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Subject: Should Noble Six have died differently?

Posted by: S_034

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Ackerson may want to put his own projects ahead of Halseys, but he isn't that incredibly stupid to order Six to attack Spartans, in the middle of battle.

Likewise, I highly doubt Six would follow such an order...


I dunno. In Uprising Ackerson essentially sacrifices the city of Cleveland just to dick around with the Covenant. That's several million people who WILL die just because he wants to go out being an a-hole. Reach is already toast. He's off-world. There are a half-dozen different reasons that he would want S-IIs dead at any point in time, and then at least another dozen possible scenarios for wanting those particular Spartans dead within that specific scenario. They could have been carrying some data he wanted, which is why Six starts the mission on that little tower; he could have been broadcasting it back to Ackerson. That area could be, somehow, the entrance to something Ackerson wants kept secret. It could be CASTLE Base or something else. Who knows? The Spartans could have been on to it and Six was sent in to clean up the mess. I could play the "what if" game all day. The point is, the whole of the last mission makes no sense any other way. The entire game up to this point is super objective-driven, perhaps more so than any other Halo game. Yet here, the objectives just drop out. Conclusion? Six just fulfilled his objective and hasn't been issued a new one yet.

And Six's role for almost all of his soldiering career has been clandestine assassination. The ENTIRETY of the game we play is pretty much the opposite of how he'd do things; the only level where Six would really be doing what he does best is Nightfall, right at the beginning when nobody knows he's coming. What we may be seeing is Six's only fulfillment in the whole storyline of his purpose in life. Never mind the fact that for God knows how long, Six reported only to Ackerson. He's probably more loyal to Ackerson than he is to any other human or organization out there, because for almost all of his career he's been Ackerson's pet murderbot. I don't think he'd bat an eye at killing off a bunch of Spartans, particularly since Reach was lost already. He doesn't have any more reason to be loyal to these Spartans than he did to be loyal to any of the dozens or hundreds of people he assassinated prior.


Okay, but that doesn't necessarily mean he liked Ackerson. He was most likely just following orders. Maybe the reason he stayed behind to die is because he felt regret, and he didn't want Ackerson to receive fame for his accomplishments, so he died. Seems believable to me? What are your thoughts on this?

  • 06.07.2011 8:34 AM PDT
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Gettin' all Herodotean up in here!


Posted by: ThePredkiller2

Okay, but that doesn't necessarily mean he liked Ackerson.
It doesn't necessarily mean that he liked Ackerson, but we've got nothing to indicate that he disliked Ackerson, either. Think about this. For who knows how long, Ackerson has been 312's only real symbol of authority. Spartan-312 has been getting anything and everything he has in life from and through Ackerson, and Ackerson knows it. Ackerson may be an evil d-bag, but he's not an idiot. If you've got a personal assassin, possibly the most effective personal assassin the galaxy has ever seen, are you gonna piss him off? Ackerson has every reason to keep S-312 happy with him. It's good for Ackerson, and therefore it's safe to assume that Ackerson did everything in his power to make sure that was the case.

He was most likely just following orders. And? Personal feelings are pretty much irrelevant as long as he's still willing to follow orders.

Maybe the reason he stayed behind to die is because he felt regret, For? He's a soldier. He follows orders. Ackerson's been giving those orders, presumably with good justifications to back them up. He follows those orders, everything stays copacetic. He's got nothing to burden his conscience. Never mind the fact that from most of the descriptions we've gotten, 312 is a borderline psychopath with a penchant for murder-face. The idea that he sacrificed himself out of guilt doesn't fly, because there's no guilt there.

and he didn't want Ackerson to receive fame for his accomplishments, so he died. Seems believable to me? What are your thoughts on this? Why would he care? It's not like Ackerson's somehow getting fame for S-312's accomplishments prior to Reach. Ackerson isn't taking Noble Six's accomplishments, like singlehandedly demolishing Innie militias, and saying "I did that." Nobody would buy that, because Ackerson's a desk jockey. Never mind the fact that even if it was about credit or accomplishments, Ackerson's got a better chance of taking credit now that 312's dead than when he was alive, because when he was alive they could have just given him the credit.

Never mind the fact that what you say doesn't explain the scenario presented to us by the last level.

  • 06.07.2011 10:42 AM PDT

wll cheif and some of his team made it off alive in the originol storys so i think that this is incorrect

  • 06.07.2011 11:09 AM PDT
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Posted by: StingyDogtyler1
Well, Chief and some of his team made it off alive in the original stories, so i think that this is incorrect.


You think what is incorrect? What are you even referring to? Clarify, NOW.

  • 06.07.2011 2:40 PM PDT

Posted by: S_034

Posted by: ThePredkiller2

Okay, but that doesn't necessarily mean he liked Ackerson.
It doesn't necessarily mean that he liked Ackerson, but we've got nothing to indicate that he disliked Ackerson, either. Think about this. For who knows how long, Ackerson has been 312's only real symbol of authority. Spartan-312 has been getting anything and everything he has in life from and through Ackerson, and Ackerson knows it. Ackerson may be an evil d-bag, but he's not an idiot. If you've got a personal assassin, possibly the most effective personal assassin the galaxy has ever seen, are you gonna piss him off? Ackerson has every reason to keep S-312 happy with him. It's good for Ackerson, and therefore it's safe to assume that Ackerson did everything in his power to make sure that was the case.

People in his position of power, and with his personality, really don't care about pissing anyone off as long as they get what they want. If what you are saying is even remotely close to the truth, then why would Ackerson care about pissing off Six if he is getting what he wants? The SPARTANS were his brainchild, and he would get the credit.

He was most likely just following orders. And? Personal feelings are pretty much irrelevant as long as he's still willing to follow orders.

Yep, and SPARTANS are conditioned from birth to follow orders. Its not his fault. He's conditioned to do it, even if he doesn't want to.

Maybe the reason he stayed behind to die is because he felt regret, For? He's a soldier. He follows orders. Ackerson's been giving those orders, presumably with good justifications to back them up. He follows those orders, everything stays copacetic. He's got nothing to burden his conscience. Never mind the fact that from most of the descriptions we've gotten, 312 is a borderline psychopath with a penchant for murder-face. The idea that he sacrificed himself out of guilt doesn't fly, because there's no guilt there.

Well, "your" Noble Six, maybe, but "my" Noble Six has a degree of Humanity. If "my" Noble Six was aware of Ackerson's scheming, and he would, he is a bright fella, even after he followed Ackerson's orders as he was conditioned to do, he would still have felt a sting of guilt and self-loathing on a level he'd never felt before for killing a squad of his SPARTAN brothers. "My" Noble Six would make it a personal mission to make sure Ackerson's evil never left Reach.

and he didn't want Ackerson to receive fame for his accomplishments, so he died. Seems believable to me? What are your thoughts on this? Why would he care? It's not like Ackerson's somehow getting fame for S-312's accomplishments prior to Reach. Ackerson isn't taking Noble Six's accomplishments, like singlehandedly demolishing Innie militias, and saying "I did that." Nobody would buy that, because Ackerson's a desk jockey. Never mind the fact that even if it was about credit or accomplishments, Ackerson's got a better chance of taking credit now that 312's dead than when he was alive, because when he was alive they could have just given him the credit.

See above posts.

Never mind the fact that what you say doesn't explain the scenario presented to us by the last level.

By the way, I think you're taking what I'm saying in the complete opposite direction I was pushing it. I actually liked your theory, there were some parts I disagreed with, but for the most part I agree. I just don't think Noble Six is a heartless killing machine, even if he is working with Ackerson. My Noble Six was just stuck under his leadership against his own will, and is a good, kind-hearted soul. Other than that, none of what I have said has contradicted your idea...


Replies in italics and bold print.

[Edited on 06.07.2011 2:59 PM PDT]

  • 06.07.2011 2:59 PM PDT
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Gettin' all Herodotean up in here!



Posted by: ThePredkiller2

Duly noted. My feeling is that if Noble Six were so kind-hearted that killing fellow Spartans would make him suicidal, he probably wouldn't be a "hyper-lethal vector" or Ackerson's "personal grim reaper", but we really can't know at this point, so it's just as valid an opinion.

To be fair to myself, I find it hard to believe that Ackerson would be beefheaded enough to ever get on S-312's bad side. Ackerson may be an evil dickwad, but if there's one thing he does better than every living thing this side of the Flood, it's self-preserve. That's what 312's for. He solidifies Ackerson's position of power and eliminates anything and everything that might be a threat. Ackerson is ENTIRELY dependent on 312 for this kind of stuff, and there's absolutely no way he doesn't know it. Ackerson may not give a damn about what's best for humanity, but he sure knows what's best for him, and making sure 312 doesn't hate him is right up there. He knows the III series. He knows their tendencies toward mental aberrations and psychosis. 312 is described as a "hyper-lethal vector" and "a lone wolf assassin". What that means is that personal disposition aside, S-312 can sneak up behind you, murder you six different ways, burn your village and sell your women and children into slavery without you even realizing it happened until after he used your soul as chewing gum. 312 is insanely dangerous, and if anyone were to get on his bad side it's unlikely they'd see him coming. Would you piss him off? I sure as Hell wouldn't. And Ackerson may be a tool and a jackass, but he's not dumb enough to think that he can be a total dick to the most powerful killing machine at his disposal. Because a III-series like 312 would probably snap and turn his intestines into dental floss.

On a more serious note, I'd like to say that I'm sorry I jumped down your throat like that. I took your argument of Noble Six's "staying behind to die" to mean not getting on the Autumn, not his waiting to die following killing the other Spartans. And I thought you were talking about guilt for decades of following Ackerson's orders, not that one specific instance. That's my bad for misinterpreting.

[Edited on 06.07.2011 10:22 PM PDT]

  • 06.07.2011 5:10 PM PDT
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I don't think that Noble Six should have died in the game. His fate should have been ambiguous so the player could decide his fate themselves.

  • 06.26.2011 6:46 PM PDT


Posted by: That Atheist
She should have died in the Longsword. I like that idea.

Yes I just said She. I consider Noble Six to be female in cannon.
umadbro?


Inotmad. I think Halo needs more prominent female, main characters of the flesh and blood variety :P My Six is female too, I haven't got much of a back story for her though :/

As for the people saying Six was a personal grim reaper for Ackerson, we don't know who she was the assassin for in ONI, it is likely it is Colonel Ackerson, and if you want it to be that can be who is it is since every Six will have a different backstory, but it's not definite that he was her CO before being transferred to Noble Team. And another thing, why would she go back under Ackerson's command once the rest of Noble Team were gone? Also, while Spartans follow orders, they're not mindless puppets and won't follow a bull--blam!- order, such as going and killing other Spartans, nor would Ackerson, or any other officer, be stupid enough to order the deaths of Spartans (Humanity's greatest warriors).

And on the subject of Ackerson himself, he may be a very arrogant piece of work, but he's really a good guy. I'd probably compare him to Severus Snape in the Harry Potter series, not a pleasant guy to be around and someone that everybody hates, but he's not a villain. Ackerson made up the Forerunner artifact in Cleveland in order to protect his brother and the rest of the city. The Covenant did what he expected and merely rounded everybody in the Cleveland area up, and then a great deal of the population escaped...and on top of that it cost the Covenant a great deal of time and in the process lost one of their higher ranking Prophets. And the SIIIs, Ackerson may have proposed a callous plan and one that would get him into a position of power, but ultimately he also did it to buy valuable time for Humanity by stalling the Covenant war machine with the SIII's operations. So yes, Ackerson may be rather callous, selfish, and arrogant, but he's not such a bad guy deep down, he cares about preserving Humanity, albeit by any means necessary.

God...I can't believe I wrote up a defense of Colonel Ackerson XD Hahaha, lol.

  • 06.26.2011 9:19 PM PDT

And since his/her backstory and service history is left up the imagination, it could very well be more impressive than Master Chief's. Mine's is, and there is no argument that can unmake that.

  • 06.28.2011 7:35 PM PDT

Heh yeah Coma, Ackerson may have not liked the Spartan IIs, but his ONLY hostile action toward them would have been the rigging of the Mark V armor testing.

As for Six being Ackerson's personal grim reaper... I find that unlikely for the reason Six got transferred to Noble Team. Why would Ackerson give up such a skilled Spartan assassin, or approve the transfer? More likely it was somebody in ONI with a decent amount of authority, but not super high up.

  • 06.28.2011 7:48 PM PDT

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Heh yeah Coma, Ackerson may have not liked the Spartan IIs, but his ONLY hostile action toward them would have been the rigging of the Mark V armor testing.

As for Six being Ackerson's personal grim reaper... I find that unlikely for the reason Six got transferred to Noble Team. Why would Ackerson give up such a skilled Spartan assassin, or approve the transfer? More likely it was somebody in ONI with a decent amount of authority, but not super high up.


Well it does say that his previous handler was reluctant to have him transferred...

  • 06.28.2011 7:52 PM PDT


Posted by: ThePredkiller2
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Heh yeah Coma, Ackerson may have not liked the Spartan IIs, but his ONLY hostile action toward them would have been the rigging of the Mark V armor testing.

As for Six being Ackerson's personal grim reaper... I find that unlikely for the reason Six got transferred to Noble Team. Why would Ackerson give up such a skilled Spartan assassin, or approve the transfer? More likely it was somebody in ONI with a decent amount of authority, but not super high up.


Well it does say that his previous handler was reluctant to have him transferred...


But why would Ackerson, the figurative 'head' of the Spartan III project, approve it if he was the person in charge of Six before?

  • 06.28.2011 8:28 PM PDT

Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron

Posted by: ThePredkiller2
Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Heh yeah Coma, Ackerson may have not liked the Spartan IIs, but his ONLY hostile action toward them would have been the rigging of the Mark V armor testing.

As for Six being Ackerson's personal grim reaper... I find that unlikely for the reason Six got transferred to Noble Team. Why would Ackerson give up such a skilled Spartan assassin, or approve the transfer? More likely it was somebody in ONI with a decent amount of authority, but not super high up.


Well it does say that his previous handler was reluctant to have him transferred...


But why would Ackerson, the figurative 'head' of the Spartan III project, approve it if he was the person in charge of Six before?

I'm sure there is some reason out there.

  • 06.29.2011 9:17 AM PDT


Posted by: Cmdr DaeFaron
Heh yeah Coma, Ackerson may have not liked the Spartan IIs, but his ONLY hostile action toward them would have been the rigging of the Mark V armor testing.

As for Six being Ackerson's personal grim reaper... I find that unlikely for the reason Six got transferred to Noble Team. Why would Ackerson give up such a skilled Spartan assassin, or approve the transfer? More likely it was somebody in ONI with a decent amount of authority, but not super high up.


I'm not even sure he was trying to kill Chief during the Mark V test, it's a possibility, he sure did authorize excessive force for just a test. I think it would make him look bad if John had actually died, he certainly wanted to make sure he failed and made the SII project look bad.

Yeah...I don't find the prospects of Six working for Ackerson being too likely...>_> Knowing him, if Six had been Ackerson's Reaper, then she never would have wound up on Noble Team. That's what my thoughts are, some other high-ranking ONI operative, but no one with anywhere near the same amount of political clout as Ackerson.

  • 06.30.2011 10:04 AM PDT
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Deva Path


Posted by: DecepticonCobra

We are all going to get banned aren't we?

He was trying to kill chief coma

  • 06.30.2011 10:25 AM PDT

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