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Subject: Question: Is it Halo we love, or is it Bungie?

How can they shrug off 500 bullets?

I came for the Halo. But I stayed for the Bungie.

  • 06.11.2011 9:35 PM PDT

I respect Bungie for making great Halo games. However I am deeply pi**ed off with the huge middle finger they gave us with Halo Reach. So much potential Reach had... just couldn't believe it.

I love Halo more by a landslide. I will buy every Halo game from 343. I will just rent what Bungie makes... If I feel like it.

  • 06.11.2011 10:25 PM PDT

I don't understand how any of you are complaining about Halo: Reach, it was a fantastic game. Overall it was the best Halo.

Halo CE had Campaign
Halo 2 had Multiplayer
Halo 3 had forge
ODST had firefight

Reach had all of those in one package! Halo reach is not a middle finger to the face, that's just a terrible thing to say about a company who shared there passion for games with us. I am honestly shocked that people think Reach was so bad.

But an opinion is an opinion, can you all tell me just why you think Reach was so terrible?

  • 06.12.2011 5:02 AM PDT

I don't understand how any of you are complaining about Halo: Reach, it was a fantastic game. Overall it was the best Halo.

Halo CE had Campaign
Halo 2 had Multiplayer
Halo 3 had forge
ODST had firefight

Reach had all of those in one package! Halo reach is not a middle finger to the face, that's just a terrible thing to say about a company who shared there passion for games with us. I am honestly shocked that people think Reach was so bad.

But an opinion is an opinion, can you all tell me just why you think Reach was so terrible?



Amazing, those are my exact thoughts on Reach.

Edit: Thank you for making this thread, I thought I was the only one who wasn't completely disrespecting and complaining about Bungie and reach on these forums and you sir just stopped me from leaving.

[Edited on 06.12.2011 6:10 AM PDT]

  • 06.12.2011 6:01 AM PDT

"I will show you how a true Prussian officer fights!"

"And i will show you where the iron crosses grow..."

- "Cross of Iron"

I love both haha.

  • 06.12.2011 8:09 AM PDT

If you can read this, that means I'm not a Shaolin monk...

yet.

Halo.

  • 06.12.2011 8:20 AM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.

I love Halo. I used to love Bungie for the massive involvement they had with the community, that was 3 years ago... After that they became pretty sterile to me. There was no genuine enthusiasm, since Reach was released everything has declined.

  • 06.12.2011 8:26 AM PDT

I came for Halo, and oddly enough, the only reason I'm probably still around here is I play Myth/Marathon now.

I guess I've moved from a Halo fan to a Bungie fan, I've been burnt out on Halo since the third.

  • 06.12.2011 8:29 AM PDT

If you can read this, that means I'm not a Shaolin monk...

yet.


Posted by: ajw34307
I love Halo. I used to love Bungie for the massive involvement they had with the community, that was 3 years ago... After that they became pretty sterile to me. There was no genuine enthusiasm, since Reach was released everything has declined.

Yeah. I love the product that's there for me to enjoy more than I love the company trying to make money.

  • 06.12.2011 8:30 AM PDT

By the power of truth, I, while living, have conquered the universe.


Posted by: Privateskool
I don't understand how any of you are complaining about Halo: Reach, it was a fantastic game. Overall it was the best Halo.

Halo CE had Campaign
Halo 2 had Multiplayer
Halo 3 had forge
ODST had firefight

Reach had all of those in one package! Halo reach is not a middle finger to the face, that's just a terrible thing to say about a company who shared there passion for games with us. I am honestly shocked that people think Reach was so bad.

But an opinion is an opinion, can you all tell me just why you think Reach was so terrible?


Quantity =/= quality, that's the best way to put it.

The campaign was an abysmal effort to tie in the game to CE, it was not needed at all and was pulled off horribly. Levels were more linear than ever, the characters were sterile archetypes nobody cared about and there was no real story until the last 2 missions (can anyone say "shoehorn"?).

It's not just that, it's the way the story is told. Compare this fecal matter to the masterful campaigns of Halo CE, 2 and ODST. The build up is flawlessly drawn together to the final conclusion, here's Halo 2 as an example:
1) Earth is under attack, you follow the Prophet to another Halo.
2) You have been shamed for failing to save Halo, you earn your reprieve as Arbiter and become an assassin. You are told the Great Journey is a lie.
3) All story points converge on the Library. John and Thel meet the Gravemind and become allies to stop the Ring from firing after Johnson and Miranda are kidnapped.
4) Gravemind uses this as a distraction, he takes High Charity as his own whilst John follows Truth to Earth and the other Halos are put on stand-by. The tone that everything is at stake is set for the final installment as the fight is going to be finished.

We're left with questions like:
- What will happen to Cortana?
- Can Earth be saved?
- How will others respond to this "alliance"?
- Will Truth fire the other rings?

It's the sort of thing that sparked off thousands of fan fictions with each interpretation being wildly different. Reach lacked an substance or mystery to it because all along we knew what would happen. We knew Noble Team would die, we knew Reach would fall - the story is a lot less exciting when every detail is able to be guessed from the start.

Multiplayer is a convoluted mess with armour abilities which changed the "golden triangle" of grenades, weapons and melee into a sort of rusty tin quadrilateral. The rule of 3 was broken by armour abilities which were an awful addition, equipment was fine, I can't see what possessed Bungie to put in armour lock...

Firefight is now awful. In ODST we were made to work together, I have never played a more strategic match than my many attempts to get Endure from 2009-2010. It was frantic, it was fun and encouraged players to learn a lesson in teamwork when facing a group of Chieftains on Alpha Site.

In Reach all people care about is individual stats and credits, games are now an incoherent mess if jetpack + rockets with no consequence of failure when you die because you have infinite lives. Custom options? Yeah that's great, but I have not seen any innovative gametypes from the community. It's all "ZOMG EARN ACIEVEMENTS AND CR!!!".

Forge World is brilliant, well executed and great to use. As an avid Forger I'm very keen on using that map to it's fullest potential... Then I look at every other map and think "oh... I can't do anything cool or innovative here, back to Forge World". Halo 3 had a much more versatile Forge mode because every map had something unique that could be done to it, Bungie went slack with the maps in Reach and delivered poorly crafted campaign sections which play horribly (Boardwalk... *shudders*).

Whenever I look at Reach, I see what could have been and the fact that a lot of others share the same vision has left me feeling very underwhelmed by this "swan song" of Bungie's.

[Edited on 06.12.2011 9:35 AM PDT]

  • 06.12.2011 9:20 AM PDT

Vengeance only leads to an ongoing cycle of hatred.

Halo.

I did love Bungie, as well, until they came out with Reach...

  • 06.12.2011 9:25 AM PDT

If you didn't Play Halo: CE or Halo 2 MP, your opinion about Halo means nada.

CE + H2 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> H3+Reach+H4

Halo 1 & 2

  • 06.12.2011 9:41 AM PDT

Multi-trillionaire modern cowboy.

That's right.

I love Halo. I like Bungie.

  • 06.12.2011 9:46 AM PDT

Multi-trillionaire modern cowboy.

That's right.


Posted by: SEAL Sniper 9
Halo.

I did love Bungie, as well, until they came out with Reach...

  • 06.12.2011 9:47 AM PDT

Welcome to bungie, you have no rights. play nice!
CLICK!

Halo, it's magnificense, all those tiny details upon such great artificial world. All those clouds in that vast inner ring and the texture of the mountains capped with snow to the immense seas that separate land from each other. Such beauty and such life in contrast to it's true purpose. The annihilaton of life. Halo, the dark secrets it keeps, the danger it holds in a casket of beauty.

Halo.


Did I go too far?

  • 06.12.2011 9:47 AM PDT
  • gamertag: [none]
  • user homepage:

I love both.

I trust Frankie behind the helms of the Halo franchise as he seems like he does care about the series (unlike his employers).

I can't wait for Bungie's new project as well, especially since Jason Jones is the project lead on it, much like he was on the first two Halo titles.

  • 06.12.2011 10:19 AM PDT
  • gamertag: Potomo
  • user homepage:

Boomer.
Best. Ship. Ever!

I liked Bungie long before Halo and I will continue to do so. I also still like Halo despite Reach.

  • 06.12.2011 11:39 AM PDT

Can't win an arguement?
Correct their grammer instead

I love te game, the devs did a good job. If they made a rubbish game I wouldn't buy it just because they made it.

  • 06.12.2011 11:47 AM PDT

Ignore my gamertag. It's actually Dragonzzilla.

Posted by: homocidalham
I like Halo. I love Bungie.

  • 06.12.2011 11:55 AM PDT


Posted by: ajw34307

Posted by: Privateskool
I don't understand how any of you are complaining about Halo: Reach, it was a fantastic game. Overall it was the best Halo.

Halo CE had Campaign
Halo 2 had Multiplayer
Halo 3 had forge
ODST had firefight

Reach had all of those in one package! Halo reach is not a middle finger to the face, that's just a terrible thing to say about a company who shared there passion for games with us. I am honestly shocked that people think Reach was so bad.

But an opinion is an opinion, can you all tell me just why you think Reach was so terrible?


Quantity =/= quality, that's the best way to put it.

The campaign was an abysmal effort to tie in the game to CE, it was not needed at all and was pulled off horribly. Levels were more linear than ever, the characters were sterile archetypes nobody cared about and there was no real story until the last 2 missions (can anyone say "shoehorn"?).

It's not just that, it's the way the story is told. Compare this fecal matter to the masterful campaigns of Halo CE, 2 and ODST. The build up is flawlessly drawn together to the final conclusion, here's Halo 2 as an example:
1) Earth is under attack, you follow the Prophet to another Halo.
2) You have been shamed for failing to save Halo, you earn your reprieve as Arbiter and become an assassin. You are told the Great Journey is a lie.
3) All story points converge on the Library. John and Thel meet the Gravemind and become allies to stop the Ring from firing after Johnson and Miranda are kidnapped.
4) Gravemind uses this as a distraction, he takes High Charity as his own whilst John follows Truth to Earth and the other Halos are put on stand-by. The tone that everything is at stake is set for the final installment as the fight is going to be finished.

We're left with questions like:
- What will happen to Cortana?
- Can Earth be saved?
- How will others respond to this "alliance"?
- Will Truth fire the other rings?

It's the sort of thing that sparked off thousands of fan fictions with each interpretation being wildly different. Reach lacked an substance or mystery to it because all along we knew what would happen. We knew Noble Team would die, we knew Reach would fall - the story is a lot less exciting when every detail is able to be guessed from the start.

Multiplayer is a convoluted mess with armour abilities which changed the "golden triangle" of grenades, weapons and melee into a sort of rusty tin quadrilateral. The rule of 3 was broken by armour abilities which were an awful addition, equipment was fine, I can't see what possessed Bungie to put in armour lock...

Firefight is now awful. In ODST we were made to work together, I have never played a more strategic match than my many attempts to get Endure from 2009-2010. It was frantic, it was fun and encouraged players to learn a lesson in teamwork when facing a group of Chieftains on Alpha Site.

In Reach all people care about is individual stats and credits, games are now an incoherent mess if jetpack + rockets with no consequence of failure when you die because you have infinite lives. Custom options? Yeah that's great, but I have not seen any innovative gametypes from the community. It's all "ZOMG EARN ACIEVEMENTS AND CR!!!".

Forge World is brilliant, well executed and great to use. As an avid Forger I'm very keen on using that map to it's fullest potential... Then I look at every other map and think "oh... I can't do anything cool or innovative here, back to Forge World". Halo 3 had a much more versatile Forge mode because every map had something unique that could be done to it, Bungie went slack with the maps in Reach and delivered poorly crafted campaign sections which play horribly (Boardwalk... *shudders*).

Whenever I look at Reach, I see what could have been and the fact that a lot of others share the same vision has left me feeling very underwhelmed by this "swan song" of Bungie's.


Yea this guy just explained my exact reasons for hating Reach.
Seriously like every single reason right down to the point.

If they would have just followed canon and characters we actually know, then Reach would have been great. Insted of giving us these Spartans that nobody knew anything about. I would have rather played as the Rookie or Johnson. They were on Reach and fans would have enjoyed playing as them awhole lot more. People had been reading "The fall of Reach" for 10 years and that's what they know Reach to be. Then they throw this crap at us.

-Along with a firefight that was just an arcade mode, rather than a survival like ODST. Not to mention the awful FF maps.

-MM I just won't even get into... I'll just say awful gamplay, awful teamwork, and awful maps.

-Forge World... Like my friend said above me, it was a nice idea and I was excited, but then you get in there and you see that you have limited options for people like me who are perfectionist and like detailed maps. Grey and blue got boring as well And the lack of forging outside of Forge World was lame. I'ed rather they didn't make FW at all and actually put effort into making actual maps, cuz my God did they need them.

This game was most certainly a "middle finger" to me. It seemed as if Bungie cared more about drivable forklifts and Moa than they did about Halo. So yea Bungie can go do whatever the heck they want, because I'm just sick of them and would rather a company that actually cares make Halo.

  • 06.12.2011 12:40 PM PDT

I love Bungie and Halo

  • 06.12.2011 12:44 PM PDT

I'm 23, I have a house, dog, girlfriend, job and I have no interest in any fanboyism so if you're thinking about sending me a childish PM, don't be surprised when I don't call back.


Posted by: homocidalham
I like Halo. I love Bungie.

  • 06.12.2011 1:09 PM PDT

I think Bungie didn't realize Halo's fullest potential. In fact, I think they kinda failed at making the games progress somehow. We also got the same thing, only more streamlined each time. I think a new developer, one that wasn't behind the creation of Halo, certainly with fans in the team, would bring life back to the franchise.

  • 06.12.2011 1:22 PM PDT


Posted by: ajw34307

Posted by: Privateskool
I don't understand how any of you are complaining about Halo: Reach, it was a fantastic game. Overall it was the best Halo.

Halo CE had Campaign
Halo 2 had Multiplayer
Halo 3 had forge
ODST had firefight

Reach had all of those in one package! Halo reach is not a middle finger to the face, that's just a terrible thing to say about a company who shared there passion for games with us. I am honestly shocked that people think Reach was so bad.

But an opinion is an opinion, can you all tell me just why you think Reach was so terrible?


Quantity =/= quality, that's the best way to put it.

The campaign was an abysmal effort to tie in the game to CE, it was not needed at all and was pulled off horribly. Levels were more linear than ever, the characters were sterile archetypes nobody cared about and there was no real story until the last 2 missions (can anyone say "shoehorn"?).

It's not just that, it's the way the story is told. Compare this fecal matter to the masterful campaigns of Halo CE, 2 and ODST. The build up is flawlessly drawn together to the final conclusion, here's Halo 2 as an example:
1) Earth is under attack, you follow the Prophet to another Halo.
2) You have been shamed for failing to save Halo, you earn your reprieve as Arbiter and become an assassin. You are told the Great Journey is a lie.
3) All story points converge on the Library. John and Thel meet the Gravemind and become allies to stop the Ring from firing after Johnson and Miranda are kidnapped.
4) Gravemind uses this as a distraction, he takes High Charity as his own whilst John follows Truth to Earth and the other Halos are put on stand-by. The tone that everything is at stake is set for the final installment as the fight is going to be finished.

We're left with questions like:
- What will happen to Cortana?
- Can Earth be saved?
- How will others respond to this "alliance"?
- Will Truth fire the other rings?

It's the sort of thing that sparked off thousands of fan fictions with each interpretation being wildly different. Reach lacked an substance or mystery to it because all along we knew what would happen. We knew Noble Team would die, we knew Reach would fall - the story is a lot less exciting when every detail is able to be guessed from the start.

Multiplayer is a convoluted mess with armour abilities which changed the "golden triangle" of grenades, weapons and melee into a sort of rusty tin quadrilateral. The rule of 3 was broken by armour abilities which were an awful addition, equipment was fine, I can't see what possessed Bungie to put in armour lock...

Firefight is now awful. In ODST we were made to work together, I have never played a more strategic match than my many attempts to get Endure from 2009-2010. It was frantic, it was fun and encouraged players to learn a lesson in teamwork when facing a group of Chieftains on Alpha Site.

In Reach all people care about is individual stats and credits, games are now an incoherent mess if jetpack + rockets with no consequence of failure when you die because you have infinite lives. Custom options? Yeah that's great, but I have not seen any innovative gametypes from the community. It's all "ZOMG EARN ACIEVEMENTS AND CR!!!".

Forge World is brilliant, well executed and great to use. As an avid Forger I'm very keen on using that map to it's fullest potential... Then I look at every other map and think "oh... I can't do anything cool or innovative here, back to Forge World". Halo 3 had a much more versatile Forge mode because every map had something unique that could be done to it, Bungie went slack with the maps in Reach and delivered poorly crafted campaign sections which play horribly (Boardwalk... *shudders*).

Whenever I look at Reach, I see what could have been and the fact that a lot of others share the same vision has left me feeling very underwhelmed by this "swan song" of Bungie's.


Agreed on almost everything. I think they could've made a great campaign even if we knew the outcome, but that didn't happen. Long Night of Solace and New Alexandria had lots of potential, but ultimately the missions are way too short and some segments feel like teasers (I particularly look at you LNoS). The game feels too much like a playable movie (although the cinematic work is better than what was featured in Halo 3) rather than a real game.

  • 06.12.2011 1:29 PM PDT


Posted by: ajw34307

Quantity =/= quality, that's the best way to put it.

The campaign was an abysmal effort to tie in the game to CE, it was not needed at all and was pulled off horribly. Levels were more linear than ever, the characters were sterile archetypes nobody cared about and there was no real story until the last 2 missions (can anyone say "shoehorn"?).

It's not just that, it's the way the story is told. Compare this fecal matter to the masterful campaigns of Halo CE, 2 and ODST. The build up is flawlessly drawn together to the final conclusion, here's Halo 2 as an example:
1) Earth is under attack, you follow the Prophet to another Halo.
2) You have been shamed for failing to save Halo, you earn your reprieve as Arbiter and become an assassin. You are told the Great Journey is a lie.
3) All story points converge on the Library. John and Thel meet the Gravemind and become allies to stop the Ring from firing after Johnson and Miranda are kidnapped.
4) Gravemind uses this as a distraction, he takes High Charity as his own whilst John follows Truth to Earth and the other Halos are put on stand-by. The tone that everything is at stake is set for the final installment as the fight is going to be finished.

We're left with questions like:
- What will happen to Cortana?
- Can Earth be saved?
- How will others respond to this "alliance"?
- Will Truth fire the other rings?

It's the sort of thing that sparked off thousands of fan fictions with each interpretation being wildly different. Reach lacked an substance or mystery to it because all along we knew what would happen. We knew Noble Team would die, we knew Reach would fall - the story is a lot less exciting when every detail is able to be guessed from the start.

Multiplayer is a convoluted mess with armour abilities which changed the "golden triangle" of grenades, weapons and melee into a sort of rusty tin quadrilateral. The rule of 3 was broken by armour abilities which were an awful addition, equipment was fine, I can't see what possessed Bungie to put in armour lock...

Firefight is now awful. In ODST we were made to work together, I have never played a more strategic match than my many attempts to get Endure from 2009-2010. It was frantic, it was fun and encouraged players to learn a lesson in teamwork when facing a group of Chieftains on Alpha Site.

In Reach all people care about is individual stats and credits, games are now an incoherent mess if jetpack + rockets with no consequence of failure when you die because you have infinite lives. Custom options? Yeah that's great, but I have not seen any innovative gametypes from the community. It's all "ZOMG EARN ACIEVEMENTS AND CR!!!".

Forge World is brilliant, well executed and great to use. As an avid Forger I'm very keen on using that map to it's fullest potential... Then I look at every other map and think "oh... I can't do anything cool or innovative here, back to Forge World". Halo 3 had a much more versatile Forge mode because every map had something unique that could be done to it, Bungie went slack with the maps in Reach and delivered poorly crafted campaign sections which play horribly (Boardwalk... *shudders*).

Whenever I look at Reach, I see what could have been and the fact that a lot of others share the same vision has left me feeling very underwhelmed by this "swan song" of Bungie's.


-Campaign
First of all it seems that you are being heavily crucial on Reach simpley because you knew the outcome already. I thought players knew that prequels were intended to follow current stories and not be that surprising? It is a prequel after all.

I can understand why some were dissapointed that it didn't follow the story of the book but i think everyone has to understand that Bungie created Halo, not the book "The Fall Of Reach". When the creator says something or makes something it becomes canon because it is there work of art.

Besides, Halo: Reach doesn't do too much that throws the book off from canon. If you notice they did a pretty swell job of making majority of the book still possible to canon. I see it as, how would you like someone defining the guidelines for you on your next entry into a video game franchise you created? Personally, i'd hate it.

-Multiplayer
I can't see how people wish they had of stuck with the Halo 3 method on this. Equiptment was a complete joke, and Bungie knew it. It didn't work well and no one really cared for it. With Reach, Armour abilities are a completle new mechanic that everyone must understand to suceed. Now, i understand how some wish the original Halo multiplayer was left alone but this brings me back to something else.

With every new Halo there is a New multiplayer experience. This is what keeps Halo fresh and new. It's exactly this reason that keeps Halo's multiplayer alive. With each new entry people are excited to see what is happening next.

Look at Call of Duty, fan or not with each new entry we are playing the exact same game with maybe a few new weapons, it's getting stale but Halo is ever progressing.

Halo CE - Introuduction to the 2 thumbstick rechargeable sheilds, weapon-melee-grenade gameplay.

Halo 2 - Dual Wielding, Car jacking, dealing with other players being elites.

Halo 3 - Equiptment

Halo Reach - Armour abilities.

With each new entry there is new things to be learned and different ways to get a kill or stay alive.

-Firefight
Though i will admit i was more fond of the traditional Firefight that ODST had the new firefight is honestley much more efficient for online play. Bungie saw the millions of players who had to literally drag themselves through a firey pit of lava just too keep there online connection well enough to beat the endure acheivement. They were asking way to much of players to have faith in both 4 players and an internet connection for 3+ hours. Plus, you can play firefight like ODST if you set it that way.

-Forge
Overall you can do alot more with Forge in this addition to the Halo franchise. Being able to do more is really the only right direction for something like forge, since forge is about imagination and adding more just extends the lengths that your minds can travel to without a roadblock.

All in all i think some people are forced to never love what the current project is, they have to stick in the past. I myself least enjoyed Halo 3 of the Halo games and that is the opinion i have stuck too. But some people literally say, Halo 2 sucked, Halo 3 sucked 2 was way better, Halo Reach sucked and Halo 3 was definatley the best. When people change there mind that often you can't take them seriously. Provided i do not think this is the case with you, it is with many.

I love all the Halo's. Combat evolved is my favorite, Reach is my favorite overall if your looking at each section of the game as a whole, and Halo 3 is my least favorite. But they all are an awesome entry into an ever progressing universe.



[Edited on 06.12.2011 5:34 PM PDT]

  • 06.12.2011 5:28 PM PDT

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