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This topic has moved here: Subject: The Lockout vs. Guardian Debate
  • Subject: The Lockout vs. Guardian Debate
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Subject: The Lockout vs. Guardian Debate

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(

Here I am going to show you a detailed outline of the comparison of Lockout vs. Guardian. You can decide for yourself which is the better map, but I will show you how much skill there is involved to mastering Guardian over Lockout.

Feel free to post videos of Lockout gameplay to show skill involved for the map itself. Also, some quality gameplay from each will be highlighted here. This post is currently for instructional purposes, but will be edited later for clarity and quality.

Links for Lockout: to be updated

List of Jumps: Coming soon!

Importance of Spawn/Map control:

Gameplays:
FB MLG Oddball

Links for Guardian: to be updated

List of Tactical Jumps:
S1 to S3
Shortcut to Blue
Gold 1 to Gold 2
Bottom Mid to Top Mid
Stump Jump
A few others here, but I might refilm some of the good one's myself and put in list

Importance of Spawn/Map Control:
note to self: something here?http://www.youtube.com/user/SLEEKYx16

Guardian Gameplays:
In game tutorials? lol

[Edited on 05.14.2011 12:58 AM PDT]

  • 05.14.2011 12:29 AM PDT

Halo 2 for Life!

I think your doing alot of work for no reason.

halo wiki has over view of all maps and MLG websites have very detailed stragies for each maps.

You could make it yourself but others have already done it.

  • 05.14.2011 1:01 AM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(


Posted by: totallymassive
You could make it yourself


Probably the best idea for me to do it since I'm going to link all of this to counterpoint a post that one of the users made on another thread. I guess I could just move it there, but the guy had like a wall of stuff to address because he didn't go into any detail so I got to make counterarguments with facts.

[Edited on 05.14.2011 1:43 AM PDT]

  • 05.14.2011 1:31 AM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(

Alright so basically I need some footage of gameplay useful lockout jumps...

[Edited on 05.14.2011 2:00 AM PDT]

  • 05.14.2011 1:44 AM PDT

no. nonono

In Halo 2 & 3 Bungie put a lot of effort into making nifty little shortcuts like you have linked. So far it doesn't look like there are any in Reach D:

  • 05.14.2011 2:32 AM PDT

Posted by: HiredN00bs
Arrogant hyperbolic exclamations of woe? Seems like a normal day for Halo/Bungie.net.

Posted by: droppedasababy
In Halo 2 & 3 Bungie put a lot of effort into making nifty little shortcuts like you have linked. So far it doesn't look like there are any in Reach D:


Sword Base, Zealot, Powerhouse...

  • 05.14.2011 3:02 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

G1-G2 > Any jump in lockout.

Lockouts jump didn't require as much precision as Halo 3s but they were still hard (at the start)

  • 05.14.2011 3:48 AM PDT

no. nonono

Posted by: Method Man NYC
Posted by: droppedasababy
In Halo 2 & 3 Bungie put a lot of effort into making nifty little shortcuts like you have linked. So far it doesn't look like there are any in Reach D:


Sword Base, Zealot, Powerhouse...
I haven't heard of any on these maps. Link?

  • 05.14.2011 4:14 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

Posted by: droppedasababy
Posted by: Method Man NYC
Posted by: droppedasababy
In Halo 2 & 3 Bungie put a lot of effort into making nifty little shortcuts like you have linked. So far it doesn't look like there are any in Reach D:


Sword Base, Zealot, Powerhouse...
I haven't heard of any on these maps. Link?

Colonel Grade 1

People are getting worse at trolling

  • 05.14.2011 4:40 AM PDT

no. nonono

Posted by: xMclovin IRE
Posted by: droppedasababy
Posted by: Method Man NYC
Posted by: droppedasababy
In Halo 2 & 3 Bungie put a lot of effort into making nifty little shortcuts like you have linked. So far it doesn't look like there are any in Reach D:


Sword Base, Zealot, Powerhouse...
I haven't heard of any on these maps. Link?

Colonel Grade 1

People are getting worse at trolling
What are you talking about? I don't see how I am "trolling" and I don't know what rank has to do with anything.

  • 05.14.2011 4:50 AM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(


Posted by: xMclovin IRE
G1-G2 > Any jump in lockout.

Lockouts jump didn't require as much precision as Halo 3s but they were still hard (at the start)


I've pulled off all of the top 4 that I listed a lot. The gheyy jump actually started in MLG, but for some reason it's the least known.

  • 05.14.2011 9:23 AM PDT

We're the Flintstones kids, ten million strong and growing...

Glass Galaxies - a theme for bungie.net

Per audacia ad astra. Halo Reach | Destiny

Posted by: xMclovin IRE
Posted by: droppedasababy
Posted by: Method Man NYC
Posted by: droppedasababy
In Halo 2 & 3 Bungie put a lot of effort into making nifty little shortcuts like you have linked. So far it doesn't look like there are any in Reach D:


Sword Base, Zealot, Powerhouse...
I haven't heard of any on these maps. Link?

Colonel Grade 1

People are getting worse at trolling

....what? I'm a brig and I've never heard of any half-decent jumps or anything in any of these maps. Does that make me a troll too?

  • 05.14.2011 10:13 AM PDT

no. nonono

Posted by: Zoidberg25
Posted by: xMclovin IRE
Posted by: droppedasababy
Posted by: Method Man NYC
Posted by: droppedasababy
In Halo 2 & 3 Bungie put a lot of effort into making nifty little shortcuts like you have linked. So far it doesn't look like there are any in Reach D:


Sword Base, Zealot, Powerhouse...
I haven't heard of any on these maps. Link?

Colonel Grade 1

People are getting worse at trolling

....what? I'm a brig and I've never heard of any half-decent jumps or anything in any of these maps. Does that make me a troll too?
Shut up troll go back to the flood

  • 05.14.2011 5:30 PM PDT

We're the Flintstones kids, ten million strong and growing...

Glass Galaxies - a theme for bungie.net

Per audacia ad astra. Halo Reach | Destiny

Posted by: droppedasababy
Posted by: Zoidberg25
Posted by: xMclovin IRE
Posted by: droppedasababy
Posted by: Method Man NYC
Sword Base, Zealot, Powerhouse...
I haven't heard of any on these maps. Link?

Colonel Grade 1

People are getting worse at trolling

....what? I'm a brig and I've never heard of any half-decent jumps or anything in any of these maps. Does that make me a troll too?
Shut up troll go back to the flood

I know right :x people scream "troll!" at the first sight of something they don't understand or disagree with

  • 05.14.2011 6:05 PM PDT

Gamers Anon

Achronos: And what's this about a "design team" I've been hearing? Apparently stosh is so awesome he's now considered a "team".

I like both maps for different reasons and I personally find the two maps incomparable.

  • 05.14.2011 6:24 PM PDT

"No Mission Too Difficult, No Sacrifice Too Great—Duty First!" - The fighting first's motto.

Losing internet 9/7/2012 until i don't know when. See you starside folks.


Fada beo Halo 2!

Posted by: totallymassive
I think your doing alot of work for no reason.

halo wiki has over view of all maps and MLG websites have very detailed stragies for each maps.

You could make it yourself but others have already done it.


i like Halo wiki, it's an awesome site with lot's of information, on multiplayer, and the campaign.

  • 05.14.2011 8:32 PM PDT

This is a Reach account that I created the day they announced his name in a bnet weekly update. Any stats regarding ODST or Halo 3 are irrelevant. Also, Halo CE master race. Halo 1 > other halo games > other games.

Account Status: Silver :(

Posted by: Chief077
Posted by: totallymassive
I think your doing alot of work for no reason.

halo wiki has over view of all maps and MLG websites have very detailed stragies for each maps.

You could make it yourself but others have already done it.


i like Halo wiki, it's an awesome site with lot's of information, on multiplayer, and the campaign.


True, but not for comparing the competitiveness and skill of maps.

  • 05.14.2011 8:45 PM PDT

Lockout and Guardian were both the best maps for their respective titles. The only thing I didn't like about Guardian was the entire section of the blue room. I'm not a jumper and I don't really try toooo hard to use any tactics at all. I just think they have a nice flow.

  • 05.15.2011 10:48 AM PDT

This is actually the stupidest thing ever posted on B.net:

Posted by: the omega man117
Why does everyone hate Halo 2? Maybe its because its the worst game ever next to mario.


Posted by: Muzza777
I like both maps for different reasons and I personally find the two maps incomparable.

  • 05.15.2011 12:53 PM PDT
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  • Noble Heroic Member

"A life lived for others is the only life worth living" - Albert Einstein

"I have your RCON right here." - Iggwilv

"Always my pleasure to be lazy." - InvasionImminent

Here's a video to be used for reference towards Lockout jumps Personally, I always found the Lockout jumps harder, but, that's just me.

  • 05.15.2011 1:55 PM PDT
  • gamertag: HD LAG
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Halo fanboy since December 2001.

My other account has a 2 day ban, but this is Noble Six.


Posted by: Dr Syx
Here's a video to be used for reference towards Lockout jumps Personally, I always found the Lockout jumps harder, but, that's just me.


I disagree because the jumps I have listed are actually used a lot in MLG while those jumps are more just for tricks. I could find tons of trick videos, but I am trying to show tactical jumps. If you think these Guardian jumps are easy just send a video of you pulling them off in a row. That's what knightxofxlight did in an actual 1v1.

  • 05.15.2011 2:03 PM PDT
  •  | 
  • Noble Heroic Member

"A life lived for others is the only life worth living" - Albert Einstein

"I have your RCON right here." - Iggwilv

"Always my pleasure to be lazy." - InvasionImminent

The reason most of these jumps aren't normally seen in MLG tournaments is because they're harder to pull off. They have actual use. Many get you to places much faster. The thing is, though, if you fail at it, you die. You look like a complete idiot in an actual competitive match falling off the edge trying to do a gimmicky jump.

There are a few of those that are often used. One is to get from the main platform to the sniper tower. Another is to get from the bridges to the top floors by way of the door frame. I've seen people jump from bridge to bridge many times as well. Now another one that came to me while typing this is the slide jumps at Sniper tower down to the bridge to take you to the Gravity Lift room and the one from Red Tower to the main platform.

By the way, I never said they were easy. That's the problem with a lot of people on here in interpretation. Just because I say I think one thing is harder doesn't mean I believe the other is easy. I've done most, if not all, the jumps on both Guardian/Lockout. I found Lockout's to a bit more challenging.

[Edited on 05.15.2011 2:17 PM PDT]

  • 05.15.2011 2:15 PM PDT
  • gamertag: HD LAG
  • user homepage:

Halo fanboy since December 2001.

You say they are harder? Care to show a video of you doing these H3 one's yourself. It takes more 30 minutes to learn each of them effectively except for G1 to G2. Pull off each twice in a row and I'll believe you. There are about a dozen tactical jumps for guardian and they all take a reasonable amount of skill. Several of the jumps you shown were never once used in MLG because they are trick jumps and not the same thing. I kind of get annoyed when people say these Guardian jumps are easy, especially from non 50s.

For example these kinds of jumps are not tactical jumps. That's my Canadian friend, Cody Sheppard not me. Jumps that are not used in matchmaking or for actual gameplay do not count.

[Edited on 05.15.2011 2:36 PM PDT]

  • 05.15.2011 2:30 PM PDT
  •  | 
  • Noble Heroic Member

"A life lived for others is the only life worth living" - Albert Einstein

"I have your RCON right here." - Iggwilv

"Always my pleasure to be lazy." - InvasionImminent

You continuously say that I claim they're easy when I've just said I never said that. They're hard, but, I had more difficulty doing the ones on Lockout than I did with Guardian. I even said "That's just me" as in that was my experience. It might not be the experience of everyone, but it was mine. Actually read my posts before replying to them.

Also, what does being a 50 have to do with jumping around on a map? It's obvious if you look at my profile that I didn't have much time with the game online. I don't take the game seriously in any sense. I never take any of them seriously. The only time I ever did was back in the Halo: CE/Halo 2/Early Halo 3 days and that was only at tournaments to win money, which, I did numerous times. (Yes, even Halo 3).


Posted by: Lag in HD
For example these kinds of jumps are not tactical jumps. That's my Canadian friend, Cody Sheppard not me. Jumps that are not used in matchmaking or for actual gameplay do not count.
Yet again, did you even look at my reply or assume what I said? I gave examples of jumps that are used in actual gameplay. All of which I do on the typical game.

[Edited on 05.15.2011 2:38 PM PDT]

  • 05.15.2011 2:33 PM PDT
  • gamertag: HD LAG
  • user homepage:

Halo fanboy since December 2001.

I find Guardians jumps harder imo, but I can't really do either atm coz I've been away from XbL for a while.

  • 05.15.2011 3:17 PM PDT

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