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Subject: Why didn't they flash clone troopers?

Think about it, they are going to die anyway, why not clone marines and send them to the front lines to fend off Covenant forces? They cloned Spartans, I'm sure Marines are no different, would be similar to the Clone Army of Star Wars, a gene host creating clones out of the gene pool. They could make an army in such a short amount of time. Considering that Halsey managed to replace the clones with the Spartans and the clones was the same age as the Spartan, they managed growth acceleration.

If someone has an answer as to why not, go ahead and fill me in.

  • 06.01.2011 12:31 AM PDT

PEANUT-BUTTER SLAP!

It's illegal and I don't remember seeing anything that actually says how long they live. Would kinda suck if 1/8 of your troops dropped dead, wouldn't it?

  • 06.01.2011 12:46 AM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

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Posted by: mojeda101
Think about it, they are going to die anyway, why not clone marines and send them to the front lines to fend off Covenant forces? They cloned Spartans, I'm sure Marines are no different, would be similar to the Clone Army of Star Wars, a gene host creating clones out of the gene pool. They could make an army in such a short amount of time. Considering that Halsey managed to replace the clones with the Spartans and the clones was the same age as the Spartan, they managed growth acceleration.

If someone has an answer as to why not, go ahead and fill me in.


There was a discussion about this before. It's simply not viable because:

- Extremely short lifespan of flash cloned individuals
- Clones still require training
- Clones still take up resources (uniforms, guns, medical supplies etc)

...among other things. It's not cost effective to use additional resources for what will be dead man in no time guaranteed in or out of the battlefield than to outfit a natural human being with a normal lifespan.

  • 06.01.2011 12:47 AM PDT

My name is Legion, for we are many.

The difference between Star Wars and Halo is that cloning technology in Star Wars was developed by aliens (I forgot their species name) and developed by humans in Halo. Also, they didn't grow the babies slowly like in Star Wars, they flash cloned them, and flash reproduction causes severe and irreversible genetic damage. The cloned Spartans all died of neurological/biological diseases not long after they were produced.

  • 06.01.2011 3:18 AM PDT
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Because we wanted to play Halo not Star Wars.

  • 06.01.2011 3:45 AM PDT

Que Pasta...?
:D

Simple, it's unethical.

One of the beautiful facts about humans is that, even in a time of genocidal war, our main populations would still be disgusted in knowing something we as a species consider wrong is occurring, even if it's for the good of us all.

And a government simply couldn't do it in secret, as people would notice. Analysts would notice the amount of resources going into use, and would wonder who they were being used by, as, especially that far into the future, the size of our population would likely be recorded, and the amount of equipment in use just wouldn't fit the number of people recorded as in action.

Ps, sorry for any bad grammar or babbling, I'm tired... ^.^

  • 06.01.2011 3:56 AM PDT

Ridiculous food requirements.

  • 06.01.2011 5:56 AM PDT

Posted by: katamariguy
Ridiculous food requirements.
They die in a few weeks you don't need food. Just grow 'em and send 'em out to their deaths.

  • 06.01.2011 6:10 AM PDT

Posted by: ElementalRunner

Posted by: Commander Stroll
Still using a pump-action shotgun over 500 years in the future I see.

omg not realistic stop game production plz


Posted by: ThePredkiller2
Posted by: katamariguy
Ridiculous food requirements.
They die in a few weeks you don't need food. Just grow 'em and send 'em out to their deaths.


This guy is definately the next head of the UN Ethics Office.

  • 06.01.2011 8:38 AM PDT

I like Call of Duty and Gears of War, AND Halo. Why must everyone else like only one or the other?


Posted by: carpy444
Simple, it's unethical.


And that would stop the government? That didn't stop them from kidnapping kids to put into the SPARTAN program. (and that was before the huge genocidal Covenant arrived on the scene) If they felt justified in kidnapping children to serve against a threat as pathetic as the Insurrection, how much more justified would they feel they would be to take unethical action to fight against a seemingly unstoppable threat?

  • 06.01.2011 8:59 AM PDT

Posted by: CoolCJ24

Posted by: ThePredkiller2
Posted by: katamariguy
Ridiculous food requirements.
They die in a few weeks you don't need food. Just grow 'em and send 'em out to their deaths.


This guy is definately the next head of the UN Ethics Office.


No thank you, I don't deal in politics...

[Edited on 06.01.2011 9:04 AM PDT]

  • 06.01.2011 9:04 AM PDT

We Are The Meta.

It was easy for the UNSC to flash clone children rather than adults, clone children already got sick/die very quickly. To use troopers would:
a, make it harder to keep the cloning secret.
b, they wouldn't last as long as the children versions/already weaker versions to begin with.
c, cost (simple government choice there).
d, if the clone troopers died during training, there wouldn't be many for battle/clones might not actually be able to survive long in war conditions e.g. stress/fear/wounds etc...

  • 06.01.2011 9:26 AM PDT

Posted by: Brutal Subley
It was easy for the UNSC to flash clone children rather than adults, clone children already got sick/die very quickly. To use troopers would:
a, make it harder to keep the cloning secret.
b, they wouldn't last as long as the children versions/already weaker versions to begin with.
c, cost (simple government choice there).
d, if the clone troopers died during training, there wouldn't be many for battle/clones might not actually be able to survive long in war conditions e.g. stress/fear/wounds etc...


Why do children last longer if they're weaker? That doesn't make any sense whatsoever...

  • 06.01.2011 9:32 AM PDT

Scientifically, the clones in Wars were "birthed" in artificial "wombs" on the planet Kamino, a world dedicated entirely to the science of cloning and building the Republic's army. During the fetus stage, the Kaminoans artificially induced specialized growth hormones to make the Clones grow faster (and be more readily fit for duty upon being born). It took a longer time for the Clones to be born.

Halo's human clones were made fast--Flashed--into existance by way of Flash Cloning, a quicker, less expensive, but severely less effective method then the Kaminoan's clones in Wars.

  • 06.01.2011 10:40 AM PDT

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I suppose its not really moral issues the UNSC had on their mind. They kidnapped 6 year olds augmented them, and put them into battlefields anyway, so they didnt really care about being unethical.
I guess its really down to money. The amount of resources they would require. They would probably need more medical supplies than normal marines because of their health conditions. Also they wouldnt be very good in a fight. Daisy 023's clone could barely move and was in a wheelchair. I dont think a flashcloned marine would be very efficient in a war.

  • 06.01.2011 11:44 AM PDT

Posted by: mojeda101
Think about it, they are going to die anyway, why not clone marines and send them to the front lines to fend off Covenant forces? They cloned Spartans, I'm sure Marines are no different, would be similar to the Clone Army of Star Wars, a gene host creating clones out of the gene pool. They could make an army in such a short amount of time. Considering that Halsey managed to replace the clones with the Spartans and the clones was the same age as the Spartan, they managed growth acceleration.

If someone has an answer as to why not, go ahead and fill me in.
The clones they replaced the Spartans with were brain dead. Flash-cloning whole bodies is super-expensive, resource intensive, and highly illegal.

Even if they regular-cloned them, it would still take years and probably trillions of dollars to get a significant, trained force. Highly impractical. Better just to use already grown and functioning men as soldiers.

Also, they'd be sued by the Kaminoins, who, may I remind you, have Jedi lawyers.

  • 06.01.2011 11:54 AM PDT
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- Clones still require training

Training may not be a huge issue. We know that Halo humans have the ability to transfer memories from one brain to another. It may have been possible to have a clone soldier who already has all of the training they would need. It does have a 95% failure rate, so perhaps not the best option.

Was manpower even a serious problem for the UNSC?


  • 06.01.2011 11:57 AM PDT

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Posted by: opogjijijp
- Clones still require training

Training may not be a huge issue. We know that Halo humans have the ability to transfer memories from one brain to another. It may have been possible to have a clone soldier who already has all of the training they would need. It does have a 95% failure rate, so perhaps not the best option.

Was manpower even a serious problem for the UNSC?



What are you talking about?

  • 06.01.2011 12:01 PM PDT

Brains beats brawn get used to it

Fear the Red Comet

Variety is the spice of life.
Long live games.
Death to all fanboys.


Posted by: opogjijijp
- Clones still require training

Training may not be a huge issue. We know that Halo humans have the ability to transfer memories from one brain to another. It may have been possible to have a clone soldier who already has all of the training they would need. It does have a 95% failure rate, so perhaps not the best option.

Was manpower even a serious problem for the UNSC?




When did the memory thing happen?

  • 06.01.2011 2:01 PM PDT

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The same reason every marine doesn't drive a scorpion. Money.

The cost of cloning is probably expensive and uses vast resources. It probably isn't as cost effective as simply recruiting new naturally grown humans.

On the other hand it is necessary and effective for perhaps replacing stolen children for building hyper-expensive super soldiers. Other than that it simply doesn't make sense to deal with the giant cost and resources of creating a clone army. Cloning works alot like normal pregnancy, except in a tube. If you wanted to clone an army you would do better to force insemination of woman, same effect, just not the perfectly same genes.

  • 06.01.2011 2:56 PM PDT


Posted by: Buggy Virus
The same reason every marine doesn't drive a scorpion. Money.

The cost of cloning is probably expensive and uses vast resources. It probably isn't as cost effective as simply recruiting new naturally grown humans.

On the other hand it is necessary and effective for perhaps replacing stolen children for building hyper-expensive super soldiers. Other than that it simply doesn't make sense to deal with the giant cost and resources of creating a clone army. Cloning works alot like normal pregnancy, except in a tube. If you wanted to clone an army you would do better to force insemination of woman, same effect, just not the perfectly same genes.

Going along with how it's not worth the financial cost, if I remember correctly the number of soldiers never really made a difference in the conflict, as it usually came down to combat between ships above the planet, as even a million soldiers on the ground wouldn't have much of a chance against orbital bombardment/glassing. So it's only logical that they invest more money and effort into building ships and orbital defenses rather than use it on ineffective soldiers.

  • 06.01.2011 3:04 PM PDT
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Posted by: opogjijijp
Was manpower even a serious problem for the UNSC?

No, I don't think so. After all there would be millions of volunteers from dozens of colonies to fill up the ranks, and if there was a shortage they could easily start a draft and conscript millions more, probably even billions.

  • 06.01.2011 4:04 PM PDT


Posted by: Buggy Virus
The same reason every marine doesn't drive a scorpion. Money.

The cost of cloning is probably expensive and uses vast resources. It probably isn't as cost effective as simply recruiting new naturally grown humans.

On the other hand it is necessary and effective for perhaps replacing stolen children for building hyper-expensive super soldiers. Other than that it simply doesn't make sense to deal with the giant cost and resources of creating a clone army. Cloning works alot like normal pregnancy, except in a tube. If you wanted to clone an army you would do better to force insemination of woman, same effect, just not the perfectly same genes.


I think the Scorpion argument also has roots in gameplay and in strategy.
Scorpion divisions helping you through gameplay would make the game so easy that you don't have to do anything.
Scorpions can't search houses, go through narrow pasegways (which are all to abundant in Halo games), or aim stright up.

And yes, they are pretty expensive... I think.

  • 06.01.2011 4:49 PM PDT

Even if flash cloned troopers worked, you are still spending lots to outfit them fully.

  • 06.01.2011 5:04 PM PDT

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Even if flash cloned troopers worked, you are still spending lots to outfit them fully.


I don't think money is an issue when you are about to become extinct.

  • 06.01.2011 5:19 PM PDT

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