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This topic has moved here: Subject: Halo 2 is overrated.
  • Subject: Halo 2 is overrated.
Subject: Halo 2 is overrated.

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(


Posted by: JacobGRocks
This is the definition of Nostalgia Goggles:
There is a tendency for adults to see newer material in a medium (be it music, film, animation, or comic books) as inferior to the older 'classics' that they knew in their youth.
There are three levels of this. The first involves a person enjoying modern material, but preferring older classics instead. People subject to the first level are perfectly willing to accept newer material, even admitting certain material to be better than a classic. The second level involves a person believing that most material produced during modern times is greatly inferior, however, they are willing to admit that there are exceptions. The third level is a full-on despising of all modern works (which may or may not be limited to a single medium) and the absolute refusal to believe that anything could be even close to the level of the classics they used to enjoy.
There are many causes for this. First, people's tastes are generally based on the art they knew as they grew up and they continue to inform themselves on this basis. Second, tastes refine as one matures; what may have seemed brilliant to a child or teen would seem crude or laughable to most adults, but the memories of how great something from one's youth seemed linger long afterward, making the familiar examples seem better than more or less equivalent modern ones in comparison. Third, change in most art forms comes in waves, rather than developing continuously, and the transition from one wave to another can be jarring and unfamiliar - while the periods between waves tend to be uninspired across the board.
However, it is likely that the most important cause of this nostalgia is a consequence of Sturgeon's Law combined with the passage of time: As new material is released, the vast majority will be of mediocre or worse quality, but over time, a powerful selection pressure causes all but the best material (and in some infamous cases, the worst) to be rapidly forgotten, leaving an increasingly inaccurate impression of the overall quality of the genre over time. This is known as "the nostalgia filter", and can be easily demonstrated by a careful review of the period works that are not remembered today.
The distance of time also compresses the memories of past eras, causing the best work to seem more continuous than it was, whereas "new" is a continually moving frontier: between this memory compression and the selective memories of "the good stuff", the past of the genre is remembered as a time when "it all was good"
One final possible reason: most developers/authors/artists/musicians/etc. create whatever is popular at that day and age. This means that what was popular last year isn't being produced in the same density. If a person's preference is for something that is out of fashion right now, they may have little choice besides 'hang onto the older version' or 'give up on it completely'.
Of course, just because a person prefers an older work to more modern things doesn't mean they only like it because of nostalgia. Sometimes the older work is better, or at least has it's own appeal that the present things don't - even beyond "Charm", which is often thrown around to describe stuff mostly to just mean "It's nostalgic".
Sam Viviano, art director of MAD Magazine, has a saying which defines the Nostalgia Filter: "Mad was at its best whenever you first started reading it." A corollary to that is that, if you didn't like Mad, it was at its best shortly before you started reading it.
You'll notice that this trope sometimes overlaps with the Periphery Hatedom - Almost all the time people trashing about how the new stuff sucks brings up stuff that was marketed towards the youth of our generation, and the stuff that's considered a "classic" and is an example of "good" works? The stuff they enjoyed when they were younger. Never mind that 20 years ago, when it was being marketed towards them, the 14-30 year olds of that generation were saying the exact same thing we are today. It's a neverending cycle.


Source: TVTropes


Yes, I should have just looked for something like. Good point.

  • 05.13.2011 7:31 AM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(

I hope this doesn't erupt another flame war. We should concentrate on comparing the games if we are going to keep debating instead of little trivial matters such as the meaning of how I used nostalgia.

  • 05.13.2011 8:02 AM PDT
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My first account here on BNET: ULLER_MECH

Coming from someone who's name is a reference to Halo Reach...

  • 05.13.2011 8:06 AM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(


Posted by: SwiftXen
Coming from someone who's name is a reference to Halo Reach...


Yep, this has been mentioned before. I made this hours after they announced Noble Six as the main character in an update.

  • 05.13.2011 8:09 AM PDT
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My first account here on BNET: ULLER_MECH

It's all your opinion and not necessarily everybody agrees with you. So stop speaking as if you speak for the whole community.

  • 05.13.2011 8:13 AM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(

Posted by: SwiftXen
It's all your opinion and not necessarily everybody agrees with you.

k...
Posted by: SwiftXen
So stop speaking as if you speak for the whole community.

? Actually in my OP I was complaining about the community, but a lot has happened since then.

  • 05.13.2011 8:56 AM PDT

Odie's Iced Tea - $59.98

Pfhor Eternity

Marathon: Durandal: 0:36:46 (Kindergarten) WR

Halo 2 had the best multiplayer maps, the most balanced weapons, the perfect ranking system, and the almighty BR.

I mean, look at my username.

  • 05.13.2011 11:18 AM PDT

Posted by: HiredN00bs
Arrogant hyperbolic exclamations of woe? Seems like a normal day for Halo/Bungie.net.

Posted by: NOBLE SlX
Posted by: Method Man NYC
Posted by: NOBLE SlX
Nostalgia is a neutral word that can be used positively or negatively. For those of us that wish for the Halo franchise to move in a different direction, Halo 2 nostalgia would be considered negative. It is usually used to describe a defined memory. If one plays Halo 2 before CE they would have a defined memory that would change their opinion of Halo CE. If you played them in order then you can have a more informed opinion. Many of the people here who have posted have made it seem as if they started playing Halo with Halo 2 which would create a nostalgic bias.


The funny thing is, that many of the people here actually started with Halo 3 and had no H2 Service Record activity (if they have one) prior to 2008/2009.

Many people lost their gamertags from Xbox v1 to 360 because they couldn't remember the email/password, so I'm not sure you can prove that. The gamertags may have even been deleted by now so they wouldn't be able to find their stats.

Evidence A
Evidence B


But why is it that almost EVERYONE I'm asking has no H2 GT? It's ridiculous.

  • 05.13.2011 12:38 PM PDT

It's about time they started deleting all of those old gamertags.

  • 05.13.2011 1:58 PM PDT

Posted by: dm8ns
Many will enter, only one will rise to the top and he might not even win....

I never liked Halo 2 multiplayer, with it's dual-wielding and BR and stuff. Doesn't mean I'm happy with the DMR though.

  • 05.13.2011 2:01 PM PDT

Down, down to hell and say that I sent you there...

I came into the world with my legs forward and a woman cried "he was born with teeth!"

"I had no father I am like my father...I had no brother I am like my brother...And this word, "love" which old farts call divine be resident in men like you -blam!-. But not in me, I am my mother-blam!- self, alone."

You Are an Idiot


Posted by: NOBLE SlX
Posted by: Master Fox
As someone who played close to 10,000 games in Halo 2, and could barely muster enough care to play around 3,000 in Halo 3, the series has taken a direction that has turned it to -blam!-. Reach is certainly better than Halo 3 in every aspect possible, but that's not really saying a lot. Halo 2 was the pinnacle of the series and it has gone downhill from there.

Opinions are opinions. I like Reach a lot, but I would never put it over Halo 3. Halo 2 was the only speedbump in the series for me and I only played it because it was "the next Halo game" and at the time I enjoyed it (but not even close to any of the others). You didn't mention Halo CE, so I guess you didn't play it enough to mention it. I was skeptical with Halo 3 at first, but it turned out to have the best weapon balance and the maps were much more detailed and involving. It seems obvious to me that you represent one who has started with Halo 2. A lot of people started their xbox with Halo 2 because of the hype that Halo CE brought.

I bought an Xbox in early 2002 after playing Halo CE at a friend of mine's house during a LAN party. So I pretty much fit the standard Halo archetype from the time the series started. And I've lost count of how many times I've played through Halo CE, so it's not like I started the series with Halo 2.

The weapon balance in Halo 3 wasn't any more balanced than that of Halo 2 outside of the obviously ridiculously powered sword. But Bungie went the other way with it in Halo 3 where it could be parried and with the lunge being cut down, there were plenty of weapons, including the mauler and shotgun, that just nullified its use completely.

The gameplay became sterile and boring. The matches that started with Assault Rifles turned into rush -> spray assault rifle -> melee = both players die from a simultaneous beatdown. Equipment ruined the flow of a game by giving a player that was beat because he made a mistake a second chance with a dumb bubble shield or shield regenerator. Battle Rifles and sniper rifles didn't have hitscan, which made them victims to terrible latency and lag of the game, causing plenty of moments where you headshot someone on your screen, but they live due to terrible hit detection.

Halo 2 had a wide variety of ways to play. One could dual wield on some maps, use BRs or play any number of ways. You couldn't do that in Halo 3 since dual wielding had been nerfed to the point it was almost useless. Combine that with the slightly slower movement speed, weapons that were unsatisfying to shoot, it wasn't a fun time.

I still don't know what the hell you mean by maps being detailed and involving. Are you talking about graphics? Sure, the maps certainly looked better, but they didn't play better than their counterparts. Neither Guardian, which was a "spiritual successor" to Lockout, or the eventual Blackout remake, played nearly as well as the original Lockout. Avalanche was a bastard of the original Sidewinder and played terribly with so much wasted space that went unused for the majority of the game. The only map that played worth a damn compared to its predecessor was Midship, and Bungie would be hard pressed to -blam!- that one up.

To a contrary point, no BTB map in Halo 3 played as well as any of the greats of Halo 2. Last Resort was terrible compared to Zanzibar. There were no good quality mid-size maps like Terminal, Relic, Zanzibar, Burial Mounds or anything of the sort. There were no great CTF/Assault style maps such as Beaver/Battle Creek, Sanctuary, Colossus, etc.

Yeah, I bought Halo 2 because of the hype after playing Halo CE. And I bought Halo 3 because of the hype after playing Halo 2. Whereas I immediately fell in love with Halo 2 and played around 10,000 games, I could barely muster enough interest to get on and play with friends nightly on Halo 3. I even went back to 2 to make sure it wasn't nostalgia. And it wasn't. It was and is a better game. I still play more Halo 2 PC than I do Halo 3 or Reach because it's a better game.

  • 05.13.2011 3:47 PM PDT

"No Mission Too Difficult, No Sacrifice Too Great—Duty First!" - The fighting first's motto.

Losing internet 9/7/2012 until i don't know when. See you starside folks.


Fada beo Halo 2!

Posted by: Grumpy1
Damn I get tired of the word nostalgia being used as a negative. Everyone on the planet has some form of nostalgia and it's always considered a good thing, except in this forum.

If you truly like a game it's not nostalgia drives you to say it was the best, you like it the best because it was the best to you.

I played CE first and I like H2 better and there's a lot of people who played CE first and like H2 better. Where's the nostalgia theory on that?



i played H2 multiplayer before I ever got CE, i got it pc version. it was an awesome game but Halo 2 is better.

  • 05.13.2011 4:47 PM PDT

This is the average H2 Fanboy.
Xfire: JacobGRocks.
50 in H2/H3? Great, but you still fail at this.


Posted by: Master Fox
Cool Essay Bro


Maybe you never played Halo PC. It was far better then that. And it still is, look at the player count.

  • 05.13.2011 5:52 PM PDT
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???

loved'em all equally man, i just played more CE than anything.

  • 05.13.2011 6:25 PM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(

RESERVED FOR REBUTTLE

  • 05.14.2011 12:26 AM PDT

Your whole post was based on opinion OP. But Halo 2 had an amazing community. In no other Halo or game really do you see custom games that became universally played across an entire game. Hell, zombies/living dead is now apart of H3 and Reach matchmaking(even though it's nowhere near as good). Halo 2 put XBL on the map for not only giving online console gaming a chance to rival online PC gaming, but also set the blueprint for how matchmaking is in video games on XBL. If it wasn't for Halo 2 for all we know XBL could be joining servers to find games. Your argument that the people who say Halo 2 is the best never experienced LAN on Halo CE is retarded. I and many of my friends who like Halo 2 more experienced that. We loved it but Halo 2 was so much more because we didn't have to make big plans to lug xbox's and tv's over to each others houses and use up our whole day. Halo 2 has a special place in my heart and that will never change. It was the game that got me into online gaming and I have never had nor will I ever again have as much fun playing any other game. And that I can not call overrated.

[Edited on 05.14.2011 1:13 AM PDT]

  • 05.14.2011 1:12 AM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(

Posted by: DISP05ABLE H3R0
Your whole post was based on opinion OP. But Halo 2 had an amazing community. In no other Halo or game really do you see custom games that became universally played across an entire game. Hell, zombies/living dead is now apart of H3 and Reach matchmaking(even though it's nowhere near as good). Halo 2 put XBL on the map for not only giving online console gaming a chance to rival online PC gaming, but also set the blueprint for how matchmaking is in video games on XBL. If it wasn't for Halo 2 for all we know XBL could be joining servers to find games. Your argument that the people who say Halo 2 is the best never experienced LAN on Halo CE is retarded. I and many of my friends who like Halo 2 more experienced that. We loved it but Halo 2 was so much more because we didn't have to make big plans to lug xbox's and tv's over to each others houses and use up our whole day. Halo 2 has a special place in my heart and that will never change. It was the game that got me into online gaming and I have never had nor will I ever again have as much fun playing any other game. And that I can not call overrated.

Are you honestly trying to tell me that zombies is better in halo 2 than in halo 3? >.<

If halo CE had XbL it would have also gotten XbL huge. Halo 2 carried off of Halo 1s hype. XbL started with Halo 2 so I don't see how this could mean anything.

"we didn't have to make big plans to lug xbox's and tv's over to each others houses and use up our whole day." I have two TVs in my basement, but lugging an xbox was worth it and very common. We did it almost every day after school when I was in elementary school. No big deal because they made carrying cases for it.

[Edited on 05.14.2011 1:40 AM PDT]

  • 05.14.2011 1:33 AM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(

...

[Edited on 05.14.2011 1:59 AM PDT]

  • 05.14.2011 1:45 AM PDT

Halo 2 for Life!

50/50 aint that bad. therefore halo 2 has won!

  • 05.14.2011 3:21 AM PDT

Posted by: HiredN00bs
Arrogant hyperbolic exclamations of woe? Seems like a normal day for Halo/Bungie.net.

Posted by: totallymassive
50/50 aint that bad. therefore halo 2 has won!


It's a Halo 2 forum lol.

Try making such a poll on the CE forum, there will be 10% NO-stalgia and 90% Yes.

[Edited on 05.14.2011 3:47 AM PDT]

  • 05.14.2011 3:47 AM PDT
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Don't know where you did math but 50/50 means it's even.

  • 05.14.2011 3:50 AM PDT
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I AGREE ALL THE WAY WITH YOU BRO!!! The sad thing is most people dont know about that because back then offline gaming was still the thing by that time. Online for consoles was not main stream yet, but look where we at now and its all thanks to Halo 2!!!

  • 05.14.2011 4:09 AM PDT

This is the average H2 Fanboy.
Xfire: JacobGRocks.
50 in H2/H3? Great, but you still fail at this.


Posted by: NOBLE SlX
Posted by: DISP05ABLE H3R0
Your whole post was based on opinion OP. But Halo 2 had an amazing community. In no other Halo or game really do you see custom games that became universally played across an entire game. Hell, zombies/living dead is now apart of H3 and Reach matchmaking(even though it's nowhere near as good). Halo 2 put XBL on the map for not only giving online console gaming a chance to rival online PC gaming, but also set the blueprint for how matchmaking is in video games on XBL. If it wasn't for Halo 2 for all we know XBL could be joining servers to find games. Your argument that the people who say Halo 2 is the best never experienced LAN on Halo CE is retarded. I and many of my friends who like Halo 2 more experienced that. We loved it but Halo 2 was so much more because we didn't have to make big plans to lug xbox's and tv's over to each others houses and use up our whole day. Halo 2 has a special place in my heart and that will never change. It was the game that got me into online gaming and I have never had nor will I ever again have as much fun playing any other game. And that I can not call overrated.

Are you honestly trying to tell me that zombies is better in halo 2 than in halo 3? >.<

If halo CE had XbL it would have also gotten XbL huge. Halo 2 carried off of Halo 1s hype. XbL started with Halo 2 so I don't see how this could mean anything.

"we didn't have to make big plans to lug xbox's and tv's over to each others houses and use up our whole day." I have two TVs in my basement, but lugging an xbox was worth it and very common. We did it almost every day after school when I was in elementary school. No big deal because they made carrying cases for it.


There were other XBL games that did stuff first. Mechassault, Star Wars Battlefront, Counter-Strike, Unreal Championship, etc, etc.

  • 05.14.2011 6:12 AM PDT

Posted by: Darth1Snyder
Everytime someone sacks my groceries, I think of Loaf.

Halo 2 is overrated.

You clearly didn't play this during it's prime. Therefore your opinion is not wanted.

Without Halo 2..........I can't even imagine.

  • 05.14.2011 9:16 AM PDT


Posted by: JacobGRocks

Posted by: NOBLE SlX
Posted by: DISP05ABLE H3R0
Your whole post was based on opinion OP. But Halo 2 had an amazing community. In no other Halo or game really do you see custom games that became universally played across an entire game. Hell, zombies/living dead is now apart of H3 and Reach matchmaking(even though it's nowhere near as good). Halo 2 put XBL on the map for not only giving online console gaming a chance to rival online PC gaming, but also set the blueprint for how matchmaking is in video games on XBL. If it wasn't for Halo 2 for all we know XBL could be joining servers to find games. Your argument that the people who say Halo 2 is the best never experienced LAN on Halo CE is retarded. I and many of my friends who like Halo 2 more experienced that. We loved it but Halo 2 was so much more because we didn't have to make big plans to lug xbox's and tv's over to each others houses and use up our whole day. Halo 2 has a special place in my heart and that will never change. It was the game that got me into online gaming and I have never had nor will I ever again have as much fun playing any other game. And that I can not call overrated.

Are you honestly trying to tell me that zombies is better in halo 2 than in halo 3? >.<

If halo CE had XbL it would have also gotten XbL huge. Halo 2 carried off of Halo 1s hype. XbL started with Halo 2 so I don't see how this could mean anything.

"we didn't have to make big plans to lug xbox's and tv's over to each others houses and use up our whole day." I have two TVs in my basement, but lugging an xbox was worth it and very common. We did it almost every day after school when I was in elementary school. No big deal because they made carrying cases for it.


There were other XBL games that did stuff first. Mechassault, Star Wars Battlefront, Counter-Strike, Unreal Championship, etc, etc.


I remember seeing crimson skies was the number 1 most played game on live for a while, not a bad game (in my opinion).

  • 05.14.2011 10:25 AM PDT