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Subject: *slight spoilers* The prisoner.

Yeah, we still believe in all the things that we stood by before.
I know, to everything we've seen here, maybe even more.
I know we're not the only ones and we were not the first.
And unapologetically we stand behind each word.

Well I finished Cryptum a little while ago and one thing has been stuck in my head about the prisoner. Not the fact that he may be the Gravemind or anything like that. But if I recall correctly when humanity was battling the Flood they asked him about the Flood. His answer was apparently so horrible that it cause many of the interviewers to kill themselves and he was shut off for years until he got out. My only question is what could he have said when questioned about the Flood? What was so horrible that it causes insanity and suicide? Just something for you guys to discuss.

  • 01.26.2011 5:28 PM PDT
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Gamertag: J7XD
New BNET: J7XD

Maybe he predicted the future? Gave them visions?

Btw- At the end, the prisoner states he is the Last Precursor.

EDIT: I think he told the humans the "cure" for the Flood. There is none. There no way of stopping them.

*suicide*

EDIT 2: inb4 Johnson (first strike) reference.

[Edited on 01.26.2011 5:39 PM PST]

  • 01.26.2011 5:36 PM PDT

We worked out the answer a couple of hours ago.

The prisoner didn't say anything to the humans, or to Didact. The prisoner is dead (obviously. how could he still be alive?); he's just a preserved specimen. The humans used his DNA to create a flood-killing virus though.

When the humans were defeated by the -blam!-Runners, they wanted to keep the Flood cure a secret. So they made up some silly stories to tell the Forerunners, and even planted a fake communication device inside the prison, so that the Forerunner would think they were talking to the Prisoner.

There's nothing he could say to make people commit suicide. It was all just FUD/propaganda

  • 01.26.2011 6:43 PM PDT

And So Forerunner And Flood Became One.

Your thinking too hard, I mean your theory makes sense. But they wouldn't introduce this mysterious missing character in the book to just have it be dead and a big human trick. The captive is alive.

  • 01.26.2011 6:55 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: Traxus 04
The prisoner is dead (obviously. how could he still be alive?); he's just a preserved specimen.

How is it obvious?

Posted by: Traxus 04
The humans used his DNA to create a flood-killing virus though.

They did?

  • 01.26.2011 7:12 PM PDT

Well it's obvious he's dead cause how could life survive inside an impenetrable cage for tens of thousands of centuries. Food. Energy. Decay. Etc.

The humans manufactured a viral weapon against the flood... We don't know how... The Forerunners can't figure it out... But we're guessing that the Precursor is part of the answer to that particular puzzle. If the answer was simply 'their scientists just invented a cure' that would be a bit boring and lame, so the secret to the cure must lie in some plot element already hinted at

The Prisoner is quite a mysterious character, true, but I think it'd be a really good twist if we found out the Prisoner was really just the cure to the Flood, but mendicant bias hid it from the Forerunners and defected

PLUS the fact that it'd mean humans were screwing with the Forerunners' heads, long after they'd lost the war

  • 01.26.2011 8:07 PM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: Traxus 04
Well it's obvious he's dead cause how could life survive inside an impenetrable cage for tens of thousands of centuries. Food. Energy. Decay. Etc.

The possibility of suspending a life-form for eons is not past the capabilities of the Precursors I would imagine. The Forerunners use vacuum energy as a power source, which is by all intents and purposes thought to be unlimited (Under some arguments). I doubt that energy would be a concern for anything Precursor related. Humanity also possessed temporal technology - Time Locks. That stasis chamber could be under a time dilation field, in which case 1 second in there could be a very long time on the outside world. It is not entirely out of the question to have the Prisoner stored in there for eons.

Posted by: Traxus 04
The humans manufactured a viral weapon against the flood... We don't know how... The Forerunners can't figure it out... But we're guessing that the Precursor is part of the answer to that particular puzzle.

Not so much manufacture as genetically program themselves. They turned themselves into the cure, and sacrificed themselves. They also had the advantage of studying the Flood from the beginning, watching as it evolved and had a reference point (The initial dust) to work with. The Flood that the Forerunner encountered was already mutated far beyond what Humanity originally encountered. It also might not have occurred to the Forerunner, given their belief in the Mantle, that the cure could have been something so horrible but necessary as sacrificing one third of your species population. They may have dismissed it outright due to how it went against the Mantle. They never had the original dust to work with either, another factor.

Posted by: Traxus 04
If the answer was simply 'their scientists just invented a cure' that would be a bit boring and lame, so the secret to the cure must lie in some plot element already hinted at.

Perhaps, but it shows that even in those days Humanity was ingenious and cunning and reacted well under pressure, similar to how they behaved in the Human-Covenant war. It shows that that could be one of Humanitys defining traits. It links Humanity in those times to the one in 2552, so that it is just not another alien race that you won't care about: They were us. It also shows that Humanity is returning to the way it once was and has not truly lost anything of what it used to be.

  • 01.26.2011 8:54 PM PDT

The Forerunner, the Great Journey, and Heaven Theory

[Announcement Trailer] Halo: Forerunner

Posted by: Agustus
I lol'd at the absurd miscommunication that occurs whenever dibbs post something. Perhaps his brain is so highly evolved that he can no longer clearly communicate with lesser life forms, even among his own species.

Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: Traxus 04
The prisoner is dead (obviously. how could he still be alive?); he's just a preserved specimen.

How is it obvious?

Posted by: Traxus 04
The humans used his DNA to create a flood-killing virus though.

They did?
Traxus has been posting his own conclusions as "facts" for a while now. Apparently instead of supplying sources for information, simply prefacing your conjectures with "isn't is obvious" or "if you read closely" is enough to effectively conclude a conjecture to be fact.

It's fine if you post these things as opinions, but to say "Oh we've already conclusively decided this was the case" is beyond arrogant and silly. All you will do is further propagate falsities to other members who will then have to be corrected.

Edit:Posted by: Traxus 04
Well it's obvious...
Shocking...

[Edited on 01.26.2011 11:43 PM PST]

  • 01.26.2011 11:40 PM PDT

More of your crap....?

Traxus: The prisoner didn't say anything to the humans, or to Didact. The prisoner is dead (obviously. how could he still be alive?); he's just a preserved specimen. The humans used his DNA to create a flood-killing virus though.

Too bad he's quite clearly alive. Stasis exists. Humans have cryo pods, ancient humans have a device called a time bolt which is supposedly nearly as good as the Forerunner stasis pods. Mentioned in Cryptum, and shown in Ghosts of Onyx, and all capable of indefinate prolongation of life.

The Prisoner clearly becomes the Gravemind, according to the Terminals in Halo 3 and in Cryptum. Mendicant spent time with the Gravemind, and turned on the Forerunner [h3]. Didact says the Prisoner escaped onto the Halo, and left with Mendicant for 43 years [cryptum]. The Terminals state Mendicants stay with the Gravemind was 43 years [h3]

And I have done so {~}
[379,807 hours]. If they wished they
could have made a decision based on
that data alone.

But as you are the next stage in the
evolution of the universe, who am I
- or my creators - to obstruct your
progress?
[Terminal 4, Mendicant Bias to the Gravemind]

---

"How recently?"
"Judging by the diffusion of its magnetic shadow, four or five decades ago."

"How could It travel?" he asked. "Who would come here...." Then his face reflected a darkly obvious theory. "Those who conducted the test."

"Mendicant Bias" I heard myself say.

It seemed that after 43 years, the prodigal Halo had returned.
[Cryptum, Didact discussing the Prisoner and his ally]


Moving on.

Traxus: When the humans were defeated by the -blam!-Runners, they wanted to keep the Flood cure a secret.

Too bad the ****ing novel explicitly states that humanity and the prophets both told the Forerunner all about the Flood. The Forerunner didn't believe them. They state this. Are you mentally ill? Honestly. The books and lore clearly state things, and you create your imbecilic fanfiction that clearly flies right in the face of that, and you try to pass it as fact.

Honestly, you're pretty pathetic. And wrong.

Page 272, Cryptum

Many Forerunner, in fact, regarded the entire story of the Flood - for that was the name humans gave to the spreading infestation, this intergalactic disease - as fabrication designed to absolve humans of blame.


So you clearly have no -blam!- idea what you are talking about.

  • 01.27.2011 1:52 AM PDT

Yes, really

I think he may have told them the cure, seeing how the Human's managed to push the flood out of the galaxy, even when fighting two wars, but the forerunners,with their superior military power, got owned by them in under 1,000 years.

Although, I don't see how the flamethrower could be all that horrible...

  • 01.27.2011 5:05 AM PDT

Seriously Oak, Ive been doing this -blam!- for 16 years, gimmie my Friggen starter Pokemon and dont call me till im the champion! ¬_¬

i imagine he simply told him what the forerunners knew

The only way to kill the flood is to kills its food

To tell your friends and families the only way to escape from damnation is mass suicide would probobly put a noose round my neck too

Anyway, you have to remember the books the first in a trilogy, and ill bet my right kidney the next is from a human POV :P

  • 01.27.2011 5:25 AM PDT


Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: Traxus 04
Well it's obvious he's dead cause how could life survive inside an impenetrable cage for tens of thousands of centuries. Food. Energy. Decay. Etc.

The possibility of suspending a life-form for eons is not past the capabilities of the Precursors I would imagine. The Forerunners use vacuum energy as a power source, which is by all intents and purposes thought to be unlimited (Under some arguments). I doubt that energy would be a concern for anything Precursor related. Humanity also possessed temporal technology - Time Locks. That stasis chamber could be under a time dilation field, in which case 1 second in there could be a very long time on the outside world. It is not entirely out of the question to have the Prisoner stored in there for eons.

Posted by: Traxus 04
The humans manufactured a viral weapon against the flood... We don't know how... The Forerunners can't figure it out... But we're guessing that the Precursor is part of the answer to that particular puzzle.

Not so much manufacture as genetically program themselves. They turned themselves into the cure, and sacrificed themselves. They also had the advantage of studying the Flood from the beginning, watching as it evolved and had a reference point (The initial dust) to work with. The Flood that the Forerunner encountered was already mutated far beyond what Humanity originally encountered. It also might not have occurred to the Forerunner, given their belief in the Mantle, that the cure could have been something so horrible but necessary as sacrificing one third of your species population. They may have dismissed it outright due to how it went against the Mantle. They never had the original dust to work with either, another factor.

Posted by: Traxus 04
If the answer was simply 'their scientists just invented a cure' that would be a bit boring and lame, so the secret to the cure must lie in some plot element already hinted at.

Perhaps, but it shows that even in those days Humanity was ingenious and cunning and reacted well under pressure, similar to how they behaved in the Human-Covenant war. It shows that that could be one of Humanitys defining traits. It links Humanity in those times to the one in 2552, so that it is just not another alien race that you won't care about: They were us. It also shows that Humanity is returning to the way it once was and has not truly lost anything of what it used to be.



Are you a wizard?

  • 01.27.2011 5:42 AM PDT

And So Forerunner And Flood Became One.

The captive is alive.

End of discussion.

  • 01.27.2011 7:25 AM PDT

-blam!- Was that actually blammed out? Or did I just type it? You'll never know.

Didn't like it. I'm sorry. Did not like the book at all.

Anyway, probably just told them his story and how meaningless their lives and struggles were in the vastness and grandeur of the conflicts and other things to put them in an existential quandary of suicidal thoughts.

  • 01.27.2011 7:36 AM PDT

Repeat after me; only fools believe they won't get fooled again!

Maybe the prisoner is the gravemind, or something similar. Maybe the precursors are the flood?
It is theorized that humans and forerunners, and possibly other similar beings were created by the precursors. If these are all true, then he could have told the humans their only reason for existence, to be food for the flood. Those interviewers didn't like the idea, and went nuts.

  • 01.27.2011 8:40 AM PDT

The thing about the human cure to the Flood is that they managed to hide it completely from the Forerunners. Even though the Forerunners could extract human memories and search them for information. This makes me think that the cure must have been something very mysterious and unconventional, whatever it was. Think outside the box

Also, even if the Prisoner was still alive all that time, surely the test-firing Halo would have killed him. I suppose MB could have fine tuned the Halo to melt away his prison (built with Precursor 'neural physics' building material) and then cut it out just before the captive inside was reached by the pulse. Hmmm.

Could end up in nasty case of 'you were just supposed to blow the bloody doors off!' though

Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: Traxus 04
Well it's obvious he's dead cause how could life survive inside an impenetrable cage for tens of thousands of centuries. Food. Energy. Decay. Etc.

The possibility of suspending a life-form for eons is not past the capabilities of the Precursors I would imagine. The Forerunners use vacuum energy as a power source, which is by all intents and purposes thought to be unlimited (Under some arguments). I doubt that energy would be a concern for anything Precursor related. Humanity also possessed temporal technology - Time Locks. That stasis chamber could be under a time dilation field, in which case 1 second in there could be a very long time on the outside world. It is not entirely out of the question to have the Prisoner stored in there for eons.

Posted by: Traxus 04
The humans manufactured a viral weapon against the flood... We don't know how... The Forerunners can't figure it out... But we're guessing that the Precursor is part of the answer to that particular puzzle.

Not so much manufacture as genetically program themselves. They turned themselves into the cure, and sacrificed themselves. They also had the advantage of studying the Flood from the beginning, watching as it evolved and had a reference point (The initial dust) to work with. The Flood that the Forerunner encountered was already mutated far beyond what Humanity originally encountered. It also might not have occurred to the Forerunner, given their belief in the Mantle, that the cure could have been something so horrible but necessary as sacrificing one third of your species population. They may have dismissed it outright due to how it went against the Mantle. They never had the original dust to work with either, another factor.

Posted by: Traxus 04
If the answer was simply 'their scientists just invented a cure' that would be a bit boring and lame, so the secret to the cure must lie in some plot element already hinted at.

Perhaps, but it shows that even in those days Humanity was ingenious and cunning and reacted well under pressure, similar to how they behaved in the Human-Covenant war. It shows that that could be one of Humanitys defining traits. It links Humanity in those times to the one in 2552, so that it is just not another alien race that you won't care about: They were us. It also shows that Humanity is returning to the way it once was and has not truly lost anything of what it used to be.

  • 01.27.2011 8:47 AM PDT
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"Time was your ally human. But now it has abandoned you. The Forerunners....have returned. And this tomb... is now yours". - The Didact


Posted by: Traxus 04
The thing about the human cure to the Flood is that they managed to hide it completely from the Forerunners. Even though the Forerunners could extract human memories and search them for information. This makes me think that the cure must have been something very mysterious and unconventional, whatever it was. Think outside the box

Also, even if the Prisoner was still alive all that time, surely the test-firing Halo would have killed him. I suppose MB could have fine tuned the Halo to melt away his prison (built with Precursor 'neural physics' building material) and then cut it out just before the captive inside was reached by the pulse. Hmmm.

Could end up in nasty case of 'you were just supposed to blow the bloody doors off!' though

Posted by: anton1792
Posted by: Traxus 04
Well it's obvious he's dead cause how could life survive inside an impenetrable cage for tens of thousands of centuries. Food. Energy. Decay. Etc.

The possibility of suspending a life-form for eons is not past the capabilities of the Precursors I would imagine. The Forerunners use vacuum energy as a power source, which is by all intents and purposes thought to be unlimited (Under some arguments). I doubt that energy would be a concern for anything Precursor related. Humanity also possessed temporal technology - Time Locks. That stasis chamber could be under a time dilation field, in which case 1 second in there could be a very long time on the outside world. It is not entirely out of the question to have the Prisoner stored in there for eons.

Posted by: Traxus 04
The humans manufactured a viral weapon against the flood... We don't know how... The Forerunners can't figure it out... But we're guessing that the Precursor is part of the answer to that particular puzzle.

Not so much manufacture as genetically program themselves. They turned themselves into the cure, and sacrificed themselves. They also had the advantage of studying the Flood from the beginning, watching as it evolved and had a reference point (The initial dust) to work with. The Flood that the Forerunner encountered was already mutated far beyond what Humanity originally encountered. It also might not have occurred to the Forerunner, given their belief in the Mantle, that the cure could have been something so horrible but necessary as sacrificing one third of your species population. They may have dismissed it outright due to how it went against the Mantle. They never had the original dust to work with either, another factor.

Posted by: Traxus 04
If the answer was simply 'their scientists just invented a cure' that would be a bit boring and lame, so the secret to the cure must lie in some plot element already hinted at.

Perhaps, but it shows that even in those days Humanity was ingenious and cunning and reacted well under pressure, similar to how they behaved in the Human-Covenant war. It shows that that could be one of Humanitys defining traits. It links Humanity in those times to the one in 2552, so that it is just not another alien race that you won't care about: They were us. It also shows that Humanity is returning to the way it once was and has not truly lost anything of what it used to be.


True could be

  • 01.27.2011 9:44 AM PDT

"Find where the liar hides, so that I may place my boot between his gums!" - Rtas 'Vadum

Posted by: Traxus 04
The thing about the human cure to the Flood is that they managed to hide it completely from the Forerunners. Even though the Forerunners could extract human memories and search them for information. This makes me think that the cure must have been something very mysterious and unconventional, whatever it was. Think outside the box.

Did the Master Builder know that a cure was the method that Humanity used to push out the Flood, or at that time did he just suspect that it was done through conventional warfare? They may not have found out about the cure until after they had destroyed Humanity, at which point it would have been lost.

The Humans that took their own lives could have been the ones with the knowledge of the cure. They could have killed themselves to prevent the Forerunner from getting it and, assuming that the captive is the source, made up that story to aberrate the Forerunners search for the cure. However, that is all speculation. There really is not anything to suggest that the Captive is the cure, and that the reason for the Humans taking their lives being down to wanting to prevent the Forerunners from getting it rather than being tormented by a horrific revelation about the Flood. It seems to be circular logic as well: The reason for the Humans killing themselves is because the Captive is the Cure. The Captive is the Cure because those Humans killed themselves.

Why would one bother making up a story in the first place anyway? If the scientists killed themselves and all knowledge of the cure erased then there would be no reason for the Forerunner to suspect the Captive as being the source. Better to ignore it completely rather than draw unnecessary attention to it. Now the Forerunner know that Humanity did in fact ask it something about the Flood and it did, for the first time, give an intelligible response. Wouldn't they also have removed the device that they used to communicate with the captive so as to ensure that the Forerunner could not communicate with it at all?

  • 01.27.2011 10:06 AM PDT

What i'm suggesting is this:

The Precursors were so powerful that the Flood were not a serious problem to them. They simply looked around until they found creatures with a natural resiliency to the Flood infection - and they found the sea scorpion thing, which had Flood killing antibodies.

When they left our galaxy, for whatever reason, they left a specimen in stasis, which contained the antibodies, should anyone need them in future fights with The Flood.

When the ancient humans got into war with the Flood, they studied the specimen (the Captive) and obtained the necessary antibodies. The antibodies were injected into millions of humans, who were then sent to counter-infect the Flood and kill it off. The humans died too, of course, along with the anti-bodies. Thus no trace was left of the Flood cells (destroyed) or the anti-bodies (died out after their hosts died).

The one thing that did remain, of course, was the captive/specimen. But the humans were in no mood to let the Forerunners find it, under the circumstances. Except they couldn't destroy it either - Precursor tech is indestructible.

Soooo they were left with one option: deception. They built a fake 'communications device' which seemingly allowed conversation with the Captive, but actually only 'received' things that the humans had programmed it to say. They programmed it to say this dude was the last Precursor, that Forerunners had betrayed the Precursors long ago, and that The Flood was their revenge.

This would have two results
a) Forerunner religion would be undermined, possibly causing civil war (like what happened with the Covenant)
b) Forerunners would be afraid of the Captive and refrain from studying it or trying to release/retrieve it

Now for THIS to be kept a secret by the humans would be a much simpler exercise: the scientist or small research team would have gotten the 'cure' fit-for-purpose directly from the Captive/specimen, and then they would have set about infecting/vaccinating many people. Only one person (or a few) need know where the cure came from (compared with a massive research effort to independently engineer a cure), and the vaccination equipment could be destroyed after use, and the anti-bodies die out in their hosts eventually. No way for the Forerunners to work out what was going on, even if they could capture humans and read their memories.

Remember that the Didact says although he spoke to the Captive, it wasn't a 'real conversation'... like it was scripted. Oh a nd it does say in Cryptum that humanity were 'understandably reluctant to reveal the secret' of how they defeated the Flood, and that they 'distributed it amongst themselves' and the secret was 'impenetrable to our techniques.' So the Forerunners did look, they just mysteriously couldn't find it anywhere. The explanation must be able to explain this clandestine secrecy, even the face of literally 'mind-reading' equipment.

However there is no DIRECT suggestion that the cure and Captive are related. The only real good hint was that Didact can't understand how the human communication device is pushing through Precursor technology. But it just fits very well. You got to admit though, mind****ing the Forerunners with a fake message from the Precursors is a brilliant 'up yours' on humanity's part, if it's true. FUD at its best.

  • 01.27.2011 11:14 AM PDT

Traxis: This is my fanfiction, far different from the facts that the book Halo Cryptum clearly explains already.

I do so enjoy tracking down your posts, and proving you wrong relentlessly. Not that you make it difficult.

This makes me think that the cure must have been something very mysterious and unconventional, whatever it was

The book explains exactly what the cure was. The humans designed a genetic pathogen to feed the Flood, that once assimilated, killed the Flood and presumably other Flood around it.

Using this pathogen, they sacrificed a full third of their territory to the Flood with now genetically altered humans. The Flood choked to death on them, and what survived was chased out of the galaxy by human warships.

Soooo they were left with one option: deception. They built a fake 'communications device' which seemingly allowed conversation with the Captive, but actually only 'received' things that the humans had programmed it to say. They programmed it to say this dude was the last Precursor, that Forerunners had betrayed the Precursors long ago, and that The Flood was their revenge.


You mean a total fabrication that is implied nowhere in the novel, and is based on absolutely nothing beyond your goofy casual fanfiction? Gotcha.

He's a Precursor. Humanity, very very clearly, was explained to have told the Forerunner everything the survivors knew about them. And the Forerunner didn't believe a word of it.

gg.

  • 01.27.2011 12:32 PM PDT


Posted by: Traxus 04
We worked out the answer a couple of hours ago.

The prisoner didn't say anything to the humans, or to Didact. The prisoner is dead (obviously. how could he still be alive?); he's just a preserved specimen. The humans used his DNA to create a flood-killing virus though.

When the humans were defeated by the -blam!-Runners, they wanted to keep the Flood cure a secret. So they made up some silly stories to tell the Forerunners, and even planted a fake communication device inside the prison, so that the Forerunner would think they were talking to the Prisoner.

There's nothing he could say to make people commit suicide. It was all just FUD/propaganda


the flood on the halo ring in halo books survived for millions of years in a preserved state. kinda like hibernating and if he was in a capsole that preserved him that is logical i like your theory however, with the addition that since my opinion is that the humans outdated the forerunners that they created this precursor and enslaved him and used him as a tool to defeat the flood perhaps control all the flood to do the humans bidding. this is common human mentality and when they realized what they had created and how evil it was they just scratched the plan and buried it as a last resort tool and used the dna from it as an alternative but with lot higher casulties

  • 01.27.2011 1:08 PM PDT

Yeah, we still believe in all the things that we stood by before.
I know, to everything we've seen here, maybe even more.
I know we're not the only ones and we were not the first.
And unapologetically we stand behind each word.

Most of this makes sense.

  • 01.27.2011 2:53 PM PDT


Posted by: Mingo245
Most of this makes sense.


What does? If you've read Cryptum, the book destroys Traxtool's theory.

Because the Humans did tell the Forerunner about the Flood, everything they knew. Because the Prisoner is alive, and is a Precursor. It implies nowhere that he is anything else, nor that it is some elaborate human trick. It clearly states the methods used by the humans to destroy the Flood.

What, pray tell, makes sense when his theory counts on all of the above, clearly stated in the novel, not being true?

  • 01.27.2011 4:43 PM PDT

Yeah, we still believe in all the things that we stood by before.
I know, to everything we've seen here, maybe even more.
I know we're not the only ones and we were not the first.
And unapologetically we stand behind each word.

Posted by: forthnback

Posted by: Mingo245
Most of this makes sense.


What does? If you've read Cryptum, the book destroys Traxtool's theory.

Because the Humans did tell the Forerunner about the Flood, everything they knew. Because the Prisoner is alive, and is a Precursor. It implies nowhere that he is anything else, nor that it is some elaborate human trick. It clearly states the methods used by the humans to destroy the Flood.

What, pray tell, makes sense when his theory counts on all of the above, clearly stated in the novel, not being true?
I didn't mean the theory. That makes no damn sense at all. I meant your debunking of the theory and what some of the others said. That makes sense.

  • 01.27.2011 6:48 PM PDT

Oh, so you're another person who didn't read the second page of chapter 22 of Cryptum.

  • 01.27.2011 6:55 PM PDT

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