create a specialized organ or even entire creature to counter the armor.

In fact, they did that with the Thrasher Form in Halo Wars. It was built for the specific purpose of crushing tanks, and being able to take multiple direct tank shells.

Necromorphs would infect the parasite of the flood, and take over it with a decentralized nervous system.

There's actually significant evidence suggesting that's impossible. The Halo 3 Besterium desribes the Flood and the Gravemind to be a singular "macro-organism." There are no individuals in the Flood, merely extensions of the Gravemind's "body."

The venus flytrap in Halo 2 you speak too is not so much the Gravemind itself as it is the organ it uses to speak verbally. (of course, it is later revealed he doesn't need a mouth since he's telepathic). Trying to infect the Flood with anything at all would result in one of the following.

1) The Form will simply die the same as a bullet would kill it. Difference is the Necros need to kill their prey first. Note that Flood can live through incredible pain if the infection is undamaged (read The Flood book. They're a lot like the Necros.) This suggests pure Flood would have to be ripped so apart they'd be useless to the Necros.

2) Infecting would have no effect at all on the Flood Super Cell, and it would simply reject it.

3) As the Flood is somewhere in between living and dead, and that Necros can only infect dead, AND as the Flood is not individulastic but rather a single super organism sharing the same cell structure and mind, it would likewise be impossible to infect the Flood. It would take the instantanious death of every Flood in the galaxy to be able to infect the Gravemind/Flood.

4) If the Necros DO infect the Flood, the FSC will inform the Gravemind instantly about how the Necros work. Mind will in turn exploit this to his advantage. It is stated in Halo: Cryptum that even dead Flood can still infect, so the celluar structure is still alive (another reason why Necros can't infect the Flood. They can't infect what is still alive).

By contrast, the Flood can very easily infect the Necros and defeat them.

1) They can infect both living AND dead flesh. So long as they have a nervous system (which Necros do), the Flood can infect them. And even if the Necros are so utterly FUBARed to tiny pieces, the FSC can still use the flesh to add to the Flood's overall biomass, thus churning out more Pure Forms, which in turn can serve any purpose the Gravemind wants it to and take any form.

2) The Gravemind itself does not have a corporeal body to target and kill that will destroy the entire species, unlike the Necromorphs. He is rather a distibuted telepathic "ghost", I suppose you could say, that dictates the Flood biomass. The Flood biomass and everything it has infected or taken over itself is its "body." But kill the Hivemind or destroy the Marker and you beat the Necros.

3) As well, the Gravemind is of a vast, nearly omnipotent intellect. He has the knowledge of at least an entire galaxy in time. The Necro Hivemind by contrast seems more animalistic. Now I haven't played Dead Space 1 yet, but I have seen the boss battle. It doesn't strike me as anything more then an animal. But I may be wrong.

4) The Flood do not require the infection of other races to reproduce. In fact, when the coordinate stage is reached, the infected forms are repurposed to either defend important Flood controlled areas, such as planets or hives. Or they are melted down for clacium to further the construction of more Pure Forms. Dead Pure Forms are likely re-melted to create even more Pure Forms.

Pure Forms themselves are given a frontlines offensive role. This makes sense as the Gravemind can create literally whatever he deems fit for a specific task. Whatever he needs he creates.

The Flood will essentially harvest the Necros for more and more parts. It isn't like humans fighting where when a human kills a Necro, the Necros lose one Necro.

It is rather, when the Flood kill a Necro, they lose one AND the Flood gain at least one more. When the Necros kill a Flood, the Flood reharvest the "dead" Flood and create another, stronger Pure Form.

Add on Flood>Necro reason #5) The Flood can use weapons, technology, can highjack computers, and learn, and the Flood are simply better then Necros.

Also consider the Flood would reach billions in a single swarm of Pure Forms.

Quite frankly, the design of the Flood is ingenious. They really are the perfect enemy.
Is the entirety of the combat form's body made of this "supercell"?

And how do you know that the supercell would reject the necrofection?

And we don't know that much about the Hivemind. Also note, that it's unknown whether or not that Necromorphs may go through several stages of infection, like the flood do.

Also, necromorphs do not need bodies to reproduce. They can undergo mitosis, as evidenced on the walls of the Ishimura.

  • 02.03.2011 7:45 PM PDT

Flood would overwhelm the Necromorphs by sheer numbers.

  • 02.04.2011 5:46 PM PDT


Posted by: Isaac Clarke
Posted by: ROBERTO jh
@Issac Clarke (lol)

"The Flood are much more adaptable."

I take it you've never heard of the Flood Super Cell. From the Encyclopedia: "Flood biomass is composed of an undifferentiated cell type that is referred to as the Flood Super Cell (FSC), which can be described as aproximating "thinking muscle." The FSC closely resembles neurons or glial cells in structure. The Flood can arrange these cells to mimic any organ they might need."

So if they need a Flood to, say, break tanks apart or at least take on heavy armor, the Flood Super Cell will create a specialized organ or even entire creature to counter the armor.

In fact, they did that with the Thrasher Form in Halo Wars. It was built for the specific purpose of crushing tanks, and being able to take multiple direct tank shells.

Necromorphs would infect the parasite of the flood, and take over it with a decentralized nervous system.

There's actually significant evidence suggesting that's impossible. The Halo 3 Besterium desribes the Flood and the Gravemind to be a singular "macro-organism." There are no individuals in the Flood, merely extensions of the Gravemind's "body."

The venus flytrap in Halo 2 you speak too is not so much the Gravemind itself as it is the organ it uses to speak verbally. (of course, it is later revealed he doesn't need a mouth since he's telepathic). Trying to infect the Flood with anything at all would result in one of the following.

1) The Form will simply die the same as a bullet would kill it. Difference is the Necros need to kill their prey first. Note that Flood can live through incredible pain if the infection is undamaged (read The Flood book. They're a lot like the Necros.) This suggests pure Flood would have to be ripped so apart they'd be useless to the Necros.

2) Infecting would have no effect at all on the Flood Super Cell, and it would simply reject it.

3) As the Flood is somewhere in between living and dead, and that Necros can only infect dead, AND as the Flood is not individulastic but rather a single super organism sharing the same cell structure and mind, it would likewise be impossible to infect the Flood. It would take the instantanious death of every Flood in the galaxy to be able to infect the Gravemind/Flood.

4) If the Necros DO infect the Flood, the FSC will inform the Gravemind instantly about how the Necros work. Mind will in turn exploit this to his advantage. It is stated in Halo: Cryptum that even dead Flood can still infect, so the celluar structure is still alive (another reason why Necros can't infect the Flood. They can't infect what is still alive).

By contrast, the Flood can very easily infect the Necros and defeat them.

1) They can infect both living AND dead flesh. So long as they have a nervous system (which Necros do), the Flood can infect them. And even if the Necros are so utterly FUBARed to tiny pieces, the FSC can still use the flesh to add to the Flood's overall biomass, thus churning out more Pure Forms, which in turn can serve any purpose the Gravemind wants it to and take any form.

2) The Gravemind itself does not have a corporeal body to target and kill that will destroy the entire species, unlike the Necromorphs. He is rather a distibuted telepathic "ghost", I suppose you could say, that dictates the Flood biomass. The Flood biomass and everything it has infected or taken over itself is its "body." But kill the Hivemind or destroy the Marker and you beat the Necros.

3) As well, the Gravemind is of a vast, nearly omnipotent intellect. He has the knowledge of at least an entire galaxy in time. The Necro Hivemind by contrast seems more animalistic. Now I haven't played Dead Space 1 yet, but I have seen the boss battle. It doesn't strike me as anything more then an animal. But I may be wrong.

4) The Flood do not require the infection of other races to reproduce. In fact, when the coordinate stage is reached, the infected forms are repurposed to either defend important Flood controlled areas, such as planets or hives. Or they are melted down for clacium to further the construction of more Pure Forms. Dead Pure Forms are likely re-melted to create even more Pure Forms.

Pure Forms themselves are given a frontlines offensive role. This makes sense as the Gravemind can create literally whatever he deems fit for a specific task. Whatever he needs he creates.

The Flood will essentially harvest the Necros for more and more parts. It isn't like humans fighting where when a human kills a Necro, the Necros lose one Necro.

It is rather, when the Flood kill a Necro, they lose one AND the Flood gain at least one more. When the Necros kill a Flood, the Flood reharvest the "dead" Flood and create another, stronger Pure Form.

Add on Flood>Necro reason #5) The Flood can use weapons, technology, can highjack computers, and learn, and the Flood are simply better then Necros.

Also consider the Flood would reach billions in a single swarm of Pure Forms.

Quite frankly, the design of the Flood is ingenious. They really are the perfect enemy.


Is the entirety of the combat form's body made of this "supercell"?

A: Yes. The fleshy, rotted growths on the walls of hives and the skin of infected are the FSC. AKA, the Gravemind.

And how do you know that the supercell would reject the necrofection?

A: For one, it is said in the Bestarium the Flood are immune to disease. Second, the FSC is designed to adapt nearly instantly to anything that poses a threat to it. Third, it is a single macroorganism connected by thought. For those of you who know what it is, think the Andromeda Strain. The Flood's a lot like that.

And we don't know that much about the Hivemind. Also note, that it's unknown whether or not that Necromorphs may go through several stages of infection, like the flood do.

A: Precisely: its unknown. We can't use assumptions in debates.

Also, necromorphs do not need bodies to reproduce. They can undergo mitosis, as evidenced on the walls of the Ishimura.

A: I now know that after seeing the DS2 walkthrough. But can they create pure Necro forms outside of the infector?

  • 02.04.2011 7:32 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

I just play for fun. MLG can kiss my ass.

What everyone seems to be forgetting is that the Flood have numbers, strength, and near omniscience on their side. They have troops that actually increase in number during a battle. They also can just take over a dead Necro victim before the Necro virus can start its work. So, all in all, the Flood win.

  • 02.04.2011 10:16 PM PDT

Posted by: Caaaarrrl
What everyone seems to be forgetting is that the Flood have numbers, strength, and near omniscience on their side. They have troops that actually increase in number during a battle. They also can just take over a dead Necro victim before the Necro virus can start its work. So, all in all, the Flood win.


Both affect the host in sheer seconds, it takes the flood about 10 seconds to infect a host, so does the Necromorphs.

  • 02.08.2011 11:27 PM PDT

I always viewed Necromorphs as what the flood would be if they could have more types/appearances.

Different style of combat forms, specialized forms, etc.

Though necromorphs vs the flood?

Flood infect living and dead.

Necromorphs infect the dead.

Result? They infect each other and create something WTF scary.

  • 02.08.2011 11:50 PM PDT

Success is just going from failure to failure without a loss of enthusiasm.

I still think the flood would win, but can the Flood survive in a vacuum?

  • 02.09.2011 9:33 AM PDT

No new games, catching up with the world, and filling it with the name of SpazDragon, the dragon with a spas-12.

I feel a crossover coming up!!!

  • 02.09.2011 10:43 AM PDT

  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • of 4