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Subject: Should Reach's fleet have retreated to Earth?
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Posted by: Dustin 6047

Posted by: Omanisat

Posted by: zepedrodel

Posted by: Omanisat
And if they hadn't fought at Reach, all the Covenant ships that would have been destroyed there would have been free to join the attack on Earth.

Can't you read? The OP proposed that they would explode a NOVA. That would be enough to blast the entire Covenant fleet.


so what, we save the Covenant the trouble of killing everyone on Reach by doinig it ourselves? Take that evil aliens.



If you launch the Nova and don't let the bomb explode until it passes the enemy fleet far enough so it will only kill them, but not the planet or ODP or whatever you don't want to get destroyed, then the NOVA isn't suicide. And you can decide where a NOVA explodes, just not when. All you need to do is adjust the speed to hit your target before the time runs out. So in 8 seconds (or however long it will take before the shell to burn up by the inner explosion) it will get to your target no matter the distance.

The problem there is that covenant ships have really good point defenses and could destroy any missile or Nova Bomb that comes at them unless their overwhelmed by a massive amount of them.

  • 05.14.2011 6:21 PM PDT

the fleet was stupid in a number of respects, their single biggest asset was so under-used! the best asset in the human fleet was Prowlers, they are capable of inflicting so much damage on enemy forces without using Magnetic Accelerator Cannons or Archer Missiles, want to destroy a Covenant fleet with a NOVA? load said NOVA onto a Prowler, go dark and sneak to a point where the fleet will pass by, make sure your NOVA is stealth modified, deploy and fall-back, watch the fireworks! there is no reason that plan wouldn't work since Prowlers are very very hard to detect, nuclear ordnance is only detectable when exiting faster than light travel. given more time to prepare for a war against the Covenant I think Prowlers would have been better utilised and important planets would have been protected by mine-fields and such.

also no the Reach fleet shouldn't have fallen back, Reach was one of the most important worlds in our territory, it would never have been abandoned!

  • 05.15.2011 8:15 AM PDT

It wouldn't have worked. Chances are, the Covenant could've tracked them to the location they slipspaced to, bringing Halo 2 around quicker.

  • 05.15.2011 8:39 AM PDT

hit and run isn't effective against the Covenant though, due to the long range of a lot of their naval weapons. also massed fire is the best way of penetrating Covenant shielding and causing real damage to their ships.

so in a defensive situation I think formation is the best call, the biggest irritation for me personally in regards to human naval tactics in Halo (one which in my own fiction and post-war fleet have fixed) is the lack of nuclear ordnance used in engagements, these enormous ships are stated at having 'three' nuclear missiles, THREE!! right now on this planet, hidden under the waves, ballistic missile submarines (like the USN Ohio Class) are carrying as many as 192 nuclear warheads, these submarines are only ~170 metres long, which is only around a third the length of a Frigate in Halo. also nuclear ordnance is proven to be a very effective weapon against Covenant in naval engagements, especially the HORNET mines deployed by Prowlers.

in a post-war short story I have been writing (which takes place in an alternate Halo Universe where Earth was lost!) a Covenant fleet enters an enormous asteroid field (caused by the collision of two planets! and home to BASTION, one of the human fortresses/naval bases), the fleet gets almost annihilated by a large amount of stealth, nuclear mines and a number of concealed missile batteries.

  • 05.15.2011 8:40 AM PDT

the orbital defence platforms were fine, we just made one absolutely fatal mistake in their design! the S-MAC was perfect the way it once, it would absolutely junk any Covenant warship it hit without exception due to the insane muzzle velocity and the mass of the projectile, wouldn't just junk the ship would likely shatter it! the fatal problem with the defence platforms was the lack of point defences, since the Covenant didn't engage them head on, that would have been suicidal! they sent boarding craft and single-ships to take them down, which worked perfectly due to a couple of factors, one the platforms had no notable anti-aircraft batteries and two had rather small crews and no automated defences inside.

if the platforms were protected by batteries and had internal defences (thick security doors, automated weapons, and AI with control over atmosphere able to vent compartments into space!) destroying them would have been very difficult. hell why not station a bunch of SPARTAN-III soldiers on each platform, they were after-all mass produced, cheap SPARTAN troopers, what is more important than ensuring the S-MAC platforms remain operational?

if I could set up Reach defences it would have went like this, far out there would have been sentinel satellites to detect incoming threats well before they entered orbit, lots and lots of these forming a 'sensor shield' around Reach. second line of defence would have been orbital mine-fields and Prowler patrols (with HORNET mines), third line of defence would have been the S-MAC platforms (with anti-aircraft batteries!) and the main fleet, also orbital hangers for bombers. fourth and final level of defence would be a contingency plan, in-case orbital defences are breached and the Covenant begin landing, have satellites in orbit (with stealth coatings and such!) with nuclear ordnance and kinetic energy 'rods', have them linked to ground forces so area denial support can be called in from the orbital satellites using laser designator, make like almost impossible for the Covenant and then if all else fails, NOVA bomb too make sure they regret ever taking Reach!

  • 05.15.2011 9:29 AM PDT

what would you rather do, destroy them, or let the Covenant have them! as I said make them pay dearly for ever setting foot on Reach, they loose a fleet, countless crusaders and a 'holy' relic. it got nuked in the game when Halsey and Noble evacuated, that sort of a blast could only have been nuclear.

  • 05.15.2011 9:41 AM PDT

Posted by:ScubaToaster
Posted by: HipiO7
This man, this man right here put it so eloquently that I actually cancelled my own 2000+ word long post.
/slow clap for respect


:)
The person who said participating is important, not winning, obviously never won anything.

The UNSC had to much to loose at Reach, they had to defend it at all costs.

I'm 100% positive they would have used a NOVA bomb to defend Reach, if they ever had the chance to get one up to orbit.

  • 05.15.2011 11:47 AM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.

Don't quite understand why people say a Nova bomb would defend Reach. For one it was still an experimental gamble to use it at the time it fell, and second off its blast radius would do more damage to Reach itself in one second than the entire Covenant fleet in just as much time.

Sure if they had full confidence in the bomb and intercepted the Covenant far far, far away from Reach it could be a viable defense strategy, but to deploy it against an enemy fleet in close proximity to the planet is more of a method of denying the Covenant resources and relics rather than defending it. It'd leave barely anything left to defend.

  • 05.30.2011 7:05 PM PDT


Posted by: StealthSlasher2
Don't quite understand why people say a Nova bomb would defend Reach. For one it was still an experimental gamble to use it at the time it fell, and second off its blast radius would do more damage to Reach itself in one second than the entire Covenant fleet in just as much time.

Sure if they had full confidence in the bomb and intercepted the Covenant far far, far away from Reach it could be a viable defense strategy, but to deploy it against an enemy fleet in close proximity to the planet is more of a method of denying the Covenant resources and relics rather than defending it. It'd leave barely anything left to defend.


Kill more friendlies then enemies.

  • 05.30.2011 7:18 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: Dustin 6047
I meant like this.


Again it relies on intercepting the Covenant far, far away from the planet.

There's also the issue of the NOVA's maximum range. It's certainly not the average nuclear mine. Anything but, so deploying it in a similar manner would be unfeasible. Given the risks it would be one hell of a gamble to try and set it up that way without knowing the minimum safe distance for the fleet, and still keep it in a spot where the Covenant would likely pass through on its way to engage Reach's defenses.

Edit:

Let's also not forget the fact that, as a whole, the Covenant fleet is constantly advancing towards the UNSC fleet. They're not all staying back and taking pot shots at the defenses. So the idea of placing a NOVA all the way behind them out of reach of Reach's defense becomes a moot inefficient idea as the Covenant rapidly close the distance.

[Edited on 05.31.2011 1:19 AM PDT]

  • 05.30.2011 11:00 PM PDT
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Posted by: Dustin 6047
I wonder if a NOVA bomb could blow up a star. Then a whole system would be dead instead of just a moon sized area.
Like a scorched earth policy?

  • 06.01.2011 1:57 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: Pandora117

Posted by: Dustin 6047
I wonder if a NOVA bomb could blow up a star. Then a whole system would be dead instead of just a moon sized area.
Like a scorched earth policy?


That'd basically be the effect if Novas were used to crack stars, but it's pointless in this case.

The Covenant weren't out to steal human resources and thrive off of them. They were out to just plain kill humans. Denying the Covenant additional resources could be beneficial in the long run, or using a Nova to disrupt existing Covenant supply lines, but constantly retreating and destroying all resources along the way isn't productive in terms of actually fighting the Covenant back and winning the war. Scorched earth policies only work if the enemy is dependent on the resources left behind as they advance.

It's incredibly effective in Russia because once the winter sets in, logistics for transferring food and other supplies becomes a nightmare in the snow (and that's without any blizzards and what not stirring up). Thus food and the like would be better off scavenged from the territory that's taken. But when the Russians decide to burn all the fuel resources, farms, food stock, etc then that invading army is properly screwed and needs to turn around or face hell.

The Covenant do not face that type of logistical issue where they would starve to death or be killed by naturally occurring weather in space. With slipspace travel, a non existent system can be by passed without a care in the world. Natural resources are still plentiful well within their own territory.

  • 06.01.2011 2:11 PM PDT
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OMFG Halo Now On The NES!!!
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Welcome to the internet, where expressing your opinion is an act of war.

Roger that. But what if you use a NOVA bomb to make the host star go supernova(hopefully) killing the Covenant fleet in the progress.

  • 06.01.2011 2:17 PM PDT


Posted by: Pandora117
Roger that. But what if you use a NOVA bomb to make the host star go supernova(hopefully) killing the Covenant fleet in the progress.


You'd also kill friendlies, unless they had somehow managed to run.

Also denies the UNSC the chances of coming back (should the war be won) and recolonizing the world, or getting resources from the other planets.

  • 06.01.2011 2:25 PM PDT

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