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  • Subject: Am I the only one tired of people saying ME or SW would destroy Halo?
Subject: Am I the only one tired of people saying ME or SW would destroy Halo?
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Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.


Posted by: DEMONCLOWN99
im am going to guess you know nothing of the ME universe because they have the human fleet and take the halo universe and if not they can include the variety of other species in the galaxy and dominate because if you did not know the citadel is less than a fourth of the intellegent civilizations and if they worked together they could dominate for they have never had their full forces all together in one battle.

Compared to the races being discussed here, ME is really underpowered. The only people I could see ME beating would be the UNSC (due to their small size). Even then, it would be a tough fight.

  • 06.18.2011 6:33 PM PDT
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Posted by: DEMONCLOWN99
im am going to guess you know nothing of the ME universe because they have the human fleet and take the halo universe and if not they can include the variety of other species in the galaxy and dominate because if you did not know the citadel is less than a fourth of the intellegent civilizations and if they worked together they could dominate for they have never had their full forces all together in one battle.


Infantry security forces that wreck planets.
Unknown size of cruiser.
Ships that can destroy planets (eg. Planet Breakers) and are only 800 meters/1km.
50km Fortress-class vessels.
The Halo array.
Micro Dyson spheres.
WEAPONIZED SLIPSPACE.
The ability to build planets and stars.
The ability to use stars as grenades.
Ridiculously fast FTL travel.

As stated above, the guns on a Forerunner CRUISER (The cruisers are the only ones that are said to have opened up on the ring, the Fortress-class was not using any weapon) are multi-teraton, lowballed. Mass Effect doesn't stand a chance.

  • 06.18.2011 6:43 PM PDT

-blam!- Was that actually blammed out? Or did I just type it? You'll never know.


Posted by: Spartan 100
The force doesn't exist in halo so it can't really work.


That's probably the saddest argument ever brought up in universe crossover battles. "Well that doesn't exist in X universe so it won't really work."

Slipspace doesn't exist in the Star Wars universe. So no Slipspace for anyone in Halo. In fact, Forerunners don't exist in it either. When it comes down to it the only common thing is humans, so it'll just be a big fist fight between a bunch of humans. Great idea.

[Edited on 06.18.2011 6:56 PM PDT]

  • 06.18.2011 6:50 PM PDT

All I have to say is all 3 series' are very good, and they are good in different ways. I like Star Wars overall, but that doesn't mean I don't also love Halo and Mass Effect.

  • 06.18.2011 6:58 PM PDT

"Concise and devoid of elegance...what I have come to expect from human communication"-Endless Summer

Spartan at range>Jedi,Clone/Storm Trooper,or any Droid.

Jedi close up>Spartan,Marine,Flood(?),Covenant

Forerunner=Jedi at close range

Forerunner>Jedi at range

Precursors>everything

  • 06.19.2011 2:24 AM PDT

Why so British?

Okay, all I see is a lot of speculation as to what would beat what in any Universe, how about this ME has a trilling storyline no doubt, but Halo has more history (in reality) and so has a stronger community and more creative people behind it, so the same could be said for Star Wars but LucasArts has made mistakes, KOTOR was good KOTORII was disappointing, Halo also some mistakes ill admit bla, bla, bla...

They are all good Sci-Fi Universes, there is no clear winner between them, I still play Halo CE, Starwars: BattleFront...and sold ME1 but thats not the point, okay so the Deathstar could blow up Halo big deal, so could MC. They are all immortal games, I mean look at Halo CEA, how cool is that, and ME3 is coming out this year, we have KOTOR:Online coming out also: so this is all irrelevant, none is so overwhelmingly better than the other, enough said, argument over, shut-up - SW could not destroy Halo, Halo could not destroy ME, if they tried(?) it would be one endless blood-bath...

-of course, the Republic in SW would'nt last that long...it never does.

  • 06.19.2011 4:37 AM PDT
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Posted by: Xd00999

Posted by: DEMONCLOWN99
im am going to guess you know nothing of the ME universe because they have the human fleet and take the halo universe and if not they can include the variety of other species in the galaxy and dominate because if you did not know the citadel is less than a fourth of the intellegent civilizations and if they worked together they could dominate for they have never had their full forces all together in one battle.

Compared to the races being discussed here, ME is really underpowered. The only people I could see ME beating would be the UNSC (due to their small size). Even then, it would be a tough fight.


UNSC's Navy is small? You jest.

Reach data pad confirms that before the Human-Covenant War occured, UNSC navy had about 2,000 ships total.

Note: It is true that ME is vastly underpowered against the Halo universe, even UNSC can win it. Let's compare on their main weapon on ships, eh?

Mass Accelerator Cannon (ME) can fire 20kg slugs, in 1 to 2% speed of lightspeed (Needs citation, anybody can give a link for it?) and is calculated to generate about 38 kilotons of TNT.

MAC= Magnetic Accelerator Cannon (UNSC, in Halo) can fire 600 ton slug, super-dense ferric tungsten with depleted uranium core, in .4c or 40% of light-speed, generating about 64 kilotons (previous was 1.17 teratons and do not know why it was changed) of TNT.

Which is more powerful? Note: ME's "MAC" can fire its slugs per two seconds while UNSC's "MAC" can fire 600 ton slug per estimated to be five minutes to a minutes, really it depends on variation of ammunition/weight plus nuclear fusion reactors as well.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If, anybody can correct me if I made mistake on ME's specs. I do play ME and 2, even read all codex data and read all books, and I'm still rusty on ME lol!

[Edited on 06.19.2011 5:13 AM PDT]

  • 06.19.2011 5:06 AM PDT

Flood's and Universe's Warhammer 40k fanatic and the one who knows much about it.

I also like House Stark and winter, hurr.

Am I the only one who is annoyed by the fact, that Halo fans rarely accept that 40k would defeat Haloverse without any effort?

  • 06.19.2011 5:17 AM PDT
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Posted by: PARANOID 6679
okay so the Deathstar could blow up Halo big deal, so could MC.

And according to Cryptum, Forerunner cruisers can do the same thing against a Halo that is 3x bigger then the ones in the games, and tear it apart with their light guns.

SW could not destroy Halo, Halo could not destroy ME, if they tried(?)

Okay, name one time the Systems Alliance, the Citadel races, the Terminus Systems species, the Collectors, or the Reapers
EVER got close to matching Forerunner tech.

Sovereign tanking the combined firepower of the Citadel Defense Fleet and the entire System Alliance fleet? Said defense fleet and the Alliance fleet's most powerful gun was measured in kilotons. Compare with 200~ petatons on Forerunner Fortress-class and extremely [REDACTED] high teratons on Forerunner cruisers...
-of course, the Republic in SW would'nt last that long...it never does.

Politics would be the complete doom of SW. The Republic would just sit there twiddling it's fingers, relying on the Jedi, whose ships are blown out of space before they could do anything.

The only way I see SW doing damage to the Forerunners now is guerrila warfare. Gather a hugearse fleet, jump in to an outlying Forerunner vessel, spam the crap out of your guns, and jump away before more ships could arrive/before the ship turns around and wastes you. Said tactics could only work against Planet Breakers... you know, the smallest of Forerunner ships... and then only until they start sending ships in wolf packs rather than alone.

Or building an Eclipse-class, filling it up with explosives, and sending it flying at near lightspeed towards a Forerunner vessel. This will be effective against Forerunner cruisers and PBs, but I don't know about Fortress-class vessels...
Said tactic will drain your resources like crazy, and the Forerunners have an insanely good industry... any ships you MIGHT destroy could be replaced fast. Course, SW getting Star Forge might be a small problem... but given how Forerunner infantry CAN WRECK WORLDS, I don't see it being much of one. Just means more of a kill count in favor of the Forerunners.

Forerunner 1: "How many ships you kill today, Didact?"
Didact: "Too many, I lost count." *Insert angst*

[Edited on 06.19.2011 5:24 AM PDT]

  • 06.19.2011 5:23 AM PDT
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Posted by: teekuppi
Am I the only one who is annoyed by the fact, that Halo fans rarely accept that 40k would defeat Haloverse without any effort?

Contemporary Halo, yes.

Forerunners, it would be the other way around.

Precursors are still mysterious, so I won't bother to open that can-o-worms yet.

  • 06.19.2011 5:26 AM PDT
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Posted by: raganok99

Posted by: Xd00999

Posted by: DEMONCLOWN99
im am going to guess you know nothing of the ME universe because they have the human fleet and take the halo universe and if not they can include the variety of other species in the galaxy and dominate because if you did not know the citadel is less than a fourth of the intellegent civilizations and if they worked together they could dominate for they have never had their full forces all together in one battle.

Compared to the races being discussed here, ME is really underpowered. The only people I could see ME beating would be the UNSC (due to their small size). Even then, it would be a tough fight.


UNSC's Navy is small? You jest.

Reach data pad confirms that before the Human-Covenant War occured, UNSC navy had about 2,000 ships total.

Note: It is true that ME is vastly underpowered against the Halo universe, even UNSC can win it. Let's compare on their main weapon on ships, eh?

Mass Accelerator Cannon (ME) can fire 20kg slugs, in 1 to 2% speed of lightspeed (Needs citation, anybody can give a link for it?) and is calculated to generate about 38 kilotons of TNT.

MAC= Magnetic Accelerator Cannon (UNSC, in Halo) can fire 600 ton slug, super-dense ferric tungsten with depleted uranium core, in .4c or 40% of light-speed, generating about 64 kilotons (previous was 1.17 teratons and do not know why it was changed) of TNT.

Which is more powerful? Note: ME's "MAC" can fire its slugs per two seconds while UNSC's "MAC" can fire 600 ton slug per estimated to be five minutes to a minutes, really it depends on variation of ammunition/weight plus nuclear fusion reactors as well.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If, anybody can correct me if I made mistake on ME's specs. I do play ME and 2, even read all codex data and read all books, and I'm still rusty on ME lol!


Hmm...so the System Alliance's most powerful gun is half as powerful as the UNSC's standard issue, but can fire in two seconds while the UNSC's takes time to charge? I'd say they're about balanced.

UNSC can one-shot the SA, but the SA can out-spam the UNSC.

[Edited on 06.19.2011 5:31 AM PDT]

  • 06.19.2011 5:31 AM PDT


Posted by: SC Matt Klassen

Posted by: PLUT0NIUM 235
problem is though, we are straying off what the original topic was, the OP didn't want all this sort of crap happening again with the Forerunner, Death Star, super-weapons galore, it keeps happening everything someone makes a Halo versus anything thread, always descends into super-weapon orgies or random number throwing!


Random-number throwing? Nope. Hard calculations, yes.

And the Forerunner's bog standard class of ships do the same thing as most Star Wars superweapons.

>And as for that universe/galaxy destroying bomb that Star Wars has, there is a problem with that scenario. It's supposed to fragment the planet and send chunks in every direction to cause a chain reaction, right? So what happens when those chunks hit black holes and/or get annihilated by warships? The cycle is broken. Said chunks might also fly into suns and burn up, or into gas giants and get pulped.


do realise that sort of weapon is even more preposterous than the Halo Installations 'deadly neutrinos'! seriously suggesting that sending fragments of planets into space will cause a chain reaction that will destroy everything? the universe is so unbelievably vast there is absolutely no chance of that being plausible, for one 99.9% of your fragments would miss, even if you got a planet like earth and blew it up in such a way that it would fragment the chances you'd hit anything (even in our solar system) aren't really all that great since the vast majority of the solar system is empty space. can you see how that idea isn't going to work?

Edit: also how can it be hard calculation? what in science lets something blow up a planet with a funky green laser, so it can't really be called calculations, the problem is all these so called calculations are still based on weapons that can output thousands of times more energy than a normal, box standard star can in a second. without explaining how it works or what is powering it then calculations are moot, that is why Star Trek (to the star wars fans horror!) usually has an advantage in these scenarios, because we know how their reactors, torpedoes and what not are powered by, something that is real and quantifiable. same goes for the humans in the halo universe with their magnetic accelerator cannons, powered by nuclear fusion generators using magnetism to launch a slug at very high speeds, though the speeds for the most part aren't beyond the realms of possibility!

[Edited on 06.19.2011 6:10 AM PDT]

  • 06.19.2011 5:58 AM PDT
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Posted by: PLUT0NIUM 235

Posted by: SC Matt Klassen

Posted by: PLUT0NIUM 235
problem is though, we are straying off what the original topic was, the OP didn't want all this sort of crap happening again with the Forerunner, Death Star, super-weapons galore, it keeps happening everything someone makes a Halo versus anything thread, always descends into super-weapon orgies or random number throwing!


Random-number throwing? Nope. Hard calculations, yes.

And the Forerunner's bog standard class of ships do the same thing as most Star Wars superweapons.

>And as for that universe/galaxy destroying bomb that Star Wars has, there is a problem with that scenario. It's supposed to fragment the planet and send chunks in every direction to cause a chain reaction, right? So what happens when those chunks hit black holes and/or get annihilated by warships? The cycle is broken. Said chunks might also fly into suns and burn up, or into gas giants and get pulped.


do realise that sort of weapon is even more preposterous than the Halo Installations 'deadly neutrinos'! seriously suggesting that sending fragments of planets into space will cause a chain reaction that will destroy everything? the universe is so unbelievably vast there is absolutely no chance of that being plausible, for one 99.9% of your fragments would miss, even if you got a planet like earth and blew it up in such a way that it would fragment the chances you'd hit anything (even in our solar system) aren't really all that great since the vast majority of the solar system is empty space. can you see how that idea isn't going to work?

...that's almost exactly what I said. But that's considered the epitome of superweapons in Star Wars...

Whale on the poor [REDACTED]s that bring it up against other canons, not me.

  • 06.19.2011 6:07 AM PDT

You know it was funny, I used to think the whole "Forerunner Infantry>Continents" thing was a load of BS until I re-read Cryptum.

War Sphinxes are considered, basically, war suits for Forerunners, perhaps like a 20 meter Mech. Now we know for sure that these Sphinxes are designed to lay low entire cities and can indeeds weep continents and devestate them, though I had thought they were fighter-class ships. As it were, there's a distinction.

Forerunner Seekers are a more modernized Forerunner suit/mech thing. They are smaller, sleeker, and, considering the term "smaller" seem to better fit the idea of a suit. Yet they're also considered more powerful, and destroyed Didact's Planet Breaker bit by bit (though the Confirmer removed its weapons, the fact these suits of armor gravitationally pulled the ship apart, a ship designed to take outrageous hits on the adamantium armor, is impressive).

Still, while there is a little more evidence to suggest that they are as powerful as some say, I'm still calling what destroyed Janjur Qom artillery and fighter weapons until proven otherwise.

  • 06.19.2011 6:12 AM PDT
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Posted by: SC Matt Klassen

Posted by: raganok99

Posted by: Xd00999

Posted by: DEMONCLOWN99
im am going to guess you know nothing of the ME universe because they have the human fleet and take the halo universe and if not they can include the variety of other species in the galaxy and dominate because if you did not know the citadel is less than a fourth of the intellegent civilizations and if they worked together they could dominate for they have never had their full forces all together in one battle.

Compared to the races being discussed here, ME is really underpowered. The only people I could see ME beating would be the UNSC (due to their small size). Even then, it would be a tough fight.


UNSC's Navy is small? You jest.

Reach data pad confirms that before the Human-Covenant War occured, UNSC navy had about 2,000 ships total.

Note: It is true that ME is vastly underpowered against the Halo universe, even UNSC can win it. Let's compare on their main weapon on ships, eh?

Mass Accelerator Cannon (ME) can fire 20kg slugs, in 1 to 2% speed of lightspeed (Needs citation, anybody can give a link for it?) and is calculated to generate about 38 kilotons of TNT.

MAC= Magnetic Accelerator Cannon (UNSC, in Halo) can fire 600 ton slug, super-dense ferric tungsten with depleted uranium core, in .4c or 40% of light-speed, generating about 64 kilotons (previous was 1.17 teratons and do not know why it was changed) of TNT.

Which is more powerful? Note: ME's "MAC" can fire its slugs per two seconds while UNSC's "MAC" can fire 600 ton slug per estimated to be five minutes to a minutes, really it depends on variation of ammunition/weight plus nuclear fusion reactors as well.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If, anybody can correct me if I made mistake on ME's specs. I do play ME and 2, even read all codex data and read all books, and I'm still rusty on ME lol!


Hmm...so the System Alliance's most powerful gun is half as powerful as the UNSC's standard issue, but can fire in two seconds while the UNSC's takes time to charge? I'd say they're about balanced.

UNSC can one-shot the SA, but the SA can out-spam the UNSC.


Yes, correct. But ME had a huge disadvantage is that they cannot fire Mass Accelerator Cannon in long period of time in battle due to heat generated by Mass drivers which it would require this ship to retreat somewhere safe then displace its heat to space. Seems that UNSC had no problems with it since they have technology to displace the heat from MAC quickly and able to fight for long time. Frigates carries three heavy slug rounds, and possibly 10 to 15 standard slug rounds so far...

With sheer numbers of UNSC navy, overwhelming volleys of MACs (Not mention that destroyers have two MACs, Cruisers is believed to have two as well, carriers and super carrier is also believed to carrying more than two MACs, due to their size. Let's show example of Battle of Psi Serpentsis, where UNSC had 162 warships, which mostly numbered of 23 carriers, 13 cruisers, 1 Super heavy cruiser, 79 destroyers and 42 frigates. With that numbers... what can you determine for battle at citadel if UNSC appears and collides with cidatel's entire fleet?

And most arguments made by Plutonium, other members from other threads saying that UNSC and Covenant in Halo universe is weak... I found it is massive errors that they made. Covenant's shields requires that any weapon with 2.4 TT range of firepower to completely collapse the shielding. Only plasma torpedoes are capable of dishing out single-digit teraton since it confirmed that it takes a few plasma torpedoes to dissipate the shields, then second to take out ship at ease. Also at battle of Jericho VIII where a fleet of 36 covenant fleets fires the plasma torpedoes at surface of Jericho, melting the landscape to glass, boiling oceans, etc. So then how did UNSC's MAC with 64 kilotons manage to take out Covenant ships? 64 kilotons vs 2.4 teratons is not good odds for UNSC...

Which it would mean that there was typo error on MAC's 64 kiloton range of TNT and actual calculation shows that would be that MAC (frigate standard) may be indeed as 1.17 teraton of TNT.

Spacebattles forums It shows calculations of plasma torpedoes. You can search other halo related discussions such as MAC rounds, etc... They do make good calculations based from books and games as well.

For now, Halopedian and Halowiki is no longer reliable sources for me, only books, games and probably this forum since their accurate calculations.

[Edited on 06.19.2011 6:29 AM PDT]

  • 06.19.2011 6:15 AM PDT


Posted by: PLUT0NIUM 235

Posted by: SC Matt Klassen

Posted by: PLUT0NIUM 235
problem is though, we are straying off what the original topic was, the OP didn't want all this sort of crap happening again with the Forerunner, Death Star, super-weapons galore, it keeps happening everything someone makes a Halo versus anything thread, always descends into super-weapon orgies or random number throwing!


Random-number throwing? Nope. Hard calculations, yes.

And the Forerunner's bog standard class of ships do the same thing as most Star Wars superweapons.

>And as for that universe/galaxy destroying bomb that Star Wars has, there is a problem with that scenario. It's supposed to fragment the planet and send chunks in every direction to cause a chain reaction, right? So what happens when those chunks hit black holes and/or get annihilated by warships? The cycle is broken. Said chunks might also fly into suns and burn up, or into gas giants and get pulped.


do realise that sort of weapon is even more preposterous than the Halo Installations 'deadly neutrinos'! seriously suggesting that sending fragments of planets into space will cause a chain reaction that will destroy everything? the universe is so unbelievably vast there is absolutely no chance of that being plausible, for one 99.9% of your fragments would miss, even if you got a planet like earth and blew it up in such a way that it would fragment the chances you'd hit anything (even in our solar system) aren't really all that great since the vast majority of the solar system is empty space. can you see how that idea isn't going to work?

Edit: also how can it be hard calculation? what in science lets something blow up a planet with a funky green laser, so it can't really be called calculations, the problem is all these so called calculations are still based on weapons that can output thousands of times more energy than a normal, box standard star can in a second. without explaining how it works or what is powering it then calculations are moot, that is why Star Trek (to the star wars fans horror!) usually has an advantage in these scenarios, because we know how their reactors, torpedoes and what not are powered by, something that is real and quantifiable. same goes for the humans in the halo universe with their magnetic accelerator cannons, powered by nuclear fusion generators using magnetism to launch a slug at very high speeds, though the speeds for the most part aren't beyond the realms of possibility!


No, he's saying its a load of BS, not using it to his advantage.

@Edit: Nothing in reality describes how to messure a funky green lazer destroying a planet. These calculations are based off of the ammount of energy required to destroy a planet, Death Star style.

For example, in order to shatter a planet the way Death Star did in Episode IV, you'd need upwards of a zettaton of power. All we know of Star Wars weapons is that their weapons use explosions to deliver damage (which is yet another nail in the coffin for Star Wars defenders: any explosion that is in a higher tonnage range should still, regardless of any kind of armor, explode with spectacular, blinding force, yet they never do) so around a zettaton of explosive force was directed at Alderaan in Episode IV.

The methodology of Star Wars weapons--explosive yields rather then melting, cutting or gravity beams like other sci-fi universes--makes for easier yield calculations.

  • 06.19.2011 6:21 AM PDT
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Posted by: raganok99

Posted by: SC Matt Klassen

Posted by: raganok99

Posted by: Xd00999


Compared to the races being discussed here, ME is really underpowered. The only people I could see ME beating would be the UNSC (due to their small size). Even then, it would be a tough fight.


UNSC's Navy is small? You jest.

Reach data pad confirms that before the Human-Covenant War occured, UNSC navy had about 2,000 ships total.

Note: It is true that ME is vastly underpowered against the Halo universe, even UNSC can win it. Let's compare on their main weapon on ships, eh?

Mass Accelerator Cannon (ME) can fire 20kg slugs, in 1 to 2% speed of lightspeed (Needs citation, anybody can give a link for it?) and is calculated to generate about 38 kilotons of TNT.

MAC= Magnetic Accelerator Cannon (UNSC, in Halo) can fire 600 ton slug, super-dense ferric tungsten with depleted uranium core, in .4c or 40% of light-speed, generating about 64 kilotons (previous was 1.17 teratons and do not know why it was changed) of TNT.

Which is more powerful? Note: ME's "MAC" can fire its slugs per two seconds while UNSC's "MAC" can fire 600 ton slug per estimated to be five minutes to a minutes, really it depends on variation of ammunition/weight plus nuclear fusion reactors as well.

---------------------------------------------------------------

If, anybody can correct me if I made mistake on ME's specs. I do play ME and 2, even read all codex data and read all books, and I'm still rusty on ME lol!


Hmm...so the System Alliance's most powerful gun is half as powerful as the UNSC's standard issue, but can fire in two seconds while the UNSC's takes time to charge? I'd say they're about balanced.

UNSC can one-shot the SA, but the SA can out-spam the UNSC.


Yes, correct. But ME had a huge disadvantage is that they cannot fire Mass Accelerator Cannon in long period of time in battle due to heat generated by Mass drivers which it would require this ship to retreat somewhere safe then displace its heat to space. Seems that UNSC had no problems with it since they have technology to displace the heat from MAC quickly and able to fight for long time. Frigates carries three heavy slug rounds, and possibly 10 to 15 standard slug rounds so far...

With sheer numbers of UNSC navy, overwhelming volleys of MACs (Not mention that destroyers have two MACs, Cruisers is believed to have two as well, carriers and super carrier is also believed to carrying more than two MACs, due to their size. Let's show example of Battle of Psi Serpentsis, where UNSC had 162 warships, which mostly numbered of 23 carriers, 13 cruisers, 1 Super heavy cruiser, 79 destroyers and 42 frigates. With that numbers... what can you determine for battle at citadel if UNSC appears and collides with cidatel's entire fleet?

Given the limitations that the SA had put onto their fleet... yeah, one UNSC battlegroup could curbstomp them.

  • 06.19.2011 6:35 AM PDT

Really? they consider that a viable super-weapon? Wow, Star Wars is more far gone than I thought! That is what gets silly about these debates, how this sort of thing gets dragged into it and ruins the debate, always ends up destroying planets and what not.

That is one of the charming things about Mass Effect, that makes it one of the better science fiction universes, because it never resorts to insane weapons that can destroy planets and galaxies, the ships aren't massive, hundred kilometre long things with guns putting out ridiculous amounts of power that total urinate all over the laws of the universe as we know it. Though granted the whole Mass Effect thing in itself, with element Zero is a stretch, its not on the level of most other science fiction in the way that it is still believable and all of the technology is based on this novel concept.

Also the Reapers are an interesting enemy that again don't resort to insane, pointless and unbelievable 'planet killing' levels of fire-power or such, just rather mysterious vessels that appear without motive and start killing things. Halo was one of these universes with believable weapons and technologies until one brings the Forerunner into the debate, because they defy convention, where-as the other powers in the Halo universe conform to the normal sort of rules of science within reason, shields are a stretch again but not to the extent of lasers that have thousands of times more power than out sun puts out in a second for example. Glassing planets with high energy plasma isn't really hard to believe, would take time but its believable since it doesn't physically destroy the planet which takes one into the realms of ridiculous.

So to conclude, it is pointless to debate if common ground cannot be found between the respective universes. The Covenant and the United Nations Space Command are two more grounded science fiction factions, don't really possess any preposterous levels of fire-power with the exception of things like the NOVA bomb, but even that is just a rather large nuclear device. So comparing them to things like the Empire, from a universe where tiny, puny looking lasers on small fighters have a ridiculous power output of something like forty trillion watts! and bigger warships sporting 'lasers' that can produce shots with more than a thousand times the output of a main sequence star, one starts to realise how a comparison is both stupid and frankly impossible. Halo is believable (with exception of Forerunner), Star Wars is simply not believable, not unless people realise there is no conceivable way that the weapons are that powerful.

So going to list what races in science fiction I would consider 'plausible' for comparison, based on believability:

Terrans (Starcraft), Zerg (Starcraft), UNSC (Halo), Covenant (Halo), Colonial Fleet (Battlestar Galactica), Cylons (Battlestar Galactica), Reapers (Mass Effect), Alliance (Mass Effect), plus any others that fit the description.

The things all these have in common is they don't go too far beyond the realms of possibility, don't have planet destroying weapons and such things as 'magical' creatures like Force Sensitive in Star Wars. Though there are a number of psionic Terrans there is no need to include their psionic abilities into a discussion since the Terrans don't rely on them in a debate, though Terran Ghost cloaking is still valid as it is a suit technology rather than an 'ability'.

  • 06.19.2011 6:39 AM PDT

Covenant ships use nuclear fusion reactors, how can nobody see how the concept of the shield absorbing two and a half trillion tons of TNT is ridiculous? The Tsar Bomb with its fifty million tons of TNT produced around 1.4% of the energy released by a star, like our Sun does in a second (stars are natures fusion reactors). Were talking about absorbing almost a million times that, so almost a million times more powerful than the Tsar Bomb hitting a shield, where in the name of Jesus is the power coming from cause it isn't nuclear fusion, or matter/anti-matter. It is also equally laughable that a Plasma Torpedo could contain this amount of energy, just take a step back for one second and think about what you saying, really think about it and do some 'number crunching' in your head.

How can people not realise that in itself is so preposterous it can't even be taken as a serious statement? If a Plasma Torpedo was THAT powerful it wouldn't just 'damage' a Marathon, it would vaporise it out-right, could have two miles of Titanium-A armour and it would do nothing, absolutely nothing to protect you, so its not possible for them to be that powerful because a Marathon is stated to be able to take numerous Plasma Torpedoes before succumbing to it, can't even believe that sort of thing is being posted as a 'factual' number!

The same applies for Magnetic Accelerator Cannons, don't think anyone here seems to realise just how powerful a trillion tons of TNT actually is, its a world altering amount of power. Look at the Krakatoa eruption, that was a mere 'two-hundred' or so megatons of TNT and that altered global temperatures around a degree and a half, the explosion was heard thousands of miles distant, the island was out-right annihilated, people coming to the insane conclusion that a MAC round can contain thousands of times more power than that is rather nuts, no other word.

This thread has me sitting here in disbelief, also another nail in the coffin of the Covenant shields being able to absorb trillions of tons of TNT is if that was the case, the purpose of SHIVA nuclear weapons in ship to ship engagements is? And the Prowler Dusk was able to destroy twelve Covenant capital ships and damage a further four with a bunch of HORNET mines (lower yield than SHIVA!) how exactly? Also don't even suggest the Covenant didn't have their shields in place, this was in a combat situation for goodness sake not like a pleasure cruise. So twelve fully shielded Covenant warships taken out by a bunch of ~30 megaton nuclear mines, amusing considering their shields can 'absorb' around five hundred million times that amount of energy don't you think?

  • 06.19.2011 7:09 AM PDT


Posted by: PLUT0NIUM 235
Really? they consider that a viable super-weapon? Wow, Star Wars is more far gone than I thought! That is what gets silly about these debates, how this sort of thing gets dragged into it and ruins the debate, always ends up destroying planets and what not.

That is one of the charming things about Mass Effect, that makes it one of the better science fiction universes, because it never resorts to insane weapons that can destroy planets and galaxies, the ships aren't massive, hundred kilometre long things with guns putting out ridiculous amounts of power that total urinate all over the laws of the universe as we know it. Though granted the whole Mass Effect thing in itself, with element Zero is a stretch, its not on the level of most other science fiction in the way that it is still believable and all of the technology is based on this novel concept.

Also the Reapers are an interesting enemy that again don't resort to insane, pointless and unbelievable 'planet killing' levels of fire-power or such, just rather mysterious vessels that appear without motive and start killing things. Halo was one of these universes with believable weapons and technologies until one brings the Forerunner into the debate, because they defy convention, where-as the other powers in the Halo universe conform to the normal sort of rules of science within reason, shields are a stretch again but not to the extent of lasers that have thousands of times more power than out sun puts out in a second for example. Glassing planets with high energy plasma isn't really hard to believe, would take time but its believable since it doesn't physically destroy the planet which takes one into the realms of ridiculous.

So to conclude, it is pointless to debate if common ground cannot be found between the respective universes. The Covenant and the United Nations Space Command are two more grounded science fiction factions, don't really possess any preposterous levels of fire-power with the exception of things like the NOVA bomb, but even that is just a rather large nuclear device. So comparing them to things like the Empire, from a universe where tiny, puny looking lasers on small fighters have a ridiculous power output of something like forty trillion watts! and bigger warships sporting 'lasers' that can produce shots with more than a thousand times the output of a main sequence star, one starts to realise how a comparison is both stupid and frankly impossible. Halo is believable (with exception of Forerunner), Star Wars is simply not believable, not unless people realise there is no conceivable way that the weapons are that powerful.

So going to list what races in science fiction I would consider 'plausible' for comparison, based on believability:

Terrans (Starcraft), Zerg (Starcraft), UNSC (Halo), Covenant (Halo), Colonial Fleet (Battlestar Galactica), Cylons (Battlestar Galactica), Reapers (Mass Effect), Alliance (Mass Effect), plus any others that fit the description.

The things all these have in common is they don't go too far beyond the realms of possibility, don't have planet destroying weapons and such things as 'magical' creatures like Force Sensitive in Star Wars. Though there are a number of psionic Terrans there is no need to include their psionic abilities into a discussion since the Terrans don't rely on them in a debate, though Terran Ghost cloaking is still valid as it is a suit technology rather than an 'ability'.


I don't mind rediculous weapons in a universe, TBH, so long as they actually friggin' do what they are said to do .

The outlandish numbers in some universes can make for stories that would otherwise be impossible. Sometimes, the numbers are there to deliberately show superior force, like how the Forerunners' power is so extreme so as to show that they were the unquestioned rulers over the galaxy. In turn, the Precursors made the Forerunners look like ants to show what enlightened super beings they were.

Outrageous weapons can be a plot device in of themselves, there's nothing wrong with them, unless you look at weapons as only to be considered in a vs debate, which isn't correct.

  • 06.19.2011 7:15 AM PDT
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"Time was your ally human. But now it has abandoned you. The Forerunners....have returned. And this tomb... is now yours". - The Didact

I do not agree. Droids would be heavily used, you have yet to see any of the droids that the Empire possess in the Movies although books, games, and other media have used them before. Dark Troopers alone would handle the Flood, they are basically Spartans with much better armor, add to the fact they are droids.

Dark Troopers won't be able to handle Flood forms the size of HW Dreadnaughts
See origins

And i will mention the Pure Forms vs sentinels again.

Considering they made the Death Star, I'm sure they could construct planet sized structures.

Covered by others



The Yuuzhan Vong.


Do the yuuzhan vong have the ability to infect hosts and use them in their for their own purposes?
Can they create near countless forms from biomass?
Do they have a supercell that allows them to adapt to anything?
Do they have a transsentient being as a leader that coordinates all attacks with his telephatic ability?
..
...
..

I very much doubt that

So any other parasites i missed?

  • 06.19.2011 7:16 AM PDT
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Member of Bungie.net for nearly three years, still continuing!

Enjoy what you have and live on.

My gamertag is Elder Bias

Read this forums: Spacebattles forums again, please.

Perhaps there is too many errors and typo errors, possibly messed up on tech specs in the books? Maybe Halo Franchise should thought to make this Technical specs manual book to describe about firepower, technology, reactors, ETC... like Star Trek did have one.

And where you did get information on Covenant using fusion nuclear reactor??? Wiki is not acceptable source.

[Edited on 06.19.2011 7:23 AM PDT]

  • 06.19.2011 7:17 AM PDT
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Do not waste your tears, I was not born to watch the world grow dim. Life is not measured in years, but by the deeds of men.

Posted by: goldhawk
We should know better, because we are better.


Posted by: SC Matt Klassen

Posted by: teekuppi
Am I the only one who is annoyed by the fact, that Halo fans rarely accept that 40k would defeat Haloverse without any effort?

Contemporary Halo, yes.

Forerunners, it would be the other way around.

Precursors are still mysterious, so I won't bother to open that can-o-worms yet.

I'm sure your opinion would change when the deamons get involved. Halo is basically a massive sacrifice to Khorne. Tzeencth would have a plan to destroy the Forerunners ready in a second. Nurgle's Rot and the Zombie Plague work pretty similar to the flood. As for Slaanesh, who knows? We don't have enough examples of Forerunner society to come to a conclusion.

  • 06.19.2011 7:22 AM PDT


Posted by: hotshot revan II
I do not agree. Droids would be heavily used, you have yet to see any of the droids that the Empire possess in the Movies although books, games, and other media have used them before. Dark Troopers alone would handle the Flood, they are basically Spartans with much better armor, add to the fact they are droids.

Dark Troopers won't be able to handle Flood forms the size of HW Dreadnaughts
See origins

And i will mention the Pure Forms vs sentinels again.

Considering they made the Death Star, I'm sure they could construct planet sized structures.

Covered by others



The Yuuzhan Vong.


Do the yuuzhan vong have the ability to infect hosts and use them in their for their own purposes?
Can they create near countless forms from biomass?
Do they have a supercell that allows them to adapt to anything?
Do they have a transsentient being as a leader that coordinates all attacks with his telephatic ability?
..
...
..

I very much doubt that

So any other parasites i missed?


The Vong's own technology would be there downfall (and they're not a parasite, they're an extragalactic race).

All of their tech is biological, even starships (they find mechanical tech offensive). Once you get to the point of pitting them against the Flood, as in, they're your only option, you've already admitted defeat.


The Dark Trooper project was never fully completed. Phase IIIs at least weren't.

And even if they were, the Mind would simply make a Flood form designed to kill it. Likely a gian, sky-scraper sized behemoth because Dark Troopers don't mess around.

I'm still laughing at the mental image of a Coruscant with a Flood infection on it.

  • 06.19.2011 7:23 AM PDT

have read it, still doesn't change the fact that its a load of rubbish, Covenant Plasma Torpedoes are NOT in the power range. it breaks EVERYTHING in Halo fiction if that was the case and makes Halo one of those super inconsistent Universes that are terrible, weak and not well thought out. answer me these questions then:

1) how can a Marathon survive being hit by numerous Plasma Torpedoes which are 'wrongly' said to be in the trillion tons of TNT range, keep in mind the ship is armoured with Titanium (which is no wonder metal) and is ~1,200 metres long, that is like getting a ship and hitting it with all of the nuclear weapons on this planet, thousands of times over and it surviving!

2) how does a field of HORNET mines (~30 megatons) disable four shielded capital ships and destroy another twelve, even though they are what, a million times less powerful than a Plasma Torpedo?

3) how does on place the equivalent energy of a TRILLION tons of TNT into a bolt of Plasma that isn't all that large or special, keep in mind that this is all powered (at the same time as the shields) by nuclear fusion reactors which can only generate so much power?

its pointless posting that thread because its simply not possible for them to be anywhere even close to that powerful, hell not even a percent of that, magnitudes LESS powerful is the more realistic number.

[Edited on 06.19.2011 7:27 AM PDT]

  • 06.19.2011 7:25 AM PDT