Halo: Combat Evolved Forum
This topic has moved here: Subject: To all The idiots petitioning for multiplayer.
  • Subject: To all The idiots petitioning for multiplayer.
Subject: To all The idiots petitioning for multiplayer.

wow, lots of stuff to say..

The pistol.
someone said that every 10 year old would whore it. if everyone used it, it would be fair. the only thing is that kids unfamiliar with the pistol will suck. while at minimum it can take 3 shots to kill someone in multiplayer, it doesnt always take onlly 3 shots. there have been times when it will take me 5 shots but someone else 4 so i died with the pistol.

ALSO
the pistol is beatable in certain circumstances. On blood Gulch, sniper and pistol may be the best way to beat it. On other closer levels, shotgun or my personal favorite the plasma rifle will kill the pistol close rang. if you havent used the plasma rifle in CE you might not understand.


There are many ways the Halo CE multiplayer was balanced if you were good. If not then you would -blam!- and moan about how unfair the pistol was.

I understand why 343 did not have the multiplayer the way most people wanted it, but it makes sense to have it reach style so that it wont split people, but i still wish that the original multiplayer woulda stayed the same.

  • 06.13.2011 9:56 AM PDT

Your point being? Why are you such a troll. I didnt like halo 3. Of course i sucked at it. Each halo game has a change in machanics. I loved halo CE thats why im here and not on the reach forums, because i was good at halo ce
so Ps: -blam!- YOU
Posted by: sg1Elim89
JonnyRL you need to shut the -blam!- up. You're bad at reach(0.86) and only have less than 400 games in halo 3. You are a no good troll who is just spamming hate threads on the CE forum since you suck so bad at halo.

  • 06.13.2011 10:17 AM PDT

SPARTAN TRAP
asking for mods is not a smart idea.
no bumping.

what is your next game going to be Bungie?


Posted by: JohnyRL
You dont get it do you? Shotgun was a close range weapon. it didnt work at long range (BALANCED) Rockets good at mid and close rangem, not so much at long range BALANCED. Halo CE pistol kills close range long range and mid range. You just cant have a weapon like that in a multiplayer title...


fyi, the pistol does have a range (balanced, mocking you, partially) that is what you are not willing to accept.

  • 06.13.2011 10:27 AM PDT

The pistol was OP at all ranges

  • 06.13.2011 11:21 AM PDT

SPARTAN TRAP
asking for mods is not a smart idea.
no bumping.

what is your next game going to be Bungie?

not in the campaign at least, because you can get so far away that even if you have the reticule on the enemy it will not reach them.

  • 06.13.2011 11:38 AM PDT

I agree. For campaign the pistol was great, just OP in multiplayer

  • 06.13.2011 11:39 AM PDT

SPARTAN TRAP
asking for mods is not a smart idea.
no bumping.

what is your next game going to be Bungie?


Posted by: JohnyRL
I agree. For campaign the pistol was great, just OP in multiplayer


are you saying that in the campaign it has a range and in multiplayer it doesn't?

  • 06.13.2011 11:51 AM PDT

no, i mean that having OP weapons in PVE is OK, no one is at a disadvantage. Multiplayer is a different story. Im beginning to wonder if some of you understand game design.
Posted by: SPARTAN TRAP

Posted by: JohnyRL
I agree. For campaign the pistol was great, just OP in multiplayer


are you saying that in the campaign it has a range and in multiplayer it doesn't?

  • 06.13.2011 11:55 AM PDT


Posted by: ARACHN0TRON

Posted by: JohnyRL

Posted by: skull56546
If they create a multiplayer it would kill halo reach and possibly halo 4

I HIGHLY doubt that bro. Halo CE's multiplayer, in comparison to what is available on the market today, is terrible



CE multiplayer was the most balanced multiplayer of all the Halo games. Everyone started with a powerful easy to use pistol, so everyone stood a chance against everyone else, perfectly fair. Games nowadays don't seem to understand that making it so you start with weaker weapons, and have to fight to get better ones off the map, actually makes it somewhat unfair.

Why should someone get a killing spree automatically because he got to the sword first? He shouldn't. And if your fighting a team of vehicles, is it fair to not stand a chance simply because the other team occupies all the anti-vehicle weapons?

CE balanced everything absolutely perfectly. Modern developers could learn much from it. And it's pretty sad that they don't.


Red Faction Guerrilla comes to mind. So underrated...



[Edited on 06.13.2011 12:41 PM PDT]

  • 06.13.2011 11:56 AM PDT

How many people watched the 343 vidoc video? Huh?? How many? "The Pistol is still wildly overpowered!" There you go
The Pistol is overpowered, next question.

  • 06.13.2011 12:00 PM PDT

SPARTAN TRAP
asking for mods is not a smart idea.
no bumping.

what is your next game going to be Bungie?


Posted by: JohnyRL
no, i mean that having OP weapons in PVE is OK, no one is at a disadvantage. Multiplayer is a different story. Im beginning to wonder if some of you understand game design.
Posted by: SPARTAN TRAP

Posted by: JohnyRL
I agree. For campaign the pistol was great, just OP in multiplayer


are you saying that in the campaign it has a range and in multiplayer it doesn't?


I'm striving to understand what you are saying, not just read the words and put my own twist on them. I believe I am understanding you now, in campaign it's okay if you over power the computer, because it's a computer, but if you over power another human with a pistol, while the other person has a rocket launcher, you are using the god gun against a human gun, kind of like in Halo 2 the plasma rifle against the scarab gun.

  • 06.13.2011 12:01 PM PDT

SPARTAN TRAP
asking for mods is not a smart idea.
no bumping.

what is your next game going to be Bungie?


Posted by: JohnyRL
How many people watched the 343 vidoc video? Huh?? How many? "The Pistol is still wildly overpowered!" There you go
The Pistol is overpowered, next question.


in the campaign, it is Reach Multiplayer.

  • 06.13.2011 12:02 PM PDT

Posted by: JohnyRL
no, i mean that having OP weapons in PVE is OK, no one is at a disadvantage. Multiplayer is a different story. Im beginning to wonder if some of you understand game design.

And I'm beginning to wonder if you understand the games that you're discussing.

You're seriously arguing that Halo 1, a game which gives players a weapon which, while not as effective as many "power" weapons in their particular roles, is all-round effective and always ensures that players have a fighting chance, "puts players at a disadvantage," yet Reach, a game in which power weapons are so strong relative to everything else that it ultimately turns into a screwed up game of rock-paper-scissors, is fair? On an encounter-by-encounter basis, your premises suggest the opposite of your conclusions!

If putting players at a disadvantage is problematic, then Reach's weapon set is the ultimate stage of failure and what not to do. Didn't spawn near the sniper rifle, which is effective against everything and even works at close range because of the large hitboxes? Haha, enjoy being instagibbed by the person who did!

[Edited on 06.13.2011 1:31 PM PDT]

  • 06.13.2011 1:28 PM PDT

The pistol is not OP simply by virtue of being a utility weapon that in good hands was decent at all ranges but it never excelled in any other than mid range. Furthermore the pistol has such a ridiculous skill gap (that's ridiculous in the good way) I don't know about you but you just can't pick up the pistol and suddenly do godly with it, it is a hard unforgiving weapon to use. Contrary to what you are saying the pistol did not hand out 3sk; you had to work for them. I was pretty decent at CE and I couldn't consistently 3sk when someone had a good strafe going on. Hell look at some Pro tournaments even they can't consistently 3 shot with it.

Johnny have you even played the game because everything that comes out of our mouth gives the impression that you haven't.

  • 06.13.2011 1:47 PM PDT

I have just listened to the 343 podcast, and I don't like their decision not to make Halo CE online.

First I'm gona address the Pistol issue, because everyone brought it up, and even Bungie themselves have always said it's overpowered.

It is a brilliant weapon because as some gentlemen (and maybe ladies) have already mentioned, everyone has one. It has range, though not infinite and it's even usable close up. Everyone starts with one. So WHATEVER weapon the opponent has, if you played you cards right and caught them at the right distance, you have a chance of taking them down, rocket launcher and all. Remember Halo 2's default SMG? What was the first thing you did? Swap it, because if you go up against someone who as a weapon other than a SMG, then your only hope is your 2 grenades. That in my opinion is crap. As a game that attempts to start everyone on an equal footing, it's crap that you are given a weapon that affectively useless.

I also agree with the rock-paper-scissors analogy that sums up Halo Reache's multiplayer. It feels like so much of it depends on odds, rather than skill.

I learnt how to use the CE's pistol much to the annoyance of my brother. My brother would beat me at Street Fighter, Mortal Kombat, Killer Instinct, everything including Halo CE. But when I learnt how to use the pistol, I suddenly had a fighting chance. I didn't get ambushed trying to get a power weapon because I started with something I could use. I didn't win on every map, because I couldn't exploit the range on every map (obviously maps have different ranges...). The pistol wasn't the answer to everything but it gave me a fighting chance and it felt good to be empowered at the start for once.

In my experience, all the people who moan about Halo CE's pistol are the people who died from it and couldn't figure out how to use it. In which case, you either find a counter statergy or find a new game to play. There are plenty out there at the moment. It's the same with COD quickscope issue: the only people who moan are people who die from it and think it's unfair. To put it harshly, man-up or get lost. Seriously, no one is forcing you to play a game you keep loosing at.

If the pistol was overpowered, EVERYONE would use it and it would quickly get boring because it's clear it's the only affective way of getting kills. That didn't happen with Halo CE.

And as further proof and in response to the 343 podcast, how did Halo PC online multiplayer balance? From what I hear people still play it to this day, so it sounds like the balancing works fine online.

And as for the larger issue using Reach's engine for the multiplayer: I hate the arguement that they don't want to "split" the Reach community. The Reach community is exactly that: they will always play Reach. In fact you'll probably find Halo CE online would attract new players to Halo, because it is a very different game. Activision do not have this narrow mindset, and the last 3-4 COD games have tons of people still playing all of them.

So I'm not going to bother with Reach anymore. There's so many things about it that piss me off, and now this is the final nail in the coffin. I do enjoy it, yes, but I'm not going to play a game where so many crap discissions are made. I will be getting Halo CE and I hope Halo 4 turns out well, but Reaches multiplayer doesn't deserve anymore of my time.

Have fun with your armour lock and your only-head-shots-kill rifles.

  • 06.13.2011 3:45 PM PDT

indeed
Posted by: SPARTAN TRAP

Posted by: JohnyRL
no, i mean that having OP weapons in PVE is OK, no one is at a disadvantage. Multiplayer is a different story. Im beginning to wonder if some of you understand game design.
Posted by: SPARTAN TRAP

Posted by: JohnyRL
I agree. For campaign the pistol was great, just OP in multiplayer


are you saying that in the campaign it has a range and in multiplayer it doesn't?


I'm striving to understand what you are saying, not just read the words and put my own twist on them. I believe I am understanding you now, in campaign it's okay if you over power the computer, because it's a computer, but if you over power another human with a pistol, while the other person has a rocket launcher, you are using the god gun against a human gun, kind of like in Halo 2 the plasma rifle against the scarab gun.

  • 06.13.2011 6:17 PM PDT

Reach's power weapons are powerful but balanced. Unlike this so called infallible pistol, which is considered OP by everyone else but the halo Ce fanboys

  • 06.13.2011 6:18 PM PDT

EXACTLY even frank occoner agrees with me >_<
Posted by: INLINE JOSH
Posted by: DAJSK
Posted by: Snyder Chips
If there was CE multiplayer then little 10 year olds would e whoring the pistol the entire time.
You know you would have one too?


Hahah nobody realises this is what Frank O Connor said.

  • 06.13.2011 6:19 PM PDT

Posted by: JohnyRL
Reach's power weapons are powerful but balanced.

No, they aren't. They do give you an advantage in an absolute sense over other players, as opposed to simply creating a wider tactical variety. The sniper rifle in Reach is so easy to hit with and so effective against vehicles that it could most definitely be described as a "better DMR."

The very fact that the standard spawn weapons take so long to kill with means that 1sk AoE weapons like rockets and the fuel rod don't give a targetted player, at most ranges, any chance to fight back at all. You're screwed simply by dint of spawning with inferior weapons to what all the lucky people are carrying.

Halo 1 avoids that. The pistol is not as effective in any respect as power weapons intended for that respect, but it's all-round useful and ensures that you always have a fighting chance. It's exactly what a starter weapon in an active game should be. As opposed to something like the DMR, which is "better" in some sense than the other basic weapons but still leaves you completely screwed no matter how well you play against the games' power weapons.

Though I'm not sure why I keep saying this. We've restated it a million times, and your argument is still effectively "no you're wrong Reach's weapons are more balanced, M6D is imbalanced." You don't seem to actually have an argument nor any interest to address ours.

Unlike this so called infallible pistol, which is considered OP by everyone else but the halo Ce fanboys
That word does not mean what you think it means.

And of course non-Halo 1 players are going to consider it OP. Industry standard has long been to give players with power weapons stupid easy-kill advantages. People are just used to it. A game that tries to make the playing field reasonable is unusual.

EXACTLY even frank occoner agrees with me >_<
In a marketting video where he also said that it can kill anything in 3 shots to the head from anywhere, which is a load of nonsense, especially when you're talking about campaign. Buzzword spewing by a PR guy does not constitute an effective argument.

Let's keep in mind that Frankie is also the guy who initially wrote that the reason that they weren't including Halo 1 online MP was that it wouldn't feel the same due to the netcode, all the while people were making a big deal over how the game was including online coop.

Frankie is a cool guy and a source of useful information, but trusting the big PR man for arguments regarding the merits of given video games? Rofl.

[Edited on 06.13.2011 7:01 PM PDT]

  • 06.13.2011 6:58 PM PDT

"well said mini moose"

Posted by: firestorm02
Halo CE in my opinion had the best multiplayer. The pistol was a 3 shot kill and was good at all ranges if you knew how to use it properly.. believe it or not the pistol in CE had a slight bloom and with that big of a reticule long range isn't as easy as you might think. It was better for mid and close range. Everyone started with one so it was balanced out, the other power weapons cut down the ability of the pistol.

Example:

Sniper vs Pistol at long range.

Sniper wins due to better accuracy and more zoom.

Pistol vs Shotgun close range (and occasionally mid range, that CE shotgun was a boss..)

Shotgun wins and only requires one well places shot vs 3 head shots.

Rockets vs Pistol

(See shotgun vs pistol above.)

I also couldn't help but notice you trying to be cute and asking another forum member to play CE now..

Plenty of people still play CE on a daily basis whether it be online or not.

I play it through XBC when I get the time too, I find the multiplayer far better than the other titles and I've been playing Halo since it first came out..


could you tell me what XBC is. If it is just computer than I am out of luck.

  • 06.13.2011 7:21 PM PDT

I for one agree with OP. Major MAJOR rose tinted glasses going on here when talking about CE multi. It would not work as a matchmaking game, and a LAN game it works wonderfully.

Also i believe 80% of these kids screaming about lack of multi were well under 10 years old when it actually came out and dont have a clue what they are referring to and are just going along with the crowd complaining.

  • 06.13.2011 7:56 PM PDT

Fail, in reach you spawn with a pistol with which you should be able to keep knocking his scope off if your getting sniped until you can move to cover, what you cant generally anymore do is countersnipe a sniper with a goddamn PISTOL, so stop crying about that

M6D works in a lan setting because if someone is whoring it like a douche you can throw a chair at their head until they stop, not so much online. CE online would be 100% pistol all day every day and to me that just sounds boring.

Bungie even agree the M6D was an abberation, theyve stated thats why in halo two they came up with the BR and start you off with the smg, and nerfed the pistol hardcore.

And frankie is the Head of Franchise Development at 343i FYI.......he is the boss man and what he says goes, for better or worse. He is no PR robot.
Posted by: Tupolev
Posted by: JohnyRL
Reach's power weapons are powerful but balanced.

No, they aren't. They do give you an advantage in an absolute sense over other players, as opposed to simply creating a wider tactical variety. The sniper rifle in Reach is so easy to hit with and so effective against vehicles that it could most definitely be described as a "better DMR."

The very fact that the standard spawn weapons take so long to kill with means that 1sk AoE weapons like rockets and the fuel rod don't give a targetted player, at most ranges, any chance to fight back at all. You're screwed simply by dint of spawning with inferior weapons to what all the lucky people are carrying.

Halo 1 avoids that. The pistol is not as effective in any respect as power weapons intended for that respect, but it's all-round useful and ensures that you always have a fighting chance. It's exactly what a starter weapon in an active game should be. As opposed to something like the DMR, which is "better" in some sense than the other basic weapons but still leaves you completely screwed no matter how well you play against the games' power weapons.

Though I'm not sure why I keep saying this. We've restated it a million times, and your argument is still effectively "no you're wrong Reach's weapons are more balanced, M6D is imbalanced." You don't seem to actually have an argument nor any interest to address ours.

Unlike this so called infallible pistol, which is considered OP by everyone else but the halo Ce fanboys
That word does not mean what you think it means.

And of course non-Halo 1 players are going to consider it OP. Industry standard has long been to give players with power weapons stupid easy-kill advantages. People are just used to it. A game that tries to make the playing field reasonable is unusual.

EXACTLY even frank occoner agrees with me >_<
In a marketting video where he also said that it can kill anything in 3 shots to the head from anywhere, which is a load of nonsense, especially when you're talking about campaign. Buzzword spewing by a PR guy does not constitute an effective argument.

Let's keep in mind that Frankie is also the guy who initially wrote that the reason that they weren't including Halo 1 online MP was that it wouldn't feel the same due to the netcode, all the while people were making a big deal over how the game was including online coop.

Frankie is a cool guy and a source of useful information, but trusting the big PR man for arguments regarding the merits of given video games? Rofl.


[Edited on 06.13.2011 8:08 PM PDT]

  • 06.13.2011 8:05 PM PDT

Precisely my point. You started with an easy to use weapon and make your way up the charts of weaps as you find better ones, and thats reach. I guess all the high ratings reach's multiplayer got were people on drugs ^_^
Posted by: Tupolev
Posted by: JohnyRL
Reach's power weapons are powerful but balanced.

No, they aren't. They do give you an advantage in an absolute sense over other players, as opposed to simply creating a wider tactical variety. The sniper rifle in Reach is so easy to hit with and so effective against vehicles that it could most definitely be described as a "better DMR."

The very fact that the standard spawn weapons take so long to kill with means that 1sk AoE weapons like rockets and the fuel rod don't give a targetted player, at most ranges, any chance to fight back at all. You're screwed simply by dint of spawning with inferior weapons to what all the lucky people are carrying.

Halo 1 avoids that. The pistol is not as effective in any respect as power weapons intended for that respect, but it's all-round useful and ensures that you always have a fighting chance. It's exactly what a starter weapon in an active game should be. As opposed to something like the DMR, which is "better" in some sense than the other basic weapons but still leaves you completely screwed no matter how well you play against the games' power weapons.

Though I'm not sure why I keep saying this. We've restated it a million times, and your argument is still effectively "no you're wrong Reach's weapons are more balanced, M6D is imbalanced." You don't seem to actually have an argument nor any interest to address ours.

Unlike this so called infallible pistol, which is considered OP by everyone else but the halo Ce fanboys
That word does not mean what you think it means.

And of course non-Halo 1 players are going to consider it OP. Industry standard has long been to give players with power weapons stupid easy-kill advantages. People are just used to it. A game that tries to make the playing field reasonable is unusual.

EXACTLY even frank occoner agrees with me >_<
In a marketting video where he also said that it can kill anything in 3 shots to the head from anywhere, which is a load of nonsense, especially when you're talking about campaign. Buzzword spewing by a PR guy does not constitute an effective argument.

Let's keep in mind that Frankie is also the guy who initially wrote that the reason that they weren't including Halo 1 online MP was that it wouldn't feel the same due to the netcode, all the while people were making a big deal over how the game was including online coop.

Frankie is a cool guy and a source of useful information, but trusting the big PR man for arguments regarding the merits of given video games? Rofl.

  • 06.13.2011 8:07 PM PDT