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Subject: How did Kat manage to be chosen for Noble team ?
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Posted by: Lt Leitner

Posted by: manwith
Posted by: Lt Leitner

Posted by: manwith
I'm not sure why people would give a crap about genetics in the first place because it has little to no effect on combat effectiveness.

It should be obvious once the technology and medical care gets further the candidates gets wider, because it's not as strict anymore.


Uh, yeah it does. Take Usain Bolt. There are sure as hell people who train harder then him, but he's the fastest man in the world because of his genes. This can be applied in a broader sense to any characteristic.

Yes training is essential, but a team of soldiers with world class training, against a same sized team of the forty best candidates in the world, with the same training will lose.


Except we don't know exactly if Spartan-III's have worse, the same, or better genes compared to Spartan-II's because S-III candidates weren't around by the time the Spartan-II program started.

Kurt even says in one of his letter to Mendez that Halsey would have chosen Noble Team if she had had the chance.

We know Kelly is the fastest human ever in the Halo universe, but that doesn't make her any better than other Spartans. In fact, there are most most casualties in a Spartan team Kelly was part of.


We can reasonably assume that they are in some elements inferior. The most obvious would be psycological profile (compare Emile to Jorge), and size. Yes Jorge is exceptional, but the average SII is bigger then the average SIII.

It's simple statistics. The SII has almost every single human alive as a possible candidate. The SIII had those orphaned by the covenant. A muc smaller population, with the obvious damage of being orphanes.

Now I suppose you could argue that the SII were chosen simply by how close they matched the medical profile to survive the procedure, but their success prior to that indicates the reverse. They were chosen for being exceptional individuals first, and with much looser guidelines on surviving the upgrades.

Which means yes the SIII might be able to take more candidates who would be ideal except from being medically unsuitable, but I don't think this makes up for the otherwise drastically reduced candidate group.


Not even true actually. Carter, Emile and Jun are just as tall, (Jun even taller) than the members of Spartan-II Blue Team.
All Spartan-IIIs who can past 25 year of age will reach the average Spartan-II height limit.

Jorge is obviously an exception, because he's the tallest known Spartan after Sam.

  • 02.26.2011 9:14 AM PDT


Posted by: privet caboose
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
as Noble Team had the Spartan II genetics...


Pure speculation.


Letter between Kurt and Mendez, states Halsey would have picked the members of Noble Team if they had been around when she was selecting candidates.

Doesn't directly say Noble Team, but he says they get people she would have picked. He then says they are placed in the field armed like Spartans, and getting local help without asking for it.

Sounds like Noble Team.

[Edited on 02.26.2011 10:11 AM PST]

  • 02.26.2011 10:10 AM PDT

Weapon of Oppression


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: RotaryCookie
I think what we have to remember about Noble team are, while they have the same genetic profile as Spartan IIs, and use a (less powerful maybe?) variant of Mjolnir, they do not have the training that a Spartan II has, both in war and Mjolnir usage. They were never meant to survive, more to be a giant pain in the Covenants arse.

That is why they, some more than others, don't seem to be as good as Chief or the IIs.


I like to believe Jorge is a ressurected or repaired washout II. This is why he was assigned to Noble. He would never be able to fight as a II, but he was too able to be left to rot at ONI. So they turned him into an invunerable walking turret to give Noble mobile fire support wherever they go.



Noble Team used the exact same armor as Master Chief used, Mark V. Different appearance, same armor.

Spartan III training is actually labeled as better then Spartan II training <_<. I'm also not seeing why a 'ressed or treated' washout Spartan II wouldn't be able to perform as well as the others.

(To those saying Spartan threes had a slightly wider range of genetic profiles, that is true, however Noble Team members had the Spartan II genetic profile.)

Though, if the OP is basing ability of AI scripting, lol. AI behavior does not = character traits.


Not even, I'm not basing it on AI scripting, I'm basing it on Kat's supposed situational awareness problem, and the fact that Jorge doesn't seem to act like any other Spartan ll, which seemed a bit disappointing, you'd think Jorge would be the leader of Noble team.

  • 02.26.2011 11:13 AM PDT

she was one of the origional members of noble team and she would have been chosen when she was a child

  • 02.26.2011 1:30 PM PDT


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: privet caboose
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
as Noble Team had the Spartan II genetics...


Pure speculation.


Letter between Kurt and Mendez, states Halsey would have picked the members of Noble Team if they had been around when she was selecting candidates.

Doesn't directly say Noble Team, but he says they get people she would have picked. He then says they are placed in the field armed like Spartans, and getting local help without asking for it.

Sounds like Noble Team.


Pretty much this ^

Noble Team are among those who would have made it into the Spartan II program, or at least been candidates for it, if the Spartan II project had been later or if they had been around earlier. This is why they have been given Mjolner armor and were never sent on their suicide ops.

  • 04.22.2011 9:39 PM PDT
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  • 04.22.2011 9:53 PM PDT

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Posted by: RotaryCookie

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Noble Team used the exact same armor as Master Chief used, Mark V. Different appearance, same armor.


Mark V(B) is what Noble uses. I refuse to believe it's the same. It is clearly Mk IV with shields. :S See Cole Protocol cover art.


Mark V[B] is just a helmet, there's no other component of said armor so far, so no. Just because theirs is customizable means nothing to the actual variant it is.

and guess what, Mark V is technically Mark IV with shields. The armor in Reach is just a graphically upgraded version of the Mark V on CE.

Take this picture as an example, it's concept art from the production of Halo 3 regarding the Mark V armor

  • 04.22.2011 11:13 PM PDT

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Posted by: ExcellentSix
Same goes for Jorge, a veteran sparant II, who seems to always be corrected by Carter.
I honestly think the fans' love for Jorge is a subconscious yearning for the Master Chief, which is projected onto Jorge due to him being the only other SPARTAN-II seen in a Halo game.

That being said, for being a career soldier, Jorge comes off as pretty damn naive at times. If I were Carter, this is how I would have handled this little outburst:Jorge: MAC rounds? IN ATMOSPHERE!?

Carter: Mother -blam!-, you've been fighting against these mother -blam!- aliens for going on 27 years now. Nine damn years ago, Admiral Cole made a -blam!- gas giant go supernova and destroyed an entire Covenant fleet, and this -blam!- surprises you?

Next time you have something to say, raise your hand and give us a little preview first, so I know whether or not I should bother giving a -blam!-.
And yes, the profanity was 100% necessary.

  • 04.23.2011 12:07 AM PDT

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Posted by: Primo84
Posted by: ExcellentSix
Same goes for Jorge, a veteran sparant II, who seems to always be corrected by Carter.
I honestly think the fans' love for Jorge is a subconscious yearning for the Master Chief, which is projected onto Jorge due to him being the only other SPARTAN-II seen in a Halo game.

That being said, for being a career soldier, Jorge comes off as pretty damn naive at times. If I were Carter, this is how I would have handled this little outburst:Jorge: MAC rounds? IN ATMOSPHERE!?

Carter: Mother -blam!-, you've been fighting against these mother -blam!- aliens for going on 27 years now. Nine damn years ago, Admiral Cole made a -blam!- gas giant go supernova and destroyed an entire Covenant fleet, and this -blam!- surprises you?

Next time you have something to say, raise your hand and give us a little preview first, so I know whether or not I should bother giving a -blam!-.
And yes, the profanity was 100% necessary.

Six: Owned.

  • 04.23.2011 12:15 AM PDT

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  • 04.23.2011 2:21 AM PDT

Dat ass

  • 04.23.2011 2:25 AM PDT

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Posted by: RotaryCookie
Mark V(B) is what Noble uses. I refuse to believe it's the same. It is clearly Mk IV with shields. :S See Cole Protocol cover art.

Mk. V (B) refers only to the helmet, not the actual suit, same as all the other desrciptions. It even says in in the game booklet as well that it is Mk. V, as well as the GI Reach page.

And for Grey Team, cover art is interprtive to the artist, as is all art. "Never judge a book by it's cover", becuase it is rarely accurately representing the inside, and it isn't mean to.

As for simply refusing to believe something despite evdidence, I can't ague with that. Ignorance is bliss and as lon as your happy then goof for you. However, your personal take on canon cannot be included in an objective discussion such as this.


Most would, but every case in individual. Jorge, clearly for some reason is either a washout who is not as good as a Spartan II, or is a retard they gave Mjolnir to as a joke. I vote for washout because I like him.
Again this is your personal opinion wit no solid evidence to back it up in either scenario.

No, SIII training was different, focussing on team tactics, more like conventional Special forces (oxymoron?) than the lone wolf super soldier training on the SII.
Are you actually sugesting that IIs never got team tactics training? Fireteam excercises? Of course they did. the books and comics both clearly show this was a huge part of teir training, as well as actual real-life military career. It is even explained that the Chief finds it difficult working alone.

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

(To those saying Spartan threes had a slightly wider range of genetic profiles, that is true, however Noble Team members had the Spartan II genetic profile.)

Though, if the OP is basing ability of AI scripting, lol. AI behavior does not = character traits.

That's what I'm thinking, in which case we all know that on game mechanics and AI are not representative of "real-life" circumstances.

[Edited on 04.23.2011 3:44 AM PDT]

  • 04.23.2011 3:43 AM PDT

Posted by:ScubaToaster
Posted by: HipiO7
This man, this man right here put it so eloquently that I actually cancelled my own 2000+ word long post.
/slow clap for respect


:)
The person who said participating is important, not winning, obviously never won anything.

Jesus. Some people just need to think about what they say before they post.

It´s a game people. The AI has it´s limits. I´m pretty sure if NOBLE was ever decipted in the novels, they would be alot more effective.

Kat was NOBLE´s tech specialist, and if she was a Spartan, she must have been as good as any other member of NOBLE. She managed to survive this long, it must be for a reason.

And Jorge followed orders, no matter who they came from. He wasent going to secound guess orders from a man he had alot of trust in as a capable leader nor in his superior, Holland.

Seriously people, THINK before you post. It´s like the Reach Forum is starting to come here, filling this place with ignorance.

  • 04.23.2011 4:30 AM PDT
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I'm gonna finish it. Just like Jigga did to the pyramid.

cause she had a nice ass

  • 04.23.2011 6:23 AM PDT

The safety dance, with DetailedKILLER and friends.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f843hEnKV_E

Posted by: Dustofsaturn
Kat and Carter are the only surviving members of the original noble team because:

1. Carter would never drive with Kat.

2. Kat would abandon the Hog after she "accidently" drove it over a cliff leaving the other spartan to die.

3. There were no snipers.


^ you forgot Kat's fear of heights causing Carter to never have flied before. Silly carter, scarabs aren't landing pads.

  • 04.23.2011 6:48 AM PDT


Posted by: Primo84
Posted by: ExcellentSix
Same goes for Jorge, a veteran sparant II, who seems to always be corrected by Carter.
I honestly think the fans' love for Jorge is a subconscious yearning for the Master Chief, which is projected onto Jorge due to him being the only other SPARTAN-II seen in a Halo game.

That being said, for being a career soldier, Jorge comes off as pretty damn naive at times. If I were Carter, this is how I would have handled this little outburst:Jorge: MAC rounds? IN ATMOSPHERE!?

Carter: Mother -blam!-, you've been fighting against these mother -blam!- aliens for going on 27 years now. Nine damn years ago, Admiral Cole made a -blam!- gas giant go supernova and destroyed an entire Covenant fleet, and this -blam!- surprises you?

Next time you have something to say, raise your hand and give us a little preview first, so I know whether or not I should bother giving a -blam!-.
And yes, the profanity was 100% necessary.


While your scenario is slightly humorous, I don't think it was that dumb having Jorge being surprised about a MAC round being fired at something while in atmosphere. It's not the norm, so why shouldn't he be a bit surprised that they're firing it there. Jorge being a II certainly had no affect on my liking of him, I liked him on his own merits.

  • 04.23.2011 2:59 PM PDT

She cammed up with the best plans, she was a genius.

  • 04.23.2011 3:17 PM PDT
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Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: privet caboose
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
as Noble Team had the Spartan II genetics...


Pure speculation.


Letter between Kurt and Mendez, states Halsey would have picked the members of Noble Team if they had been around when she was selecting candidates.

Doesn't directly say Noble Team, but he says they get people she would have picked. He then says they are placed in the field armed like Spartans, and getting local help without asking for it.

Sounds like Noble Team.


Pretty much this ^

Noble Team are among those who would have made it into the Spartan II program, or at least been candidates for it, if the Spartan II project had been later or if they had been around earlier. This is why they have been given Mjolner armor and were never sent on their suicide ops.

nice necropost

  • 04.23.2011 3:25 PM PDT


Posted by: Sparty Boy 117
Posted by: OrderedComa

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: privet caboose
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
as Noble Team had the Spartan II genetics...


Pure speculation.


Letter between Kurt and Mendez, states Halsey would have picked the members of Noble Team if they had been around when she was selecting candidates.

Doesn't directly say Noble Team, but he says they get people she would have picked. He then says they are placed in the field armed like Spartans, and getting local help without asking for it.

Sounds like Noble Team.


Pretty much this ^

Noble Team are among those who would have made it into the Spartan II program, or at least been candidates for it, if the Spartan II project had been later or if they had been around earlier. This is why they have been given Mjolner armor and were never sent on their suicide ops.

nice necropost


Haha thanks...I think >_>

  • 04.23.2011 5:59 PM PDT

Posted by: Commander GX
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Posted by: Tucker 051
Kat is lame, Jorge is awesome.


Yep.

  • 04.23.2011 6:14 PM PDT


Posted by: HipiO7
Jesus. Some people just need to think about what they say before they post.

It´s a game people. The AI has it´s limits. I´m pretty sure if NOBLE was ever decipted in the novels, they would be alot more effective.

Kat was NOBLE´s tech specialist, and if she was a Spartan, she must have been as good as any other member of NOBLE. She managed to survive this long, it must be for a reason.

And Jorge followed orders, no matter who they came from. He wasent going to secound guess orders from a man he had alot of trust in as a capable leader nor in his superior, Holland.

Seriously people, THINK before you post. It´s like the Reach Forum is starting to come here, filling this place with ignorance.


There is another reason Jorge would listen to Carter he is a Chief Warrant Officer Carter is a Commander Spartans were train to listen to superiors. When Jorge through Six off the ship he was man handling a superior officer cause Six is a LT

  • 04.23.2011 6:28 PM PDT

Vengeance only leads to an ongoing cycle of hatred.

dat ass- I mean...well I don't know. lol.

  • 04.23.2011 6:31 PM PDT

Vengeance only leads to an ongoing cycle of hatred.


Posted by: Tucker 051
Kat is lame, Jorge is awesome.

Kat is lame, Jorge is lame. Buck, Mickey, Romeo, Rookie, Dutch, Dare, and Virgil are awesome.

  • 04.23.2011 6:32 PM PDT

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Posted by: SEAL Sniper 9

Posted by: Tucker 051
Kat is lame, Jorge is awesome.

Kat is lame, Jorge is lame. Buck, Mickey, Romeo, Rookie, Dutch, Dare, and Virgil are awesome.
Spartans, Marines, ODSTs, and the UNSC is lame. Sangheili are awesome.

  • 04.23.2011 9:06 PM PDT

Adepto In Meus Campester
Posted by: ParagonRenegade
You were totally and absolutely correct in every way, I don't know why we were arguing, you're so amazing I should never have doubted you.

Posted by: matman25402
Spartans, Marines, ODSTs, and the UNSC is lame. Sangheili are awesome.

Lolthis.

  • 04.23.2011 9:13 PM PDT

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