Bungie Universe
This topic has moved here: Subject: Covenant Corvettes
  • Subject: Covenant Corvettes
  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • of 3
Subject: Covenant Corvettes

Man is born free but everywhere he is in chains.

They serve as frigates for the Covenant Carriers. On Reach, the carrier was kept in orbit away from the battle while the Corvette was the ship that was closer to the planet, bombarding swordbase. We see the same kind of thing happen with the humans' ships too. The frigates bombard and provide support while the bigger ships are usually in orbit.

  • 03.07.2011 11:05 AM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."

Well that's a really bad design for a weapon station. I mean, imagine if it fell on enemy hands? They could simply bombard the planet with their own MAC guns. No wonder Humanity got defeated so many times.....

  • 03.07.2011 11:14 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

I just play for fun. MLG can kiss my ass.

to Cmdr DaeFaron,

It is possible to fire a round with less of a charge, and as for the turning around to fire, well they could be double barreled.

  • 03.07.2011 11:18 AM PDT


Posted by: Caaaarrrl
to Cmdr DaeFaron,

It is possible to fire a round with less of a charge, and as for the turning around to fire, well they could be double barreled.


I was agreeing that they can turn around, we even hear of a few doing just so in the fall of Reach

  • 03.07.2011 11:19 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

I just play for fun. MLG can kiss my ass.


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: Caaaarrrl
to Cmdr DaeFaron,

It is possible to fire a round with less of a charge, and as for the turning around to fire, well they could be double barreled.


I was agreeing that they can turn around, we even hear of a few doing just so in the fall of Reach


What? Where? I don't remember reading anything that said that.

  • 03.07.2011 11:22 AM PDT


Posted by: Caaaarrrl

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: Caaaarrrl
to Cmdr DaeFaron,

It is possible to fire a round with less of a charge, and as for the turning around to fire, well they could be double barreled.


I was agreeing that they can turn around, we even hear of a few doing just so in the fall of Reach


What? Where? I don't remember reading anything that said that.


A cruiser jumped behind the super MAC line, while it was still dark one of the stations turned and fired on it.

  • 03.07.2011 11:42 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

I just play for fun. MLG can kiss my ass.


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: Caaaarrrl

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: Caaaarrrl
to Cmdr DaeFaron,

It is possible to fire a round with less of a charge, and as for the turning around to fire, well they could be double barreled.


I was agreeing that they can turn around, we even hear of a few doing just so in the fall of Reach


What? Where? I don't remember reading anything that said that.


A cruiser jumped behind the super MAC line, while it was still dark one of the stations turned and fired on it.


I guess I better read TFoR again.

  • 03.07.2011 11:44 AM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Yes, they can turn and face toward the planet, however the super mac rounds impacting the planet would cause MAJOR damage to the planet. Not something you'd use to swat a Corvette out of the sky.


Or is a MAC in general necessary to swat a Corvette down and keep it down for good.

Out of curiosity for anyone that knows and can clarify this for me. Has there been any precedence for a MAC cannon (from ship or station) being fired at a lower charge to reduce power either in the books or games?

I ask because now that I've mentioned the Spirit of Fire I now begin to question just how MACs in general rate in for orbital strikes. I'm no expert when it comes to the science of how the guns function and the force they exert like some other members here. From what is seen from cinematics from the Halo games it is still implied or outright stated that MACs in general in game can still cause severe devastation to some degree as the books portray.

Halo Wars: Cutter mentions that a direct MAC blast of the shield in Arcadia could destroy whatever is underneath.

Halo 2: Johnson states that a MAC gun can tear a hole "clean" through a capital ship easy.

Reach: Due to the "sensitive nature" of Sword Base MAC rounds were prohibited from being used on the Corvette. However, I feel that this dialogue could go two ways. Either the Corvette is too close to Sword Base that a shot would level a decent chunk of the base, or if it's possible that Dot's dialogue about Sword Base being "sensitive" could be interpreted as its location being a secret to general forces of the UNSC and thus ONI doesn't want its coordinates revealed if it does not have to. Thus they would merely not have authorization to use them.

Yet in all three instances there's contradictions to the power being shown.

Halo Wars: The shield gets dropped, then suddenly we're granted free reign to rain MAC rounds without prejudice on the exposed Covie base with no fear of damaging whatever was impeding them from using MACs in the first place. Does the force of the MAC spread out in a wider area when it hits a shield? Also it's quite possible that the Spirit's MAC is in reality just a re-purposed Mass Driver possessing the same amount of strength as one, yet if that were the case it would be referred as such much like the Mass Driver in Reach and Harvest.

Halo 2: By technicality it seems that the Orbital MACs are inaccurate or simply not as effective on shields as both Carriers are able to slip past the orbital cluster. Given that an AI, Cortana no less, was in charge of aiming the MAC and tasked with concentrating fire on those carriers I'm surprised both slipped through unscathed with only their shields being down.

Reach: This shot used to destroy the Corvette came from an orbital MAC station. If used at full force it would cause some severe planetary damage based on what is said of it in the books, Halo 2, and to a deeper degree from the members of this community who can get it down to a science. So is there a way for them to have toned down the shot? Do factors exist like the Corvette being over water that could reduce impact? Was there actually severe (though not catastrophic) planetary damage actually done under the water that is merely unseen by us? And if so could it be the reason why command was hesitant on using MAC rounds when it was closer to Sword Base? Could there be a fear of damaging the Sword Base artifact or the access route leading to it if the MAC round impacted on the ground closer to the base? Given that Kat (unaware of the artifact and underground tunnel leading to it) questions why the MACs aren't taking shots at the Corvette when it's really close to the base and practically overhead it would be assumed that she does not consider the blast to be a danger to those within the base...

The books paint a far more deadly force behind both ship and orbital based MAC guns, so the existence of the Spirit's, Earth's, and Reach's MACs combat effectiveness in game is rather puzzling...

Off-topic within this thread of Corvette functions I know, but given that the only Corvette seen to have been destroyed was due to a MAC round it would be a sort of baseline to determine its durability. A barrage of missiles near the bridge is enough to make one turn tail and retreat, the presence of Longswords is enough to make them break off from an attack and retreat (though other factors like the loss of ground forces may contribute to this), but....whatever constituted the FPF barrages in Exodus was completely ineffective and didn't even graze them. Based on audio cues it almost sounds like the UNSC forces in NA were using Mass Drivers, though there is nothing present to confirm what they were using to strike out at the Corvettes prior to the missile batteries.

So really the defensive strength of the Corvette is quite hard to place when the power of the MAC guns and any variation they could or could not possess cannot be placed properly. It's a hell of an inconsistency that has bugged me mainly for my assumption that the UNSC forces in NA did try using Mass Drivers against the Corvettes which did nothing when a seemingly less powerful missile barrage can effectively damage it enough to make one pull out of the fight for a while.

  • 03.07.2011 11:56 AM PDT

I am alpha, i am omega.

I am the last of the primes.

Corvettes < frigate < destroyer < light cruiser < cruiser < ccs battle cruiser < revrant class cruiser < light carrier < super cruiser < assualt carrier < super carrier.

I cba to list the prwolers the covies use...

But i belive the light cruiser is the strongest pound for pound covie ship...

  • 03.07.2011 1:15 PM PDT

As was said before, I believe that the Corvettes are used as large Dropship & Cover Ships, transporting the troops from their Supercarrier and defending them in a large surface area.

In terms of Durability, A UNSC Frigate could have easily outmatched a Corvette. Even the 600ton Ship MAC would have likely destroyed this unshielded target. Jorge even said the Savannah's 50mm guns were able to damage the topside area ( Which prevented getting back to the Sabres ). The only reason the UNSC Savannah was destroyed was due to not being allowed to engage the Corvette ( This would have destroyed the purpose of LNoS ) and that it had no Slipspace Drive.

Ground side SAMS and Longswords appear to be able to drive them off, as well as Sabres being able to cause moderate damage ( By destroying it's engines ). I personally think the Super MAC Mark V strike on the Corvette in ONI Sword base was overkill, as I saw what seem to be Mass Drivers in the Airfield.

The Corvette makes a good Transport for Larger ship cargo's, but performs poorly in most other ways. An explanation for no shields might be a Stealth coating of some kind to keep them hidden. One of the Corvettes at the end of Nightfall appears to be partially cloaked.

I'll continue to study this unique Ship.



[Edited on 03.07.2011 2:17 PM PST]

  • 03.07.2011 2:15 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: The Seraphim
One of the Corvettes at the end of Nightfall appears to be partially cloaked.

I'll continue to study this unique Ship.



I am intrigued. What do you mean by partially cloaked?

  • 03.07.2011 2:19 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

I just play for fun. MLG can kiss my ass.

He/she meant that you couldn't see half of the ship.

  • 03.07.2011 2:34 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: Caaaarrrl
He/she meant that you couldn't see half of the ship.


I'm fairly confidant that you can't see half the ship because of the foggy atmosphere combined with a cliff wall.

  • 03.07.2011 2:51 PM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."

Posted by: StealthSlasher2

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Yes, they can turn and face toward the planet, however the super mac rounds impacting the planet would cause MAJOR damage to the planet. Not something you'd use to swat a Corvette out of the sky.


Or is a MAC in general necessary to swat a Corvette down and keep it down for good.

Out of curiosity for anyone that knows and can clarify this for me. Has there been any precedence for a MAC cannon (from ship or station) being fired at a lower charge to reduce power either in the books or games?

I ask because now that I've mentioned the Spirit of Fire I now begin to question just how MACs in general rate in for orbital strikes. I'm no expert when it comes to the science of how the guns function and the force they exert like some other members here. From what is seen from cinematics from the Halo games it is still implied or outright stated that MACs in general in game can still cause severe devastation to some degree as the books portray.

Halo Wars: Cutter mentions that a direct MAC blast of the shield in Arcadia could destroy whatever is underneath.

Halo 2: Johnson states that a MAC gun can tear a hole "clean" through a capital ship easy.

Reach: Due to the "sensitive nature" of Sword Base MAC rounds were prohibited from being used on the Corvette. However, I feel that this dialogue could go two ways. Either the Corvette is too close to Sword Base that a shot would level a decent chunk of the base, or if it's possible that Dot's dialogue about Sword Base being "sensitive" could be interpreted as its location being a secret to general forces of the UNSC and thus ONI doesn't want its coordinates revealed if it does not have to. Thus they would merely not have authorization to use them.

Yet in all three instances there's contradictions to the power being shown.

Halo Wars: The shield gets dropped, then suddenly we're granted free reign to rain MAC rounds without prejudice on the exposed Covie base with no fear of damaging whatever was impeding them from using MACs in the first place. Does the force of the MAC spread out in a wider area when it hits a shield? Also it's quite possible that the Spirit's MAC is in reality just a re-purposed Mass Driver possessing the same amount of strength as one, yet if that were the case it would be referred as such much like the Mass Driver in Reach and Harvest.

Halo 2: By technicality it seems that the Orbital MACs are inaccurate or simply not as effective on shields as both Carriers are able to slip past the orbital cluster. Given that an AI, Cortana no less, was in charge of aiming the MAC and tasked with concentrating fire on those carriers I'm surprised both slipped through unscathed with only their shields being down.

Reach: This shot used to destroy the Corvette came from an orbital MAC station. If used at full force it would cause some severe planetary damage based on what is said of it in the books, Halo 2, and to a deeper degree from the members of this community who can get it down to a science. So is there a way for them to have toned down the shot? Do factors exist like the Corvette being over water that could reduce impact? Was there actually severe (though not catastrophic) planetary damage actually done under the water that is merely unseen by us? And if so could it be the reason why command was hesitant on using MAC rounds when it was closer to Sword Base? Could there be a fear of damaging the Sword Base artifact or the access route leading to it if the MAC round impacted on the ground closer to the base? Given that Kat (unaware of the artifact and underground tunnel leading to it) questions why the MACs aren't taking shots at the Corvette when it's really close to the base and practically overhead it would be assumed that she does not consider the blast to be a danger to those within the base...

The books paint a far more deadly force behind both ship and orbital based MAC guns, so the existence of the Spirit's, Earth's, and Reach's MACs combat effectiveness in game is rather puzzling...

Off-topic within this thread of Corvette functions I know, but given that the only Corvette seen to have been destroyed was due to a MAC round it would be a sort of baseline to determine its durability. A barrage of missiles near the bridge is enough to make one turn tail and retreat, the presence of Longswords is enough to make them break off from an attack and retreat (though other factors like the loss of ground forces may contribute to this), but....whatever constituted the FPF barrages in Exodus was completely ineffective and didn't even graze them. Based on audio cues it almost sounds like the UNSC forces in NA were using Mass Drivers, though there is nothing present to confirm what they were using to strike out at the Corvettes prior to the missile batteries.

So really the defensive strength of the Corvette is quite hard to place when the power of the MAC guns and any variation they could or could not possess cannot be placed properly. It's a hell of an inconsistency that has bugged me mainly for my assumption that the UNSC forces in NA did try using Mass Drivers against the Corvettes which did nothing when a seemingly less powerful missile barrage can effectively damage it enough to make one pull out of the fight for a while.


I can answer the Halo Wars thing.

The MAC cannon on Halo Wars is a toned down version of the real MACs, it's done like that for gameplay reasons. I mean, every played Skirmish? it takes up to two MAC strikes to kill a Prophet, a Prophet, the single most frail species of the Covenant, resisting two direct shots.

And I do believe that the MAC blast shown on ONI Sword Base could have potentially harmed the base (more than it already was) If you see it, the Corvette alone was able to punch a hole on top of the base, now imagine something strong enough to completely pass through said ship with ease and in an instant. I'd think the sheer force would have made the building collapse and kill everybody inside and perhaps even ruin the underground facilities like the rail and elevator, effectively destroying any way to get to Halsey and Cortana for that matter.

  • 03.07.2011 2:52 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

I just play for fun. MLG can kiss my ass.

^

The ODPs probably only used a 10% charge to down the ship and avoid unimaginable destruction.

  • 03.07.2011 2:57 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: RKOSNAKE
I can answer the Halo Wars thing.

The MAC cannon on Halo Wars is a toned down version of the real MACs, it's done like that for gameplay reasons. I mean, every played Skirmish? it takes up to two MAC strikes to kill a Prophet, a Prophet, the single most frail species of the Covenant, resisting two direct shots.

And I do believe that the MAC blast shown on ONI Sword Base could have potentially harmed the base (more than it already was) If you see it, the Corvette alone was able to punch a hole on top of the base, now imagine something strong enough to completely pass through said ship with ease and in an instant. I'd think the sheer force would have made the building collapse and kill everybody inside and perhaps even ruin the underground facilities like the rail and elevator, effectively destroying any way to get to Halsey and Cortana for that matter.



It still does not account for the cinematic discussion on the power of the MAC cannon demolishing anything under the Arcadia Shield which was my main point when bringing up Halo Wars. There are several things compensated for gameplay reasons in Halo Wars, but what occurs in the cutscenes and Halo:Genesis still stands as points of contention as they would be sources of "hard" canon evidence.

With that said, if anyone reading this has access to Genesis, the limited edition graphic novel, please be sure to post if the Spirit was outfitted with a toned down MAC gun or if it was given a military grade one. I faintly remember a segment in which Cutter describes all the changes to the ships from its change of cargo from civilian goods to military grade ordinance, but am currently unable to look it up myself at the moment.

As for the other point I have no doubt in my mind that the shot fired at the Corvette would do considerable damage to Sword Base if the Corvette had been directly above the base itself, but it was never the case as it was never directly above Sword Base itself.

My focus in that regard is two-fold. First and foremost would be the area of effect damage that could be caused by the round if it had hit the surface of land Sword Base was built upon. We didn't see that, instead we saw the Corvette get hit above water and thus didn't see the impact it caused on the terrain underwater. Second off is the penetrative power of that particular round. Because, again, the round landed in the water past the Corvette in addition to never seeing that particular body of water again intact we are unable to see the extent of how far the round went underground. Seeing as how the terrain has been practically terraformed by glassing beams (note for example that where the air base and runway stood has now been carved out and now there is nothing but water and sheer cliffs) there's no way to gauge it when returning during the level "The Package".

Also, again, given Kat's dialogue, it is still implied that a MAC round from any of the orbital stations above them would not harm them... to a significant degree at least based on where the Corvette was at the time and also considering that Kat is not aware of (and would not consider concern for) any underground tunnels that need to be protected.

  • 03.07.2011 3:30 PM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."

Posted by: StealthSlasher2

Posted by: RKOSNAKE
I can answer the Halo Wars thing.

The MAC cannon on Halo Wars is a toned down version of the real MACs, it's done like that for gameplay reasons. I mean, every played Skirmish? it takes up to two MAC strikes to kill a Prophet, a Prophet, the single most frail species of the Covenant, resisting two direct shots.

And I do believe that the MAC blast shown on ONI Sword Base could have potentially harmed the base (more than it already was) If you see it, the Corvette alone was able to punch a hole on top of the base, now imagine something strong enough to completely pass through said ship with ease and in an instant. I'd think the sheer force would have made the building collapse and kill everybody inside and perhaps even ruin the underground facilities like the rail and elevator, effectively destroying any way to get to Halsey and Cortana for that matter.



It still does not account for the cinematic discussion on the power of the MAC cannon demolishing anything under the Arcadia Shield which was my main point when bringing up Halo Wars. There are several things compensated for gameplay reasons in Halo Wars, but what occurs in the cutscenes and Halo:Genesis still stands as points of contention as they would be sources of "hard" canon evidence.

With that said, if anyone reading this has access to Genesis, the limited edition graphic novel, please be sure to post if the Spirit was outfitted with a toned down MAC gun or if it was given a military grade one. I faintly remember a segment in which Cutter describes all the changes to the ships from its change of cargo from civilian goods to military grade ordinance, but am currently unable to look it up myself at the moment.

As for the other point I have no doubt in my mind that the shot fired at the Corvette would do considerable damage to Sword Base if the Corvette had been directly above the base itself, but it was never the case as it was never directly above Sword Base itself.

My focus in that regard is two-fold. First and foremost would be the area of effect damage that could be caused by the round if it had hit the surface of land Sword Base was built upon. We didn't see that, instead we saw the Corvette get hit above water and thus didn't see the impact it caused on the terrain underwater. Second off is the penetrative power of that particular round. Because, again, the round landed in the water past the Corvette in addition to never seeing that particular body of water again intact we are unable to see the extent of how far the round went underground. Seeing as how the terrain has been practically terraformed by glassing beams (note for example that where the air base and runway stood has now been carved out and now there is nothing but water and sheer cliffs) there's no way to gauge it when returning during the level "The Package".

Also, again, given Kat's dialogue, it is still implied that a MAC round from any of the orbital stations above them would not harm them... to a significant degree at least based on where the Corvette was at the time and also considering that Kat is not aware of (and would not consider concern for) any underground tunnels that need to be protected.


Well I have not read Genesis but perhaps the MAC on The Spirit of Fire was designed for Ground Support instead of Ship to Ship engagements, that could answer why it can fire 4 shots and still do little damage.

  • 03.07.2011 3:39 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

We are determined that before the sun sets on this terrible struggle our flag will be recognized throughout the world as a symbol of freedom on the one hand and of overwhelming force on the other.


Posted by: StealthSlasher2

Posted by: MegaMuffin16
Maybe they're escort ships. Somewhat similar to a tugboat and an aircraft carrier.


The deployment of Corvettes reminds me of how the aliens from Independence Day operated though on a different scale.

Given that the Super Carrier seems to have several slots underneath it to refuel Corvettes I would argue (based on what's currently available) that the Corvettes are exclusively deployed by Super Carriers. This is our only time seeing Corvettes, but as is noted in Reach they seem to have very limited (relatively speaking) operation time compared to other Covie ships as they need to refuel after a short amount of time into the attack on Reach. However it is quite possible that the Corvettes have been operating on Reach long before even the Visagrad incident and thus expended a good deal of their resources then. In any case though the presence of the Super carrier as the sole warship of any other class in the system (in combination with the Corvette "slots") seems to imply that the Corvettes are reliant on the carrier for support.

The way I see it, the Corvette is a means for the carrier to rapidly deploy its forces over the surface of an entire planet. Of course dropships could do the same thing, but this is the important part.The Corvette can allow said spread out forces to maintain a hold on their assigned region by providing each of those separate forces an adequate means of support to sustain itself (Close air support, heavy bombardment, intelligence, and possibly ammo fuel and other necessities for infantry). Which... in turn would lessen the chances of a unit being isolated by enemy forces on a planet wide scale when separated from the mothership.

The super carrier may be large, powerful, and house legions of troops, but it can't be everywhere on a planet to support all those troops when spread out...The corvettes would be the best method overall to support all those troops all over the planet.




We have ourselves a winner!

  • 03.08.2011 6:01 PM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Posted by: chotato
smart, interesting, seems out of place.


Official fan of Assassin's Creed, Call of Duty, (Problem with that?) Halo, and Bungie, also a total gaming junkie.

Light Assault, artillery, and engaging small UNSC ships in orbit.

Examples:

ONI Sword Base, there is one pounding SB and a UNSC Military Base with artillery cannons

LNoS, it destroyed the Savannah even with heavy damage and destroyed engines. Obviously meant to be used against fast ships like the Frigate and Destroyer

Condemned, you can see one attacking a UNSC Frigate

Exodus, there are a few of 'em destroying building, providing support for ground forces, and destroying escape shuttles.

  • 03.08.2011 6:14 PM PDT


Posted by: opogjijijp
Posted by: ExcellentSix
A UNSC frigate is evenly matched for a Corvette,


I'd say a UNSC frigate outmatches a corvette. The Frigate in LNoS held out pretty long, and it wasn't even seriously fighting back. Since those missile on Exodus were enough to damage Corvettes, I have little doubt that a Frigate with several hundred missiles and a MAC would win against a Corvette(possibly several of them)


Also, in LNoS the Savannah wasn't trying to destroy the Corvette, but the Corvette was giving the frigate everything it had. So I imagine that if the Savannah was actually trying to destroy the Corvette it would have done it with ease.

[Edited on 03.08.2011 6:17 PM PST]

  • 03.08.2011 6:16 PM PDT

"I may not be perfect, but always been true."

A Frigate can destroy two Corvettes in a fight, one with a MAC blast and the other with their Archer Missiles seeing how Corvettes lack shields.

  • 03.08.2011 6:24 PM PDT

  • Pages:
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • of 3